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  1. #3166

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    Quote Originally Posted by MANEATINGWREATH View Post
    /\ I suppose that it might be a bit far-fetched (No offense). Nevermind then. My writer's block at the moment is how Gracey (First name to be determined) got into the Mansion after Constance left.
    I've always been a fan of either Edward or William.

    I've also always thought of Master Gracey as either being the first or second owner, not the last (even though this goes against popular belief and contradicts most given facts; I just happen to like it better that way). But it's up to you.

  2. #3167

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    I've also always thought of Master Gracey as either being the first or second owner, not the last (even though this goes against popular belief and contradicts most given facts; I just happen to like it better that way). But it's up to you.
    If he was the first, the following owners probably would have taken his picture down from above the fireplace and replaced it with their own.

  3. #3168

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    All the suggested names sound good. I have a whole list to choose from now.

    Dorian Gracey
    William Gracey
    Edward Gracey
    Lawrence Gracey

    Any others? Hmm?

    There is another character named Edward who exists much earlier in the Mansion's history so that might eliminate Edward Gracey (No relation). As a matter of fact Edward Gore was the first child to live in the house (Followed by his brother Godfrey) and the first adult to commit suicide in the house.
    "Y'all come back now, ya hear?"

  4. #3169

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    While on the subject of fan fiction, an interview with a former HM Cast Member was posted today:
    From the Mouth of the Mouse: Interview - Constance, Haunted Mansion (Disney Dispatch)

    From the interview:
    I know it's not required of you, but I do know that some Cast Members who work at the Mansion create an unofficial back story for their character. Did you?
    I did! I was originally a maid for Master Gracey, back before the Mansion turned into its current form. I was married to one of the butlers, and we lived together in the servant's quarters.
    Unfortunately, I made the mistake of having a torrid affair with one of the kitchen staff, a cook to be exact. When my husband found out, he went mad, and killed us both in a fit of rage and jealousy. I've been spending my afterlife trying to make up for my mistake, and earn my husband's forgiveness. But rumor has it that he flung himself into the nearby river, never to be seen again, living... or dead.
    I love that sort of stuff! You guys really go out of your way to make your characters come 'alive', even though few will ever hear their stories.
    I don't know what happened to it, but there used to be a book we kept of everyone's stories. Aside from just ours, we also created unofficial biographies for some of the Mansion's more famous residents.
    There's a website I found not long ago that has a few of them, but nowhere near as many as we had in the book. It was fun to come up with this stuff. It made the job, and who we were, more real to us!

  5. #3170

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    I have a backstory for myself when I become a HM butler (Hopefully over the summer if I'm not doing the local production of Les Miserables).
    "Y'all come back now, ya hear?"

  6. #3171

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    I have a backstory for myself when I become a HM butler (Hopefully over the summer if I'm not doing the local production of Les Miserables).
    Best of luck! Or "break a leg," if you're superstitious.

    One thing I don't think we've really talked about is when the attraction takes place.

    Are we in present day?

    I don't think so. Wouldn't make sense with Master Gracey's fresh burial ground (before Pepe le Queue), which suggested his recent demise.
    If he had literally just died, there would have to be some sign of modern technology in his house.

    I think of it as being set in the '60s.
    The '69 Story and Song album takes place during "one autumn night, not long ago."
    Last edited by SmellyOrangutan; 05-03-2011 at 10:31 PM.

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    The reason for "one autumn night, not long ago" is that you are alive today, and you are visiting this old house today. You don't go back in time. Mike and Karen = you, the visitor.

    I don't see any reason to bring activities in the HM's history down to the present. Since around the turn of the 20th century, I think it's been unoccupied by humans. Constance was the last owner. That's why her stuff is still in the attic and her portrait is still up. (Would you keep a bunch of the previous owner's stuff in your attic, including wedding portraits and banners?) The place started out with candlelight and was partially modernized to gas sometime in the latter part of the 19th c., probably. But it was never electrified, suggesting that no one was living there during the 20th c. None of the ghosts date past 1899, suggesting that ghosts of people who died during the 20th c. don't feel at home in the place for some reason.

    It sounds like all you've got to indicate recent activity is the fresh earth on MG's grave. But that could be explained many ways. Maybe the grave itself is haunted, and no matter what anyone does, it turns back into a "fresh" grave during the night (a more modest version of Ken Anderson's old concept). Or someone exhumed the body not long before your visit, for some unknown reason. (Remember, it only has to happen once: this is a one-time event you're experiencing, like seeing a movie). Perhaps the Mansion's reputation for being haunted, and perhaps dark rumors and stories of a strange and evil portrait of the last owner in the foyer, could have influenced some local black magic dabblers to do a little grave robbing. Point is, the fresh earth is explainable in any number of ways, while more mundane facts like the lack of electricity and the undisturbed Connie relics are harder to explain if the place was still active until relatively recently. One can easily image a grave being disturbed at a haunted house. It's harder for me to picture ghosts or occultists carefully removing the wiring before your visit.
    "My mental facilities are twice what yours are, pea brain!"

    The conversation continues at Long-Forgotten, the blog.

  8. #3173

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    It sounds like all you've got to indicate recent activity is the fresh earth on MG's grave.
    I consider the (clearly living) butlers and maids as part of the overall "story."
    I don't see the mansion as being this abandoned place, like in the Story and Song album.
    Even the official site of DL's HM (though they've screwed up before) says that the mansion is tended by faithful servants of the departed owner.
    As for what their duties are, I don't know. Maybe to give tours of a real haunted house.

    Grim Grinning Ghosts is heard as a funeral dirge as you gaze upon Master Gracey's portait in the foyer.
    BTW, this is starting to make me think maybe the original Imagineers meant for the foyer portrait to be seen as MG. If the fresh mound of dirt has been there since day one, then probably.

    There's a black wreath hanging on the front door, which traditionally indicates a recent passing.

    Remember the ghosts are assembling for a wake.
    A "swinging wake," but a wake nonetheless. It has to be a wake for someone.
    Someone who recently died. Why would they wait over a century to have this wake?
    If it's for Master Gracey, it doesn't go against "no mourning please" because no one's mourning.
    Everyone's having a blast. Though that black wreath on the front door may be going against his wishes.

    As for all the cobwebs and dust, Master Gracey could have been a kooky Gomez Addams or Anton LaVey type of guy. You'd have to be a little eccentric to live in a mansion haunted by hundreds of ghosts.

    So the tour of the mansion takes place during a ghostly wake honoring the transition of its most recent mortal resident (probably MG).

    I change my mind about it being set in the '60s. It's still a period piece, but it's earlier than that. I only said '60s because of the style of the graveyard music.

    I've always thought the caretaker doesn't look very modern, with his lantern and all.
    He's a ghost in the Murphy movie, and he fits right in with any of the other ghosts.
    At WDW he wears a baseball cap, but those were around pre-'60s so I don't see the issue.

    Liberty Square and New Orleans Square are both supposed to transport you to a bygone era anyway.

    Constance was the last owner. That's why her stuff is still in the attic and her portrait is still up. (Would you keep a bunch of the previous owner's stuff in your attic, including wedding portraits and banners?)
    The same argument could be made the other way. If Constance was the last owner, why didn't she take Master Gracey's portrait down?

    The other pictures are still up in the portrait gallery.
    They probably predate MG and Constance, but no one took those down.

    Constance and MG could have even been related as well, and/or lived in the mansion at the same time.

    EDIT:
    WDW still has the Clem Hall portraits as far as I know, where Constance appears the oldest.
    I'd say she's about 70 in the pic.
    If Constance is around 30 in 1877 then she'd be 70 in 1917.
    Last edited by SmellyOrangutan; 05-04-2011 at 01:43 AM.

  9. #3174

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    The WDW attic used to have things like the Phantom of the Opera (1925) poster and the sheet music for "I'm On My Way to Mandalay" (1913).
    Unless you don't count the miscellaneous attic items, people were living there beyond 1899.

  10. #3175

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    There was not a mound of fresh dirt since day one, cast members, and WDI, only started doing that when the character took a life of it's own (through fan Fics etc.). If you want to put it in terms of a story, i would go with HBG2's theory (and If you want to break the HD, there is no longer a mound of dirt). Your foyer portrait argument also holds little to no weight, since the same argument can be made about a number of things (singing busts, aunt Lucretia portrait & bust, etc.). The "no mourning please" epitaph is a pun like all the others; mourning=morning. He was just laid to rest. As for the foyer dirge and dust... The mansion is a retirement home for ghosts, they like that sort of thing. You are supposed to be riding the mansion in real time, not being transported into the past, period. As for the maids and butlers, well, I don't know what to say. They are ride operators. They needed to be themed so they were called maids and butlers. I'm sure someone can easily make up some reason why they are still around easily.

    That's all I need to say for now. My apoligies for any misspelling, I am typing this on my phone.
    Last edited by MasterGracey13; 05-04-2011 at 05:23 AM.

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    Most of the evidence cited is specific to WDW, so if we're looking for a story that embraces Anaheim as well, much of it is gone. How to deal with differences between the HM's is an unsolved problem, but a bare bones basic plot outline and history would probably need to be confined to the overlap of the two circles.

    The two HM's have two possible reconstructions in any event. Andrew Jackson and Jean Lafitte are almost certainly in the Anaheim mix.

    I'm with MG13 on the maids and butlers. A necessary evil, to be screened out mentally, like the green EXIT signs. Even the GH references to multiple numbers of guests throughout much of the immediate, post-stretching room monologue, is simply prep for the doombuggies and therefore to be screened out as thematically null, more necessary evils for a park ride. I figure you're all alone in there, no matter how many people are around you or with you. This is one reason to quibble about the new HHG effect, which acknowledges the multiplicity of guests, but that's part of the inconsistency they decided to just go ahead and embrace for the sake of incorporating the HHG concept, which requires a vehicle going by. Suddenly, the "nothing" that is the doombuggy becomes indeed a vehicle for the final stretch, and it can have multiple passengers.
    "My mental facilities are twice what yours are, pea brain!"

    The conversation continues at Long-Forgotten, the blog.

  12. #3177

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    One thing interesting that I've noticed about TDL's HM is the fact that some of the Graveyard's pop-ups wear hats. From what I've seen, the pop-up near the Mummy and Old Man is wearing a nightcap, and the pop-up closest to the Executioner and Prisoner is wearing a 1700's powdered wig. This definitely implies that there are in fact ghosts from all over the world. So are the pop-ups enchanted corpses? Ghosts? Ghouls? Zombies?
    "Y'all come back now, ya hear?"

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    Quote Originally Posted by Grinning Ghost View Post
    The Graveyard pop-ups originally did have individual screams associated with each one. They would all pop up together at the end of each verse of GGG with a scream. One of the screams was a repeat of the Stretch Room scream, while others that were used can be heard on the Story and Song Lp.
    I remember them as popping up every two measures (eight beats of the bride's heart), and as being accompanied by a shriek/scream.

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    Quote Originally Posted by MANEATINGWREATH View Post
    It can possibly be an open house that goes around the earth and hosts open houses for any interested ghosts.
    Disney himself stated clearly that it was a retirement home for ghosts that he collected or invited from around the world.

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    Quote Originally Posted by TheHatboxGhost View Post
    I remember them as popping up every two measures (eight beats of the bride's heart), and as being accompanied by a shriek/scream.
    They're cued for the last line of each verse of GGG. Visual exclamation marks, I call 'em.

    Dark rides that can bear the level of analysis we use of the HM are rare indeed. It may well be sui generis (one of a kind). That means there are no established rules for this genre, and we're on our own.

    This is how I do it. Your mileage may vary. When you're at WDW, the DL HM doesn't exist. When you're in Anaheim, the Orlando HM doesn't exist. (Tokyo is the same, but it rarely gets onto my radar screen.) When you're at neither one, you can speculate on a common narrative, but that isn't the "real" story as opposed to the others. I'm dubious about meta-narratives that try to put all the HM's into one universe. Is Han Solo the kind of guy who would shoot first and ask questions later, or not? When you're watching original SW4, he is, and when you're watching enhanced SW4, he isn't. If you want to discuss his personal morality and character, you have to have two constructions now. What you don't do is say, "He's sorta the kind who would, but sometimes he isn't" in an attempt to embrace it all. WDW has some data (MG portrait in foyer, etc.) that dictates to some degree the contours of that construction. Anaheim, the same. Data distinctly from one doesn't count for the other, except, perhaps, as secondary support for a theory. DL is mercifully free (IMO) of most Gracey constraints.
    "My mental facilities are twice what yours are, pea brain!"

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