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  1. #16

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    Re: What will happen to Carsland once it is deemed outdated?

    I know a number of people who have never seen Cars and they love Cars Land. That should be an indication of the staying power of this land. Unlike Avatarland they're planning for Animal Kingdom. That movie has already lost it's popularity and it only came out a few years ago.

  2. #17

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    Re: What will happen to Carsland once it is deemed outdated?

    Quote Originally Posted by SavannaQueen View Post
    Sometimes I lie awake at night wondering what would happen to the Matterhorn if guests ever forgot about Third Man on the Mountain. They'd have to tear it down and replace it with something more timeless, like a regular mountain. Curse those movie tie-ins!
    I actually have a copy of Third Man on the Mountain on DVD. I found it used on amazon and wanted to see the story behind the attraction and it was decent movie from it's time period. I have always loved the matterhorn because it is fun, cool, and its the mountain. I have been lucky to have seen the real mountain on a european trip. The whole question of outdated is silly because most if not all the disney rides are based on classic stories that each generation can read and enjoy. Boring people should be outdated right!

  3. #18

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    Re: What will happen to Carsland once it is deemed outdated?

    Seems like you've just described Toon Town. Just saw the movie again recently and it still boggles me that an entire land was built around that one single mediocre movie...and Toon Town is starting to get awfully long in the tooth.

    And how many people "get" the Roger rabbit ride do you think, btw?

  4. #19

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    Re: What will happen to Carsland once it is deemed outdated?

    Quote Originally Posted by Susan Hughes View Post
    I know a number of people who have never seen Cars and they love Cars Land. That should be an indication of the staying power of this land. Unlike Avatarland they're planning for Animal Kingdom. That movie has already lost it's popularity and it only came out a few years ago.
    I feel like what you said directly contradicts itself. You basically said that the success of Carsland is not based on the whether or not the movie is popular, but the success of Avatarland WILL be based whether or not the movie is popular. So which one is it?

    Quote Originally Posted by SavannaQueen View Post
    Sometimes I lie awake at night wondering what would happen to the Matterhorn if guests ever forgot about Third Man on the Mountain. They'd have to tear it down and replace it with something more timeless, like a regular mountain. Curse those movie tie-ins!
    ^Best commment ever. You win at Micechat.
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    Re: What will happen to Carsland once it is deemed outdated?

    Quote Originally Posted by vnormth View Post
    Seems like you've just described Toon Town. Just saw the movie again recently and it still boggles me that an entire land was built around that one single mediocre movie...and Toon Town is starting to get awfully long in the tooth.

    And how many people "get" the Roger rabbit ride do you think, btw?
    Are there really people that haven't seen Who Framed Roger Rabbit? I grew up watching that movie, and my brothers (aged 5 and 11) watch it all the time, as much as they watch newer movies like Cars and older Disney films.



    Anyway, I agree with what many others in this thread have said about the land's immersion being enough to keep it going for a long, long time. Also, I can't imagine people not watching the movie anymore. Pixar's films are classics, I think they're on the same level as Walt Disney's classics, they're timeless. Do you know anyone who hasn't seen Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs? I don't, and that film came out back in 1937. Pixar's movies may not be fairytales but I still think they have the same timeless power to stay popular years into the future.

  6. #21

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    Re: What will happen to Carsland once it is deemed outdated?

    Sigh, The Matterhorn was NOT based on Third Man on the Mountain. While they were on location shooting the movie, Walt became enamored by the Matterhorn and decided he wanted one in his park. That's it. It has nothing to do with the movie. He had already conceived the idea of a toboggan style ride around a mountain before he ever went to Switzerland, but when he saw the Matterhorn, that sealed the deal and he knew what he wanted. In fact, in the movie it's not even CALLED The Matterhorn! They renamed it "The Citadel"!!

    Also about Toontown, I still think it works because they didn't base it DIRECTLY on TT from Roger Rabbit. They at least had sense enough to soften it around the edges and make it "Mickey's" Toontown with a more fun look at where Mickey, Minnie, Donald, etc. live, whom I think it's safe to say are all timeless. They did not make an exact replica of what you see in the movie. As for Car Toon Spin, well I don't think it really matters as long as the ride is good. A lot of people these days might not know the movie or who the characters are, but it's still a popular ride because it's a GOOD ride. Same goes for Splash Mountain. Which is why I think that out of all of Cars Land, RSR will at least be the one thing that is likely to remain "as is" even if/when the popularity of "Cars" falls by the wayside.

  7. #22

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    Re: What will happen to Carsland once it is deemed outdated?

    What will happen when Carsland becomes outdated? The same thing that is happening to boring attractions like FNSV and Buzz. The reality is that the style of Pixar movies are not classic enough to handle 40+ years of service on their own, computer animation just advances too fast and makes the older movies feel dated, especially to children. I don't think this land will be very entertaining in 10 years time because unlike other attractions such as Splash Mountain, RSR is not very thrilling or repeatable for adults. I went on RSR 3 times and it progressively just gets worse, it reminds me of a more expensive and grand version of Monsters Inc. It's still a good ride, just don't feel the theme or concept will hold interest for the long run. If the racing portion had been longer, faster, and more aggressive I don't think RSR would be experiencing this as much.

    Walt Disney was a smart man who understood what makes attractions popular for the long term:

    "You're dead if you aim only for kids. Adults are only kids grown up, anyway."


    If you want to see what a long-term well made attraction looks like, Journey to the Center of the Earth is a primary example which features mystery, intense thrill, adult themes, and startling moments. Matter a fact, every single E-ticket in the past has accomplished one or more of these categories very well, RSR does not hit it out of the park on any one of these.
    Last edited by Seawolf; 06-27-2012 at 12:21 PM.

  8. #23

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    Re: What will happen to Carsland once it is deemed outdated?

    Quote Originally Posted by Diznygrl View Post
    Sigh, The Matterhorn was NOT based on Third Man on the Mountain. While they were on location shooting the movie, Walt became enamored by the Matterhorn and decided he wanted one in his park. That's it. It has nothing to do with the movie. He had already conceived the idea of a toboggan style ride around a mountain before he ever went to Switzerland, but when he saw the Matterhorn, that sealed the deal and he knew what he wanted. In fact, in the movie it's not even CALLED The Matterhorn! They renamed it "The Citadel"!!
    Exactly right. Likewise, the Jungle Cruise was not based on The African Queen. The design of the boats was inspired by the boat in African Queen, which itself was designed after actual tramp workboats in Africa.
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  9. #24

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    Re: What will happen to Carsland once it is deemed outdated?

    People...really forget MR TOAD's wild ride is still there....now really is that movie BIG? Same goes with Song of the South.....Carsland is here to stay and if it really for some reason does die out (boys like cars...so i don't see this happening) but they could just call it route 66...and retheme it a a little..and ta-da

  10. #25

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    Re: What will happen to Carsland once it is deemed outdated?

    But Seawolf, you do realize you are in a tiny, tiny minority. Your opinion is just as valid as anyone elses, but not many other people feel the ride is getting worse after 3 rides. It might be true for you, but your perception isnt necesarrily reality for everyone else, and that is what matters in the long run.

  11. #26

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    Re: What will happen to Carsland once it is deemed outdated?

    Quote Originally Posted by planodisney View Post
    But Seawolf, you do realize you are in a tiny, tiny minority. Your opinion is just as valid as anyone elses, but not many other people feel the ride is getting worse after 3 rides. It might be true for you, but your perception isnt necesarrily reality for everyone else, and that is what matters in the long run.
    The minority excuse is a fallacy, it has been done before and has been proven incorrect on numerous occasions, FNSV being a prime example. I rate an attraction objectively and describe what it does well and what it doesn't. I gave a very detailed reason why RSR will not work long term, that has nothing to do with me being a "minority" as you are trying to paint it. Just because an attraction gets a large crowd at launch does not prove it can last 40+ years and become a classic. You could have built an impressive 300 million dollar barney ride and it would have garnered large crowds initially.

    All you have to do is ask yourself, what do FNSV, Buzz, Little Mermaid, and RSR all have in common? They focus too narrowly on children and don't capitalize well on mystery, intense thrill, adult themes, or startling moments; granted RSR does better than the other three but still doesn't take it far enough, just as Little Mermaid doesn't with Ursula. Every one of the classic E-tickets does at the very minimum one of these categories very well, including the Fantasyland attractions and Roger Rabbit. Just look at Mr. Toad, they have hell at the end of the attraction, a great feature introduced to keep adults entertained.

    If Walt had followed trends and the majority public opinion at the time, Disneyland would not have become the amazing place it transformed into.
    Last edited by Seawolf; 06-27-2012 at 03:30 PM.

  12. #27

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    Re: What will happen to Carsland once it is deemed outdated?

    Do you know anyone who hasn't seen Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs? I don't, and that film came out back in 1937.
    Uh I know one person who has never seen it! That would be me!

    On top of that I've never seen Peter Pan, Pinochio, Alice in Wonderland, Mr. Toad or Dumbo, ie, all the other cartoons represented in FL! But yet, it FEELS like I seen them all since I been riding those rides since I was 4 years old! And of course, Disney didnt make most of the original stories and been seeped in popular culture. He just adapted them, so I've always seen some version of most of them somewhere else. I was thinking about seeing Snow White and the Huntsman for example, but the bad reviews kept me away! Obviously I know how they ALL end to...happily ever after!

    But the point is it doesnt really matter. You dont have to see the movie to get it obviously, because if you did, then the rides would suck! Sure it helps with references with scenes in the rides and it make you appreciate them more when done right, but the ride has to stand on its own regardless! Some do, some dont! And RSR for example, it has nothing to do with the actual film obviously, just created a different story where we are directly involved in it and not just casual observers like a lot of the FL rides and that really helps it more! So again it doesnt remotely matter if we seen the movies or not. Its nice if you know a little about the characters but it doesnt remotely in terms of your enjoyment of the ride.

  13. #28

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    Re: What will happen to Carsland once it is deemed outdated?

    Quote Originally Posted by WorldDisney View Post
    Uh I know one person who has never seen it! That would be me!

    On top of that I've never seen Peter Pan, Pinochio, Alice in Wonderland, Mr. Toad or Dumbo, ie, all the other cartoons represented in FL! But yet, it FEELS like I seen them all since I been riding those rides since I was 4 years old! And of course, Disney didnt make most of the original stories and been seeped in popular culture. He just adapted them, so I've always seen some version of most of them somewhere else. I was thinking about seeing Snow White and the Huntsman for example, but the bad reviews kept me away! Obviously I know how they ALL end to...happily ever after!

    But the point is it doesnt really matter. You dont have to see the movie to get it obviously, because if you did, then the rides would suck! Sure it helps with references with scenes in the rides and it make you appreciate them more when done right, but the ride has to stand on its own regardless! Some do, some dont! And RSR for example, it has nothing to do with the actual film obviously, just created a different story where we are directly involved in it and not just casual observers like a lot of the FL rides and that really helps it more! So again it doesnt remotely matter if we seen the movies or not. Its nice if you know a little about the characters but it doesnt remotely in terms of your enjoyment of the ride.
    Oh yeah, I completely understand what you mean! The Fantasyland attractions are wonderful because they provide an experience. They tend to be designed to put you in the position of a main character, exploring settings and situations that may be present in their films, but they're experiences that can stand alone, while also adding a layer of dimension to favourite films.

    I think Cars Land shows the same potential because it's made to be like an experience. For example, Radiator Springs Racers includes scenes or references to scenes from the film, but because it's an experience, it doesn't dully re-play the plot. You're meant to actually be a car, meeting other cars, residents of Radiator Springs, and preparing and taking part in a race. You don't need to have seen the movie to enjoy it, though those who have seen the movie may enjoy seeing the film's characters and settings themselves and taking part in settings and situations they loved to see in the film, but it has an experience independent enough from the film, too.

  14. #29

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    Re: What will happen to Carsland once it is deemed outdated?

    Quote Originally Posted by Seawolf View Post
    What will happen when Carsland becomes outdated? The same thing that is happening to boring attractions like FNSV and Buzz. The reality is that the style of Pixar movies are not classic enough to handle 40+ years of service on their own, computer animation just advances too fast and makes the older movies feel dated, especially to children. I don't think this land will be very entertaining in 10 years time because unlike other attractions such as Splash Mountain, RSR is not very thrilling or repeatable for adults. I went on RSR 3 times and it progressively just gets worse, it reminds me of a more expensive and grand version of Monsters Inc. It's still a good ride, just don't feel the theme or concept will hold interest for the long run. If the racing portion had been longer, faster, and more aggressive I don't think RSR would be experiencing this as much.

    Walt Disney was a smart man who understood what makes attractions popular for the long term:

    "You're dead if you aim only for kids. Adults are only kids grown up, anyway."


    If you want to see what a long-term well made attraction looks like, Journey to the Center of the Earth is a primary example which features mystery, intense thrill, adult themes, and startling moments. Matter a fact, every single E-ticket in the past has accomplished one or more of these categories very well, RSR does not hit it out of the park on any one of these.
    Sorry dude, count me in as one of the people who definitely disagree with your assessment! For one thing, I LOVE Buzz! Do it nearly everytime I go and every Disney theme park worldwide since its in every resort! It still gets 1+ hour waits at TDR for example!

    I agree about FNSV to an extent, but I found the original attraction pretty boring as well. I rode it mostly because it felt so campy and its still fun to ride through water, but I think the subs in general has had their day. But I doubt it has anything to do with Nemo the story and more to do with FNSV the ride. Its all about execution and in fact the Nemo ride in Epcot is still highly rated and considered more popular even though it cost a fraction of what FNSV did and a shorter ride basically proves that.

    And its funny how you completely overlooked TSM, one of the most popular attractions in the whole resort which is VERY kid friendly and has no thrills to speak of unless you count the air it blows in your face lol. In fact its so popular at DHS, with hours of wait times, it easily beats ST there which IS a thrilling and adult type attraction, but gets 10 min waits vs TSM 1-2 hour waits there. Again, its less about the story and characters and ALL about execution and how repeatable it is, so again, cant agree with your basic assessment there.

    As for CL and RSR, I have no idea what you been riding, but this thing is a HUGE hit! Most people consider it their top 5 ride in the resort. Not DCA, the resort. Its getting 3+ hour lines two weeks after it opened because word of mouth is that strong! How many other rides in the resort was getting 3+ hour rides daily for weeks? Whats even crazier is its that long basically all day long! I think its only fell to 80 mins on one day for an hour or so but everything I been hearing it goes from 150-240 mins on any given day! The only other ride I can think of with those crazy wait times the first few weeks is Indy, at least in my lifetime. And the fact people are comparing this ride to Indy proves its really a hit. Doesnt mean EVERYONE likes it but to say its not repeatable because its not repeatable for you is a bit absurd!

    I'm pretty sure 10 years from now both CL and RSR will still be pretty popular.

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    Re: What will happen to Carsland once it is deemed outdated?

    Quote Originally Posted by WorldDisney View Post
    Sorry dude, count me in as one of the people who definitely disagree with your assessment! For one thing, I LOVE Buzz! Do it nearly everytime I go and every Disney theme park worldwide since its in every resort! It still gets 1+ hour waits at TDR for example!
    Yet only manages to get 10-15 minute waits here in an extremely dense crowd over in Tomorrowland.

    I agree about FNSV to an extent, but I found the original attraction pretty boring as well. I rode it mostly because it felt so campy and its still fun to ride through water, but I think the subs in general has had their day. But I doubt it has anything to do with Nemo the story and more to do with FNSV the ride. Its all about execution and in fact the Nemo ride in Epcot is still highly rated and considered more popular even though it cost a fraction of what FNSV did and a shorter ride basically proves that.
    How can you compare a 40+ year old attraction which received no upgrades and was left to rot in the 90's to a modern overlay with a 160 million dollar renovation behind it? If Submarine Voyage had been redone properly with its existing adult theme, the attraction would have lasted another 40 years and we wouldn't be hearing people constantly bash it or talk of its removal; you don't hear these kind of comments coming out of 20,000 leagues under the sea in Tokyo do you? The fact remains that the childish concept and poor execution are the reasons for this attractions underwhelming performance.

    And its funny how you completely overlooked TSM, one of the most popular attractions in the whole resort which is VERY kid friendly and has no thrills to speak of unless you count the air it blows in your face lol. In fact its so popular at DHS, with hours of wait times, it easily beats ST there which IS a thrilling and adult type attraction, but gets 10 min waits vs TSM 1-2 hour waits there. Again, its less about the story and characters and ALL about execution and how repeatable it is, so again, cant agree with your basic assessment there.
    Toy Story Mania is a low capacity attraction which features a disorienting thrill aspect going around turns. It takes a video game concept which many of us can connect with and capitalizes on it. The queue is also very well done and has a barker animatronic to gain attention from people walking by. The attraction by no means has proven itself as a long term attraction, it is still brand new. Until you can point to an attraction like this which has lasted 40 years your point is moot because Buzz had the same demand at the beginning, just had more capacity to accommodate the crowds.

    As for CL and RSR, I have no idea what you been riding, but this thing is a HUGE hit! Most people consider it their top 5 ride in the resort. Not DCA, the resort. Its getting 3+ hour lines two weeks after it opened because word of mouth is that strong! How many other rides in the resort was getting 3+ hour rides daily for weeks? Whats even crazier is its that long basically all day long! I think its only fell to 80 mins on one day for an hour or so but everything I been hearing it goes from 150-240 mins on any given day! The only other ride I can think of with those crazy wait times the first few weeks is Indy, at least in my lifetime. And the fact people are comparing this ride to Indy proves its really a hit. Doesnt mean EVERYONE likes it but to say its not repeatable because its not repeatable for you is a bit absurd!

    I'm pretty sure 10 years from now both CL and RSR will still be pretty popular.
    Again, new attractions will always gain huge crowds no matter how poor the theme or execution turned out. FNSV had 4 hour waits at the beginning and sustained lengthy queue times for a whole year.
    Last edited by Seawolf; 06-27-2012 at 05:05 PM.

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