Disneyland: Not the Same Without Implied Danger?

[darkfairycthulu]

Originally Posted by mycroft16

The OP is made of WIN. I can not add to that most excellent post.

Thank you very much Mycroft! I appreciate that quite a bit.

[Professortango]

This is the issue I had when I heard about the new Radiator Springs Racers. Such a thrilling attraction design applied to a humdrum theme. Racing has no real stakes, especially when the guests can't really control the vehicles. Racing from danger or chasing something or escaping or anything with stakes puts an emotional investment into the attraction. Don't get me wrong, I'll enjoy speeding around in a car. But it'll be a purely physical thrill without engaging me mentally or emotionally.

[darkfairycthulu]

Originally Posted by Professortango

This is the issue I had when I heard about the new Radiator Springs Racers. Such a thrilling attraction design applied to a humdrum theme. Racing has no real stakes, especially when the guests can't really control the vehicles. Racing from danger or chasing something or escaping or anything with stakes puts an emotional investment into the attraction. Don't get me wrong, I'll enjoy speeding around in a car. But it'll be a purely physical thrill without engaging me mentally or emotionally.

Thank you Professor, you are quite right. This is an excellent point, I am glad you raised it. It's all about Disney perceiving characters need a ride, not that something will be an exciting experience or have personal involvement from guests, the way I see it from how Racers has been pitched.

[caligirl09]

That is so true. I wait for the day that the DLR gets a thrilling ride at the "Dinosaur" level. I'm thinking that the updated star tours and little mermaid attractions may be thrilling- well to an extent.

[Datameister]

Originally Posted by Professortango

Don't get me wrong, I'll enjoy speeding around in a car. But it'll be a purely physical thrill without engaging me mentally or emotionally.

I wish I could say more, but for legal reasons, I can't. So all I'm going to say is...you're wrong. Very, very wrong. Understandably so, considering the limited information that's been made public, but still wrong. And when 2012 comes, you are going to be SO happy to experience the proof.

[GhostHost2]

I agree fully with the OP, but let's not forget that the Queen of Hearts wants to decapitate you in Alice. One of my fears for the DCA expansion is the lack of implied danger in attractions. RSR has already been discussed. If RSR is simply racing around with no implied danger, it will never be the next Indy. Also, Little Mermaid has potential for implied danger, but I am fearing that the scary parts of the story such as Ursula will be toned down and minimized in favorite of cutesy scenes.

[DisneyIzz]

I think the classic Disney cartoons are built into most areas of the park, yet, I also don't get why there have been no recent additions of more thrilling, fearsome rides. Even little kids get a kick out of the sense of not knowing what's coming next in a ride. Hopefully Disney will come to the realisation that they can still have the whimsical, cheerful atmosphere, always present in Disney parks, but still give people something to scream about!

[disneyfann121]

Originally Posted by Datameister

I wish I could say more, but for legal reasons, I can't. So all I'm going to say is...you're wrong. Very, very wrong. Understandably so, considering the limited information that's been made public, but still wrong. And when 2012 comes, you are going to be SO happy to experience the proof.

Very intriguing, Data. Sounds like RSR might actually live up to expectations. I know you can't say anything specific, but how about the final price tag? Can you speculate on that?

[Datameister]

I have no idea what the cost will be, other than "very high." I just know that for the first time since I became aware of the Disneyland online fan communities and started knowing about things before they opened, I am truly and completely stoked for an upcoming attraction, one that I think will unabashedly have all the hallmarks of an outstanding Disney attraction. Sorry, I know it sounds like a tease, and I really wish I could say more. I almost didn't say anything at all, but I can't stand to hear pessimism about it...I'm just too excited for it!

[Professortango]

Sorry if this goes off topic in the course of events

Most of my fave attractions have at least one spooky/dark momment. Tiki Room has the Gods being angered, Country Bear Vacation had Ghostriders in the Sky, headhunters on Jungle Cruise, Spiders/Hopper in Tough to be a Bug, ht opening launch tunnels on Space and nicely ominous. I don't think Disney is shying away form spookyness, considering the Halloween fireworks and Ghost Galaxy.

I think the problem lies more with Disney getting a little lazy. Instead of creating an emotional investment with storytelling, they are falling back on pre-exitstancing franchises to add an emotional context. I think Buzz is a clear example. Buzz could be an amazing E-ticket experience with commitment to the issues already in place. Have an E-ticket where the galaxy is in danger and us mere citizens are called to lend a hand to defeat an evil warlord. We blast off with the Space Rangers and fight our way past enemy ships and onto the planet Zerg has taken over. There we defeat robot unruly aliens and break into the secret lair to rescue prisoners of war and destroy Zerg's war machine. It's a great story where stakes are high and the gimick (shooting) plays an important role in the attraction. It also fits the land. But instead of making a full-fledged attraction, they relied on our preconcieved toy versions of Buzz and friends and filled the attraction with enough movement and neon paint that we don't have time or energy to try and follow a narrative.

The same can be said for Nemo. Instead of trying to work the characters they wanted into an attraction that suited the land, they just plopped them in. And instead of having the experience revolve around us as participants, we take on a passive role of watching movie-inspired scenes. Midway Mania is another example of Disney taking the easy road. It's a fun attraction, and I do enjoy it, but instead of working the characters and gimick into a full-fledged attraction with stakes, story, and multi-level storytelling; we get a zany serries of Pogo games hosted by our friends from Toy Story.

And I know many will be quick to defend Midway Mania, as the attraction is a success despite being the easier imagineering path; but I wonder if the attraction could have been as popular if it were relying on completely original characters. A new character AA acting as the barker and random CGI personalities inside introducing the games. I think the fun of the attraction would remain, but the spirit would be greatly affected, proving Disney's belief that pre-existancing franchises can compensate for less than amazing storytelling in an attraction.

[ChrisFL]

Originally Posted by Professortango

And I know many will be quick to defend Midway Mania, as the attraction is a success despite being the easier imagineering path; but I wonder if the attraction could have been as popular if it were relying on completely original characters. A new character AA acting as the barker and random CGI personalities inside introducing the games. I think the fun of the attraction would remain, but the spirit would be greatly affected, proving Disney's belief that pre-existancing franchises can compensate for less than amazing storytelling in an attraction.

I agree on this, however I think Disney's perception is more from a marketing standpoint, they want people (with kids) to go see their Favorite Toy Story characters, instead of just a new midway ride.

I think Disney is afraid to step into "unknown" territory most of the time with new attractions these days, not to mention the all-powerful SYNERGY so they can make sure their other divisions stand to profit from this branding.

[mycroft16]

I remember people saying that the TLM ride-through on the DVD looked way to scary and dark, but it is precisely those dark, scary moments that make the ride fun and work. It's the anxiety and worry while going up the lift hill on a roller coaster that makes your adrenaline pump even more than just dropping would. It's the terror that the elevator cable might actually snap on Tower of Terror. It's wondering if those trees might actually be coming to life and if they just might grab you this time on Snow White. It's that blasted train on Mr. Toad that freaks me out every dang time (so bloody simple and still so effective)! It's why we go to movies, to see the hero in the blackest of possible situations overcome that and live through it. At Disneyland, we are, in essence, the heroes. We are the ones plunged into the dark and evil situation and we are the ones surviving. Be it Pinnochio or Thunder Mountain. It's the kind of real story-telling that we love and crave and that Disney has, to some extent, forgotten or been willing to sacrifice.

Originally Posted by Datameister

I wish I could say more, but for legal reasons, I can't. So all I'm going to say is...you're wrong. Very, very wrong. Understandably so, considering the limited information that's been made public, but still wrong. And when 2012 comes, you are going to be SO happy to experience the proof.

I'm still ticked off, upset, jealous about that trip of yours Data... <grumble> hehe Just kidding.

Actually, this brings me to another point about how Disney creates this fear-death experience. Show buildings. Think about it... you go anywhere else and pretty much you can see the entire ride from some vantage point. There is no surprise about what might happen to you. With Disney, even the coasters, barring Screamin, are hidden. Matterhorn is encased in a mountain, BTMRR, most of the track is behind a mountain, Splash is mainly indoors, dark-rides, etc. You can't see, ahead of time, what you're getting yourself into. Even rides like Casey Jr. and Storybook land hide behind hedges and walls. Storybook Land even uses the fear aspect with getting swallowed by Monstro. I've watched kids tell their parents that they are too scared to ride it. I've been on boats with kids who have been assured that it will be ok, but are still, understandably, nervous. That fear gives way to joy and happiness when they see that there is no back to the whale and it only serves to highten the enjoyment of the miniature models.

Build it like a movie, not like an amusement park.