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  1. #1

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    What would it take for the Subs to fit in Tommorowland?

    To be clear at the outset...this is not intended as a thread to discuss the relative merits of the current attraction occupying the lagoon, whatever my feelings of it may be (not good). My question is, what do you think it would take to make a attraction relevant to being part of Tommorowland? What about a undersea voyage taking place in the supposed "future" with a sleek, futuristic looking sub, to see the depths of the sea populated with advanced robotics and strangely evolved ocean life? What if it was themed to the ocean on another undiscovered world, and was a more action/science fiction themed ride with odd, menacing creatures and a storyline regarding being the first visitors to this environment? Or do you think re-hauling the entire experience to be a much more vintage/steampunk Victorian Jules Verne-esque experience with the return of the giant squid and the story of the Nautilus would be the way to go? True, any of these is unlikely to happen, sadly...but what are your ideas or thoughts?

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    Re: What would it take for the Subs to fit in Tommorowland?

    If they journeyed to the center of the earth.


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    Re: What would it take for the Subs to fit in Tommorowland?

    two words: Flux Capacitor
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  4. #4

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    Re: What would it take for the Subs to fit in Tommorowland?

    Quote Originally Posted by DLcastmbr View Post
    two words: Flux Capacitor
    Heh, good call.

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    Re: What would it take for the Subs to fit in Tommorowland?

    A sleek, Tomorrowland-ish redesign of the subs would be a must, though I must admit I love the extant subs and their vivid paint job. While the real subs of tomorrow may end up looking very similar to those we see today, featuring such subs would not (and does not) help the theme of Tomorrowland.

    Naturally, cartoon characters would be out, since Disney has never done an underwater futuristic universe. (Atlantis being somewhat of an exception, but Disney decided against that after the movie inexplicably didn't do so well. I liked it. *shrug*)

    Steampunk is also out. That's great for DLP's Discoveryland, but it doesn't make sense in Tomorrowland.

    Perhaps the best way would be to make it a futuristic journey into and below the oceanic crust. It starts out in the ocean, and you descend deeper and deeper through the water until you reach a tunnel that has been carved into the rock. You then pass into a huge cavern where materials are being mined or something. That might be a good point for the whole "and then something goes horribly wrong" motif...

    The point is, humanity has scarcely explored anything deeper than the top of the planet's crust. That's a frontier that we'll no doubt be probing for many centuries to come. The ocean holds a lot of unknowns, but it's a more familiar and less futuristic venue. Could be worth doing something with in Tomorrowland, and the subs would be the best place for that.

    EDIT: Note that this would be more realistic and futuristic than Journey to the Center of the Earth.


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    Re: What would it take for the Subs to fit in Tommorowland?

    I've got some great ideas on this one. Excellent question darkfairycthulu. I'll write it up and post it later when I'm not so busy.

    Our revels now are ended. These our actors, As I foretold you, were all spirits and Are melted into air, into thin air: And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, The cloud-capp'd towers, the gorgeous palaces, The solemn temples, the great globe itself, Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff As dreams are made on, and our little life Is rounded with a sleep. mycroft16 on Twitter

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    Re: What would it take for the Subs to fit in Tommorowland?

    Quote Originally Posted by Datameister View Post
    A sleek, Tomorrowland-ish redesign of the subs would be a must, though I must admit I love the extant subs and their vivid paint job. While the real subs of tomorrow may end up looking very similar to those we see today, featuring such subs would not (and does not) help the theme of Tomorrowland.

    Naturally, cartoon characters would be out, since Disney has never done an underwater futuristic universe. (Atlantis being somewhat of an exception, but Disney decided against that after the movie inexplicably didn't do so well. I liked it. *shrug*)

    EDITED
    Count me in on wanting the subs to be redesigned first off, and I like your ideas for the upper crust of the Earth's surface/tunnel idea, though I personally would want to see some weird/monstrous sea life....but hey, what can I say, I like monsters. Heh. I agree with you as well on Atlantis...I quite enjoyed that movie, it was something different and had a fun kind of forties adventure story/lost society feel and I liked the style of all the technology and such, it was a good adventure flick. Too bad it didn't do better overall...

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    Re: What would it take for the Subs to fit in Tommorowland?

    It's very simple, modernize the original concept of Submarine Voyage which is what they should have done in the first place. Restore Walt's vision of underwater exploration!

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    Re: What would it take for the Subs to fit in Tommorowland?

    I LOVE the idea that Darkfairy put out there. I have long thought that we, as a human race, should explore the possibilities of colonizing the ocean floor. The whole idea is futuristic enough. Remember, 2/3 of our planet is covered with water. Imangine all the real estate possibilities!!!!!

    I've even designed a personal high-speed submersible that I feel has potential for use in the FUTURE! The subs for a futuristic ocean expedition attraction would have to be sleek. I do like the subs they have now, but maybe just paint them a different color and add a some new details.

    Remember, not ALL of the attractions that were in Tomorrowland had a plot. Many were just educational (ie. Adventure Thruough Inner Space). Many of the attractions in Epcot are educational as well, and equally just as interesting and fun to visit. Wasn't the whole idea of Tomorrowland to be of ideas and concepts that we MIGHT see in the future? Since when did every new attraction have to be a "thrill ride"?

    I like Datameister's idea, but I don't think it necessarily needs a "and then, something goes wrong" motif. Just something to educate. If you put in a "and then..." scenario, then the credability of exploration of below the ocean's crust could be shot to heck. People would see it as too dangerous, and something that would most likely never happen. Of course, they did say the same thing before we put a man on the moon....

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    Re: What would it take for the Subs to fit in Tommorowland?

    I'm not a big fan of the wet for dry sets or the cartoon fish. I'm with everyone else about returning the attraction to an updated version of the original exploration theme.

    While they're at it, I suggest they add a restaurant with an underwater view of the lagoon called "Finding Nemo Sushi" as a nod to the current attraction.
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    Re: What would it take for the Subs to fit in Tommorowland?

    Quote Originally Posted by darkfairycthulu View Post
    My question is, what do you think it would take to make a attraction relevant to being part of Tommorowland?
    We--and WDI--first need to define what Tomorrowland is going to be about, moving forward. Yes, it's supposed to be about the future, but just like Adventureland focuses on the exploration of "exotic" jungles, Tomorrowland needs a more defined, unifying context (or does it?).

    Quote Originally Posted by darkfairycthulu View Post
    What about a undersea voyage taking place in the supposed "future" with a sleek, futuristic looking sub, to see the depths of the sea populated with advanced robotics and strangely evolved ocean life?
    What I'd like is a return to something more "science factual" in flavor like Tomorrowland used to be, even if it is highly speculative. The subs could explore various regions of the Earth that have not yet been explored to any significant degree, as well as the aquatic environments of other planets and their moons, such as Europa. If the Disneyland Railroad can travel through every land of Disneyland, the Grand Canyon, and even back in time to the Primeval World, I don't see why the subs--another archetypal vehicle--couldn't travel to all of those other places during one trip.

    Quote Originally Posted by darkfairycthulu View Post
    What if it was themed to the ocean on another undiscovered world, and was a more action/science fiction themed ride with odd, menacing creatures and a storyline regarding being the first visitors to this environment?
    Maybe, but it would have to be a really good story.

    Quote Originally Posted by darkfairycthulu View Post
    Or do you think re-hauling the entire experience to be a much more vintage/steampunk Victorian Jules Verne-esque experience with the return of the giant squid and the story of the Nautilus would be the way to go? True, any of these is unlikely to happen, sadly...but what are your ideas or thoughts?
    While I'm not for the idea of "retro-future" theming Tomorrowland, if that is done, then heck yes, a 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea theme for the subs would be awesome! To be honest, I wouldn't complain too loudly if they bring the real Nemo--Captain Nemo--to the Submarine Voyage, whatever Tomorrowland's overall theme. A ride based on Disney's Atlantis: The Lost Empire would be a significant improvement as well, in my opinion.

    Quote Originally Posted by Datameister View Post
    Naturally, cartoon characters would be out, since Disney has never done an underwater futuristic universe. (Atlantis being somewhat of an exception, but Disney decided against that after the movie inexplicably didn't do so well. I liked it. *shrug*)
    People were pretty biased against Disney animated features by that time, I recall. Although I would not necessarily consider the community of home theater enthusiasts representative of the general population, plenty of them bought the Atlantis DVD just for the killer soundtrack, and found to their surprise that they liked the movie (I guess they assumed that it would suck for some reason). Equally inexplicable to me is the tremendous box office total of Finding Nemo, which I consider one of Pixar's weakest, most lackluster efforts--while they haven't made a BAD movie so far, this isn't really a good one, either, in my opinion. Atlantis is a lot more interesting and fun, as well as conducive to a ride experience. But as far as Disney management is concerned, money talks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Datameister View Post
    Perhaps the best way would be to make it a futuristic journey into and below the oceanic crust. It starts out in the ocean, and you descend deeper and deeper through the water until you reach a tunnel that has been carved into the rock. You then pass into a huge cavern where materials are being mined or something. That might be a good point for the whole "and then something goes horribly wrong" motif...
    I like this idea because it is tied to something that people are doing, which opens up more possibilities for a sense of guest involvement rather than just passively viewing things. Maybe the subs could be equipped with large drills on their noses and could pretend to be drilling deeper and deeper into the Earth with each successive scene, finding all kinds of weird things along the way, as well as getting into an emergency from which they can just barely escape.

  12. #12

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    Re: What would it take for the Subs to fit in Tommorowland?

    The funny answer to the OP's question is "With A Crowbar".

    That being said I really think the cartoon addition of Nemo took everything futuristic out of it. People say that speaking with fish could be something we achieve down the road, but with cartoon fish this really doesn't work. It's all about exploration. Exploring new uncharted area, exploring possible areas to be an underwater city, exploring for new species or new fuel alternatives.

    Yeah, pretty much anything but looking for a fish's school-age child.

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    Re: What would it take for the Subs to fit in Tommorowland?

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Cook View Post
    We--and WDI--first need to define what Tomorrowland is going to be about, moving forward. Yes, it's supposed to be about the future, but just like Adventureland focuses on the exploration of "exotic" jungles, Tomorrowland needs a more defined, unifying context (or does it?).
    Exactly. Even if you never come out and state it explicitly, every well-themed park/land/attraction has a lot more to its theme than a single word.

    People were pretty biased against Disney animated features by that time, I recall. Although I would not necessarily consider the community of home theater enthusiasts representative of the general population, plenty of them bought the Atlantis DVD just for the killer soundtrack, and found to their surprise that they liked the movie (I guess they assumed that it would suck for some reason).
    Makes sense.

    Equally inexplicable to me is the tremendous box office total of Finding Nemo, which I consider one of Pixar's weakest, most lackluster efforts--while they haven't made a BAD movie so far, this isn't really a good one, either, in my opinion.
    That is disagree with, though. I really enjoyed Finding Nemo, although it got a little old after I saw it a few more times than I normally would.

    Atlantis is a lot more interesting and fun, as well as conducive to a ride experience.
    But as a ride experience, yes, I would have preferred to see Atlantis in there. But it would wouldn't have business sense, of course. Which is why they should have gone with the original story route...but oh well.


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    Re: What would it take for the Subs to fit in Tommorowland?

    I agree that without a stronger direction it's hard to say which direction it should go. If they had written a new Nemo story with Nemo as an adult and tied it into a future based theme better, maybe Nemo could have actually been a better attraction in a lot of ways. Maybe he is still young, but gets caught in a time machine, and we have to help him get back to his own time. I don't know, but I know that they could have used Nemo in a better way then just retelling the movie. I guess the other options are all potentially cool, depending on how they fit with the overall theme. Or the other option with Nemo could have been to shift the entrance more toward Fantasyland, but that would have cost a small fortune.
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    Re: What would it take for the Subs to fit in Tommorowland?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lore View Post
    While they're at it, I suggest they add a restaurant with an underwater view of the lagoon called "Finding Nemo Sushi" as a nod to the current attraction.
    Ouch.

    and touche

    What would it take for the Subs to fit in TommorowLand?
    - a shoe-horn?
    - another miracle?
    - redistricting?
    - a tidal wave?

    Personally, I had always wanted (when the Subs were dark / prior to the Nemo make-over) to see the Autopia and the Submarines re-done into a semi-interconnected attraction: the Autopia vehicles updated and modernized into Mars-rover-type craft that go through tunnels and tubes under and above water, and the submarines re-worked into an exploratory-themed attraction showing the 'recent' colonization of humanity under the seas... I thought that this would have brought both attractions into the 21st Century by pushing it somewhat beyond the current (or the past...).

    Oh well.
    "I've got the heart of a child..." - I keep it in a box, next to my bed...

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