John Lasseter the New Walt Disney?

[Robert Cook]

Originally Posted by tmh331

When comparing the past 5 years to 20 years ago I don't see a noticeable deterioration in quality of Cm's, rides, or cleanliness.

I definitely saw a deterioration in the quality of CMs and cleanliness during the Pressler era, but they have both significantly improved since then. However, from a broader perspective, maybe some of us see a deterioration in young people in general from 20 years ago. Sorry kids, I just can't be completely honest without being brutal, and honesty is the best policy. Modern youngsters seem even more distracted and unable to focus than those of 20 years ago--it's not their fault, life is somehow different now.

Originally Posted by tmh331

On the contrary, I think the new rides are a marked improvement. Indy, splash, TSI (although I wish Tom and Huck had a greater presence),

Splash Mountain was there 19 years ago, so maybe that point in time should be the basis for comparison. And Tom Sawyer Island is "small potatoes" in any era.

Originally Posted by tmh331

all of fantasy land (a little more than 20 years ago),

Yeah, more like 25 years ago--we need to pick a date!

Originally Posted by tmh331

WInnie the pooh (yes I said it, a huge improvement of the country bears).

Bleh, I like Winnie-the-Pooh, but the ride is a snore. Country Bears was better.

Originally Posted by tmh331

nemo, toon town, Fantasmic to name a few.

I like Fantasmic! a lot so that's a point for you, but Finding Nemo is a poor excuse for a movie tie-in and Mickey's Toontown ain't so hot either--I wouldn't miss either one of them if they were closed right now, so it's not about nostalgia for me in this case. I would love to have the original Submarine Voyage back, although I'd trade it in a heartbeat for a tie-in with Disney's 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea because it's such an awesome movie. Barring this ideal scenario, I'd rather have an attraction based on Disney's Atlantis than Finding Nemo because the former is a better and way cooler movie than the latter.

Originally Posted by tmh331

Not to get off topic, but the addition of DCA - for us this is just an extension of Disneyland and therefore improves our overall experience....

That's one point of view, but there are others.

[Datameister]

Originally Posted by tmh331

I am a forward looking person with little passion for nostalgia, which I think will continue to dominate our different perspective.

Me personally...on the issue of the future versus the past, I side with the guy who said:

I love the nostalgic myself. I hope we never lose sight of some of the things of the past.

...and:

We keep moving forward, opening new doors, and doing new things, because we're curious and curiosity keeps leading us down new paths.

They're not mutually exclusive views. Respect for the past and excitement about the future can work together very nicely.

[techskip]

Originally Posted by Datameister

Me personally...on the issue of the future versus the past, I side with the guy who said:

I love the nostalgic myself. I hope we never lose sight of some of the things of the past.

...and:

We keep moving forward, opening new doors, and doing new things, because we're curious and curiosity keeps leading us down new paths.

Doesn't need to be one or the other.

Is that the same guy who said

it all started with a mouse

... and

anybody got a light?

... and

we're out of toilet paper!!!!!

Just checking...

[Datameister]

Originally Posted by techskip

Is that the same guy who said

it all started with a mouse

... and

anybody got a light?

... and

we're out of toilet paper!!!!!

Just checking...

Walt Disney never ran out of toilet paper. You need to re-read your history, techskip. I'd be ashamed if I were you.

[Jiminy Crickett]

Originally Posted by disneylanddad

I was watching the short video at the Blue Sky Cellar yesterday and it shows footage of Lasseter over seeing the models and concepts of some of the new DCA expansion projects, and it reminded me of another person that could be seen doing the same thing from time to time. Lasseter did start out in the park as a Skipper and was very instrumental in the pixar "digital" age of Disney, just as Walt was in the hand drawn animation. Also if you notice, what Lasseter does in the parks turns out incredible! Submarine voyage and Midway Mania are his most recent. I am really excited that he is heavily involved in the DCA makeover having seen his work.

So what do you think, is John Lasseter the New Walt Disney of the 21st century?

In a word. Y E S. Is he the "new" walt disney.. well for me personally, Walt will never ever be "gone" in my heart, but Lasseter is definitely as determined, passionate, smart, imaginative, creative, full of hope and dreams, and his heart IS in the right place to continue what walt brought us in the first place. I have MUCH faith in John. I wasn't old enough to "have faith" in walt so to speak, I wasn't around for his time of rise, but Lasseter is a time and I'm happy, and proud, supportive, excited and anxious to see what he makes of it. His time, I'm here for, and ready!!

[tmh331]

Robert Cook - I definitely saw a deterioration in the quality of CMs and cleanliness during the Pressler era, but they have both significantly improved since then. However, from a broader perspective, maybe some of us see a deterioration in young people in general from 20 years ago. Sorry kids, I just can't be completely honest without being brutal, and honesty is the best policy. Modern youngsters seem even more distracted and unable to focus than those of 20 years ago--it's not their fault, life is somehow different now.

I agree, but I also understanding it is a meaningless statement. You can go back to the time of the Roman Empire and find scrolls with exactly the same sediments - I think it is more a case of our skewed perception of how we were at that age versus how we really were. Often times we have a much different perception of how we were when we were young that our parents did - it is a matter of perception and every generation seem to think the new generation is found lacking their work ethic.... The simple fact is kids are lazy, they test authority, and they develop their own style (except my kids). This is what kids do, and it is the path they must take to grow into responsible people. I'm not sure why we adults fail to realize this simple truth in the younger generations, it is the same rhetoric generation after generation, you would think we would see this.



Splash Mountain was there 19 years ago, so maybe that point in time should be the basis for comparison. And Tom Sawyer Island is "small potatoes" in any era.

Yeah, more like 25 years ago--we need to pick a date!
Bleh, I like Winnie-the-Pooh, but the ride is a snore. Country Bears
I like was better. Fantasmic! a lot so that's a point for you, but Finding Nemo is a poor excuse for a movie tie-in and Mickey's Toontown ain't so hot either--I wouldn't miss either one of them if they were closed right now, so it's not about nostalgia for me in this case. I would love to have the original Submarine Voyage back, although I'd trade it in a heartbeat for a tie-in with Disney's 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea because it's such an awesome movie. Barring this ideal scenario, I'd rather have an attraction based on Disney's Atlantis than Finding Nemo because the former is a better and way cooler movie than the latter.

That's one point of view, but there are others.

Keep in mind, I did not say any of these rides were in my ideal state, but rather they had improved what was previously there. The old submarine was a bore, there is a reason it shut down - it is now updated and much more exciting - Your ideas sound much more entertaining, but the fact is I like it better in its updated format - Same with country bears, it was merely a 15 minute break and hence got shut down and replaced by something much more appealing.

How can you say TSI is small potatos? For a child (or young at heart), what better place can their be - well I guess today's kids are just to lazy and distracted to apreciate a real hands on ride, they expect their entertainment to be given to them via a climate controlled omi-mover....

[Robert Cook]

Originally Posted by tmh331

Robert Cook - I definitely saw a deterioration in the quality of CMs and cleanliness during the Pressler era, but they have both significantly improved since then. However, from a broader perspective, maybe some of us see a deterioration in young people in general from 20 years ago. Sorry kids, I just can't be completely honest without being brutal, and honesty is the best policy. Modern youngsters seem even more distracted and unable to focus than those of 20 years ago--it's not their fault, life is somehow different now.

I agree, but I also understanding it is a meaningless statement. You can go back to the time of the Roman Empire and find scrolls with exactly the same sediments -

I've certainly heard this argument a number of times before and have considered it, but I do see fundamental differences between young people raised in different cultures, and I believe that the culture of every society does change in some ways over time. Putting these two ideas together, it stands to reason that there will be real differences between different generations within a society. To this I add the notion I have that everybody--not just young adults--these days seems to always be in a hurry and have attention deficit disorder. Twenty years ago, I never, ever saw people reading things while driving, but lately I've noticed one woman reading a novel, a bus driver reading a newspaper, and several people apparently texting (I was riding shotgun at the time, which allowed me to notice these things), not to mention all the people who yap-yap-yap constantly on their cell phones while gesticulating wildly at the wheel. Back when I was a teenager, people sometimes didn't pay enough attention or were putting on makeup while operating vehicles, but there has definitely been some "progress" made in the types and level of distractions available to the average person. It's like comparing the availability and utilization of credit cards between generations--some people were nuts back then, but nothing like how nutty even more people are today.

Have you considered that maybe some things do keep getting worse over time as civilizations "progress" farther and farther away from our natural state? Rome was growing decadent, and so are we. Once in a long while, there is a "reset" as old civilizations decline and new ones arise, only to go through the same basic process that the previous ones did.

Originally Posted by tmh331

I think it is more a case of our skewed perception of how we were at that age versus how we really were.

I'm comparing my general observations of others from then and now, not of myself at that age. If I look at just myself then and now, I'd say that although I've consciously resisted many changes that others have freely embraced, I am definitely more distracted now than I was back then, even though I was already on the Internet at the time. Maybe I was wrong to frame this issue just in terms of young people, but that seemed like the most relevant point of view when I wrote it.

Originally Posted by tmh331

Often times we have a much different perception of how we were when we were young that our parents did - it is a matter of perception and every generation seem to think the new generation is found lacking their work ethic.... The simple fact is kids are lazy, they test authority, and they develop their own style (except my kids). This is what kids do, and it is the path they must take to grow into responsible people. I'm not sure why we adults fail to realize this simple truth in the younger generations, it is the same rhetoric generation after generation, you would think we would see this.

These are universal truths with which I am familiar, but society has changed and therefore kids have changed in some ways with it. In this case, it is easy to separate what you've described from the actual changes because the latter seem to have affected adults over a wide range of ages, as well.

Originally Posted by tmh331

How can you say TSI is small potatos? For a child (or young at heart), what better place can their be - well I guess today's kids are just to lazy and distracted to apreciate a real hands on ride, they expect their entertainment to be given to them via a climate controlled omi-mover....

Well, there you have it! Maybe it's true or becomes increasingly true over time.

But what I really meant was that it's not a major attraction in most people's minds. As a young child, I liked it just fine, but I rarely visited because to me the whole of Disneyland was like an even bigger and better Tom Sawyer Island.

[Mr Wiggins]

With apologies for the O.T. post... IMO anyone who thinks the general level of Disneyland professionalism today isn't enormously different that it was 50, 40, 30 and even 20 years ago, wasn't a frequent visitor.

[techskip]

Originally Posted by Mr Wiggins

With apologies for the O.T. post... IMO anyone who thinks the general level of Disneyland professionalism today isn't enormously different that it was 50, 40, 30 and even 20 years ago, wasn't a frequent visitor.

I would venture to say that the last 15 years were a decline. The next 5, mainly under Matt, saw a rebirth and a return to the old traditions of excellence that originally made Disneyland the icon it is.

I could cite a number of things that were done in preparation for, and because of, the 50th. Any one of those reasons alone would not cite a return, but all of them combined serve to support this statement. The most notable changes are the very stores on Main Street who received a fresh coat of paint for the first time in a long time. The Lilly Belle once again graces the rails of the Steam Trains, and for the first time in many years a new engine... the Ward Kimball... helps haul guests around the park. The guns are back saving people on Jungle, and the Skips have a brand new costume. The subs are once again circling the lagoon, even if it's Nemo it's still the subs. Big Thunder has a new costume, along with many other attractions. Tiki Room, one of Walt's last beloved experiments, recieved a nine month restoration that completely modernized and overhauled the show, but kept it original. A new monorail fleet has been added, which is the first time in what... 20 plus years... Sure there have been stumbles, but the reality is the park is getting some much needed TLC and the crowds that used to love Disney have returned.

[Datameister]

Originally Posted by techskip

I would venture to say that the last 15 years were a decline. The next 5, mainly under Matt, saw a rebirth and a return to the old traditions of excellence that originally made Disneyland the icon it is.

I could cite a number of things that were done in preparation for, and because of, the 50th. Any one of those reasons alone would not cite a return, but all of them combined serve to support this statement. The most notable changes are the very stores on Main Street who received a fresh coat of paint for the first time in a long time. The Lilly Belle once again graces the rails of the Steam Trains, and for the first time in many years a new engine... the Ward Kimball... helps haul guests around the park. The guns are back saving people on Jungle, and the Skips have a brand new costume. The subs are once again circling the lagoon, even if it's Nemo it's still the subs. Big Thunder has a new costume, along with many other attractions. Tiki Room, one of Walt's last beloved experiments, recieved a nine month restoration that completely modernized and overhauled the show, but kept it original. A new monorail fleet has been added, which is the first time in what... 20 plus years... Sure there have been stumbles, but the reality is the park is getting some much needed TLC and the crowds that used to love Disney have returned.

Agreed. 1995 to...perhaps 2003 was probably Disneyland's darkest hour, though there were certainly warning signs beforehand and things aren't perfect now, either. Improvements have definitely been made. I just hope that the quality of those improvements continues to increase, because Disney is still making some rather expensive missteps, IMO. They just aren't as spectacularly bad as they were in the Dark Ages.

Off topic...but I just want to say that much of my love for Disneyland actually has its roots in that dark period. That was when I first started visiting the park with any regularity, and I became very sentimentally attached to it. Not having the experience of earlier decades, it just seemed like an amazing place to me. Looking back now, I see a lot that was wrong with what was being done...very wrong with it...but it's important to realize that things never got as bad as they could have. Disneyland was still head and shoulders above the competition. That shouldn't be enough! They should always aspire to be more than that, since frankly, the competition really isn't too impressive in the first place, on the whole. But yeah...I guess my point was just that as much as I get frustrated with things that were done in the last decade or two, it's reassuring to know that the park hasn't been irreparably damaged.

The old parking lot, on the other hand...

[Cuddles McHenry]

Why cant John Lasseter just be himself? Why cant we let him be a different sort of creative genius....

[aurora1729]

Originally Posted by disneytim

Comparisons like this are unfair and unnecessary. Why does anyone have to be the new anything? Can't John Lasseter just be John Lasseter? I'd say he's doing a pretty good job so far.

^^ exactly! I love Uncle Walt as much as the next Disney Dork. I just think we have a new cool uncle and I call him Uncle John. I don't know much about his involvement in the parks, (other than his sweeper and Skip days) but in the movie field, I think he is paralell to Walt.

I would think that John would never want to be called the next Walt. But IMHO I think, At least as far as movies go, I would say he is the Current John!

BTW I liked all of the sole disney CG movies. (meet the Robinsons and Chicken little) BUT Pixar/ Uncle John, Have the midas touch.

[TwilitWings]

I think Walt Disney is one of a kind, as is John Lasseter and to deem one the "new" other, is unfair to both. I do think that some of the arguments against John Lasseter, however, are rather harsh--particularly those on his track record with rides. Lasseter hardly has comparable power with Walt Disney in terms of control over the massive corporation that Disney is now and none of us can truly know what his dreams for the next great theme park attraction is.

Also, although many would argue that the Pixar movies have not reached the heights of say, Beauty and the Beast, one must also admit that there was a pre-existing story/fable with many of the Disney stories whereas the Pixar movies do have a slightly more "original" take on things.

[Datameister]

Originally Posted by TwilitWings

I do think that some of the arguments against John Lasseter, however, are rather harsh--particularly those on his track record with rides. Lasseter hardly has comparable power with Walt Disney in terms of control over the massive corporation that Disney is now and none of us can truly know what his dreams for the next great theme park attraction is.

I don't think anyone here is trying to say that Lasseter is doing a poor job or anything - he quite simply hasn't proven his worth as a creator of original attractions. He may be desperately itching to do so, or he may have no interest in it at all. Difficult to say. But the fact of the matter is that he hasn't demonstrated whatever potential he has in that realm, which makes comparing him to Walt senseless thus far.

Also, although many would argue that the Pixar movies have not reached the heights of say, Beauty and the Beast, one must also admit that there was a pre-existing story/fable with many of the Disney stories whereas the Pixar movies do have a slightly more "original" take on things.

I like Pixar movies quite a bit - probably more than Beauty and the Beast, which I haven't seen in a long while. They are indeed highly original.

[Coheteboy]

I still think I said it best. John Lasseter is America's answer to Hiyao Miyazaki. And that's not even comparing the two. They're both animation wizards and immediately get me interested in something with their name attached.

And yes he has a job that gets to be the most like Walt, he doesn't exactly think the way Walt does. Story is key, but concept and theme seem not to be as important.