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  1. #1

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    What if DCA had been done right the first time?

    We wouldn't be seeing all these construction walls, that's for sure!

    If DCA opened with more immersive lands to begin with, there obviously would be no need for the slew of projects going on right now. But if it had been done right the first time, who's to say it would have been better than (or as good as) what we'll be getting in 2012?

    I guess my point is, sometimes working around a current challenge causes the imagineers to become more creative than they would have been with a clean slate. For instance, the challenge of turning sunshine plaza into Buena Vista Street. Sure, BVS would have been more "ideal" with more space, freedom to place buildings where they chose, and no monorail running through the middle of it. But instead, they had to work with and around a layout that was already basically set in stone. In my opinion this causes the finished product to have more thought put into it, more charm, more atmosphere, and more history.

    Another example would be Fantasmic! They probably could have done much better with special effects, and overall spectacle if they had a clean slate to work with. Instead, they had to figure out ways to implement a new idea into an already functioning and developed area. Working around the limits/constraints of the area, while needing to be extra creative with ways to use what was already in place. The final product is an incredible show that is said by many to be superior to it's WDW counterpart where there was much more space and creative freedom to work with.

    This is just my opinion of course, and I know not everybody will agree with me. But, I believe that working around the challenges of DCA 1.0 will be to the advantage of DCA 2.0. The redone park has the potential to be more creative, more charming and have a deeper/richer history than had it been done "right" the first time.

    I'm excited to see this park continue to evolve and improve over the coming years. Just as Disneyland has done.

  2. #2

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    Re: What if DCA had been done right the first time?

    We'd call it Westcot or DisneySea.
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    Re: What if DCA had been done right the first time?

    Quote Originally Posted by sleepyjeff View Post
    We'd call it Westcot or DisneySea.
    ...or California Adventure.
    "You can cut me off from the civilized world. You can incarcerate me with two moronic cellmates. You can torture me with your thrice daily swill, but you cannot break the spirit of a Winchester. My voice shall be heard from this wilderness and I shall be delivered from this fetid and festering sewer."

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    Re: What if DCA had been done right the first time?

    It still wouldn't have been good enough for some of the critics here.

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    Re: What if DCA had been done right the first time?

    One of the reasons Disneyland hasn't had a major new E-Ticket since Indy (Disneyland's 40th anniversary), is because so much extra money had to be dumped into DCA.

    One of the likely results of a DCA done right from the beginning would be a Disneyland with at least a few newer attractions. We might even have a 3rd park by now (at least that was the master plan at the end of the 90's).

    If you haven't read our interview with John Lasseter, you might want to do so, especially the part where he admits that DCA was not a Disney quality park.
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  6. #6

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    Re: What if DCA had been done right the first time?

    Quote Originally Posted by brenden View Post
    It still wouldn't have been good enough for some of the critics here.
    That's because Once upon a time "good enough" wasn't the standard
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  7. #7

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    Re: What if DCA had been done right the first time?

    I'm not sure the layout of DCA would have led to (or now will lead to) a great park. I'd love to be proven wrong on that, and I have to admit that a huge part of what I like about Disneyland comes from the nostalgia of going there for pretty much my entire life (so far), but DCA's layout seems to have lots of space devoted to things that aren't rides or attractions. I guess it was borne of a new theme park mentality that puts the rides in one place, like Paradise Pier, and the food in another, like Pacific Wharf, but it doesn't feel right to me. The fact that there wasn't enough money to put in more attractions exacerbated it for sure.

    It's a shame all the money being spent now won't affect most of the park. I expect Buena Vista Street to create a great atmosphere for the entrance, and Carsland looks like it will be a very complete land (although I think its layout along a straight road will be a problem), but the vast majority of the park will be the same as before the billion dollars was spent.


    Quote Originally Posted by brenden View Post
    It still wouldn't have been good enough for some of the critics here.
    No kidding. I'm sure they're a tiny minority, but they sure are vociferous!

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    Re: What if DCA had been done right the first time?

    With no disrespect to the OP, I think the viewpoint of the thread is seriously skewed. DCA 1.0 was the result of a creatively crippled, politically toxic corporate organization led by an outrageous egotist. From its groundbreaking to this day, it has been -- and will continue to be -- a cash-sucking monkey on Disneyland's back. Digging out of the pit of DCA 1.0 has cost the Company untold amounts of money, creative momentum and prestige. It has given hope to the competition, inspiration to inhouse corporate suckups and the boot to too many talented WDI creatives.
    Last edited by Mr Wiggins; 09-09-2011 at 04:44 PM.
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    Re: What if DCA had been done right the first time?

    As much as I love some of the rides in DCA, I honestly think they should have just left Disneyland alone. What was wrong with the original?!

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    Re: What if DCA had been done right the first time?

    I agree Mr Wiggins, and to add, if done properly from the start we would already have had things that were woven together and done right. I always look at Tomorrowland (not the new TL) and look at how Autopia, Subs and Monorail all intertwine together, how the People Mover travelled through the buildings, heck even the Skyway through the Matterhorn and the Train going around and through (Splash Mountain). How the waterways connect and work as a system. Nothing like those concepts really work the same way in DCA, everything (for the most part) is a closed system. The Monorail presence is forced and doesn't work, especially for BVS or the 20's. So yes, while I say the Imagineers did a great job immersing Fantasmic into what they had and hoping that they will do the same with DCA 2.0, if it would of been done with this kind of a concept from the beginning then we would just be that much farther along now. DL, DCA, DTD, heck the entire resort (new park or not) would be that much better off, and have that much more to work with.
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  11. #11

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    Re: What if DCA had been done right the first time?

    Can anyone tell me, as a new resident to CA, what was so bad about DCA when it opened? I know nothing of the park except that its there and what in it now.

    Thanks

  12. #12

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    Re: What if DCA had been done right the first time?

    Quote Originally Posted by disneyland55 View Post
    We wouldn't be seeing all these construction walls, that's for sure!

    If DCA opened with more immersive lands to begin with, there obviously would be no need for the slew of projects going on right now. But if it had been done right the first time, who's to say it would have been better than (or as good as) what we'll be getting in 2012?
    Interesting question! (Sorry wiggy, I'm putting my special mousegineering hat on for this one.)
    Now, certainly it depends on what "done right the first time" means. I will not take it to mean "same as DCA 2.0."
    I'll take it to mean the following:
    1. Successful.
    2. Drawing attendance AWAY from Disneyland for a few years.
    3. A full day park, with guests coming away so tired and satisfied they don't have to go to DL.
    4. Has to stay open as long as DL every single day, due to demand.
    5. Has a separate AP for those wishing to go only to DCA, it's that good at drawing a new, separate audience to the DLR.
    6. GC Hotel is built over Disneyland Drive (West Drive) and it engulfs the current monorail stop.

    If it were built right the first time:
    1. Pressler might have been hailed as the next Walt. (Though Eisner would have taken the credit.)
    2. No Cast Member Matt" needed, since the money would flow in to maintain the attractions with gate revenue.
    3. AP actually would have been eliminated, since the park will be so popular that guests would actually pay to enter it each time they come. You know, like they used to for the 40 years prior to that genius Pressler's conversion of the revenue stream. That results in a successful return on investment, and confidence from the Board toward managers to invest and create more revenue in the park infrastructure and attractions (which, not oddly, "attract" the guests) instead of in park souvenirs and food for the cheap, short-term bucks and bonuses.

    Fantasmic! out of DL and into a similar, functioning setting (unlike WDW's Fantasmic!-only venue) would have been a great idea. Theme for area could be "Magic of the Movies," or something less lame.
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  13. #13

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    Re: What if DCA had been done right the first time?

    Quote Originally Posted by sediment View Post
    If it were built right the first time:
    1. Pressler might have been hailed as the next Walt. (Though Eisner would have taken the credit.)
    2. No Cast Member Matt" needed, since the money would flow in to maintain the attractions with gate revenue.
    3. AP actually would have been eliminated, since the park will be so popular that guests would actually pay to enter it each time they come. You know, like they used to for the 40 years prior to that genius Pressler's conversion of the revenue stream. That results in a successful return on investment, and confidence from the Board toward managers to invest and create more revenue in the park infrastructure and attractions (which, not oddly, "attract" the guests) instead of in park souvenirs and food for the cheap, short-term bucks and bonuses.
    Bingo!!
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  14. #14

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    Re: What if DCA had been done right the first time?

    Completely disagree with the OP.

    DCA is forever damned. Simple as that. The theme is still stupid. The layout of the park still sucks. And we still have MAJOR issues with sightlines. Imagine 2012, when you're standing next to the Blue Sky Cellar and you can spin in a circle to see a massive Paradise Pier, Pacific Wharf, Carsland, Bugsland, Grizzly Peak, AND Buena Vista Street. Nice layout DCA.

    IF DCA was done right the first time, it would have been unfathomably better than DCA.

  15. #15

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    Re: What if DCA had been done right the first time?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Noty View Post
    Can anyone tell me, as a new resident to CA, what was so bad about DCA when it opened? I know nothing of the park except that its there and what in it now.

    Thanks
    I think your first clue is in the name of the park itself. The original intention was for DCA to be a tourist trap for people who wanted quicker access to all the hot spots of California while replicating them in the form of a "homage". Also the majority of ride in the park's early years were located in Paradise Pier and they were cheap, generic, carnival rides. The suits decided that they could make DCA a Six Flags type park to compete with other Six Flags or Cedar Fair type parks. Disney itself lacked an overall presence in the park at the time and the themes of the few lands in the park at the time were unimaginative as they were more focused on contemporary California which in itself lacks any sort of imagination. This allowed for very little immersive theming in the park as possible. The total budget for the park when it opened was around $600million which is pretty low.

    To answer the central question of this thread (which I swear was done before):
    Please keep in mind these are just MY THEORIES

    • The layout of the park would flow better (possible hub style similar to DL)
    • Paradise Pier would still not look like a generic themed area
    • The GCH would be built into the park (as currently discussed in another thread)
    • The lagoon would be big enough to allow for more people to view World of Color at night (and not fight over FPs)
    • Monsters Inc darkride would not be in the Hollywood area
    • San Francisco would have more to do (actually this could've been an interesting alternative to BVS)
    • The parade route would be similar to DL (possibly staying out of PP depending)
    • California Screamin would have a theme (with possibly a different pun-less name)
    • The buildings in the Hollywood area would not look like boxes or backlots
    • Paradise Wharf would have attractions and not just restaraunts
    Last edited by toonaspie; 09-09-2011 at 06:51 PM.
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