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  1. #16

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    Re: How they do make the lights in Indiana Jones Adventure flicker and dimmed?

    Quote Originally Posted by disneyfan07 View Post


    attempt #2 at GETTING A DAMN ANSWER!!!!!!

    the light flickering effects, are they similar to the effects used in haunted mansion(the chandelier(s), and other lights?)
    With an attitude like that, you'll never get an answer.


    I'm sure the HM candles and every other flickering bulb is done the same way.

  2. #17

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    Re: How they do make the lights in Indiana Jones Adventure flicker and dimmed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nautilus View Post
    I'm sure the HM candles and every other flickering bulb is done the same way.
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  3. #18

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    Re: How they do make the lights in Indiana Jones Adventure flicker and dimmed?

    Quote Originally Posted by ryanvalle View Post
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    Yes, Pixie Dust

  4. #19

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    Re: How they do make the lights in Indiana Jones Adventure flicker and dimmed?

    The Indiana Jones lights likely go to a DMX or Midi controller. I've done it both ways. A simple sequencer box or computer can easily play as many audio tracks as you want and synchronize them with as many lights as you want. When the Indiana Jones ride first opened, I swore they had the lights over the bridge black out in sync with monkey passing sounds. I could have been imagining it, but such effects are easily doable. What's cool about Indian Jones is that the bulbs are very dim 100 watt bulbs. This allows a service mode where the same bulbs used for the effect are brought up to full brightness. The life span of the bulbs must also be very high, seeing as they are barely lit most of the time.

    The Haunted Mansion uses a variety of techniques. The bulbs around Leota appear to be mechanical wiggle flame bulbs dimmed such that they barely move, likely to increase the life. The NBC Overlay bulbs use LEDs controlled by a local micro-controller. The "gas" lamps and other fixtures use what appears to be a local 120V flicker effect. There are multiple ways to do this, from a mechanical cam effect, to a microprocessor controlled dimmer, to a full DMX or MIDI dimmer feed by a sequencer or program.

    I flicker nearly everything in my house and yard and use computers when it's part of a show, and microcontrollers when it's off somewhere and just needs to work. Either way, it's great fun to program a flicker.
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  5. #20

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    Re: How they do make the lights in Indiana Jones Adventure flicker and dimmed?

    Quote Originally Posted by FantasyWatersDude View Post
    Indy's lights are on a dimmer, all of the dimming is programmed for the attraction. However, power to the dimmer itself is on a relay that turns on and off rapidly giving it that nice flickering/on/off effect.

    They have an entire dimmer system developed for all of the lanterns/flickering lights park-wide. Big Thunder, HM, Adventureland, TSI, Fantasyland.
    By dimmer, you mean a dimming pack for a DMX signal right? Why would you use a switch/relay before a dimming pack, when the dimming pack could do it itself through the DMX sequence?

  6. #21

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    Re: How they do make the lights in Indiana Jones Adventure flicker and dimmed?

    You could use a Flickermaster to do the same thing at home. GAM : Lighting Equipment For Architectural, Specialty & Theatrical Effects

    I don't know what lighting controller they're using, but modern lighting boards come with a built-in effects engine. To be very rudimentary:

    Lighting fixture-->Circuit-->Dimmer-->Lighting board

    The board has a series of cues programmed into it, in this case making the lights flicker by sending a signal to the dimmer to control the amount of power going to the circuit which in turn raises and lowers the intensity of the bulb.
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  7. #22

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    Re: How they do make the lights in Indiana Jones Adventure flicker and dimmed?

    the things you learn on this board... i never once before thought about how much thought and devices and programming goes into making all these lights in the park FLICKER!
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  8. #23

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    Re: How they do make the lights in Indiana Jones Adventure flicker and dimmed?

    considering most of these attractions were done pre-digital control system days... I wouldn't be surprised to hear most of them are done with simple analog control circuits. Back in the day you would design a circuit to do your work.. not write lines of script code
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  9. #24

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    Re: How they do make the lights in Indiana Jones Adventure flicker and dimmed?

    Geez you guys! Now you've got me worked up and curious! Now that I'm replying, I might as well ask a few questions. Now, obviously Indy is on one channel, (aka one control over one circuit.) or a few channels all programmed to the same sequence. Now, it works this way because it is on a "generator" controlling all the lights, and hence, you would not want the lights flickering differently. Now comes my question. How many channels does it take to light the chandeliers in HM? They obviously all can't flicker all together, because that wouldn't look like flickering bulbs. And, then again, you wouldn't want to give each bulb it's own individual channel, because then you'd have an unmanageable number of wires, like 500! So, obviously you'd want to group some, but not too many together to make the effect believable but keep wires manageable. An example could be 10 channels. With 500 lights, you would pick out 50 random bulbs, wire them together, and call it a flicker channel. Rinse, lather, repeat.... I'm also now curious as to why they would use Digital Multiplexing (DMX) to control the lights in Indy. That seems like the hard way to do it. I'm a huge fan of DMX (the system ), but by using DMX to control only one channel, you would need an interfacing system to the computer, a program to run the system, dimmers along the way, and more. As suggested earlier, they simply could run a triac via a computer, and eliminate some complication. Just a thought. And disneyfan07, if you were to ask pleasantly, I would just point you to my reply above.




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  10. #25

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    Re: How they do make the lights in Indiana Jones Adventure flicker and dimmed?

    This ride was built pre-internet (I know... crazy huh?) so this is a very old-school, analog, simple solution.

    It Came From the GARAGE OF EVIL!! :: Projects :: Gaslight Flicker Circuit
    This link contains instructions to built a flickering light bulb using the fluorescent tube starter from a fluorescent light fixture. Works great. I know this isn't the solution they have, but it's probably the same idea... a simple circuit that controls the voltage flow to the bulbs. When the ride goes 101, this circuit is bypassed and the lights go full on.

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  11. #26

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    Re: How they do make the lights in Indiana Jones Adventure flicker and dimmed?

    Quote Originally Posted by KAN View Post
    How many channels does it take to light the chandeliers in HM? They obviously all can't flicker all together, because that wouldn't look like flickering bulbs. And, then again, you wouldn't want to give each bulb it's own individual channel, because then you'd have an unmanageable number of wires, like 500!
    More reason why you don't do digital control of every lamp. You build circuits that operate autonomously that can be bypassed if need be.

    You all are thinking in terms of the tools you have available in terms of computer control - this isn't the simplest way to do things. Simple analog electronics can do these things. The great thing about WDI's work is their ability to focus on simplicity and still be able to deliver the effect.
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  12. #27

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    Re: How they do make the lights in Indiana Jones Adventure flicker and dimmed?

    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    More reason why you don't do digital control of every lamp. You build circuits that operate autonomously that can be bypassed if need be.

    You all are thinking in terms of the tools you have available in terms of computer control - this isn't the simplest way to do things. Simple analog electronics can do these things. The great thing about WDI's work is their ability to focus on simplicity and still be able to deliver the effect.
    Exactly. Take AA's for example. They were originally run with big LP style platters that had raised sections that would push actuators up and down. Then it was sound cues that ran them, now they have become digital only recently.

    Digital is great and all, but why waste the time and expense when it can be done much cheaper, must faster and much more reliably with a simple analog circuit. As flynn said, what makes WDI great is that they know ALL the tools at their disposal and when to use which tool. Analog still has it's place.

    Our revels now are ended. These our actors, As I foretold you, were all spirits and Are melted into air, into thin air: And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, The cloud-capp'd towers, the gorgeous palaces, The solemn temples, the great globe itself, Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff As dreams are made on, and our little life Is rounded with a sleep. mycroft16 on Twitter

  13. #28

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    Re: How they do make the lights in Indiana Jones Adventure flicker and dimmed?

    The flickering lights are due to the hamster inside the generator taking a break every now and then. When the ride breaks it scares the hamster into running at full speed thereby giving the lights full brightness.
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  14. #29

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    Re: How they do make the lights in Indiana Jones Adventure flicker and dimmed?

    Quote Originally Posted by BurtGummer View Post
    By dimmer, you mean a dimming pack for a DMX signal right? Why would you use a switch/relay before a dimming pack, when the dimming pack could do it itself through the DMX sequence?
    Some lights such as arc-source and fluorescent fixtures can't be dimmed with a normal dimmer module. There are special dimmer modules available for fluorescent lights but with arc-source its usually just on-off. You can use a dowser for those but it's not the same as dimming it.
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  15. #30

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    Re: How they do make the lights in Indiana Jones Adventure flicker and dimmed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Exprmnt626 View Post
    Some lights such as arc-source and fluorescent fixtures can't be dimmed with a normal dimmer module. There are special dimmer modules available for fluorescent lights but with arc-source its usually just on-off. You can use a dowser for those but it's not the same as dimming it.
    Though that is correct, I don't think that's what BurtGummer was asking. Indy's queue uses normal incandescent light bulbs which can be electronically dimmed.
    What I think he was asking is why use a relay switch if the dimmer itself can kill 2 birds with 1 stone and do the dimming and flicker. To answer that, electronic dimmers (more specifically DMX controlled dimmers) are not designed for rapid fast fades. They can with-stand chases like you see in rock concerts, but anything faster can really take toll on the transformers in the dimmers. Relay's are designed for such rapid on/off action.

    I invite you all to read this:
    Programming Attraction(s) - PLSN
    It doesn't quite give us an answer, but does explain some cool stuff about attraction lighting and programming.

    I'm with FantasyWatersDude. From the looks of that article, the lights are pre-programmed from a lighting console that has a effects generator built-in. At a rapid pace, the board sends on/off values to the relay as well as controls the max brightness of the lights through a dimmer. If the attraction goes 101, a command can be sent to the board to turn the relay off, and dimmers at full. It is also SMPTE timecoded with the generator sound effects.

    But that's using the latest technology (or was 14 years ago.)
    I read somewhere, for the Haunted Mansion flicker lights, Walt himself designed a mechanism/board that created random voltage spikes. He created it in the early design stages of the HM before he past away. Imagineers dug up the prints and installed the device(s) for all the candles in the Mansion.

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