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  1. #1

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    Let the fireworks begin - AP discussion

    Here's an article that should get a nice, quiet, civilized discussion going!.......not


    http://www.jimhillmedia.com/mb/artic...le.php?ID=1577

  2. #2

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    Re: Let the fireworks begin!

    What a friggin Jacka$$ who's just sad that his website doesn't get enough attention from the
    Disney fanatics; or Disney diehards, Disnoids
    to keep his website popular! Dude needs to get over it and STFU!
    Quote Originally Posted by drunkmom
    this is my first buzzed post in the DMCA -- I'm really in this club because I'm a bitch more than anything. I've only had to hit the backspace 4 (oops, make that 5) times in (now 7) in this (now 9) (now 15) in this post! Damn, now I'm up to 18! Our neighbors were (19) (20) making tequilla sunrises. I thought I couldn't do tequilla (22) anymore but (24) this stuff (26) was good! It started (27) with an s



  3. #3

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    Re: Let the fireworks begin!

    He didnt account in alot of things like how much money is spent in merchandising and food, and his perspective is very pesimistic and slanted. Does he think that in writing that, that hes helping people?

    I keep coming back to edit my post... but, if there was no one who thought of the bad things at disneyland like paint striping off the wall and.. such. Would'nt the disney company just let the park go to crap? like if no cared about aging or how dirty a place is then it wouldn't ever change because they would make the same amount of money either way. Ignourance is bliss, but if your using someones ignourance to rip them off, your in the wrong morally. and thats by far the worst thing a person/company can do.
    Last edited by Uncle Remus; 08-01-2005 at 12:06 AM.
    (insert funny comment here)

  4. #4

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    Re: Let the fireworks begin!

    written by a former Imagineer-
    Wow, do you think he's the one that pitched "the wheel of dead Disney mom characters" dark ride concept for Fantasyland? Or probably hated the commute to Glendale.

    Reads like a transcript of a sad talk radio audition tape.

  5. #5

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    Re: Let the fireworks begin!

    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Remus
    He didnt account in alot of things like how much money is spent in merchandising and food, and his perspective is very pesimistic and slanted. Does he think that in writing that, that hes helping people? Thank you wise Jim Hill, you opened my eyes.

    he seems REALLY full of himself... folks.
    Jim Hill didn't write that. It's a guest writer.

  6. #6

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    Re: Let the fireworks begin!

    Quote Originally Posted by Gregmh48
    Jim Hill didn't write that. It's a guest writer.
    thanks
    (insert funny comment here)

  7. #7

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    Re: Let the fireworks begin!

    Well typically, I would spend about 100$ a year at Disneyland. If that. Thats including the price to get in. Now that I have an AP, I have spent about 4X that. Nuff said.

  8. #8

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    Re: Let the fireworks begin!

    As I've posted elsewhere, conjecture by an outsider of the fiscal impacts of the AP program is just that .... conjecture. That the writer was a former imagineer does not lend any additional creedance to his theories ..... was he "let go" because he wasn't "with the program"? Did he design things that required frequent painting? Of course, that's just conjecture on my part....

    What confused me though was his private club analogy. In the context of DL and the AP program, I think the APers as private club members and single-day (and even multi-day) guests are more "pay as you go" is a better approximation of that analogy. The author took the opposite tack .......

    In any event, I think the company has, or could quickly aquire, the information necessary to decide what tweaking the AP program needs ...... and a price adjustment might just be what the program needs.

    But 5 or 6 times? Close all of the non-ODV food and merch locations, 'cuz no one will be able to afford it! Move the ODV operations into the "permanent" locations (turkey legs and popcorn at Blue Bayou, churros and chimis at Rancho del Zocalo) and clear the walkways. Of course, there won't be a need to clear the walkways, 'cuz no one will be there!

    $500-$600 for a So Cal SELECT? That leaves me out ..... what about you? That makes DShimel's idea of "caps" seem attractive ........
    "She's taking everything. She's taking the house, she's taking the kid, she's taking the dog. IT'S NOT EVEN HER DOG. IT'S MY DOG! SHE'S TAKING . . . MY DOG!"
    - Ron Livingston, "Band of Brothers"

  9. #9

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    Re: Let the fireworks begin!

    Quote Originally Posted by Giant Panda
    $500-$600 for a So Cal SELECT? That leaves me out ..... what about you? That makes DShimel's idea of "caps" seem attractive ........

    I dont see how they would continue making the same amount of money if they charged this much for the lowest level AP. Nobody would buy them!

  10. #10

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    Re: Let the fireworks begin!

    Quote Originally Posted by disneyguy247
    I dont see how they would continue making the same amount of money if they charged this much for the lowest level AP. Nobody would buy them!
    If the choice were $1700 for a premium or $1200 for a Deluxe, some would. But I'm sure they wouldn't raise prices that much all at once. It would probably be done incrementally over time, and/or they could "grandfather in" existing APers at a reduced rate, while "really sticking it" to new APs.

    It all goes back to the data Disney collects. If the data shows they take in more money (net, all things considered) with a higher mix of non-APs in the park , then the AP program will get tweaked enough to either reduce the number of APs and/or increase profits from APs by raising the AP price.
    "She's taking everything. She's taking the house, she's taking the kid, she's taking the dog. IT'S NOT EVEN HER DOG. IT'S MY DOG! SHE'S TAKING . . . MY DOG!"
    - Ron Livingston, "Band of Brothers"

  11. #11

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    Re: Let the fireworks begin!

    Ah, the old "they make more money off day guests than APers." Uuh, yeah. That's why with Eisner, Pressler, Harris in charge, a regime who we KNOW have no goal other than to increase the bottom line, the AP program was expanded to historic proportions. Because it makes less money. Sure.

  12. #12

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    Re: Let the fireworks begin!

    This artice finally prompted me into registering and posting rather than just lurking (I'm kind of shy) . With all the talk about raising AP prices, I was wondering if Disney considers those of us who have APs and live out of state. We have APs because it is cost effective if we want to go more than once per year. We usually go about 2 or 3 times per year and spend 2-3 days in the park per trip. We usually stay at the resort, but sometimes stay on Harbor. We eat all of our meals on Disney property and buy souveniers at the parks.

    If I didn't have an AP, I would go to the parks once per year. Disney would probably lose money in my case if I didn't have an AP. I would spend less on admission (although more per day) less on food, less on lodging and less on souveniers. I know I am not the "typical" APer who is a local and makes many day visits, but I am sure there are many of us tourist types who have APs. I always thought it was backward to have cheaper passes for locals (from a profit standpoint) who probably aren't staying in a hotel and buying all their meals at the parks each time they visit. I always wondered why they didn't give the discounted passes to the out of towners since they are more likely to be staying on property and spending more per visit and are more likely to visit fewer times per year. I think for this market segment, Disney will lose money if they raise the prices much on APs.

    I might be way off on this, but just my 2 cents.
    I'd rather be at Disneyland!

  13. #13

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    Re: Let the fireworks begin!

    First of all, I think a lot of people are taking this personal when it shouldn't be. The writer of this article (not Jim Hill) is talking about some APers, not all APers. And although he could have wrote it differently, he was right on many points. There are AP holders that go to the park everyday and feel the need to point out every little detail that is out of place (ie...napkin on the floor, dust on a ledge, etc). And there are also a lot of APers that are very resistant to change. Walt wanted his parks to continually change, and yet some people are dead set against not letting Disney close any of the old attractions.

    -Michael
    “You can design and create, and build the most wonderful place in the world. But it takes people to make the dream a reality.” - Walt Disney

  14. #14

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    Re: Let the fireworks begin!

    Quote Originally Posted by askmike1
    First of all, I think a lot of people are taking this personal when it shouldn't be. The writer of this article (not Jim Hill) is talking about some APers, not all APers. And although he could have wrote it differently, he was right on many points. There are AP holders that go to the park everyday and feel the need to point out every little detail that is out of place (ie...napkin on the floor, dust on a ledge, etc). And there are also a lot of APers that are very resistant to change. Walt wanted his parks to continually change, and yet some people are dead set against not letting Disney close any of the old attractions.

    -Michael
    By the way he wrote it, he did made it sound like all APs are like this-pointing out flaws every five seconds, etc.

    He was also trying to sound much more elevated above everyone else for being a former Imagineer.

    Simply put? The man who wrote this article had an attitude and some people are offended by it.

    Not to say that he didn't have any good points. I'll agree that some Disney fanatics do suck the fun out of it in some cases. It's the little things like knowing that the hub area is the only good spot to watch the fireworks. Then again, asking a CM at the park, they would certainly tell you that as well, wouldn't they?

    If Disney fans didn't point out stuff like wearing paint, then how would the park be maintained? Just look at Knott's for Pete's sake! Instead of keeping things up and paying any attention to detail, they'll just throw in another roller coaster. Yes, new rides bring in more numbers, but looking at the place, will it be pleasing to the eye? Many people love Disneyland because of it's appearance...it's perfection of detail. It is, simply, beautiful.

    But some people in management don't care about how the park pleases guests...look at how the 50th ended up for Disneyland. The Pressler/Harris era went into simply caring about "how much money we can rip out of the guests" every day.

    The Disney fanatics make a balance. And yes, we do give Disney loads of money. Have you seen the prices of food? Merchandise? We buy more of this than the one-time visitor, so we well make up for the price of the ticket.

    Not all of us APs are fun-suckers. And when we voice something, it tends to help the equilibrium...because if nobody voiced up against anything, then nobody would care to get anything done.

    Then those people who only get to go once in a blue moon? They wouldn't enjoy their day at Disneyland, they'd be ripped off, and it wouldn't be "The Happiest Place on Earth" anymore.

  15. #15

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    nevermind

    nevermind. Other thread already created.
    Last edited by sediment; 08-01-2005 at 11:15 AM.

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