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  1. #706

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by techskip View Post
    Just FYI (and a dose of common sense for those who have already posted); there is a reason most MC members who are also 33 members do not identify themselves publicly on MC. I hope that those who have identified themselves are prepared for the flood of inbox messages when random strangers and MC members (likely new ones) start asking to be 1 of the lucky 50 comps. I know several 33 members that are MC members, and while they may agree with you to a point they refuse to risk identification for the reason stated.

    To take it a step further. Assuming individuals actually read this far... out of respect for the 33 members who have identified themselves, please do not contact them about a comp admission to Club 33.
    It is interesting that you make this point. I have identified myself as a C33 member in posts several times over the years and have received private message warnings like the one that you just posted. It turns out that I have only received two very respectful requests of the type that you anticipated (which I also respectfully declined to honor). One of the points I have tried to make is that, as a member of this private club, I feel an obligation to other paying members not to use (or "abuse" if you prefer) the membership by offering reservations to people who I do not actually know either personally or professionally. I won't even make reservations for friends of friends if I do not know them. My feeling-- and I hope it is shared by most other members-- is that giving access to the club to people I do not know makes it more difficult for other paying members to make reservations for themselves or for people that they do know. I hope people who want to visit the club but who are not members that declining to honor their requests is a way to be courteous to our fellow members.

  2. #707

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by Disneynut View Post
    My subsequent post was not directed at you, but you must enjoy being a target. I am not trying to "skip over the meat of the matter". I simply don't have the time nor the patience to continue to argue with people who don't get it and never will. I paid for my education, you should do the same.
    Here is what I don't get? Why are you so opposed to a change that only serves to make the club you joined more exclusive?

    I will give you an example. Yale wants to open a campus in Singapore to take advantage of its brand equity in Asia. The Alumni are opposed to the idea. Yale has made concessions, the most important being that the Singapore campus will not confer degrees that bear the Yale name and that are in way identical to the ones it confers at Yale College (New Haven). Still, the Alumni as a group have reservations because they continue to be concerned about the exclusivity of their own degrees. That is just how one would expect members of an exclusive club to behave.

    That is not the behavior I am seeing here. You seem more concerned with the cap placed on passes than you do with the fact that the cap and the new Platinum level would make the club more exclusive. That is what I don't get. Well, I do get it, but I don't want to say what it is.

    (As to the personal attack on flynnibus, was that really necessary?)

  3. #708

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by macindan View Post
    One of the points I have tried to make is that, as a member of this private club, I feel an obligation to other paying members not to use (or "abuse" if you prefer) the membership by offering reservations to people who I do not actually know either personally or professionally. I won't even make reservations for friends of friends if I do not know them. My feeling-- and I hope it is shared by most other members-- is that giving access to the club to people I do not know makes it more difficult for other paying members to make reservations for themselves or for people that they do know. I hope people who want to visit the club but who are not members that declining to honor their requests is a way to be courteous to our fellow members.
    A very sensible way to take self-responsibility. Thanks for sharing that.

    Hi, my name is Steve, can you get me into the Club next week?

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  4. #709

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by macindan View Post
    It is interesting that you make this point. I have identified myself as a C33 member in posts several times over the years and have received private message warnings like the one that you just posted. It turns out that I have only received two very respectful requests of the type that you anticipated (which I also respectfully declined to honor). One of the points I have tried to make is that, as a member of this private club, I feel an obligation to other paying members not to use (or "abuse" if you prefer) the membership by offering reservations to people who I do not actually know either personally or professionally. I won't even make reservations for friends of friends if I do not know them. My feeling-- and I hope it is shared by most other members-- is that giving access to the club to people I do not know makes it more difficult for other paying members to make reservations for themselves or for people that they do know. I hope people who want to visit the club but who are not members that declining to honor their requests is a way to be courteous to our fellow members.
    Thank you for putting it so nicely. It is one thing to mention membership in passing on a thread that is "here and gone". This thread has taken on quite a life, and searching for 33 will likely land an individual here within a few short clicks.

    Additionally you get the random "How do I get in to 33" newbie thread on here from time to time. If they, as a new member, search for 33 this thread will quickly come up as well. While it may not happen, there is the potential to have an inbox of 33 requests! I just wanted to make sure that the members who identified themselves are aware of that potential.
    "Happiness is a Low Water Level"


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  5. #710

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by DL714 View Post
    No, just a Professor of Literature, but I did take two courses in law while at Yale, including one in contract law. So, I know just a little about "exclusive clubs" and contract law, the latter probably more in theory than in practice. (We study all sorts of contracts in literary study too.)

    Whatever the case, if you think you have a case here, file the suit. Can't wait to read all about it in the papers.
    This is not an "exclusive club" like those that you may have studied (or joined) at Yale.
    This is more like joining a gym. A very expensive gym with a rich history, and no exercise equipment.
    Someone else owns this club. Not the members.

    ---------- Post added 05-23-2012 at 10:56 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by DL714 View Post
    Here is what I don't get? Why are you so opposed to a change that only serves to make the club you joined more exclusive?
    I guess the "more exclusive" aspect isn't worth the "paying more for fewer benefits" aspect.
    "Here You Leave the World of California Today and Enter the World of, um, er, California Today."

  6. #711

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by DL714 View Post
    Here is what I don't get? Why are you so opposed to a change that only serves to make the club you joined more exclusive?

    I will give you an example. Yale wants to open a campus in Singapore to take advantage of its brand equity in Asia. The Alumni are opposed to the idea. Yale has made concessions, the most important being that the Singapore campus will not confer degrees that bear the Yale name and that are in way identical to the ones it confers at Yale College (New Haven). Still, the Alumni as a group have reservations because they continue to be concerned about the exclusivity of their own degrees. That is just how one would expect members of an exclusive club to behave.

    That is not the behavior I am seeing here. You seem more concerned with the cap placed on passes than you do with the fact that the cap and the new Platinum level would make the club more exclusive. That is what I don't get. Well, I do get it, but I don't want to say what it is.

    (As to the personal attack on flynnibus, was that really necessary?)

    First, maybe I am getting too heated, so I do apologize. Without starting a new argument...you don't get my side of this. I am NOT opposed to the change. I know others that are opposed to it and I do understand their feelings. What I am against is the horrible manner in which this was handled. I am offended that they ask for my business and then use the very business that kept them all employed (at least within the club) as a battering ram for these new policies. I won't budge from my belief that they lied. These changes were brought about to benefit Disney...to beat up on your most loyal customers because you need to find a method to tap the waiting list is just inexcusable.

    The argument is simple. This is not about the end destination, this is about the journey.

  7. #712

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by Disneynut View Post
    First, maybe I am getting too heated, so I do apologize. Without starting a new argument...you don't get my side of this. I am NOT opposed to the change. I know others that are opposed to it and I do understand their feelings. What I am against is the horrible manner in which this was handled. I am offended that they ask for my business and then use the very business that kept them all employed (at least within the club) as a battering ram for these new policies. I won't budge from my belief that they lied. These changes were brought about to benefit Disney...to beat up on your most loyal customers because you need to find a method to tap the waiting list is just inexcusable.

    The argument is simple. This is not about the end destination, this is about the journey.
    It depends on the individual. Some are upset that the members have become the scapegoat for a fairly transparent money grab. Others are upset that those waiting weren't offered 1901 as an alternative instead of opening the ranks of 33. Still others are upset that the "exclusiveness" of 33 is slowly being eroded. Why pay for 33 when DVC can get you into the same events now and has similar perks? There was a time when the price tag bought you more than just a prestigious name. Again I apologize for the crass nature of this statement but it was bound to happen... especially when you consider how much has been cut from the rest of the resort (both parks and hotels).

    So some are upset over how this started, some complain about the journey itself, still others are upset about the eventual destination.
    "Happiness is a Low Water Level"


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  8. #713

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by techskip View Post
    It depends on the individual. Some are upset that the members have become the scapegoat for a fairly transparent money grab. Others are upset that those waiting weren't offered 1901 as an alternative instead of opening the ranks of 33. Still others are upset that the "exclusiveness" of 33 is slowly being eroded. Why pay for 33 when DVC can get you into the same events now and has similar perks? There was a time when the price tag bought you more than just a prestigious name.

    So some are upset over how this started, some complain about the journey itself, still others are upset about the eventual destination.
    Thanks for fleshing this out for everyone. You are correct, this is different for each person. I was trying to answer the individual who I believe thinks I am upset because of a limit to the comp passes. Although this is not my particular beef with the Club, I do understand that this is an issue for others.

  9. #714

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by sediment View Post



    I guess the "more exclusive" aspect isn't worth the "paying more for fewer benefits" aspect.
    Yes, you are correct. Dues are being paid (increased annually) and yet the benefits have lessened substantially. Once again, a very poor decision by King George.
    They simply should have left the club alone and not tried to squeeze it as a source of green. Add more members, that's not a problem, but don't punish the existing members.
    In truth, most members have moved beyond the 'exclusive' aspects of the club. For us, it's a nice restaurant with history, personality, and most important, a close personal tie to Walt.
    Limiting our ability to share this experience is a slap in the face and is proving to be highly discouraging.
    For those new, pending members, think carefully as to why you're joining. If you doing so to share your interests and passion for all things Disney be aware, Disney may just take those now limited benefits away the following year.
    I really pity the members who joined the club in 2011 and were not able to enjoy many years of terrific benefits as some of us have.
    To all those considering platinum. Two words to remember: CAVEAT EMPTOR!
    The Mouse cannot be trusted.

  10. #715

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by David A View Post
    Mr. Osky,
    I'm quite sure you're a reasonably sharp chap, albeit a Disneyfied one. Just run back through the prior posts, it's all there in black and white. I've grown a bit wearing of repeating myself, at least tonight that is. I've got a ton of meetings tomorrow but I should find time to get online throughout the day. Just depends how my schedule goes.
    Anyways, the basis for the initial complaint are present, you should have recognized them immediately. A paralegal or first year would see them too. This case could easily be a bar question. Look a little harder, you'll find them. Grab the facts, put them together and you'll find that a legal issue of misrepresentation is present. Sorry for sounding professorial.
    I reread every post you have put in this thread. The first one you mention the possibility of taking legal action. In none of your posts do you stipulate the basis for those legal actions.

    You don't need to be condescending to me because you do not agree with me, or you think I don't see something that you think should be obvious

    If everything is so black and white, please state what the basis is. The fact that I keep asking, and you keep saying it is obvious, or it is all there, instead of directly answering the question, tells me something. Personally, I have several close friends who are members. I have reviewed the contract when I was considering membership. I know how it has changed over the years. I do not see what basis you have for legal action. I certainly can see why you are displeased, but that doesn't mean you have merit for legal action. Again, I am not saying that you do not have a case; I am saying I don't know what it is.
    -Osky

    Quote Originally Posted by sleepyjeff View Post
    Before we totally disregard extremism; lets remember the lesson of the 3 little pigs.

    The moderate pig lost his house to the wolf too
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  11. #716

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Add me to the list of potential club members who are very grateful for this thread. As many others in the "potential" member category, it has been a dream of mine for years to have the opportunity to join Club 33. Although the new platinum membership includes many perks that are "better" for me personally than those previously enjoyed by members, what this thread has really brought home is the risk of joining based on the current perks. Based on how I think I will use the club, I can justify the $10k per year dues. I think I could get my money's worth with the perks as described today. But what this thread has helped me see is that it's the $25k that is at risk. Basically, I'd be paying a huge initiation fee for no guarantee of anything after year one. That's hard to stomach. One would *think* that Disney would not do something to so violate the "trust" of their members who have joined with certain perks in mind, but as this thread has pointed out, to many people they have already done so.

    I want to thank all the members who have come on this thread to post their opinions--no matter what "side" they are on. If I am given the opportunity to join, this thread will help me make an informed decision either way.

    P.S. And don't worry, you will never get a private message dining request from me!

  12. #717

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by Disneynut View Post
    First, let’s drop the legal talk. Funny thing, I actually had to go to law school in order to learn law. I don’t think working on the Mark Twain dock qualifies anyone to be an attorney.
    I'm not a lawyer, but I do know how to blow the steam whistle correctly! It's all in the wrist.

    My point in mentioning that I read the Club 33 membership contract they give out to members is that it was pretty cut and dried. The contract boiled down to this; Disney owns the place and they reserve the right to change the rules at any time.

    And they just changed the rules.

    And the rule change that really seems to be the sticking point here is... You used to have unlimited sign-ins every year for anyone you wanted. Now the new rule is you are limited to 50 sign-ins per year.

    If you don't think that is cool and you're upset enough that's it's no longer worthwhile to be a member because you used to invite well over 50 different people per year to dine with you, then it would seem you have two options; write a letter voicing your concern to club management and see what the response is, and/or withdraw your membership from the club.

    I agree that it's best to drop the legal talk. The legal thing would go absolutely nowhere, as Disney had every legal right to change the rules for the membership club they run. All a lawsuit would do is cost the members involved a lot of money and make things a little awkward in the dining room for them for the next few years.

  13. #718

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by CaliforniaGirl12 View Post
    Basically, I'd be paying a huge initiation fee for no guarantee of anything after year one.
    Truly, I hope you're able to secure your membership and enjoy the club as we have over these past many years. It's a special place and the staff is simply terrific. Sorry you weren't with us during the golden years, but being that you're new and aren't somewhat acclimatized as most of us are, you'll have a great deal of enjoyment.
    Be sure to introduce yourself to the valets at DGCH, they're really the finest bunch of fellows and they'll start every one of your park visits on an upbeat note.
    All this aside, yes, be extremely thoughtful of your potential purchase and do so knowing that Disney could and might proceed to revoke any specific benefit which you may find particularity enjoyable. Know this going in, eyes wide open.
    I still love the ol' club, it's the park management I have no faith in.

    ---------- Post added 05-23-2012 at 02:10 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by techskip View Post
    Thank you for putting it so nicely. It is one thing to mention membership in passing on a thread that is "here and gone". This thread has taken on quite a life, and searching for 33 will likely land an individual here within a few short clicks.
    Thanks Skip!
    It was kind of you to post the admonition regarding member contact. You're thinking outside the box just like a good skipper should! Thank you.

    Oh Skip, I must ask and I apologize if this is a silly question, but I really love your logo with the hippos! Does the 'low water line' impact the attraction or perhaps shut it down due to mechanical apparatus showing? Sorry, I just thought I'd ask. Like many, I just adore the attraction and the cast members who run it are such an integral part.

  14. #719

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Question - is it not true that the new 50 annual sign ins are no longer predicated on a meal at the Club and previously the requirement was only with a reservation?
    The Mur
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  15. #720

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    Re: Club 33 Membership Changes for 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by themur View Post
    Question - is it not true that the new 50 annual sign ins are no longer predicated on a meal at the Club and previously the requirement was only with a reservation?
    Herein lies the rub. The previous "rule" was that members could have 1 sign in a day in addition to their card and spouses card. For example, if Member A wanted to bring his/her grandchild for the day, they could sign him in. No meal required. Or they could have a party of 30 to the club for a party and everyone could have a comp ticket if they attended the meal. That ended. Now they get 50 1 day passes they can use however they wish, whether it is with or without a meal.
    If you see a cute yellow lab puppy with a yellow cape, WAVE! It might be us! (Or it may be someone else that lurks here!) Thank you for asking before you pet! Next trip, Dec 22-Jan 3rd.

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