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  1. #76

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    Removing Disney Channel Rocks

    I don't mean to de-rail your heated debates of the show but here are some more updates about the show:


    There is no real changes about the show itself but one thing to note that after the first show, and the exit music of "This is Our Song" from Camp Rock 2, the speakers then blast the area's standard jazz.

    For everyone wondering how the show is removed, here is an hour and a half of my trip poured into one post:


    The dancers exit under the bridge by the Grotto


    The control room for WoC is used during the show, I would assume specifically for the fountains.


    Onto the real stuff. For the first 15-20 minutes or so, really detailed work was done. The panels on the bottom of the stage were dismantled, the speakers, lowered, no major work. As you can see, the panels reveal the infrastructure underneath the stage.


    Another view of the stage from behind the viewing area.


    The grey panels are then loaded onto thing-a-ma-jig #1. But they then sit there for a while and do not move.


    The stair well is then dismantled


    http://www.flickr.com/photos/1scream/5213739614/
    The stage is then lowered but not completely, just to meet the level of the first tier. Short video fo the stage lowering, click here.


    At this point, the three stage pieces have been seperated. The first piece on the right, looking at the stage, is then wheeled off onto the first tier with the fences opening up.


    Set pieces from the show are loaded onto the stage platform and then a special towing machine that could be considered similar to the ones used on airplanes carries away the set piece.


    The stage railings are dismantled.


    The other end piece is then rolled off the stage.


    Up close shot at the wheels


    The craziest thing is the side pillars. They consist of two seperate pieces, the top portion, and a base attached directly to the small stages. A rope is tied to the top, main section and is slowly lowered with the CM's catching it below.


    The process is repeated for the other pillar and they are placed on this rolling platform.


    It's a tight fit but the structure barely fits through the paradise park covers.


    It is then paraded to the back stage area.


    The rest of the set pieces are placed on the stage platforms. The towing machine proceeds to parade these out of Paradise Park and down the parade route.


    Out the make shift parade gate.


    The rest of the set pieces are moved out towards the Wine area and pushed by man power.

    The entire process took right around an hour. Saying that there were some rookie mistakes too, like lowering the stage before realizing that there was still a set piece that needed to be moved onto the tier, and not position the stages correctly so they would fit through the gate. I can easily see this process being cut dramatically in time as the CM's do it more often.

  2. #77

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    Re: "Disney Channel Rocks" Much better Show

    Quote Originally Posted by Seawolf View Post
    The problem with your argument is that your treating WOC and Disney Channel Rocks as equals, they are not by a long shot
    So the rules of theme and show drop off and don't apply the more you spend? They are equals because they are both part of the parks that are trying to put on a show and support the overall experience the park's designers are trying to build. To argue the rules don't apply to WoC simply because Disney spent more money on it and it's bigger is just a cop out to try to cover up the inconsistency of your argument.

    Quote Originally Posted by Seawolf View Post
    By definition something that costs 100 million dollars, blows audiences away, gets a huge turnout, and can't be staged anywhere else should get a free pass in regards to theme, the positives far outweigh any negatives. What would you have them do, rip out WOC because it's unfair DCR isn't being treated the same way?
    No - I'd stop trying to make up rules the company itself isn't willing to adhere to which you adore when the material suits you, and abscond when the material doesn't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Seawolf View Post
    You are also making this about what I like, it's not. The number of spectators for each of these shows speak for themselves.
    The show started 2 days ago - there hasn't been any marketing at all except for a few simple things online. It's not really a clear view yet. But since you say 'these shows' - I think we have Disney's pattern here to continually invest in making new shows like these that counter your opinion of their worth. Disney wouldn't keep throwing money at these things year after year, iteration after iteration if they did not ring true with guests.

    Quote Originally Posted by Seawolf View Post
    They shouldn't limit themselves from going all out just because the theme is temporarily interrupted for a couple hours when the land is shut down anyway
    Really? the place is all shutdown to start with.. so that's why WoC was a good fit there? Your using outcomes as if they existed before the decision in the first place. You're making zero sense. I get it - you think as long as Disney goes big - there's a free pass. Got it - opinion noted. So what is the magic number Disney must spend before they can do whatever they want without the theme police hunting them down?
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  3. #78

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    Re: "Disney Channel Rocks" Much better Show

    Quote Originally Posted by Seawolf View Post
    Thanks for proving my point, Mickey continues to be special even after adulthood has been reached. No matter what your age, Mickey Mouse continues to be an icon that everyone appreciates regardless if your 2 or 100 years old, can't say the same about Hannah Montana. I would love to hear you argue that one.
    I didn't prove your point - the point soared right over your head. You claimed kids turn their back on this stuff just years later and that shows just how misguided this material is. Most people do that to Mickey Mouse, Pooh, and others too. They turn their back on it because they turn their back on anything 'kid' - as they strive to be cool, hard, hip, etc. It's generally not until they are mature enough to stop acting out that they will return to acknowledge their true interests without worries about peer pressure. The rebellion is against all things that peer pressure may result in taunting/teasing over - not because the material misses its mark.

    Quote Originally Posted by Seawolf View Post
    Just because something makes money doesn't make it good. Again, Disney is targeting an immature audience that will do anything to be more adult. That same audience turns their back on the show a few years later, something Mickey never experienced.
    BS - Mickey and friends get the same treatment. How many 18 yr olds do you know with Mickey curtains and sheets? You can't use teen rebellion as a measure of anything - it by nature is to reject child things and try to act older then they really are. The teenagers like yourself (or just past teen years) who are Disney fans 'on the outside' are the minority and not representative of the larger population.

    Quote Originally Posted by Seawolf View Post
    Is that why we see shows like I love Lucy and Andy Griffith constantly on television? Maybe in your world those shows don't have an audience but reality says different...
    Really? Tell me where they are showing besides niche cable networks like TVLand or Halmark? Or as filler at late night. I don't even see them in any listings currently (with brief searches). These networks show as retro for the older generations - not as relevant to the mass audience or these teens/etc.
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    Quote Originally Posted by sleepyjeff View Post
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  4. #79

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    Re: "Disney Channel Rocks" Much better Show

    Ohhh I see how the the maliboomer didn't fit the new theme of the Pier but this show does...oh wait no it doesn't never does the new show in Hollywood land. I like how they say they need the maliboomer gone but they keep putting other crap into the peir. At least the maliboomer was an opening day attraction and had fans behind it.

  5. #80

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    Re: "Disney Channel Rocks" Much better Show

    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    Your opinion - but one that is far outweighed by over a decade of success. People end up disliking? You mean the teen phase where it's not cool to like 'kid' stuff? Really that's what you base your argument on? I guess Mickey Mouse is rubbish too - because a good portion of older teens try to distance themselves from their childhood attraction to him as well.
    Not to derail the thread about the stage show, but...

    I agree with Flynn. Maybe the people hating on current Disney Channel offerings aren't their key demographic. I'm obviously not in their key demographic, but after a long day of work sometimes I'll throw on the Disney Channel. Maybe watch a movie... What's great is you know there will be a happy ending on these shows. As a CNA my job can get me down, as a nursing student... dude... oy. So I like watching things where yay! Everyone is happy in 30 minutes! Doesn't happen in real life. Sorta' the same reason why I watch "Glee".

  6. #81

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    Re: "Disney Channel Rocks" Much better Show

    Wow. This is really a split opinion on this show. For me, if you're going to go to the trouble of creating a show for a very prominent part of the park, and add to that the trouble of set-up and striking of the set daily, at least make the show accessible to all.

    Flynnibus, you keep using the word "Tween" and coming down on those who think that Tween entertainment isn't all that. Well, you've hit the nail on the head. Tween entertainment is for TWEENS. For a show that is performed in such a prominent location, shouldn't the entertainment be geared to all age groups and at least aim to gear itself toward all tastes?

    This show compares to putting Playhouse Disney (or whatever it is called this week) in the same location. Would you be ok with Playhouse Disney playing at Palisades Stage or even Disney Dance Crew?

    This stage is equal to Dockside Stage at TDS. This venue is very exposed and the entertainment thus far (in its nine years of operation) has proven to be well themed and appropriate, and also continues to draw large crowds.

    Even as bad as the Stitch show in Tomorrowland at WDW is, at least it was thematically appropriate. I am not suggesting they bring this show over, or that it was a great creation, but simply that creating appropriately themed entertainment is possible.

    Also, all of your arguments about parades and shows and fireworks not working. . .those shows work because they appeal to broad spectrum of guests. Also, those types of entertainment have been a rich and deeply-loved aspect of Disney for many, many years. Do you really feel that Parade of Dreams or Remember Dreams Do Come True do not fit thematically? Or that Fantasmic does not belong on Tom Sawyer's Island? They are not the same as DDC or DCR or C!ASP, in my opinion.

    Maybe we can talk about DCR in 20 years and see if this type of ill-fitting show will be around.

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    Re: "Disney Channel Rocks" Much better Show

    Quote Originally Posted by ErikInTheCity View Post
    Wow. This is really a split opinion on this show. For me, if you're going to go to the trouble of creating a show for a very prominent part of the park, and add to that the trouble of set-up and striking of the set daily, at least make the show accessible to all.

    Flynnibus, you keep using the word "Tween" and coming down on those who think that Tween entertainment isn't all that. Well, you've hit the nail on the head. Tween entertainment is for TWEENS. For a show that is performed in such a prominent location, shouldn't the entertainment be geared to all age groups and at least aim to gear itself toward all tastes?

    This show compares to putting Playhouse Disney (or whatever it is called this week) in the same location. Would you be ok with Playhouse Disney playing at Palisades Stage or even Disney Dance Crew?

    This stage is equal to Dockside Stage at TDS. This venue is very exposed and the entertainment thus far (in its nine years of operation) has proven to be well themed and appropriate, and also continues to draw large crowds.

    Even as bad as the Stitch show in Tomorrowland at WDW is, at least it was thematically appropriate. I am not suggesting they bring this show over, or that it was a great creation, but simply that creating appropriately themed entertainment is possible.

    Also, all of your arguments about parades and shows and fireworks not working. . .those shows work because they appeal to broad spectrum of guests. Also, those types of entertainment have been a rich and deeply-loved aspect of Disney for many, many years. Do you really feel that Parade of Dreams or Remember Dreams Do Come True do not fit thematically? Or that Fantasmic does not belong on Tom Sawyer's Island? They are not the same as DDC or DCR or C!ASP, in my opinion.

    Maybe we can talk about DCR in 20 years and see if this type of ill-fitting show will be around.
    Re: text I bolded-
    What is your explanation for the elecTRONica stage at the entrance of the park? Or when HSM3 was performed there?

    Disney Dance Crew features Mickey Mouse? Doesn't he appeal to everyone? Why not put him on Palisades Stage? To answer your question - no, POD and Remember do not fit Main Street/the Hub whatsoever. As the audience, we are asked to suspend our disbelief - the same with theatre. More so, a Castle doesn't really fit the theme - by the standards of most on this board, the Castle should be hidden by trees as not to ruin the theming of Main Street USA.

    Let me ask you this:
    Did you like Parade of Dreams? Remember? Fantasmic!?

    What about DDC, DCR, or C!ASP?


    Lastly,
    Flynnibus, you have a lot of support behind you. Thank you for taking the time to deal with all of the negativity in such a graceful and intelligent manner. You have earned major points with me. Bravo.

  8. #83

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    Re: "Disney Channel Rocks" Much better Show

    Quote Originally Posted by ErikInTheCity View Post
    Flynnibus, you keep using the word "Tween" and coming down on those who think that Tween entertainment isn't all that. Well, you've hit the nail on the head. Tween entertainment is for TWEENS. For a show that is performed in such a prominent location, shouldn't the entertainment be geared to all age groups and at least aim to gear itself toward all tastes?
    Broader audiences is good yes - but note that's not why people aren't complaining. They call the material crap/rubbish/etc. I wouldn't goto a Hip Hop concert - but that doesn't mean I think it's rubbish. It's just not for me. I'm not against people not like the show - just have some level headed justification.. notice Seawolf thinks all the material is just used to exploit ignorant children who know no better...

    Quote Originally Posted by ErikInTheCity View Post
    This show compares to putting Playhouse Disney (or whatever it is called this week) in the same location. Would you be ok with Playhouse Disney playing at Palisades Stage or even Disney Dance Crew?
    I'd consider if I like the show or not - and not really be all wound up over how this slice of entertainment is not adhering to some contrived set of rules the fans use to measure decisions by.

    Quote Originally Posted by ErikInTheCity View Post
    Even as bad as the Stitch show in Tomorrowland at WDW is, at least it was thematically appropriate. I am not suggesting they bring this show over, or that it was a great creation, but simply that creating appropriately themed entertainment is possible.
    And shows that theme alone won't get you squat. You are too generous about that show - it was an disaster that the company should be embarrassed about. And for that, the stages WEREN'T temporary either.

    Quote Originally Posted by ErikInTheCity View Post
    Also, all of your arguments about parades and shows and fireworks not working. . .those shows work because they appeal to broad spectrum of guests. Also, those types of entertainment have been a rich and deeply-loved aspect of Disney for many, many years. Do you really feel that Parade of Dreams or Remember Dreams Do Come True do not fit thematically? Or that Fantasmic does not belong on Tom Sawyer's Island? They are not the same as DDC or DCR or C!ASP, in my opinion.
    Of course they don't fit thematically - but you don't see me trying to call them rubbish because they don't fit their land do you? No - it's just accepted - and these types of shows are about the entertainment first - and worry less about the 'land' they are shown in. The parades and temp shows gloss over their background - just as they have done here. No need for the theme police to come waaambling in unless they want to do that for all the entertainment offerings.
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  9. #84

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    Re: "Disney Channel Rocks" Much better Show

    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    All the 'how is this victorian' or 'it doesn't fit!' talk is pretty hypocritical. How does any of your favorite parades such as Parade of Dreams fit into Main Street?

    Temporary shows and parades have never really fit into the lands. These shows are overall Disney entertainment offerings - not adjunts to the land themselves (like the actors on main street, or NoS are).

    My only beef would be is them taking over the soundtrack of the area too early - that would be an issue - and one that is easily fixed. They don't need to hype the show too much, too early.

    And some of you will never like the live-action tween material of Disney - ever. Just accept that Disney added new genres they target. Be it lizzy mcguire, or hannah montana today - its done, its EXTREMELY successful, and it doesn't resonate with you. Live with it - you'll be much happier at the end of the day.

    I'm sure some people felt the same way about Walt and his thirst for the True Action Adventures direction he took the studios instead of just pumping out more and more shorts and feature length animated films. Or how about that Mickey Mouse Club??

    The fact there isn't more 7 minute Fab 5 shorts has nothing to do with a focus on Hannah Montana - it's because that business model died with the local cinema as your primary entertainment feed in the 50s with the boom of television. People need to stop acting like this material somehow is responsible for the lack of other content from Disney.

    The hate on the Disney tween portfolio really just comes across as snobbish.
    Quote Originally Posted by Aladdin View Post
    Calling people on this board "Snobbish" isn't doing your argument any good. And you would do well to apologize.

    And your argument (especially the portion underlined by me) is just completely wrong. First of all, this show is NOT a parade. It's a stage show performed in only one location. In fact, the previous mobile versions of this show were better in the way that the entire set disappeared, when the show was over. This set just stays out there, in the open. It is a major issue with this particular venue.

    As for shows never fitting into their venue, that is just an utter lie. The Fantasyland Theaters shows were perfectly themed to the land they were located in. Tiana's ShowBoat Jubilee was AMAZINGLY well done in incorporating the theme and all of the infastructure into it's land. The Hunchback Show utilized the area behind Big Thunder Ranch in a great way too. The use of the Tomorrowland Terrace stage for the Jedi Training also works well with Star Tours being one of TL's attractions and the "space theme", which TL uses.

    As I said in my previous post, if Disney is going to cram some advertising down our throats, they would do well to remember to appeal to a broad range of guests and not just a narrow spectrum of guests. The second problem is with this particular venue. It is too out in the open, to NOT be part of the supposed theme of the area. (And yes, that has been an ENORMOUS problem with the entire concept of Paradise Pier from before it was built.) If they are going to advertise for ther Disney Channel, then place the show where it fits best - Hollywood picture backlot. Place it in that backlot stage where there is seating and shade for guests.
    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    A show that only runs certain times of the day - and who's very appearance is temporary. It doesn't really make any attempt at making itself at home.
    Certainly it does, when they create the huge set, every single day. It's got the worst of both worlds. It only comes down for WoC, but it's up all afternoon. Plus all the expense of the set up and take down every single day. And the number of performers it takes for this type of a show is way out of line too. Of course it's a lot easier to move the performers. But they still have to pay for all of them.


    I called the behavior snobbish - you are free to disagree or not. But why not prove it wrong rather then try to bury it?
    Now your twisting your own words. Your own words still end up calling people names. I'm not trying to bury anything, but you are. Quit the name calling, and we are still waiting for your apology.


    I didn't call it a parade - I said (check what you outlined) TEMPORARY SHOWS and parades.
    With the show in paradise park now, it is certainly more of a permanent show than it was before, as I noted above, regarding the sets.


    And TLT Dance Club? HSM? Fantasmic? WoC? elecTRONica? NYE parties? Donald and Mickey in Princess Stage shows?Just to name a few... This isn't Disney trying to build East High School in the middle of the pier. Keep some perspective - this is just a dance show that runs several times a day. Disney never routes their parades based on the lands either and goes 'OOOO, better turn here, don't want a theme conflict!!'. It's a performance in a amphitheater setup FOR performances.
    Oh, please, did you even read what I wrote? And as others have already said, putting this show in the same league as F!, WoC, full blown Parades, fireworks shows, and NYE parties is just not paying attention to what the problem is with the paradise park venue, and the type of show that Disney Channel Rocks is. And yes, ElecTRONica actually attempts to theme the correct land for a Movie, which fits in themeatically with Hollywood Pictures Backlot. Can't you see that? As for the Princess stage shows in the FL theater, how do they NOT fit in the FL theater?

    The initial horribly ill-fitting Paradise Pier theme, that is being attempted to reach some sort of themeatic semblance with this Billion Plus Makeover, and then entertainment forces in this out place show. The last thing this area needs is a advertisement for the Disney Channel.

    Would everyone be up in arms over U2 performing here if they weren't playing rag time tunes? No - the Disney fickle will turn a blind eye when it's convenient for their arguement because they actually like the material in the question... and when they don't, they'll try to find any sticks and stones they can come up with to throw at it to try to justify their dislike.
    first you try to equate this show with F! and WoC! Now you're trying to equate the show with U2? Really?!?!?!?!? Really???????? Or are you just attempting some humor with that. Certainly you aren't being serious?!?!?!?? (waiting for you to start calling names again)


    That's a valid point and good suggestion of a better location - yet most of the complaints are over how 'rubbish' the material is... more then it's a poor location.

    I'm not the only one suggesting that this is a bad location - others have suggested other places in addtion to the backlot stage, like the old who wants to be a Millionaire building. And yes many of the songs in this show are a problem, too, so Disney would be wise to listen.

    Why doesn't Disney want to place the same type of effort into some QUALITY THEMED LIVE ENTERTAINMENT in the Paradise Park area??????? Main Street has the Dapper Dans and the Ragtime piano players, New Orleans Square has had the various jazz entertainment over the years.
    Last edited by Aladdin; 11-27-2010 at 11:28 PM.

  10. #85

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    Re: "Disney Channel Rocks" Much better Show

    Quote Originally Posted by Seawolf View Post
    Thanks for proving my point, Mickey continues to be special even after adulthood has been reached. No matter what your age, Mickey Mouse continues to be an icon that everyone appreciates regardless if your 2 or 100 years old, can't say the same about Hannah Montana. I would love to hear you argue that one.
    Wow... You just missed the point completely.


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    Re: "Disney Channel Rocks" Much better Show

    Quote Originally Posted by Aladdin View Post
    Why doesn't Disney want to place the same type of effort into some QUALITY THEMED LIVE ENTERTAINMENT in the Paradise Park area??????? Main Street has the Dapper Dans and the Ragtime piano players, New Orleans Square has had the various jazz entertainment over the years.
    First off, chill out a bit.

    To play your 'game' - are you equating the Dapper Dans, Ragtime Piano players and various jazz entertainment of NOS to DCR?

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    Re: "Disney Channel Rocks" Much better Show

    Quote Originally Posted by Aladdin View Post
    Certainly it does, when they create the huge set, every single day. It's got the worst of both worlds. It only comes down for WoC, but it's up all afternoon. Plus all the expense of the set up and take down every single day. And the number of performers it takes for this type of a show is way out of line too. Of course it's a lot easier to move the performers. But they still have to pay for all of them.
    Well its a lot easier and cheaper to just do nothing either - but I seem to recall you always being up at the front of the crowd jeering over what hasn't been added year to year in the parks. So who knows what you really want.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aladdin View Post
    Now your twisting your own words. Your own words still end up calling people names. I'm not trying to bury anything, but you are. Quit the name calling, and we are still waiting for your apology.
    This is the last time I'm going to respond to this. 'We'?? My post is clear to read to all - I can't help you with your comprehension issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aladdin View Post
    first you try to equate this show with F! and WoC! Now you're trying to equate the show with U2? Really?!?!?!?!? Really???????? Or are you just attempting some humor with that. Certainly you aren't being serious?!?!?!?? (waiting for you to start calling names again)
    It's call analogy - it's not about making the things equal. It's about parallels. It shows how flawed the true reason behind the moaning is flawed. Don't like the show - fine - but no need to try to make up these rules that only apply some of the time, and only for some shows, but not others, etc, etc.

    Personally I don't like the show - in that I would never stand around to watch it. I really have zero interest in any of the dance shows (classic disney or not) - but my kids would probably like it. Me, give me something like the Finding Nemo Musical.. or Aladdin.
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    Re: "Disney Channel Rocks" Much better Show

    Quit the name calling, and we are still waiting for your apology.
    dont apologize!...gotta say I'm with flynnibus on this one

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    Re: "Disney Channel Rocks" Much better Show

    Quote Originally Posted by Ummmmm, No View Post
    First off, chill out a bit.

    To play your 'game' - are you equating the Dapper Dans, Ragtime Piano players and various jazz entertainment of NOS to DCR?
    I just think people don't get why you would spend al the money to make the park look better if your going to keep filling it with crap. Yes kids will like the show, but Disneyland is suppose to be for everyone and have more "classic" entertainment that is for EVERYONE DCA has 3 shows now targeted at kids Disney Playhouse, Rapping Mickey and now this.....seems like they could have more stuff like Aladdin or Blast.

    I think a show like Blast but near the Pier would work WAY better than what they have now and could be really cool to have another "real" show at DCA since I see most people just passed by HSM with a Normal band you really can't go wrong, who doesn't like Disney Music at a Disney Park (not Disney tween music, Real Disney Music)

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    Re: "Disney Channel Rocks" Much better Show

    Quote Originally Posted by JerrodDRagon View Post
    I just think people don't get why you would spend al the money to make the park look better if your going to keep filling it with crap. Yes kids will like the show, but Disneyland is suppose to be for everyone and have more "classic" entertainment that is for EVERYONE DCA has 3 shows now targeted at kids Disney Playhouse, Rapping Mickey and now this.....seems like they could have more stuff like Aladdin or Blast.

    I think a show like Blast but near the Pier would work WAY better than what they have now and could be really cool to have another "real" show at DCA since I see most people just passed by HSM with a Normal band you really can't go wrong, who doesn't like Disney Music at a Disney Park (not Disney tween music, Real Disney Music)
    What would you constitute as 'Real Disney Music'?

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