Taking the Haunted Mansion ballroom effect technology to 2010

[CAspace]

While I love and adore the original Haunted Mansion more then words could ever tell, I also think that this incredible new technology would be pretty impressive if utilized in the Haunted Mansion ballroom scene. Just think of how incredible it could be if utilized properly.

Check out this video of the technology from the company Musion and imagine how incredible it could be if used correctly. I guarantee you this will blow your socks off!

Holographic Technology - Musion Eyeliner Technical

And for another awesome demonstration Neurosonics Live on Vimeo
it gets pretty awesome at around 1:25, there is one or two bad words at the very end I just heard though so be careful. PG-13 (for language) actually it would probably be PG since it is only 1 bad word.

[F!an]

I really like this new technology and would love to see it integrated into attractions. I would like to see this used on FNSV (it currently looks flat and dull) and GG to solve the halo issue.

As for HM I think there'd be a fine line between 3D ghosts and 3D people attempting to look like ghosts...but I support upgrading technology whenever something new comes along so my vote is yes.

[MainStreetJake]

That's impressive!!! I've got part of me that really wants to see this incorporated into the Mansion, however, the other side of me is saying no, just because it's the Mansion, and I wouldn't want stuff changed. But I think this could definitely work, and keep the ghosts ghost like enough for it to work.

[MainStreetJake]

As for HM I think there'd be a fine line between 3D ghosts and 3D people attempting to look like ghosts...

That's exactly what I was thinking. I think that Disney could shoot the people, then take it, and add the ghost layers to them, and make them ghost-like. Just add a green film layer, a "smoky" layer, and then drop the opacity of the people on film, and you should be good, right?

[CAspace]

That's impressive!!! I've got part of me that really wants to see this incorporated into the Mansion, however, the other side of me is saying no, just because it's the Mansion, and I wouldn't want stuff changed. But I think this could definitely work, and keep the ghosts ghost like enough for it to work.

It would definitely have to be done in a very specific way to keep it from ruining the "vibe" of the attraction. Although if done correctly it could be pretty awesome. It would also allow for more interesting holiday "over lays" in the Ballroom, which I am not a huge fan of but it would be something that would benefit lots of other guests who love the overlays!

But the ghosts would have to be done properly. I am thinking something like GhostBusters 1 Librarian in the basement of the library scene. That might be a bit too scary though!

[TikiRoom]

Hi there,

A comment on the technology itself: so cool! It amazes me how fast technology is developing. The Jetsons, with their holographic TVs and flying cars are even closer to a reality (now if only I could get my hands on one of those push-button hair stylers...)

As for its use in the HM: I'm constantly torn on attraction technology refurbs: wanting to usher attractions in to the 21st century without losing the inherent charm that nostalgia and the original concept provides. My main concern is that the hologram would have to provide the same capability of making the ghosts have that same 'cartoonish' or 'not exactly human' quality that the HM does so well. I also wonder if the perspective of the Doombuggies would prevent this kind of technology from being used. In your demo video, it seems that this would only work if you viewed 'the stage' from head on. However, the ballroom scene is looked upon from both above (ballroom floor) and below (chandelier & ceiling).

I'm definitely not a "it could never be done respectfully & well" naysayer. I would just be concerned that, if they announced a technology update, that it would preserve what I love about the Haunted Mansion.

Cool find!

[k_peek_2000]

That's exactly the same effect that TOT uses for the ghosts in the hallway, it's nothing new. Mystery Lodge has done that effect at Knott's for 30 years. The only difference is the glass is angled differently.

[CAspace]

That's exactly the same effect that TOT uses for the ghosts in the hallway, it's nothing new. Mystery Lodge has done that effect at Knott's for 30 years. The only difference is the glass is angled differently.

This particular effect does not use glass, it is a newly designed scrim. True the pepper ghost is over 100 years old, but this technology utilizing higher definition projections and a almost invisible scrim creates a truly 3d looking image. TOT and Mystery lodge use different technologies to create a similar effect but it is not the same in my opinion in terms of resolution and clarity.

TikiRoom" As for its use in the HM: I'm constantly torn on attraction technology refurbs: wanting to usher attractions in to the 21st century without losing the inherent charm that nostalgia and the original concept provides. My main concern is that the hologram would have to provide the same capability of making the ghosts have that same 'cartoonish' or 'not exactly human' quality that the HM does so well. I also wonder if the perspective of the Doombuggies would prevent this kind of technology from being used. In your demo video, it seems that this would only work if you viewed 'the stage' from head on. However, the ballroom scene is looked upon from both above (ballroom floor) and below (chandelier & ceiling).

I'm definitely not a "it could never be done respectfully & well" naysayer. I would just be concerned that, if they announced a technology update, that it would preserve what I love about the Haunted Mansion.
"

TikiRoom:
I agree with you, it would have to be done in a very tasteful manner, preserving the magic and the nostalgia of the attraction at all costs. Frankly perhaps they have not done it because they could not justify a expense with the outcome of the final effect. In that case I am happy with what we have, believe me. I just thought this "newer" method of producing the ancient pepper ghost effect would be neat

[F!an]

That's exactly the same effect that TOT uses for the ghosts in the hallway, it's nothing new. Mystery Lodge has done that effect at Knott's for 30 years. The only difference is the glass is angled differently.

(Mystery Lodge is one of my favorite things at Knott's!!!!)

I think the OP is wondering if the technology should be used to replace a dated albeit tried and true effect in a beloved attraction rather than "Look what I found!".

[HiddenMickeyBook]

The Ballroom scene is my favorite part of Haunted Mansion. I would be squeemish to have it messed with - unless they could keep the 'integrity' of the room.

But then, I am still in awe by the faces that follow you as you walk through the Portrait gallery! lol

[CAspace]

(Mystery Lodge is one of my favorite things at Knott's!!!!)

I think the OP is wondering if the technology should be used to replace a dated albeit tried and true effect in a beloved attraction rather than "Look what I found!".

Mystery Lodge is a true treasure!

[Rongo]

I think I saw some footage from the D23 convention showing a pepper's ghost type projection interacting with a live person on a set - I wonder if this is the technology they were using? If so, I'd say that it was pretty likely that we'll be seeing it in future attractions - if we're not already seeing it. There are an awful lot of projections being used now in the park, from the subs to the Autopia queue. Are they being projected on glass or onto these special scrims?

[Seawolf]

This technology wouldn't work in the ballroom, it wasn't designed to be integrated with furniture and props looking from above. As was stated earlier, you have to view it head on and the multilevel nature of the ballroom won't allow that. The best method for improving the ballroom ghosts is to simply get new animatronics. Peppers ghost has already been proven to be a perfected method, the mansion setup is just a little outdated.

[Datameister]

I would 100% oppose this for one simple reason: it'd be a downgrade. Fortunately, it's never going to happen.

The "eyeliner" technology is nothing more than a two-dimensional modification of Pepper's Ghost. It sacrifices true three-dimensionality so that the effect can make use of projections rather than physical objects. In other words, if it were implemented in the ballroom, what we'd be seeing would be flat images of ghosts. As we moved past them, it'd become painfully obvious that they were as flat and thin as pieces of paper. The organist wouldn't be able to sit in his chair; the dancers would revolve around each other; the ghosts flying in and out of the windows would just be going back and forth in a flat plane; and the ghosts coming out of the crashed hearse wouldn't be able to move forward from it effectively. The one and only advantage - if you could call it that - would be that the ghosts could be images of real actors or CG images or cartoons or whatever. They would no longer be AAs. That'd free them up from the constraints of that technology, but it'd put them at stylistic odds with the graveyard. And what's wrong with the current AAs in the ballroom.

To summarize: the current effect allows three-dimensional, transparent ghosts to interact convincingly with physical objects in the room and with each other, portrayed by AAs like those found in the graveyard. The eyeliner effect allows two-dimensional, transparent ghosts to move around in flat planes, portrayed by video footage that you could just as easily watch on your TV at home. It's the exact same thing currently used to underwhelming effect in FNSV. [EDIT: Sorry, brain fart. The process isn't EXACTLY the same. But the end result is.]

Also, I hate that they incorrectly refer to their technique as a hologram.

P.S. I recently had the pleasure of riding HM with a 20-year-old guy who'd never experienced the attraction before in his life. The ballroom had him stunned. The scene remains one of the most tantalizing visual tableaux in the resort, and reducing the ghosts to flat movies of ghosts would be a mindblowing step backwards. Sorry to state my opinion on this so...assertively, but I'm rather fond of the current effect, and rather infuriated by the deceptive way eyeliner technology is marketed.

P.P.S. Don't get me wrong, the effect can be VERY useful when it's the most appropriate choice. Pepper's Ghost and AAs could never provide the trippy, video-based effects in TOT, for instance, and since you're viewing the effect briefly from a stationary position, the two-dimensional nature of it isn't a problem. Similarly, if there were a Tomorrowland attraction that required the illusion of a 2D screen being projected into the air, this'd be perfect. But in the specific case of the HM ballroom, it quite simply would be a terrible replacement. Again, I apologize for using such extreme terms, but it's the truth.

[k_peek_2000]

I agree with Data and Seawolf, simply the best way to upgrade the scene is to upgrade the animatronics.