Is WDS finally doing its part ?

[CheriBibi]

I spend Bastille Day week-end in DLRP. And something struck me. The Disneyland Parc was not heavily packed as it usually is on heavy days. BTM line didn't exeed 50 minutes in the afternoon peek time. Peter pan was 45 min. in the middle of the day (those two attractions on busy days can get as high as 180min)

One could only think that DLRP is losing attendance, but on the other side of Fantasia Gardens, WDS had two attractions above the 50 mins. Crush Toaster got its usual 75 and ToT 50min.

Is really DLRP just droping figures, or is WDS finaly doing its part by putting some balance in the parks attendance ? That'd be awesome, cuz DLRP recent success made it almost impossible to do more than 4 attractions in the same park on the busy days and boy are they numerous...

Anybody more informed on WDS success or DLRP failure ?

[pussnboots]

That's interesting. The arresting part is Big Thunder Mountain -- less than 50 minutes on a Bastille Day weekend afternoon? Yikes. It gets 1 hour lines on much quieter days.

But -- to leap to the cynical conclusion -- if the WDS was suddenly experiencing a surge in popularity, that still wouldn't bring in a lot of money, would it? I mean, it seems that a very large majority of DLRP guests have hoppers or Annual Passes (the Francilien one seems to be a hit). So they're not paying anything extra to ride the ToT, and Lord knows there's little else to spend money on in that park.

But still, it's good news for the park's ego, I suppose. Perhaps it won't end up 67th on list of the world's most visited theme parks again. Even if it's just as the Disneyland Park's overflow receptacle.

[fizzog]

Let's hope WDS is finally pulling in the guests, I mean really pulling them in, but who knows. I doubt this signifies much in the way of a representation of how the respective parks are doing, but it may be a good sign for the studios.

[Zarniwoop]

I can think of three reasons:
1) DLRP has overpriced the peak season and hotels are half full
2) Locals and those studying fan pages know that crowds can be huge - so they avoid the season.
3) TOT shortens other queues

[CheriBibi]

Originally Posted by pussnboots

That's interesting. The arresting part is Big Thunder Mountain -- less than 50 minutes on a Bastille Day weekend afternoon? Yikes. It gets 1 hour lines on much quieter days.

But -- to leap to the cynical conclusion -- if the WDS was suddenly experiencing a surge in popularity, that still wouldn't bring in a lot of money, would it? I mean, it seems that a very large majority of DLRP guests have hoppers or Annual Passes (the Francilien one seems to be a hit). So they're not paying anything extra to ride the ToT, and Lord knows there's little else to spend money on in that park.

But still, it's good news for the park's ego, I suppose. Perhaps it won't end up 67th on list of the world's most visited theme parks again. Even if it's just as the Disneyland Park's overflow receptacle.

Well it's always important to balance attendance between the different parks of a resort. Cluttered parks are always bad for business. Too much time stuck in lines = bad consuming. Never pack a park, NEVER !

[TDLFAN]

Originally Posted by CheriBibi

One could only think that DLRP is losing attendance, but on the other side of Fantasia Gardens, WDS had two attractions above the 50 mins. Crush Toaster got its usual 75 and ToT 50min.

Is really DLRP just droping figures, or is WDS finaly doing its part by putting some balance in the parks attendance ? That'd be awesome, cuz DLRP recent success made it almost impossible to do more than 4 attractions in the same park on the busy days and boy are they numerous...

Anybody more informed on WDS success or DLRP failure ?

I don't think it would have anything to do with being Bastille Day. I would like to think that many euroguests are finally being smart and staying away from DLRP on certain holidays. However... while the wait times at DLP were shorter... the fact that that DLP has more attractions over the WDS will impact the wait times. Also, TOT and Crush Coaster are two attractions with low capacity per hour versus most of the rides found at DLP, therefore the wait times will be longer.. plus the added effect Fastpass has on the TOT queue, will inflate the wait time there. Reason why those two rides in particular will always have long lines. I do not believe that TOT will shorten any other lines anywhere.

I also do not agree with Cheribibi... Management at any Disney park WILL INCREASE attendance regardless of how crowded it will be, up to the point allowed by safety margins. Their mission is to make money, and not loose it. Management want nothing more than to see packed parks with long lines ALL of the time. Anyone who goes to a theme park should not be misguided and should expect lines for rides and attractions. Anyone expecting anything less is simply uneducated about theme parks, period.

However, Management has always recognized that long lines is bad for the bottom line because guests spend less time spending money elsewhere..like at the shops and restaurants... therefore they came up with the Fastpass "solution"... which in fact has lenghtened the queue for many and shortened it for the few ones who know how to use the system or get there early enough to obtain a fastpass before they run out for the day. But trust me... even with Fastpass... queues can be long and the very nature of the system (or rather the psychological good service it provides to guests) will allow management to pack the parks even more...

And that is my 2 euros on this subject.

[Maverick]

Originally Posted by TDLFAN

I don't think it would have anything to do with being Bastille Day. I would like to think that many euroguests are finally being smart and staying away from DLRP on certain holidays. However... while the wait times at DLP were shorter... the fact that that DLP has more attractions over the WDS will impact the wait times. Also, TOT and Crush Coaster are two attractions with low capacity per hour versus most of the rides found at DLP, therefore the wait times will be longer.. plus the added effect Fastpass has on the TOT queue, will inflate the wait time there. Reason why those two rides in particular will always have long lines. I do not believe that TOT will shorten any other lines anywhere.

I also do not agree with Cheribibi... Management at any Disney park WILL INCREASE attendance regardless of how crowded it will be, up to the point allowed by safety margins. Their mission is to make money, and not loose it. Management want nothing more than to see packed parks with long lines ALL of the time. Anyone who goes to a theme park should not be misguided and should expect lines for rides and attractions. Anyone expecting anything less is simply uneducated about theme parks, period.

However, Management has always recognized that long lines is bad for the bottom line because guests spend less time spending money elsewhere..like at the shops and restaurants... therefore they came up with the Fastpass "solution"... which in fact has lenghtened the queue for many and shortened it for the few ones who know how to use the system or get there early enough to obtain a fastpass before they run out for the day. But trust me... even with Fastpass... queues can be long and the very nature of the system (or rather the psychological good service it provides to guests) will allow management to pack the parks even more...

And that is my 2 euros on this subject.

I think for the first time i agree with everything you say.

[CheriBibi]

Originally Posted by TDLFAN

I also do not agree with Cheribibi... Management at any Disney park WILL INCREASE attendance regardless of how crowded it will be, up to the point allowed by safety margins. Their mission is to make money, and not loose it. Management want nothing more than to see packed parks with long lines ALL of the time. Anyone who goes to a theme park should not be misguided and should expect lines for rides and attractions. Anyone expecting anything less is simply uneducated about theme parks, period.

I'm taking about mutli-parks resorts here.
You don't make more money by having one park at full capacity and the other one almost empty, you make more money by evenly splitting resort guests into both thus avoiding long lines. In the end the same amount of ticket is gonna be sold no matter where guest chose to spend their day.

Fastpass are not here to improve the quality of your day, they're here to shorten the line in order for you to have more time for food and consumer products.

Same motivation apply for balancing the park and avoiding fully packed parks where guest leave angry with their still full wallets.

[jortlaban]

Originally Posted by Zarniwoop

I can think of three reasons:
1) DLRP has overpriced the peak season and hotels are half full
2) Locals and those studying fan pages know that crowds can be huge - so they avoid the season.
3) TOT shortens other queues

1) This year is one of the first years the hotels are at almost full capacity.
2) while locals may be less during high season, the crowds from all over europe stream in
3) ToT does shorten the queues, but only those at the other park....

the actual truth lies in the fact that WDS is starting to get more ambience than Disneyland parc and it's stealing it's customers....
when that gets balanced out, things will get back to "normal"... being both parks over crowded.... where it's just WDS now that's over crowded...
Disneyland parc still remains VERY busy, but for some reason it looks like it took them 15 years to figure out crowd control... since I haven't seen bigger lines than this high season that get handled faster than ever before.

[Zarniwoop]

Originally Posted by jortlaban

1) This year is one of the first years the hotels are at almost full capacity.

Yearly basis, yes. But, this summers "peak season" hasn't been that great. That's why I think it must be prices.

Btw, in nine hours we'll get the third quarter results.

[Kristof]

the WDS are becoming a victim of its rapid expantion

WDS opens at 10 am , in the past there was a show in Studio 1 before the studio doors opened and guest could enter the park

The TOT however is such a big weenie that the Studio 1 and the area in front of it (forgot the name) becomes so crowded before 10 am, that they have decided to open the Studio doors earlier. Guests are able to already stand in line at attractions.

However they do not start operating them earlier then 10 am; causing lines at TOT that go to Cinemagique, and for Crush the line begins at the Walt Disney and Mickey statue.

So yes, there is a big capacity problem with the Studio's.

Maybe causing them to change the plans for putting in a new E-Ticket in the Studio's instead of the Disneyland park, who knows.

I myself do visit the studio's more and more as the first park in the morning.

Knowing that the first visit in the morning counts for the entrance number of the park, I think the WDS will have very good entrance numbers since the opening of TOT

[pussnboots]

Originally Posted by Kristof

the WDS are becoming a victim of its rapid expantion

WDS opens at 10 am , in the past there was a show in Studio 1 before the studio doors opened and guest could enter the park

The TOT however is such a big weenie that the Studio 1 and the area in front of it (forgot the name) becomes so crowded before 10 am, that they have decided to open the Studio doors earlier. Guests are able to already stand in line at attractions.

However they do not start operating them earlier then 10 am; causing lines at TOT that go to Cinemagique, and for Crush the line begins at the Walt Disney and Mickey statue.

So yes, there is a big capacity problem with the Studio's.

Maybe causing them to change the plans for putting in a new E-Ticket in the Studio's instead of the Disneyland park, who knows.

I myself do visit the studio's more and more as the first park in the morning.

Knowing that the first visit in the morning counts for the entrance number of the park, I think the WDS will have very good entrance numbers since the opening of TOT

I hate to beat a dead horse*, but if the Studios are really becoming that popular, simply adding more rides will not solve the capacity problem. They need more restaurants, more gift shops, more nooks and crannies, more shade, and they need all this yesterday. New rides will be needed in the long term, of course, but it appears to me that the basic infrastructure of the park is in no way up to the task of handling Disneyland Park-style crowds, nor of taking advantage of their willingness to spend money. While the park next door seems like a bustling economy, with umpteen restaurants constantly in full swing and Main Street's shops resembling a Gimbels sale each night, the Studios are no such thing. There are no lines at the ticket booths, the pre-Studio 1 Front Lot shops are often deserted, and La Terrasse is where French people eat the traditional "pique-niques" they brought from home.

It's great to hear the park is doing well, but it needs to be adapted to handle such crowds. And no, three "temporary" funfair rides are not the answer.

*lie

[soundtracker]

Originally Posted by pussnboots

I hate to beat a dead horse*, but if the Studios are really becoming that popular, simply adding more rides will not solve the capacity problem. They need more restaurants, more gift shops, more nooks and crannies, more shade, and they need all this yesterday. New rides will be needed in the long term, of course, but it appears to me that the basic infrastructure of the park is in no way up to the task of handling Disneyland Park-style crowds, nor of taking advantage of their willingness to spend money. While the park next door seems like a bustling economy, with umpteen restaurants constantly in full swing and Main Street's shops resembling a Gimbels sale each night, the Studios are no such thing. There are no lines at the ticket booths, the pre-Studio 1 Front Lot shops are often deserted, and La Terrasse is where French people eat the traditional "pique-niques" they brought from home.

It's great to hear the park is doing well, but it needs to be adapted to handle such crowds. And no, three "temporary" funfair rides are not the answer.

*lie

I couldn't agree more, Puss. Rides are only ever half of what makes up a park.

[nathan detroit]

Originally Posted by Kristof

the WDS are becoming a victim of its rapid expantion

WDS opens at 10 am , in the past there was a show in Studio 1 before the studio doors opened and guest could enter the park

The TOT however is such a big weenie that the Studio 1 and the area in front of it (forgot the name) becomes so crowded before 10 am, that they have decided to open the Studio doors earlier. Guests are able to already stand in line at attractions.

However they do not start operating them earlier then 10 am

This was happening a year ago when Crush was causing such a ermm... crush. Getting in early now at least allows time to grab a FP for one before starting to queue for another.

The Studio 1 shows that happened in the past happened because there were sweet few people around to get in the way. Pre-Crush you could arrive at the park for 9.45am and have half of it done by lunch. The fact that WDS now has some good and popular attractions is hardly reason to gripe (although managing to ride RnRC six consecutive times without quuing in the last hour is now seems a thing of the past!).

Extra crowds will hopefully mean better shops and restaurants, more attractions to come and a whole lot more general atmosphere.

[Kristof]

Originally Posted by pussnboots

There are no lines at the ticket booths, t

that is positive!

You also probably know how long lines can get at the ticket booths at the Disneyland ParK

It takes such a loooong time waiting over there. They designed the booths so badly, it's very hard to see when a booth is free, and they don't seem to use the full capacity they have (although I think many booths are not equiped with ticketmachines and computers just because they have soooo many booths under the disneyland hotel, does someone know how many?)

So I'm gonna get my 15 euro tickets at the Studio's