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  1. #7636

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    Quote Originally Posted by RequiesCat View Post
    Looking at this picture just now, it struck me, the lack of females in the family graveyard. (The crypts don't count as they are too vague to tell, one way or another.) Was it just that there were no lady imagineers working on the Mansion, to pay tribute to? Or does a woman's death come off as more tragic, like a child's death was considered too dark, thus clashing with the humor of the witty epitaphs? (This is only in reference to the family plot, since they obviously had no problem with dead ladies throughout the rest of the attraction.)
    Well, one of the few good things about PLQ are that several Female Imagineers are now honored.
    Harriet Burns


    and Dorthea Redmond

  2. #7637

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    1. Yes. Only a few female Imagineers had any hand in creating the HM, and none of them were in the forefront of the project.

    2. The HM building for the 2003 movie was just a shell, and only the bottom half at that (the top was CGI).

    3. New post up at LF

    4. One of our expatriate Threadsters (e.g., Now Disney employees or wannabees who need to stay out of public fora like this one) tells me that the iconic plaques in front of the WDW HM are gone. Instead, there are new plaques explaining the FastPass or whatever. Here's a pic:



    My immediate reaction is that this is a temporary setup. The new signs are permanent, but I suppose they will sit beneath the oval plaques eventually. Those are gone temporarily, I suspect, and in the meanwhile the new plaques would look dumb if they were as low on the posts as they will be when the oval plaques return (assuming my theory is right), so they are currently riding higher than they will be eventually.

    So why are the oval plaques gone? I can't believe they would just trash something so iconic for no reason, so either they're being cleaned up, refurbed so as to sit alongside the new signs better, or they are being redesigned. If the latter, I'm going to make a wild, wild guess, a shot in the dark, strictly fwiw and probably wrong. Maybe the word "The" will be replaced with "Disney's." For some reason, I just have a vague hunch.
    "My mental facilities are twice what yours are, pea brain!"

    The conversation continues at Long-Forgotten, the blog.

  3. #7638

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    Quote Originally Posted by HBG2 View Post
    1. Yes. Only a few female Imagineers had any hand in creating the HM, and none of them were in the forefront of the project.

    2. The HM building for the 2003 movie was just a shell, and only the bottom half at that (the top was CGI).

    3. New post up at LF

    4. One of our expatriate Threadsters (e.g., Now Disney employees or wannabees who need to stay out of public fora like this one) tells me that the iconic plaques in front of the WDW HM are gone. Instead, there are new plaques explaining the FastPass or whatever. Here's a pic:



    My immediate reaction is that this is a temporary setup. The new signs are permanent, but I suppose they will sit beneath the oval plaques eventually. Those are gone temporarily, I suspect, and in the meanwhile the new plaques would look dumb if they were as low on the posts as they will be when the oval plaques return (assuming my theory is right), so they are currently riding higher than they will be eventually.

    So why are the oval plaques gone? I can't believe they would just trash something so iconic for no reason, so either they're being cleaned up, refurbed so as to sit alongside the new signs better, or they are being redesigned. If the latter, I'm going to make a wild, wild guess, a shot in the dark, strictly fwiw and probably wrong. Maybe the word "The" will be replaced with "Disney's." For some reason, I just have a vague hunch.
    Signs explaining the FastPass as in, 'Hey let's get a FastPass for _____' or are these signs explaining the Ultimate FastPass+™ MultiFunctional Military Johnny Five Alive System Units?

    And yr Hunch? Is this 'Hunch' like, 'Hmmm.... I'm thinking XYZ per a logical set of thought processes, per AB and C' or is this more along the lines of 'I have a hunch my Power bill is due because the lights are off and these light switches were working earlier and this guy told me...' Kind of Hunch?

  4. #7639

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    Quote Originally Posted by MyFriendtheAtom View Post
    Signs explaining the FastPass as in, 'Hey let's get a FastPass for _____' or are these signs explaining the Ultimate FastPass+ MultiFunctional Military Johnny Five Alive System Units?

    And yr Hunch? Is this 'Hunch' like, 'Hmmm.... I'm thinking XYZ per a logical set of thought processes, per AB and C' or is this more along the lines of 'I have a hunch my Power bill is due because the lights are off and these light switches were working earlier and this guy told me...' Kind of Hunch?
    A hunch like, "If WDI was stupid enough to ruin thought they could improve the plaques, what kind of revision accords with their current mindset?"
    "My mental facilities are twice what yours are, pea brain!"

    The conversation continues at Long-Forgotten, the blog.

  5. #7640

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    Quote Originally Posted by HMF View Post
    Well, one of the few good things about PLQ are that several Female Imagineers are now honored.
    Harriet Burns


    and Dorthea Redmond
    Harriet's headstone is my favorite, due to obelisks being my favorite headstone shape, and its being in the good portion of WDW's queue. I wish they'd bring that graveyard back somewhere in the front portion of DLR's HM along with these headstones, but tucked away amongst some shrubs and trees, so as not to be seen unless in the queue.



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  6. #7641

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    Quote Originally Posted by HBG2 View Post
    My immediate reaction is that this is a temporary setup. The new signs are permanent, but I suppose they will sit beneath the oval plaques eventually. Those are gone temporarily, I suspect, and in the meanwhile the new plaques would look dumb if they were as low on the posts as they will be when the oval plaques return (assuming my theory is right), so they are currently riding higher than they will be eventually.
    There appears to be empty space on the far left and (out of frame) far right pillars. Perhaps the plaques will be located there?

  7. #7642

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    Quote Originally Posted by dfan07 View Post
    There appears to be empty space on the far left and (out of frame) far right pillars. Perhaps the plaques will be located there?
    Very possible. Let's hope they're just cleaning them up and nothing more.
    "My mental facilities are twice what yours are, pea brain!"

    The conversation continues at Long-Forgotten, the blog.

  8. #7643

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    Unless the "powers-that-be" rip out the cattle-chutes and put the graveyard back in its original place, (which I'm not holding my breath for) it seems the only place left to put one would be here...


    *
    ...along the left side of the queue, between where the light post stands in the middle of the shot(s), to the tree in the back. There would need to be some shrubs and small trees to the far left, just out of frame(s) here, in order to hide the graves from the entrance and those passing by. I'm uncertain of the width of this strip of lawn, but it looks as though it might fit.

    The problem then, assuming it all fits, is keeping the shrubs and whatnot from getting in the way of shots like this:

    *

    Perhaps keeping the taller plants to the left, gradually descending in height as you move toward right? *shrug*

    *Both photos were lifted from the Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion blog.

    "One of the advantages of being disorderly is that one is constantly making exciting discoveries."
    - A.A. Milne


    "I keep telling people not to lick the bats, but do they listen? Ha."
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  9. #7644

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    They could just put them back up on the berm to the left of the mansion grounds, you know, where they put the jack o'lanterns for the HMH.
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  10. #7645

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    Quote Originally Posted by WildeNight View Post
    They could just put them back up on the berm to the left of the mansion grounds, you know, where they put the jack o'lanterns for the HMH.
    That's true. Though with the steep slope of the berm, it's never seemed like a logical place for graves. But that's just my opinion.

    Also, if they were to find a more permanent home for the headstones, they wouldn't need to take them out each HMH. Just stick the pumpkins on the hill, all set!

    "One of the advantages of being disorderly is that one is constantly making exciting discoveries."
    - A.A. Milne


    "I keep telling people not to lick the bats, but do they listen? Ha."
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  11. #7646

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    Quote Originally Posted by HBG2 View Post
    A hunch like, "If WDI was stupid enough to ruin thought they could improve the plaques, what kind of revision accords with their current mindset?"
    Fair enough. Lets hope the improvement is a good ole fashioned spit shine and not some singing, bubbling interactive reference-laden 'thing'. Or have it end up with the HHGs.
    Last edited by MyFriendtheAtom; 09-01-2013 at 08:07 PM.

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    SEMI-SUPERPOST

    sorta

    Since it involves a radical rethink of the appearance of an original effect, I'll rate this a sort of SP.

    Okay, we're headed into the original DL 1969 attic, and I've got three new things to say, based on new documentary evidence that has come in over the transom, mysteriously provided by Lonesome Ghost.

    Here's an old effects blueprint of the attic that we've seen before. I've highlighted some things.



    First, about the location of the five popups. As of this blueprint, dating from April 69, there were no plans for a popup in front of the bride. Instead, there was going to be one by the exit on the right, just inside the attic. The new material doesn't change this, so now we know that as of May, this was still the plan. I don't remember any popup by the door, and I've never heard anyone else say they saw one there either, so my supposition remains that probably they changed their plans before August and put the last popup in front of the bride, and perhaps changed it from a stick-head type to a blast-up at the same time. With the steep slope of the roof in that corner by the door, it seems to me it would be a real pain to try to put a blast-up there. Perhaps that one was always going to be a blast-up variety and they relocated it for that very reason—difficulty in figuring out how to do it with such a short distance up to the ceiling for the wires. As you know, there was a blast-up over by the piano area until Connie arrived, located directly in front of the spot where Beating Heart originally was.



    (This is the most boring of the three points, and if this were all I had we'd have a SNOOZERPOST, not a SUPERPOST.)

    Second, about those spider strings. We know that when the HM opened, they had strings hanging down that would brush across your face in the attic. X talks about them. They were all pulled out by guests after the first day (and indeed, I don't remember them). The other effects blueprint that we make heavy use of shows two sets of these strings, located on the map above where the gold lines are. That was April. But by May they decided to move them, so in reality, on opening day, the two sets were located where the brown lines are. Correct this item immediately in your box of trivia, whether it's a mental file or an electronic one. Do it. NOW.

    We're still a Snoozerpost, you say? Sheesh, you guys are hard to please. Well, wait till you see what I've saved for...

    Third. I've indicated the attic posts in pink. In order to orient yourself, the one circled in blue is the one with Reginald's portrait hanging on it. It's also the one on the right in that picture above of the second blast-up, pre-Connie. According to the new info, stretched from floor to ceiling was a plastic sheet or nylon screen between that post and the one to its left, indicated on the map in green. This was directly in front of Beating Heart, in approximately the same location as the folding screen in that photo above. (The left-hand post, incidentally, is not the Frank portrait post; that's one more post over to the left.)

    You all will recall Tony Baxter's comments: "The bride stood in front of a bunch of props that were also later removed. It seemed like a lot of drapery material made from transparent plastic." I just assumed from that that there must have been a lot of glowy fabric behind and around the bride, intending to obscure the figure. This jibed with my memory. Sorta. Kinda. I remembered her looking a little blurred and indistinct, and I just figured that, well, what I must have seen in reality was the bride with a lot of fabric around her obscuring her outline or something. I also remembered her standing in what seemed like a boxy, doorway-like area, and I just figured that this must be nothing more than a faulty impression left by the attic's wooden posts and beams and such. Well, it turns out my memory needs less excusing and explaining than I originally thought.

    Here's how I described my memory of the original bride in 2007 in the original Thread (HERE): "Well, when we saw her there 8/14/69 my brother and I both thought she looked...murky. The fabric plus the figure plus the adjacent wooden attic structure almost made her look like she was standing in a doorway or cabinet or something. My theory is that they were worried that a simple figure so close to the track would just look like a mannequin, and they deliberately tried to obscure her a bit by making her harder to distinguish from her background." Now that I know that she stood behind a screen of sorts that fit between the posts on either side of her, both the murkiness and the cabinet/doorway effect that I remember seem vindicated. The mental picture I had and still have fits beautifully with what we now know was actually there. (Not a big deal to you, but I feel great about it. It's always so nice to discover you aren't quite as crazy as you thought you were. If you've never had that experience, be patient; it could still happen before you die. I mean, it's possible. At least once. Maybe.)

    I've revised my "The Bride and the Leaping Skull" post at the blog, so you can get some visual feel there. If in fact the blast-up was not there originally, and another popup was or was not at the exit, that popup would likely have been a stick-head type. That would mean that the attic had only one blast-up, only one skull jumping up out of a round hatbox, and it was at the very beginning of the attic, while the HBG was near the very end. The dynamics of the attic would have worked slightly differently, with one big foreshadowing clue at the beginning and the climax, counterpart, and solution to the mystery at the end. The bride's connection to the skull-in-a-hatbox motif would have been strictly via her heartbeat supplying the rhythm of the HBG gag. With the second skull-in-a-hatbox blast-up directly in front of her, however, you would have had a stronger connection between all the various parts of the puzzle. (Skull-in-hatbox —> skull-in-hatbox linked with Beating Heart —>heartbeat linked to ghost losing his skullish head to hatbox) Either way would have been good.
    Last edited by HBG2; 09-01-2013 at 08:07 PM.
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    The conversation continues at Long-Forgotten, the blog.

  13. #7648

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    Quote Originally Posted by RequiesCat View Post

    The problem then, assuming it all fits, is keeping the shrubs and whatnot from getting in the way of shots like this:

    *

    Perhaps keeping the taller plants to the left, gradually descending in height as you move toward right? *shrug*

    *Both photos were lifted from the Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion blog.
    Great ideas RequiesCat!! Considering the Lamp that used to be stationed there was ripped out because it interfered with shots like the ones above (allegedly), I don't think it would happen. I think having Tributes there would be awesome. But also my brain goes "We'll take care of the outside and let the ghosts take care of the inside."

  14. #7649

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    Quote Originally Posted by MyFriendtheAtom View Post
    Great ideas RequiesCat!! Considering the Lamp that used to be stationed there was ripped out because it interfered with shots like the ones above (allegedly), I don't think it would happen. I think having Tributes there would be awesome. But also my brain goes "We'll take care of the outside and let the ghosts take care of the inside."
    First: thank you! Second: I want to be clear - I am only looking for possible ways to bring the headstones back, and not the ones that blink. No "interactive" queue, please! And third: there's nothing saying that the plants need to be messy or detract from the "manicured", cared-for feel, in order to hide the graves.

    "One of the advantages of being disorderly is that one is constantly making exciting discoveries."
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    "I keep telling people not to lick the bats, but do they listen? Ha."
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  15. #7650

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    Re: The Long-Forgotten Haunted Mansion Effect Thread 7: Further Realms of Fright

    Quote Originally Posted by HBG2 View Post

    4. One of our expatriate Threadsters (e.g., Now Disney employees or wannabees who need to stay out of public fora like this one) tells me that the iconic plaques in front of the WDW HM are gone. Instead, there are new plaques explaining the FastPass or whatever. Here's a pic:



    My immediate reaction is that this is a temporary setup. The new signs are permanent, but I suppose they will sit beneath the oval plaques eventually. Those are gone temporarily, I suspect, and in the meanwhile the new plaques would look dumb if they were as low on the posts as they will be when the oval plaques return (assuming my theory is right), so they are currently riding higher than they will be eventually.

    So why are the oval plaques gone? I can't believe they would just trash something so iconic for no reason, so either they're being cleaned up, refurbed so as to sit alongside the new signs better, or they are being redesigned. If the latter, I'm going to make a wild, wild guess, a shot in the dark, strictly fwiw and probably wrong. Maybe the word "The" will be replaced with "Disney's." For some reason, I just have a vague hunch.
    This is going to be a catastrophe but the higher-ups are too stubborn and vain to back down so they just put up explanatory signs to try to lessen the damage. It makes me crestfallen how little regard the higher-ups at Disney has for their "Guests". Also HBG2, It will probably be Disney: Haunted Mansion. They don't like using 's anymore. The Red Umbrella really clashes with the Green canopy but I am sure it will be changed to green along with the exit canopy the next time they have a contrived corporate agenda to justify the expense and apparently that is the only way to let Imagineers actually be creative these days. I need to get the atmospheric music loop on my Ipod to try to numb the pain of having to walk through PLQ in November.
    Last edited by HMF; 09-01-2013 at 10:07 PM.

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