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  1. #106

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    Re: With Finding Nemo 2 announced, Are the Subs safe?

    To be fair, regarding how a lot of us nitpick DLR, we do only have two moderately sized parks, as opposed to WDW's four. Because of fewer attractions and space, more of the rides and shows are put under the microscope. I agree that sometimes we do over analyze things, but compared to the quality that WDW seems to get regularly, it's hard not to.

  2. #107

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    Re: With Finding Nemo 2 announced, Are the Subs safe?

    Quote Originally Posted by chesirecat View Post
    Actually, Pixar is a "director driven" studio, meaning that for example, Andrew Stanton has the final word on a Nemo remake, and if, and only if, there is a good story then he will make the sequel.
    I'll admit up front that I have no special knowledge of how Pixar is set up. I know that the director has quite a bit of input. But to say that Andrew Stanton has the final word on which picture gets made next - well, I just don't see that happening. And with the way Brave came out, I see a pretty large influence from Disney in the way the story flowed, indicating that Pixar isn't as autonomous as you might think.

  3. #108

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    Re: With Finding Nemo 2 announced, Are the Subs safe?

    Quote Originally Posted by danyoung View Post
    I'll admit up front that I have no special knowledge of how Pixar is set up. I know that the director has quite a bit of input. But to say that Andrew Stanton has the final word on which picture gets made next - well, I just don't see that happening. And with the way Brave came out, I see a pretty large influence from Disney in the way the story flowed, indicating that Pixar isn't as autonomous as you might think.

    Andrew Stanton directed Finding Nemo, so yes—he basically has say whether or not there will be a sequel, Nemo 2. That's how it works with sequels at Pixar, Pete Doctor, obviously, is the guy behind Monsters University. For each director, the movie is their baby, and hence, they decide future creative spin-offs.

    Brad Bird, could easily have done an Incredibles Spin-off if the right story came along, but he was earning street cred doing live action with MI, so he can do 1952, (hehe maybe a 1906 later) . . . If he feels good about an Incredibles sequel, then he will pursue that.

    Brave was an original story developed by Pixar, it involved a princess, yes, but that was integral to the story plot and there wasn't a Prince Charming. It was a typical Pixar move in that it was totally different from what came before it, (outside of the sequels), and it had Pixar's brand mix of suspenseful drama and storytelling.

    You might be mistaking a convergence of creative ideas, rather than Disney influencing Pixar or vice versa. Pixar is decidedly not getting into making "princess" films, like Disney continues to do, though they are taking a breather with this. They came up with an interesting idea and it went from there. We're they inspired by Disney? Of course everybody at Pixar is a big fan of all sorts of animation, but when you look at Brave, it is very much different from typical Disney princess films, there is no big evil personae.

    You've got maybe misguided characters like the woodcarver/witch, you've got Mor'du and really a whole interesting backstory which sort of got dropped on the editing floor when a new director had to take over as sometimes these films start taking on a life of their own when you live with the story board/storyline for months and years.

    But there wasn't this big baddies like Malificent, it was about the battle within, growing up, very different themes from Disney princess films where you've got more of an acute situational plot device/problem that the films spins on, and then a happily ever after. With Merida, her problems were of her own making and had been festering for a while, and while she reconciled with her mother, you get the sense that life's trials still have things in the works for her.

    In essence, Mor'du, like a Forbidden Planet-type id brought to life, sort of represented Merida's desire for conflict with her mother, and in general being a teenager. Happily, Merida is one of the few "princesses" in the Disney pantheon (if she even fits in that pantheon) who actually has a mother.
    Last edited by chesirecat; 08-01-2012 at 02:42 PM.

  4. #109

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    Re: With Finding Nemo 2 announced, Are the Subs safe?

    Quote Originally Posted by chesirecat View Post
    Andrew Stanton directed Finding Nemo, so yes—he basically has say whether or not there will be a sequel, Nemo 2. That's how it works with sequels at Pixar, Pete Doctor, obviously, is the guy behind Monsters University. For each director, the movie is their baby, and hence, they decide future creative spin-offs.
    Actually, no. Monsters University is being directed by Dan Scanlon, not Pete Doctor. Pete Doctor has had little to no influence on Monsters U.

  5. #110

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    Re: With Finding Nemo 2 announced, Are the Subs safe?

    Quote Originally Posted by disneylandfan95 View Post
    Actually, no. Monsters University is being directed by Dan Scanlon, not Pete Doctor. Pete Doctor has had little to no influence on Monsters U.

    Wrong, Pete Doctor wrote and directed Monsters Inc, and helped write the screenplay for Monsters University. Yeah, he took a step back from directing, but he still was primary writer on the screenplay for Monsters University and his OK was needed to do the film.

    I never said Doctor was directing, just that he was a motivating force behind the doing the film.

  6. #111

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    Re: With Finding Nemo 2 announced, Are the Subs safe?

    I personally don't hate the FN Subs. I just don't have much desire riding it again, after riding it a couple times. It's definitely better than an empty Lagoon, but I still miss the original subs.

    The SV is an iconic staple in Disneyland. There's no argument there. But I'll rather have that massive space (along with Autopia and Innoventions) to be used for something far more innovative and new.

    If they decide to keep the Subs, I hope they return the Original version, with more cool effects and scenes. Maybe add actual fish in the Lagoon (Will PETA get mad?). I'll also love if they can return Mermaids (real people) to the Lagoon. It'll add another level of magic to the Lagoon!

  7. #112

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    Re: With Finding Nemo 2 announced, Are the Subs safe?

    Quote Originally Posted by ducktalesfan5555 View Post

    If they decide to keep the Subs, I hope they return the Original version, with more cool effects and scenes. Maybe add actual fish in the Lagoon (Will PETA get mad?). I'll also love if they can return Mermaids (real people) to the Lagoon. It'll add another level of magic to the Lagoon!
    I doubt that they will ever return the subs to the pre-Nemo version. Mostly because fascination with nuclear powered subs as something new and exciting is no longer a reality. We've got an SUV sized robot about to land on Mars, and probably tens of thousands of Navy personnel live, work, play on board nuclear subs. For this reason, I think that the future of Tomorrowland will be more oriented towards Space as that is the "final frontier". James Cameron went to the bottom of the ocean and didn't see much.

    I know that Disney Seas, Paris Disneyland have Jules Verne inspired stuff, but retro-sci fi didn't work out too good for John Carter. I think a Captain Nemo movie could be great though, if made to look realistic and believable, which is super hard as we know what nuclear powered subs look like, they are really complex machines.

    Also, consider that the Nemo subs have long lines, putting back the old subs would just temporarily increase the lines, not increase ride capacity.

    What I heard from Al this week is more in line with what I'm hearing, that Innoventions will be "gutted" and that the old People mover track will be taken out. On the People Mover's footprint they could easily add an E-Ticket which has load/unload at America Sings errr . . . Innoventions, and the fast part of the ride zooms over a futuristic landscape built on Autopia. If they retooled Autopia cars to be Martian rovers, or something like that, they could keep that ride while adding an E-Ticket.

    Every time I ride Pooh, I have a gut feeling that they will take it out and put back in Country Bears, only with better effects, sort of proving the fans right . . . my brain tells me otherwise. I think fans of the original SV are sort of in the same boat, believing that they will make the "obvious" decision and return the Subs back to where they are. They'd never take out Pooh due to its popularity with little kids (maybe move it at some point) and likewise, Nemo is quite safe for now as I am beating that there are more Nemo fans (worldwide/country wide) than there are fans of the old submarine voyage.
    Last edited by chesirecat; 08-01-2012 at 06:19 PM.

  8. #113

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    Re: With Finding Nemo 2 announced, Are the Subs safe?

    Quote Originally Posted by chesirecat View Post
    They'd never take out Pooh due to its popularity with little kids (maybe move it at some point) and likewise, Nemo is quite safe for now as I am beating that there are more Nemo fans (worldwide/country wide) than there are fans of the old submarine voyage.
    They won't take them out because to do so would violate the #1 directive of Disneyland: to tie in attractions, attraction upgrades, shops, restaurants and meets-and-greets with movies that have been box office hits and/or spawned mega merchandise sales.

    "Disneyland is all about turning movies into rides."
    - Michael Eisner

    "With the acquisition of Marvel and now of Lucasfilm,
    Disney may have finally found the grail. You don't need
    imagination or art. All you need is a brand."

    - Neil Gabler


  9. #114

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    Re: With Finding Nemo 2 announced, Are the Subs safe?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Wiggins View Post
    They won't take them out because to do so would violate the #1 directive of Disneyland: to tie in attractions, attraction upgrades, shops, restaurants and meets-and-greets with movies that have been box office hits and/or spawned mega merchandise sales.

    "Disneyland is all about turning movies into rides."
    - Michael Eisner

    Of course, having a great ride which also happens to be based upon a blockbuster, or ageless children's story, are not two mutually exclusive phenomena. For example, Tokyo's Pooh has great technology, great theming, and is close to being a Fantasyland E-Ticket. Carsland just so happens to be based upon Cars, and is one of the best "lands" Disney had added to a theme park in Anaheim in decades. A lot of the attractions in Paradise Pier aren't based upon a film, such as the Ferris Wheel, and they aren't that popular, Ferris Wheel has a long line . . . because it takes forever and its not really worth it, IMHO. The two most successful rides in Paradise Pier are based upon films, Toy Story and Mermaid, though I think Mermaid doesn't quite work.

    If Burbank really wanted to hit two birds with one stone, they could have built a Tokyo-level Pooh in Disneyland, perhaps the best Pooh ride ever, wowing guests, and of course showcasing their top merchandise draw. I seriously wouldn't have a problem with this as sometimes you get a great ride.

    Grizzly Gulch and Mystic Manor are two prime examples of Disney making an attraction without a blockbuster film behind them. Will this make them better or worse as attractions? I would say that the proof of the pudding is in the eating, if the rides work then great.

    Walt was just fine with using films, such as Peter Pan and Alice in Wonderland, for rides, and the connection to the film really makes the dark rides in Fantasyland. For a lot of guests, perhaps the majority, if Disneyland had no connection whatever to its rich cinematic history, just generalized rides, the magic would be lost. It would be like the fireworks without Tinker Bell.

    I don't think most APers roll their eyes when Tinker Bell starts the fireworks, "Oh, jeez, there she goes, Disney plugging the Tinker Bell franchise . . . " But that's the reaction that a lot of APers have for certain attractions and lands, not realizing that in decades to come, guests will love the characters in Carsland, even though they might not have seen the films, or remember them much.

    I see where Mr. Wiggins is coming from, it is nice to have an experience just for the sake of having an experience, this was what Epcot was in the beginning. They had those borderline-educational rides and Mickey wasn't put in the park. A lot of that feeling of the park is still there, though they put Nemo into Living Seas, changing the feel of the ride some. I didn't really like this change, but I do like the Nemo ride in Epcot, and I recognize that the majority of theme park visitors *want* to see the characters, and that having them in attractions makes the rides relatable to some who don't have healthy imaginations ;-).

    At Epcot they actually tried to make Test Track semi-educational, about future technology . . . sort of, but the same ride system, essentially, was used for RSR. Because Disneyland is just one park, and because DCA is just one (or half a park), I don't think they'll ever have the room in Anaheim to build a west coast Epcot, or old style Tomorrowland, which was sort of what Future World was based on. There is only so much room in Disneyland . . .
    Last edited by chesirecat; 08-01-2012 at 09:36 PM.

  10. #115

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    Re: With Finding Nemo 2 announced, Are the Subs safe?

    Replace the Subs with Mini cruise ships, like the mini dream & mini fantasy

  11. #116

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    Re: With Finding Nemo 2 announced, Are the Subs safe?

    [/QUOTE] So is Haunted Mansion, Pirates of the Caribbean, Indiana Jones, Big Thunder, Snow White, Pinocchio, Alice, Mr. Toad, Roger Rabbit, Matterhorn, Space Mountain, Tower of Terror, and Splash Mountain, you know.... the most popular attractions in the park, and the ones that kids want to ride over and over again.[/QUOTE]

    I have to disagree with this to an extent especially when it comes to the age of some of the kids you may have in mind. Being an older sister to kids ranging 12-6 they all have different fears and likes. 50% of the rides you mentioned as being kids rides are on the list of rides kids I know refuse to go on. I think it's hard to typecast a ride audience because everyone has different preferences. I know plenty of kids who love Tower of Terror and hate Roger Rabbit because they're scared. Relating to kids under seven, most of the rides you mentioned they will ride once and refuse to go on later but that's just my experience these days. I also know that these kids love Nemo and would hate to see it go away.

    ---------- Post added 08-14-2012 at 10:33 PM ----------

    I also have to add that on this thread a lot of people are bitter about Nemo and want the old submarines back and coming from a younger reader who has never experienced the submarines I wanted to say that sometimes people glorify the dead or in this case closed attractions. Perhaps some of you are remembering for more than what it was? I could be wrong but this is fairly common..

    ---------- Post added 08-14-2012 at 10:36 PM ----------

    Also I would like to add I'm not a huge fan of the Nemo ride, in fact I didn't really enjoy it the times I went on and would never wait in a long line for it. So in no way am I pro Nemo but I do know people who love the ride still.

    ---------- Post added 08-14-2012 at 10:59 PM ----------

    Also I'm sick and tired of people bringing up Peoplemover. It's dead in Disneyland if you want to ride it that much go to Florida.

  12. #117

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    Re: With Finding Nemo 2 announced, Are the Subs safe?

    [/QUOTE] Relating to kids under seven, most of the rides you mentioned they will ride once and refuse to go on later but that's just my experience these days. I also know that these kids love Nemo and would hate to see it go away.

    I also have to add that on this thread a lot of people are bitter about Nemo and want the old submarines back and coming from a younger reader who has never experienced the submarines I wanted to say that sometimes people glorify the dead or in this case closed attractions. Perhaps some of you are remembering for more than what it was? I could be wrong but this is fairly common..

    Also I'm sick and tired of people bringing up Peoplemover. It's dead in Disneyland if you want to ride it that much go to Florida.[/QUOTE]

    Its hard for fans of old attractions to see them turned into something they have less interest in. I know, I have trouble enjoying Pooh because they gutted Country Bear Jamboree to put in a ride that I enjoy less. However, both Pooh and Nemo are popular with young children, and of course, young children need interesting rides too!

    Due to the short wait times, I kinda assume that Pooh is a big failure, and it certainly is much cheaper than the other three versions of Pooh in existence, but perhaps the ride accomplishes what it set out to do. Maybe also, fans of the Subs are blinded by their love of the old ride, believing that everybody thinks like them and therefore everybody else hates the ride. This can't be true as I find it a nice peaceful ride with a queue that is nice to wait in, given the view of the lagoon, plus kids love Nemo.

    Think of your most favorite ride in the park removed and replaced with, say a Ratatouille dark ride or something . . .

    Regarding the People Mover, this is endless speculation because the People Mover track is plainly visible from several locations around Tomorrowland, as is the old People Mover station, it is natural to speculate that the ride may return (apparently unlikely), or that the physical space will be used for something in the future. No other closed Disneyland attraction has its "bones" so prominently displayed.

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