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  1. #1531

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    Re: Disney's California Adventure Project Tracker II

    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Bob View Post
    Wow, I wish I could do that on my projects more often. Every once in a while with paint you're like, geeze did I pick that. For as much as people complain about Dis being cheap they do some pretty elborate things to make sure they are happy with the end results.

    I do the same thing, luckily when i buy the paint in Home depot i just take it back to be reformulated. LOL

  2. #1532

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    Re: Disney's California Adventure Project Tracker II

    Quote Originally Posted by bfdf55 View Post
    When they establish a budget, it’s based on the concept they present. And once that concept had been bought off (based on the budget they approved), the project must adhere to it. The budget should include everything needed to complete the project, including contingency. Contingency should cover all incidental costs that weren’t foreseen during initial budget assessment. The budget for Mermaid would only be “penciled in” in initial concept stages. Once the budget had been allocated, that money is not subject to being modified for other purposes.

    So I really doubt that they would be pulling funds from previously budgeted projects to fund altogether new projects. New projects would have to go through the entire process to get funding and it’s own budget.
    You are correct the diference is that the whole DCA change was presented as one major project. That project was then given preliminary costs per change and addition. Basically the board and upper management saw the overall idea WDI wanted to do and approved a budget according to estimates for the whole thing. At that point the WDI team has been allocating funds wherever they are needed. Everyone knew that the whole project would be changing with things adjusted or remoevd as it moved along. The key point is that they know how much money they have for the overall project and bids have been set. When they see the need for additional funds for one thing they revisit other parts of the project to see what they could change without gearing away from what they want the overall project to look like.


    Also one unique thing about this project is that Bob Iger gave Bob Weis full control of DCA and its changes. DCA is his baby and both he and John have actually been encouraging WDI to go back and keep revising each individual project. Some ideas that they know will most likely never be revisited are somehow integrated into the projects other ideas that they see could eventually become enhancements in the future are removed.
    Last edited by Baloo; 01-20-2009 at 11:56 AM.

  3. #1533

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    Re: Disney's California Adventure Project Tracker II

    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    seriously.. what is the point of arguing all this when you don't know the real facts.

    And NOTHING is final until its done. All this garbage about budgets, etc.

    Here's a thought for you. When you get laid off... your salary was already budgeted and allocated for.. yet, they still laid you off. Are you going to try to use an internet discussion board defense to get your job back that the money was already budgeted?

    This discussion is comical. Overages are common. Changes in plans.. common. Having to change the plan because of things learned in manufacturing or implementation... common.

    Stop taking the prophet's words as gospel. The projects are already green lit and in progress so they don't want to stop them and throw money away, for many things they are past the point of no return - that means NOTHING in terms of what they are willing to do operationally to implement the projects or make changes or add/drop things supporting the greater concepts.

    The amount of 'facts' in the last 50 or so pages in this thread wouldn't fill a shot glass.

    People need to stop thinking they are part of project management and just enjoy the ride and FACTUAL updates that come down the line.
    I think we all enjoy talking about these things whether we are right or wrong soemtimes it helps understand these projects. When i do not want to hear a certain discussion i just go to another thread. It really is that simple
    Last edited by Baloo; 01-20-2009 at 11:50 AM.

  4. #1534

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    Re: Disney's California Adventure Project Tracker II

    Quote Originally Posted by Baloo View Post
    I think we all enjoy talking about these things whether we are right or wrong soemtimes it helps understand these projects. When i do not want to hear a certain discussion i just go to another thread. It really is that simple
    The problem is the circular cycle of information... people started validating findings with the very thing they were trying to validate. The 'rampant speculation' as mycroft put it bandwagons into its own reality which soils everywhere else too. It was the whole reason I opened this thread last week.. people posting some 'information' in other threads I hadn't heard before.. so I came in here to check it out. You go to look at the source.. and its just baseless stuff... but now its being used to justify other claims. It's just a big circle based only on itself.

    People take a sliver of information and it morphs into some new reality. If I were an insider.. I'd be rolling in laughter over much of this.
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  5. #1535

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    Re: Disney's California Adventure Project Tracker II

    Quote Originally Posted by mycroft16 View Post
    While the budget is whatever Disney decides it is... Disney has decided. The budget went through countless reviews and meetings and proposals and many other steps as well before it was settled on. Many things that were in the original proposals were cut, on purpose, in order to secure the budget that they did. Going back and getting more money approved is a nightmare and usually spells the end of your career. The budget goes through so many meetings and compromises that by the time it is green-lit, it IS set in stone. Over-runs happen, and often, but it never looks good. The goal is to get it done, on time and with the money you were given.

    Disney has disappointed in the past because they have allotted paltry sums to do anything, or have simply don't nothing at all. DCA was designed primarily by a corporate retreat, NOT Imagineering. WDI just got handed the project and a really sad sum and told to make it work. And given the circumstances, they didn't do too poorly. They built exactly what the executives wanted, an 800 million dollar outdoor mall.

    Things have altered slightly since then. The merger with Pixar put some VERY creative people into very high positions of power. Steve Jobs on the board, John Lasseter in with Bob Iger as chief Creative Consultant. Bob Weiss is back. Instead of some lame "place making" that was going to happen, north of one billion dollars has been green-lit for a 1st phase makeover with more planned for the future expansion of the resort.

    DCA is integral to DLR expansion, and Disney knows this. Without a working and beautiful DCA, any future resort expansion may as well be abandoned right now. Just because plans change and timelines alter or projects are shifted to a future phase does not mean they are doing a crappy or half-hearted job. It means that things are being changed and shifted around. When ALL is said and done we will be able to judge, but we really can't before then, because we simply do not have even 1% of the information necessary.
    The "Voice of Reason" has spoken! I love your posts! Thank you for bringing things back to reality.

  6. #1536

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    Re: Disney's California Adventure Project Tracker II

    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    The problem is the circular cycle of information... people started validating findings with the very thing they were trying to validate. The 'rampant speculation' as mycroft put it bandwagons into its own reality which soils everywhere else too.
    This is what I try to stop weekly from happening in these info threads. Something gets posted here and it spawns its own thread where people discuss it and then a few pages later, that new thread is quoted as evidence in the tracking threads. It's something we all need to watch out for to make sure that these threads stay as accurate as possible. Speculation and wondering are fine, but when we start citing other speculation as evidence, then we've got a problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by disneyland255 View Post
    The "Voice of Reason" has spoken! I love your posts! Thank you for bringing things back to reality.
    Thank you! I try my hardest to stop these kinds of things before they get out of hand. Patience and reason go a long way in an online community.

    Our revels now are ended. These our actors, As I foretold you, were all spirits and Are melted into air, into thin air: And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, The cloud-capp'd towers, the gorgeous palaces, The solemn temples, the great globe itself, Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff As dreams are made on, and our little life Is rounded with a sleep. mycroft16 on Twitter

  7. #1537

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    Re: Disney's California Adventure Project Tracker II

    I wonder if the mods can actually remove the posts in here that do not have to do with the facts as put forth in post #1. It would definitely clean up the threads and keep things on track.

  8. #1538

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    Re: Disney's California Adventure Project Tracker II

    I'm sure they can... but then you get into the argument of "mine was fact, yours is speculation" so it's better to just leave it and let it serve as an example of fact, logical speculation and rampant speculation.

    Our revels now are ended. These our actors, As I foretold you, were all spirits and Are melted into air, into thin air: And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, The cloud-capp'd towers, the gorgeous palaces, The solemn temples, the great globe itself, Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff As dreams are made on, and our little life Is rounded with a sleep. mycroft16 on Twitter

  9. #1539

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    Re: Disney's California Adventure Project Tracker II

    Quote Originally Posted by disneyland255 View Post
    I wonder if the mods can actually remove the posts in here that do not have to do with the facts as put forth in post #1. It would definitely clean up the threads and keep things on track.
    Quote Originally Posted by mycroft16 View Post
    I'm sure they can... but then you get into the argument of "mine was fact, yours is speculation" so it's better to just leave it and let it serve as an example of fact, logical speculation and rampant speculation.
    As long as we keep the thread on the topic of DCA and the changes coming or possible changes we're good. If things get too far off topic we'll move them, but we would rather allow the thread to get back on track naturally.

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  10. #1540

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    Re: Disney's California Adventure Project Tracker II

    Quote Originally Posted by Baloo View Post
    DCA is his baby and both he and John have actually been encouraging WDI to go back and keep revising each individual project. Some ideas that they know will most likely never be revisited are somehow integrated into the projects other ideas that they see could eventually become enhancements in the future are removed.
    Could you possibly clarify this statement Baloo, I'm not sure I understand?

  11. #1541

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    Re: Disney's California Adventure Project Tracker II

    Thanks Anders and Mycroft.

    kaliwolf, I kind of had the same misunderstanding on Baloo's statement also.

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    Re: Disney's California Adventure Project Tracker II

    He's saying that they take a look at the resort and say, we'll this could easily be done in the future, let's drop that from this project and free up that money to add to this other budget that has things that need to go in now but we don't have the budget for.

    Our revels now are ended. These our actors, As I foretold you, were all spirits and Are melted into air, into thin air: And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, The cloud-capp'd towers, the gorgeous palaces, The solemn temples, the great globe itself, Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff As dreams are made on, and our little life Is rounded with a sleep. mycroft16 on Twitter

  13. #1543

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    Re: Disney's California Adventure Project Tracker II

    Quote Originally Posted by kaliwolf View Post
    Could you possibly clarify this statement Baloo, I'm not sure I understand?

    Basically non of the projects are complete until the final piece is painted and the attraction or additions are ready to turn over to operation.

    WDI are being encourage to really be as creative as they can with the projects they are working on. They present their ideas to Bob Weiss and John and to other WDI working on other projects and then each one gives their opinions and suggestions. The original crew then goes back and see what information they got can be useful. Sometimes when they are working on more than one project they might design one thing and then realize that they rather have a little bit more money alloted for their other project. so they revise there ideas according to what they feel is more relevant now to the project for opening. Sometimes there are times when ideas that were cut out are revisited when the attracion or area is doue for an enhancement or upkeep.

  14. #1544

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    Re: Disney's California Adventure Project Tracker II

    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    The problem is the circular cycle of information... people started validating findings with the very thing they were trying to validate. The 'rampant speculation' as mycroft put it bandwagons into its own reality which soils everywhere else too. It was the whole reason I opened this thread last week.. people posting some 'information' in other threads I hadn't heard before.. so I came in here to check it out. You go to look at the source.. and its just baseless stuff... but now its being used to justify other claims. It's just a big circle based only on itself.

    People take a sliver of information and it morphs into some new reality. If I were an insider.. I'd be rolling in laughter over much of this.
    From the very beginning I've outright stated that this thread is based on a combination of sources, including rumors. I try to go with rumors that seem to have plausibility or are at least coming from established sources like Al Lutz or Blue Sky Disney. I also have a couple people who directly send me information whenever they have any to share.

    You have to understand that wild speculation comes with the territory with this thread. Plans are constantly changing with the DCA project, and through all of it Disney remains tight-lipped with the public and shares little to no information with us. Therefore, much of the information in this thread have to come from third-party sources, which I am very grateful for, but are not always the most solid foundation to report on.

    Sorry if the rumors here aren't what you would like out of a thread like this, but this thread would be entirely useless if we were going strictly off of information that Disney releases. Heck, even their official press releases from when the DCA makeover are irrelevant now -- Walt Disney Plaza has a different name, Cars Land won't have a drive-in diner, the Preview Center moved from San Francisco Street to the wine country, and the Carthay Circle Theatre will no longer feature a Walt Disney Story attraction!

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  15. #1545

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    Re: Disney's California Adventure Project Tracker II

    Quote Originally Posted by MasterGracey View Post
    Sorry if the rumors here aren't what you would like out of a thread like this, but this thread would be entirely useless if we were going strictly off of information that Disney releases. Heck, even their official press releases from when the DCA makeover are irrelevant now -- Walt Disney Plaza has a different name, Cars Land won't have a drive-in diner, and the Carthay Circle Theatre will no longer feature a Walt Disney Story attraction!
    We all understand where the information is coming from when it is actually coming from a source. The problems we are talking about are when it goes off of total speculation. Stated rumors are fine to speculate about... but when one person speculates and then that post is taken as fact and others build off that we are into a whole new place of not even rumors any more.

    Rumors are awesome... I love rumors. I crave new rumors at this very moment. But let's discuss them logically in light of what we actually DO know. So bring on the rumors!

    Our revels now are ended. These our actors, As I foretold you, were all spirits and Are melted into air, into thin air: And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, The cloud-capp'd towers, the gorgeous palaces, The solemn temples, the great globe itself, Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff As dreams are made on, and our little life Is rounded with a sleep. mycroft16 on Twitter

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