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  1. #631

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    I hate throwing out the hypothetical ideas that we really have absolutely no control over, but it seems that a better balance to the new Gold benefits would have been something along the lines of unlimited comps with dining reservation while ACCOMPANIED by the member and a 50 comp limit on unaccompanied reservations.

    ...would that have been more digestible as a current member? (while presented in person in a pair of Mickey gloves of course!)


    ...and if I am fortunate enough to get a membership invite, I will definitely let ya know which will give an indication of the burn rate (...and have to make a serious evaluation as to the value cuz that would mean that they burned through the whole original 800 on the wait list!)
    Last edited by ParkHopper1; 05-21-2012 at 09:41 PM.

  2. #632

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by David A View Post
    IF ANY CAST MEMBER TELLS YOU THAT MEMBERS WERE ABUSING THE COMP'D PASS SYSTEM, THEY'RE LYING.
    We agree that that there were people giving reservations to anyone who asked. I consider that an abuse of the membership because it created difficulty for paying members who were trying to get reservations and benefited only people who had not paid for membership and had no real relationship with a member.

    To repeat and emphasize a point I made earlier -- and no one has disagreed-- in the last two years I often had difficulty getting reservations at the club for myself and my immediate family--particularly during busy times. Since these changes were implemented, I have had no difficulty getting every reservation I have requested. To me, that indicates that the new policies have curbed prior abuses (as I define that term) and improved the ability of members to use the club. While I would not dispute that Disney has a profit motive that must have been an important factor leading to the changes (which I do not begrudge any business), the changes--IMO-- have made it easier for members to use the club and I think that is great.

  3. #633

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Parkhopper1, oh yes, please let us know, that will be extremely interesting and will give a good indication of the turn-down rate. I honestly believe it's quite high. But I have no doubt they'll fill the ranks quickly.
    I must confess Macindan, that over the years I've not had many difficulties making reservations at the club, so long as the time to place such reservation was of a reasonable amount. It's always been difficult making last minute reservations, but that's to be expected and in some way, has always added to the charm.
    Last edited by David A; 05-22-2012 at 08:14 AM.

  4. #634

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by David A View Post
    IF ANY CAST MEMBER TELLS YOU THAT MEMBERS WERE ABUSING THE COMP'D PASS SYSTEM, THEY'RE LYING.
    So you believe 100% that the president of DLR was lying when he got up on stage and said there were members giving out thousands of passes? Or you think Al got the story wrong retelling it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Al Lutz
    It was that ticketing point that George explained was a key factor in the changes, as when they’d audited the number of comp tickets being distributed by members they found that most members were averaging a few dozen comp tickets per year passed out to friends and family. However, there are a few members that have been giving away over a thousand free tickets per year to the park, ostensibly under the assumption these were all friends and family coming in to dine at Club 33, which George explained with a wry smile.
    Or do you not consider giving out thousands of passes 'abuse'?
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  5. #635

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Thousands? So what! That's laughable and whats more laughable, is some people defend Disney's lack of ethics.
    No, I don't believe it and I really don't care. If someone did, why punish all of us? Heck, why punish that member, it's his rights and rights are worth fighting for. He/She paid for that right.
    If a member did give out 1000 tickets, taking into considering the average price of a club meal is $98.00, that's $98,000.00 in Disney's coffers. It's also approx. $17800.00 in tips, distributed to the staff. They should be shaking that persons hand saying 'Thank you, I was able to make my mortgage payment this month!' Granted, yes, the park would have made more just selling the tickets at the gate, but, most of those people probably wouldn't have visited the park without the joy of experiencing the club. It's a give and take. We give, Disney takes.
    As I stated earlier, if the club didn't work and didn't make money, why did they knock if off?
    The profit margin on the food that the club sells is very high, it's nothing too terribly special anyways. So Disney has to work a little harder to make the money, so what! It keeps cast members employed and more important, it keeps the benefits in place which shows the Walt Disney Company still has a modicum of integrity.
    Perhaps I've been around the business world too long, maybe I'm jaded, but I don't believe everything a company tells me. I know darn well that if I promise a client a specific product or service, I'd better follow through or I'll never see them again.
    Believe what you will, say what you'll say, but I'm still very angry at Disney and my faith in them has lessened significantly.

  6. #636

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    So you believe 100% that the president of DLR was lying when he got up on stage and said there were members giving out thousands of passes? Or you think Al got the story wrong retelling it?

    Or do you not consider giving out thousands of passes 'abuse'?
    I know of several members who would make a reservation for anyone who asked. Did this total thousands of passes, I really don't know...

    BUT

    Even if it did total thousands of passes you can't abuse a privilege that you PAID for!!! Disney and Club 33 SOLD him/her the right to do this. Not once did Club 33 turn his/her guests away and refuse their money paid at the end of the meal. The abuse is on behalf of Disney and Club 33 for allowing this to go on for so long (decades) despite being aware of this pattern of use.

    I think the current president of Disneyland is nothing short of a paid politician who will say anything to promote the changes he has made in the hopes of winning a contract extension later this year.

  7. #637

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    I would consider taking that perk and exercising it 'thousands of times' a year abuse.

    If I tell my neighbor 'sure, come on over to my house anytime!' and they are there every night.. they are abusing the invite. That's common sense.

    It's in the rules they can do it.. so that's why they can't punish them for the volume.. it is still abusing the intent of the perk. So they simply change the rules to prevent that kind of abuse from stop someone from claiming 'its their right'.
    Check out my blog - Coreplex: Rambling from inside the Grid


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    Quote Originally Posted by sleepyjeff View Post
    Disneyland was meant to be sipped not chug-a-lugged

  8. #638

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    I would consider taking that perk and exercising it 'thousands of times' a year abuse.

    If I tell my neighbor 'sure, come on over to my house anytime!' and they are there every night.. they are abusing the invite. That's common sense.

    It's in the rules they can do it.. so that's why they can't punish them for the volume.. it is still abusing the intent of the perk. So they simply change the rules to prevent that kind of abuse from stop someone from claiming 'its their right'.
    Your neighbor did not pay you for the "privilege".

    I love a world where we must excuse what you said and not take it literally (common sense should tell us that we should intuitively know what you really meant by your false and misleading statement) and yet we should not excuse someone for utilizing what they PAID for. Wow, what a complicated world we live in. I actually try to tell people what I mean to avoid these types of situations. How foolish of me.
    Last edited by Disneynut; 05-22-2012 at 10:01 AM.

  9. #639

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Applause and Kudos fellow member!
    Defending the defenseless is not an easy to pill to swallow nor the lightest load to carry.
    Anyone in business knows that the first objective of any new manager is to justify his existence and show where he has increased profits and bettered his work environment more so than his predecessor. This is true in every level of management. Cutting club member benefits was easy for King George, it's a hot knife into warm butter. It was however, not right.
    Tiny little Club 33 has no virtual impact on main gate ticket sales, don't even waist your time telling me it does. This is pure nonsense.
    Disneynut is standing up for a specific right as am I, a right we paid for and are due. As members, most of us worked extremely hard to obtain said membership. I don't see Disney offering refunds to us nor will I. They count their money going into their palm, not giving it out.
    Even after all of this, my affection for the park itself hasn't lessened, but George needs to know members and park guests will only stand for so much.
    One disgruntled guest may lead to two, two may lead to three, and so on.

  10. #640

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by Disneynut View Post
    I love a world where we must excuse what you said and not take it literally (common sense should tell us that we should intuitively know what you really meant by your false and misleading statement) and yet we should not excuse someone for utilizing what they PAID for. Wow, what a complicated world we live in. I actually try to tell people what I mean to avoid these types of situations. How foolish of me.

    I love a world where someone cannot see that exercising that option thousands of times per year could be considered abuse. As flynnibus put is so very eloquently:

    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    It's in the rules they can do it.. so that's why they can't punish them for the volume.. it is still abusing the intent of the perk. So they simply change the rules to prevent that kind of abuse from stop someone from claiming 'its their right'.
    -Osky

    Quote Originally Posted by sleepyjeff View Post
    Before we totally disregard extremism; lets remember the lesson of the 3 little pigs.

    The moderate pig lost his house to the wolf too
    .-- .. .-.. .-.. / .- -. -.-- --- -. . / -... --- - .... . .-. / - --- / - .-. .- -. ... .-.. .- - . / - .... .. ... ..--..

  11. #641

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    I would consider taking that perk and exercising it 'thousands of times' a year abuse.
    What George, Al, and you all failed to mention is that if the Guests didn't show, or didn't dine at 33 then the member was charged for the comp'd tickets. If they dined at 33, and did nothing else, then Disney still made a profit on the comp'd tickets. Disney traded a $75 ticket for a $98 plate plus tip. Irrespective of "abuse" on the part of the member, at no point was Disney losing money because of this behavior. Disney tolerated this behavior because it made them money.

    The other issue was the timing of this announcement, which coincided with the announcement of new "levels" and the announcement of opening up the membership list. Disney makes money on its current membership. It doesn't make money off the potential members on the waiting list. Less "abuse" means open tables, which in turn means more potential members can become paying members and taken off the waiting list.

    This had nothing to do with abuse and everything to do with a cash grab on Disney's part.
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  12. #642

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by Osky View Post



    I love a world where someone cannot see that exercising that option thousands of times per year could be considered abuse. As flynnibus put is so very eloquently:
    My personal opinion is that it was overused. That does not make it wrong. It is not what I would do or what you would do, but it was within the guidelines. What next, AP's get punished for using their pass 365 days per year. Really, this is an irrational argument that simply does not add up.

  13. #643

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post

    If I tell my neighbor 'sure, come on over to my house anytime!' and they are there every night.. they are abusing the invite. That's common sense.
    That is an absolutely ridiculous comparison. It has nothing to do with products and services in a business environment. I'm having a difficult time trying to grasp how you could even raise this issue as any comprehensive basis for comparison?
    I'm not criticizing your attempt, but you're on the Ward Kimball and we're on the C.K. Holiday. Same tracks, different trains!

  14. #644

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by Disneynut View Post
    My personal opinion is that it was overused. That does not make it wrong. It is not what I would do or what you would do, but it was within the guidelines. What next, AP's get punished for using their pass 365 days per year. Really, this is an irrational argument that simply does not add up.
    And it is your opinion that it is not abuse, like it is my opinion that it is. There are many many things that could be considered "abuse" that are not specifically outlawed in the rules. It is that type of thinking why society is so litigious today. I long to live in a world where common sense would dictate what is socially acceptable and what is not, but that is a pipe dream.
    -Osky

    Quote Originally Posted by sleepyjeff View Post
    Before we totally disregard extremism; lets remember the lesson of the 3 little pigs.

    The moderate pig lost his house to the wolf too
    .-- .. .-.. .-.. / .- -. -.-- --- -. . / -... --- - .... . .-. / - --- / - .-. .- -. ... .-.. .- - . / - .... .. ... ..--..

  15. #645

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    So you believe 100% that the president of DLR was lying when he got up on stage and said there were members giving out thousands of passes?
    I think anyone who thinks that "blame the customer" isn't among the Top 10 techniques of Disney groupthink hasn't been inside. I think anyone who thinks there could be the slightest possibility that George, or any other Disney executive on his level, would not voice the approved company line at a presentation, is kidding themselves about how Disney works.
    "With the acquisition of Marvel and now of Lucasfilm,
    Disney may have finally found the grail. You don't need
    imagination or art. All you need is a brand."

    - Neil Gabler


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