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  1. #46

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    Re: "Disneyland will never be completed." - Why the resistance to change?

    Quote Originally Posted by mycroft16 View Post
    Ok, so how does adding the classic Disney characters make iasw more "relevant" (using your definition as stated in the above quote) for current generations? It is still a boat ride through a bunch of sad, 4 decade old animatronics.

    Adding the characters doesn't make this ride any more relevant, so the whole update because, by very definition, irrelevant. The kind of relevance you are talking about is technical relevance. That involves making the ride experience and the way in which you experience it fundamentally different from the passive float through. Adding character AA's has nothing to do with this sort of relevance. Neither does adding Jack Sparrow to a ride for that matter. By your own definition, Disney has failed to make iasw relevant.

    Just because it is done everywhere else does not make it right. Just because there is genocide and racial slaughter all over the world does not mean we should do it here. Just because Coney Island and Magic Mountain do it does not mean Disney should. Disney became the gold standard by NOT doing what everyone else is doing. By being different. By being better than your average expectations. This is why relevance is not a good idea at Disneyland. Relevance means you need to make it like everyone else. What is relevant is what is the norm, the average, the mean. And Disney is so far above this that thinking you need to be relevant is almost a sickening thought.

    That song has a power that few songs in the world ever have. It doesn't matter who you are or where in the world you go, like it or hate it, everyone has an opinion of that song. There are very few things in this world that have that kind of power and penetration. The song itself is one of incredible simplistic beauty whose melody is maleable enough to be altered to fit any mode or theme imagineable. The words are timeless and are even more applicable and important today than they were the day they were first penned. Think about what these few words really mean and you understand exactly what the ride is supposed to be about:

    How on Earth do the Disney characters fulfill this simple, elegant and beautiful goal that the children of the world do? It doesn't matter to a child what color skin they have, or where they are from. They don't need to speak the same language to be friends. A smile means friendship to everyone. This song is about all of us putting aside differences and learning from the children of this world how to live in peace. It is probably the single most hopeful entertainment, in every element of its construction, in the world.

    Exactly... Instead of allowing people to continue to wallow in the mire of ignorance, let's instead educate them. Pass on the knowledge and love of these classic stories and characters. It honestly isn't that hard. I am a child of the 80s as well, and I too know and love all these characters.

    Maybe you don't quite understand what I mean by relevance because you're so blinded by your opinions you're unwilling to see the other side of the coin, something I'm also familiar with and something I don't blame you for. I have opinions, I don't think the ride needs to be changed, but aside from my own thinking, I'm able to dissect and recognize the reasoning behind it.

    Adding familiar characters to a ride that most people skip is probably done to draw more people in. Yes, this has to do with relevance in order to appeal to today's audience. Most children are familiar with the character's they've put in, I'm sure showing the characters in their respective countries will cause them to point them out, spark curiosity, etc. The message of the ride is one that is generally glossed over - sorry to say. I doubt many children, or even adults, really pay attention or care enough to "get it." Aside from holiday time, when is there ever really a line for IASW?

    " Just because there is genocide and racial slaughter all over the world does not mean we should do it here. " Now we're just being extreme. Comparing common business practice of WANTING TO MAKE MONEY to genocide is just ridiculous. If every business sacrificed the basic goal of wanting to make money, our economy would probably be in a stickier situation that it is now.

    See the correlation there? What was the figure released the other day? A 32% profit loss first quarter for the company and 4% for theme parks? Disneyland is a catalyst for the entire company. Updating attractions attracts more guests and brings people back. More guests means more money. It's a very simple equation.

  2. #47

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    Re: "Disneyland will never be completed." - Why the resistance to change?

    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Bob View Post
    I don't understand this relevance arguement. How are Pirates from several hundred years ago any more or less relevant to people from the sixties or today? The attraction seems nearly identically as busy now as before the changes to me. How you can describe any popular ride as not being relevant makes no sense. On the other hand why are other obviously irrelevant attractions like HISTA and Innoventions left for so long if relevance is Disney's motive for changing attractions?
    The original POTC was a long standing attraction on its own. I don't disagree with that. I also don't disagree with the fact it probably didn't need to be updated to stay relevant. But guess what today's teenagers and kids think of when they hear POTC? The movies. Not the ride, like most of us. "Branding" the ride with familiar characters from one of the highest grossing movies of all time probably wouldn't hurt a business model.

    I'm not sure why HISTA is still around, just as I'm not sure most of the Tomorrowland attractions aside from Space Mountain are still around. If TL had a complete overhaul, I doubt most would complain.

  3. #48

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    Re: "Disneyland will never be completed." - Why the resistance to change?

    Quote Originally Posted by sunnygirl View Post
    I know I am a frequent supporter of change in the parks. I am always excited to see the new additions and updates to beloved rides. Do I always like them? No, but I don't go into the experience looking to be dismayed or let down. As stated previously, Disneyland is not a museum. And regardless of the reason for the changes, they are happening all over. The world is ever changing and fluid. Why should Disneyland be any different?

    Wow, someone who doesn't wear their emotions on their sleeve? Is this possible? I feel like, although people here feel strongly about their own opinions, anyone in disagreance or providing an argument is jumped on.

  4. #49

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    Re: "Disneyland will never be completed." - Why the resistance to change?

    Quote Originally Posted by brenden View Post
    Wow, someone who doesn't wear their emotions on their sleeve? Is this possible?
    I occasionally have lucid moments.
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  5. #50

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    Re: "Disneyland will never be completed." - Why the resistance to change?

    I think change is a good thing. With more technological advances WDI can make new and better rides. Movie tie in's, on the other hand I'm not to sure about. I don't think replacing classic attractions for movie based attractions is the right idea. If the attraction is outdated and unpopular (HISTA) I would be fine with replacing it for a Wall-e ride, but if the attraction is popular and still very fun (Matterhorn) replacing it for a Wall-e ride would just backfire.

  6. #51

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    Re: "Disneyland will never be completed." - Why the resistance to change?

    Quote Originally Posted by brenden View Post
    Disneyland needs to stay current and appealing to today's youth.
    Today's youth = 2009

    Pinocchio = 1940
    The Three Cabelleros = 1944
    Cinderella = 1950
    Alice in Wonderland = 1951
    The Little Mermaid = 1989
    Aladdin = 1992
    The Lion King = 1994
    Mulan = 1998
    Toy Story / Toy Story 2 = 1995 / 1999
    Lilo and Stitch = 2002
    Finding Nemo = 2003

    The most recent film now represented in "it's a small world" is Finding Nemo, which is going on 6 years old.

    How do film characters that are decades old make a ride that is also decades old any more relevant than it already is?

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  7. #52

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    Re: "Disneyland will never be completed." - Why the resistance to change?

    I feel like we all should calm down and wait until we actually KNOW what is changed in the ride. How is it logical to complain about something if you haven't even experienced that yet? Once you ride IASW(for example), then you should give your opinion! I really hope this will ease tensions.
    "To all who come to this happy place - welcome. Disneyland is your land. Here age relives fond memories of the past and here youth may savor the challenge and promise of the future. Disneyland is dedicated to the ideals, the dreams, and the hard facts that have created America... with the hope that it will be a source of joy and inspiration to all the world. Thank you."

    —Walter E. Disney, July 17, 1955



    LONG LIVE Disneyland!!

  8. #53

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    Re: "Disneyland will never be completed." - Why the resistance to change?

    Quote Originally Posted by disney55 View Post
    I feel like we all should calm down and wait until we actually KNOW what is changed in the ride. How is it logical to complain about something if you haven't even experienced that yet? Once you ride IASW(for example), then you should give your opinion! I really hope this will ease tensions.
    There's photos and video of everything that's changed. We know what's changed.

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  9. #54

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    Re: "Disneyland will never be completed." - Why the resistance to change?

    I for one agree with brenden. I love change and i am totally for it. IASW for example to me is great because it pumps in more excitement and more to see. I remember as a kid I HATEDDDDDDDD that ride because it was boring and i went to Disneyland for characters and for "other rides" if I were 5 years old right now id be so stoked! (even though I already am) LOL

  10. #55

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    Re: "Disneyland will never be completed." - Why the resistance to change?

    Quote Originally Posted by disney55 View Post
    I feel like we all should calm down and wait until we actually KNOW what is changed in the ride. How is it logical to complain about something if you haven't even experienced that yet? Once you ride IASW(for example), then you should give your opinion! I really hope this will ease tensions.
    Disney55, I think you may have posted in the wrong thread. This is not about IASW changes specifically. Please read the whole thread (especially the original post) before posting.
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  11. #56

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    Re: "Disneyland will never be completed." - Why the resistance to change?

    Well I read most of the thread, and many people thought that this was about IASW changes, so I was only trying to help.
    "To all who come to this happy place - welcome. Disneyland is your land. Here age relives fond memories of the past and here youth may savor the challenge and promise of the future. Disneyland is dedicated to the ideals, the dreams, and the hard facts that have created America... with the hope that it will be a source of joy and inspiration to all the world. Thank you."

    —Walter E. Disney, July 17, 1955



    LONG LIVE Disneyland!!

  12. #57

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    Re: "Disneyland will never be completed." - Why the resistance to change?

    Quote Originally Posted by disney55 View Post
    Well I read most of the thread, and many people thought that this was about IASW changes, so I was only trying to help.
    Help what? While your intent was noble, there was nothing here that needed help. On MC, we welcome ALL different opinions and points of view. Sometimes the conversations become a bit heated, but nobody has started throwing chairs or cracking skulls up in here just yet.
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  13. #58

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    Re: "Disneyland will never be completed." - Why the resistance to change?

    Quote Originally Posted by brenden View Post
    Adding familiar characters to a ride that most people skip is probably done to draw more people in. Yes, this has to do with relevance in order to appeal to today's audience. Most children are familiar with the character's they've put in, I'm sure showing the characters in their respective countries will cause them to point them out, spark curiosity, etc. The message of the ride is one that is generally glossed over - sorry to say. I doubt many children, or even adults, really pay attention or care enough to "get it." Aside from holiday time, when is there ever really a line for IASW?

    Most people skip? Hang on a second. Compare most people skipping "it's a small world" to all the people who skip anything in A Bug's Land. Do you think the Disney company has its priorities straight? By that logic, that Bug's Land should have been covered with a circus tent and fumigated already.

    Small World got new characters because it's 100% business politics and that's sad when it takes over TRUE creativity. They're meddling with things because it's going under for a refurb anyway basically and somehow, it's easier to get money while something is going down for that long. Oh and incidentally, Hong Kong Small World is building all this, let's double the order and save on costs!

    :::greenlight stamp:::

    Let's also tell everyone in disneyland-land that whatever is going on in Hong Kong is NOT going on in California.

    :::lie:::



    Okay so.. I basically DON'T disagree with you. I understand why it's all being done. But it's not for kids. It's just business. This whole excuse that Disneyland is changing, and kids will love the characters... it's all just a cover up so they can keep their jobs and say that they work at Disneyland.

    They know they could be work on bettering what really NEEDS improvement. But somewhere up the chain of command, that's not happening.


    Change is good. But when you change something that has worked for 40+ years though... you risk alienating your audience. It's like taking someone else's film and doing your own edit to it. If you're enhancing the sound and colors, that's one thing. But if you rewrote the script and added your own scenes... that's something else altogether.


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  14. #59

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    Re: "Disneyland will never be completed." - Why the resistance to change?

    Quote Originally Posted by sunnygirl View Post
    But one person's "improve the park" is another person's "ruin the park". One person may feel strongly in their heart that the change IS improving the park, while the next guy may feel exactly the opposite. SO who's to say, in the end, whether it's an improvement or not? That's a dicey argument at best, IMO.
    I know, I was being tongue-in-cheek, in reference to the way certain posters like to use certain quotes as "evidence" for all change being beneficial.


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    Talking Re: "Disneyland will never be completed." - Why the resistance to change?

    Help what? While your intent was noble, there was nothing here that needed help. On MC, we welcome ALL different opinions and points of view. Sometimes the conversations become a bit heated, but nobody has started throwing chairs or cracking skulls up in here just yet.
    I know what you mean!
    "To all who come to this happy place - welcome. Disneyland is your land. Here age relives fond memories of the past and here youth may savor the challenge and promise of the future. Disneyland is dedicated to the ideals, the dreams, and the hard facts that have created America... with the hope that it will be a source of joy and inspiration to all the world. Thank you."

    —Walter E. Disney, July 17, 1955



    LONG LIVE Disneyland!!

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