People mover not coming back, Subs staying?

[MRaymond]

I'll repost this because it falls in line with this thought.

Take out the old PM track but retain the concrete bases. Install a complete new rail/coaster track system (steel tube) with induction motor activation. The old PM track down the TL centerline will be retained for visual appeal. {SECTION REMOVED} The loading/unloading system would be like the original PM and always move. Get into a pod and it closes. The ride is faster than the PM but not fast like a thrill ride and is able to slow down or accelerate for whatever reason. It is a style of transportation with speed. If it can't be routed through existing buildings take it through it's own venues. WDI could tie in anything they wanted; Tron, Star Wars, Incredibles, Mission to Mars. Think of when Ms Incredible was on the outside of the pod and it was zipping through the buildings. The new track route could go anywhere; above ground, below ground, zip around the Autopia, even go through SpMtn.

But here's the addition. Instead of individual pods, go with a short chain (4-6) of ATIS style pods. If the pods had swivel bases they could be rotated when going into a building. EXAMPLE: Chain of pods enters building
and slows down, pods rotate for a scenic view of diorama/AA space scene/etc. , pods rotate back to front and accelerate as they depart building. The new track system (except for down the center of TL) is open and can be banked, etc.
Not quite the PM, not quite RR. A new transportation system. Thoughts?

[JMazz]

Just for reference, here is the area that the submarine track covers...the yellow circle is where the maintenance bay is:

Attachment 22901

I won't get into speculation about what may or may not be done with the area, but I thought the map may be helpful to some.

VERY helpful. Thank you!

[BC_DisneyGeek]

Tony was asked about CBJ on Saturday. He said that it wasn't easy to get rid of them but the option for DL and where to put Pooh was similar to that of WDW. He opted to push for keeping Toad Hall. He said he would love to bring the CBJ back and thinks they would look great in DCA around Grizzly.

Can't argue with that choice. Love Toad. Taking that attraction out in WDW for Pooh, in a park lacking in attractions compared to DL, was not a good choice imo.

[ttintagel]

Tony was asked about CBJ on Saturday. He said that it wasn't easy to get rid of them but the option for DL and where to put Pooh was similar to that of WDW. He opted to push for keeping Toad Hall. He said he would love to bring the CBJ back and thinks they would look great in DCA around Grizzly.

Can't argue with that choice. Love Toad. Taking that attraction out in WDW for Pooh, in a park lacking in attractions compared to DL, was not a good choice imo.

Yeah, I guess in the end the company was able to save one Toad and one CBJ. Probably the best compromise we were going to get.

[Circa1966]

The Peoplemover.
He said that it will not be back in ANY form and asked us to get this information out there. There are a couple reasons why.
1. The track has badly deteriorated in several spots.
2. OSHA regulations would require a TON of changes. First they would have to add railings to the entire track. Second they would have to add stairways and other means to get down all along the track in case of evacuation. Third they would need to enclose the track so that people could not reach out to touch the side of the buildings as you travel along the track.

Tony said that they have tired many different ideas to try to get a ride that worked there, but nothing really worked. He really wants it there. Unfortunately, no one thought to ask when is the track was going to come down.

So much for Imagineering. Where's the Disney magic? Is it true that it only works when there's a movie tie in to power it? As some others have posted, I have a hard time with accepting what Tony Baxter has to say as well. He WAS the one who originally failed Tomorrowland in '98 and so there is some mud in his face when he has to accept responsibility for fixing it. But why is he asking US to get the information about the Peoplemover 'out there.' Isn't that something that Disney PR should take care of? Or might there be too many questions about what kind of magical replacement there might be if the media took off with it.

Disney did a great job with DCA 2.0 - and it shows what imagineering and an investment can do. Even with the movie tie-ins, this is probably one of the better achievements since Indiana Jones. But to keep leaning on the excuse that the Peoplemover tracks are too delapidated and there's not enough money in the budget and OSHA is onerous is just lame. The bottom line is that Imagineering is out of pixie dust.

PS - I know all this has been said before, but I wanted in on the conversation

[Druggas]

Notice the layers of movement? That's what made TL so popular.

[tonyrr1]

Notice the layers of movement? That's what made TL so popular.

... and those layers of motion missing is what makes TL feel so downright lifeless to me now, having come from a time when the Skyway and PeopleMover were in full swing. Someone mentioned previously, too about the Rocket Jets needing to be back on their site above the PeopleMover load/unload station, and I couldn't agree more. That ride was the visual element that drew you into the land from the hub, and having it at ground level in front of the land totally destroys that effect. I don't know what our friends in Imagineering are gonna do, but I sure hope they do SOMETHING. The land of tomorrow should not at all be without motion visible within the land itself. To me, eliminating those elements makes Tomorrowland dull and banal and hardly worth spending any time in outside of riding a particular attraction.

[mkemows]

So much for Imagineering. Where's the Disney magic? Is it true that it only works when there's a movie tie in to power it? As some others have posted, I have a hard time with accepting what Tony Baxter has to say as well. He WAS the one who originally failed Tomorrowland in '98 and so there is some mud in his face when he has to accept responsibility for fixing it. But why is he asking US to get the information about the Peoplemover 'out there.' Isn't that something that Disney PR should take care of? Or might there be too many questions about what kind of magical replacement there might be if the media took off with it.

Disney did a great job with DCA 2.0 - and it shows what imagineering and an investment can do. Even with the movie tie-ins, this is probably one of the better achievements since Indiana Jones. But to keep leaning on the excuse that the Peoplemover tracks are too delapidated and there's not enough money in the budget and OSHA is onerous is just lame. The bottom line is that Imagineering is out of pixie dust.

PS - I know all this has been said before, but I wanted in on the conversation

There is one power that Disney can't over come, that is the government. In our society that likes to sue for the littlest thing it means that this baby boomers enjoyed are disappearing. Heck, who rode bikes with helmets when we were kids! As long as the powers that be feel to that that have to make the world perfectly, absolutely safe then all the money in the world may not be enough to do some things.

Remember that Tony was talking to 400 Disney fans. What a better audience to explain why things are and why some things just can't come back.

When people want something that is gone to return I think they forget what Walt wanted with his little park. It was to constantly evolve. I have a feeling he would be surprised that some things have been around for 30, 40 and 50 years!

Who know what might be done with Tomorrowland...I for one can't wait and see what they might come up with. (As long as it isn't blue people :P)

[PeoplemoverMatt]

Baxter has said those exact words about the Peoplemover for years. He will continue to say them until something does get figured out, and then, like magic, everything will suddenly change.

[sinatra12]

This is probably not even feasible but what if Disney covered the track like at WdW, move astros orbitor to its original space, add retractable handrails to a widened track, (fix the track), and add some sort of safety mechanism to the cars to prevent injury

[Santana]

If they wanted to bring back the PeopleMover as nothing more than the PeopleMover, they could widen and cover the tracks and add rails along the sides like it is at WDW. They see no profit in that though because the money they'd invest for the project would not be marketable. "Hey, we brought back an old ride and you sit in it and it takes you around Tomorrowland at jogging speed!"

That being said, if they wanted to build a new, high-speed ride where the PeopleMover tracks currently are (after demolishing the vacant tracks and building new ones in the same space that are covered, wider than before, and with rails) then that is something they could totally do. And it would be marketable. I'm guessing they just haven't had the right idea come to them yet.

[kayoss]

The money spent to do the Subs were very well spent as they recycled a classic Disneyland attraction for $50 to $70 million, it remains popular with guests, AND they've gotten SEVEN years of free advertising for Nemo 2 by keeping the characters relevant.

!

The Finding Nemo subs redo cost closer in the neighborhood of $175 million. It was just incredibly expensive.

[cakvalasc]

The motorboat cruise area should just stay as it is, clean up the pond and surrounding landscape and add a few fountains in the water.

Regards to people mover, remove the track completely would free up some space in that area.

[bigwavedave]

It seems money shouldn't be an issue and when you spend $1.5 billion to fix a park named after the countries' third biggest state. It seems like they could spend at least half of that amount to upgrade Disneyland. Starting with the people Mover tracks. If you can't bring back the original ride, I understand, and probably a more updated version orf that our the short lived Rocket Rod attraction. I could even see them shortening some of the track. Just leaving it as is a shame. Here we have the 60th just around the corner. In my view there is really no excuse for just leaving the tracks as is. It seems they could really make the old track even shorter or tear down what needs to go and rebuild it to fit todays safty standards and still be fun. Just leaving it with nothing or just ripping it out without something new and futuristic will be a sad waiste of space and potential. It seems by making the correct turns and modifications they could give it the fun and thrill of a highway of the future. Maybe something like on I-robot. What better way to bring in the land of tommorow with a highway in the sky and futuristic vechils zooming up above, and a dark ride element were Tron once was!
Also I think it is also time to send Captian Eo to be retired and something new in their like something based on a trip to Mars. I am concerned in three years we will still be seeing a 1980's flick. I love the movie, and it was great to pay tribute to a music legend who don't forget also loved Disneyland, but it is time to move forward.
JUst a couple points of concern about a lack of what I see in intereste in updating Disneyland.
Sure they are adding a new area for the next princess meet and greet and expanding Fantasyland, but if that is the only idea for the next few years than they are missing out on some great ideas and oppertunities. Here you have the whole motor boat cruse area just rotting there, instead of adding it to fantasyland and turning it into an amazing new princess attraction like the Princess and the Frog (coaster) or maybe one based off of Beuty and the Beast. Fronterland also not getting something new would be sad!
I can't help with all the time and energy spendt on DCA has taken away from creative energy to updating and improving on Disneyland. Maybe I am wrong but it seems they have kind of neglected the original

[Omnispace]

I think that many are forgetting the important role that "excursion" rides play in a theme park. They provide a respite to walking and a balance to the thrill rides. They don't offer blazing thrills but can have their own memorable experiences.

I keep hearing that the PeopleMover was too slow but in all honesty it was the perfect pace to take around Tomorrowland. It slowed down going through the buildings so one could see the "enticements" for the different attractions and it went at a much more breezy pace when it circled around over the Autopia. It added a visual kinetic energy to the Tomorrowland scene without being distracting. It ate up a lot of people, was family-friendly, and it gave an incredible viewpoint from which to view the park.

No, it did not have a movie tie-in, it wasn't a creative property that Disney purchased to stay ahead of it's competitors, and it didn't have a line of consumer marketing products being pushed at your local Target or Wal Mart. It was a REAL prototype system that Walt Disney himself felt could transform our cities by providing clean and reliable transportation. The intent was that the technology could be sold to various city centers, airports, or universities -- any place that a mid-range automated system would benefit. At the time it was opened it was unique and an incredible feat of engineering.

So please don't think that the People Mover was just another "boring" ride. It was something new and real and it is those qualities that made the 1967 Tomorrowland so amazing when it opened. Disney made a huge mistake closing the PeopleMover because it sounds like it will never return in it's original form. My hope it that they can come up with a reasonable solution to restore part of the original experience and come up with a unique concept for it. Disney is limiting itself too much with the movie tie-ins. There are so many more ideas that can be explored. Being experimental is what made Disneyland so incredible in the first place.