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  1. #31

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    Re: Disneyland "Safety" & other debaucheries

    Quote Originally Posted by Roadrunner View Post
    At least two conductors, that I know of, have fallen off of the trains at DL. It is dangerous and possible deadly to fall from a moving train. One year ago a 17 year old Utah girl had both of her legs severed by a train after trying to hop on and fell under the train. The train was going between 7 and 18 mph.
    No one disputes that trains can be dangerous. But with PROPER TRAINING, boarding and disembarking moving trains is perfectly safe. What the conductors (and the girl trying to hop the freight) are lacking is proper training.

    But hey--that costs money.

  2. #32

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    Re: Disneyland "Safety" & other debaucheries

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve DeGaetano View Post
    No one disputes that trains can be dangerous. But with PROPER TRAINING, boarding and disembarking moving trains is perfectly safe. What the conductors (and the girl trying to hop the freight) are lacking is proper training.

    But hey--that costs money.
    That's just it. Disney is unwilling to provide the proper training, or perhaps is unwilling to accept the liability of giving these people permission to jump off of a moving vehicle. If they are not going to give them the proper training, shouldn't they at least take precautions to keep them safe?
    "You can cut me off from the civilized world. You can incarcerate me with two moronic cellmates. You can torture me with your thrice daily swill, but you cannot break the spirit of a Winchester. My voice shall be heard from this wilderness and I shall be delivered from this fetid and festering sewer."

  3. #33

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    Re: Disneyland "Safety" & other debaucheries

    Quote Originally Posted by calsig31 View Post
    No, not making things safer is a "make work program for lawyers". If an accident occurs and it can be shown that Disney knew of the danger, could have prevented it, and failed to do so then some attorney is going to have a field day with the case. I only hope that client walks through my door.
    Many safety features are just being installed to head off opportunistic lawsuits. All the attractions are built for safety; people get hurt only when they blatantly break the rules or put themselves in harm's way. When an attraction gets neutered just because of the actions of one idiot (or the child of thoughtless parents) we all lose.

    Accidents on the road are a daily occurence; accidents in theme parks are a rarity. The parks are safe. Let's stop squeezing the life out of life with this safety insantiy.

  4. #34

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    Re: Disneyland "Safety" & other debaucheries

    Quote Originally Posted by D3COY View Post
    Ugghh we live in such a litigative society nowadays. It sucks.

    .

    Anyone else feel it's getting out of hand?

    When it comes to safety I would like to ask the guy who was killed on BTRR when thought of the saftey rules, sadley when it comes to lives lost there can be no questions answered by them.

    ---------- Post added 09-13-2012 at 12:18 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by disneyfann121 View Post
    people get hurt only when they blatantly break the rules or put themselves in harm's way.
    You are so wrong on this issue it is not even funny, Think BTRR and the Columbia accidents. By your logic it is there own fault they died.
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  5. #35

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    Re: Disneyland "Safety" & other debaucheries

    Quote Originally Posted by disneyfann121 View Post
    Many safety features are just being installed to head off opportunistic lawsuits.
    Lawsuits which are caused by injuries that occur because Disney either saw or should have seen the danger and failed to act. Would it be better if Disney waited until someone actually got injured before installing safety features? That is like the tail trying to wag the dog. If an injury is foreseeable it is better to prevent it up front.

    Quote Originally Posted by disneyfann121 View Post
    All the attractions are built for safety; people get hurt only when they blatantly break the rules or put themselves in harm's way. When an attraction gets neutered just because of the actions of one idiot (or the child of thoughtless parents) we all lose.
    Not true. Sometimes an accident is... just an accident. If it can be foreseen and prevented it should be.

    Quote Originally Posted by disneyfann121 View Post
    Accidents on the road are a daily occurrence; accidents in theme parks are a rarity. The parks are safe. Let's stop squeezing the life out of life with this safety insantiy.
    So because it is rare that an accident will occur, it shouldn't be prevented? How often is someone going to step between the walls of the Carousel Theater and get squished? Because that worker's accident was a rare occurrence, should Disney have not installed break-away walls?
    "You can cut me off from the civilized world. You can incarcerate me with two moronic cellmates. You can torture me with your thrice daily swill, but you cannot break the spirit of a Winchester. My voice shall be heard from this wilderness and I shall be delivered from this fetid and festering sewer."

  6. #36

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    Re: Disneyland "Safety" & other debaucheries

    Quote Originally Posted by calsig31 View Post
    If they are not going to give them the proper training, shouldn't they at least take precautions to keep them safe?
    No one seems to want them to take the ultimate precautions for keeping the Conductors safe--keeping them off the trains altogether. You do admit that with this precaution in place, the liklihood of any accident involving moving trains and Conductors will fall to very near zero, right?

    I again reiterate that keeping them penned up in the trains is not safe for the Conductors OR the passengers.

  7. #37

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    Re: Disneyland "Safety" & other debaucheries

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve DeGaetano View Post
    No one seems to want them to take the ultimate precautions for keeping the Conductors safe--keeping them off the trains altogether. You do admit that with this precaution in place, the liklihood of any accident involving moving trains and Conductors will fall to very near zero, right?

    I again reiterate that keeping them penned up in the trains is not safe for the Conductors OR the passengers.
    Keep them on the train. These people are part of the show. However if they are not going to train them properly, keep them safe. At least give them an area like the workers on the back of the parking lot trams have.
    "You can cut me off from the civilized world. You can incarcerate me with two moronic cellmates. You can torture me with your thrice daily swill, but you cannot break the spirit of a Winchester. My voice shall be heard from this wilderness and I shall be delivered from this fetid and festering sewer."

  8. #38

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    Re: Disneyland "Safety" & other debaucheries

    Quote Originally Posted by calsig31 View Post
    Keep them on the train. These people are part of the show.
    Saftey comes before show.

  9. #39

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    Re: Disneyland "Safety" & other debaucheries

    Quote Originally Posted by calsig31 View Post
    So because it is rare that an accident will occur, it shouldn't be prevented? How often is someone going to step between the walls of the Carousel Theater and get squished? Because that worker's accident was a rare occurrence, should Disney have not installed break-away walls?
    Well of course they should have...and they did. Disney has a very good track record for preventive safety measures. The issue is if they are going over board. I think those little "safety" nets on the Jungle Cruise boats are a good example. No one has ever fallen out of a boat. They seem quite unnecessary.

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve DeGaetano View Post
    No one seems to want them to take the ultimate precautions for keeping the Conductors safe--keeping them off the trains altogether. You do admit that with this precaution in place, the liklihood of any accident involving moving trains and Conductors will fall to very near zero, right?

    I again reiterate that keeping them penned up in the trains is not safe for the Conductors OR the passengers.
    This is true. Conductors have to be able to spot hazards or anything else that may compromise the safety of guests or themselves
    Jack Sparrow - "You have been monstrously deceived." Pirate - We are decepted then..." Jack Sparrow - "Yes"

  10. #40

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    Re: Disneyland "Safety" & other debaucheries

    Quote Originally Posted by disneyfann121 View Post
    Accidents on the road are a daily occurence; accidents in theme parks are a rarity. The parks are safe. Let's stop squeezing the life out of life with this safety insantiy.
    Commercial airline accidents in the developed world are not exactly common, so shall we stop finding new ways to prevent an accident because they don't happen all that often?

    Its better to prevent an accident then to wait for one to happen then react.

    If Disney finds something that is not safe, they really have no choice but to correct it, if they don't and someone gets hurt or dies, well Disney would have to explain why they did nothing to prevent it even thought they knew about it.

  11. #41

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    Re: Disneyland "Safety" & other debaucheries

    Quote Originally Posted by jsmith11618 View Post
    If Disney finds something that is not safe, they really have no choice but to correct it, if they don't and someone gets hurt or dies, well Disney would have to explain why they did nothing to prevent it even thought they knew about it.
    So why don't you tell us what's unsafe about the current safety position on the trains, with its two handrails and large non-slip standing surface?

  12. #42

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    Re: Disneyland "Safety" & other debaucheries

    Anybody else think that if an accident occurs at the Park and it is found to be the guests fault that Disney should sue them? I do, maybe then people won't be so careless and pay attention. IMO, the attention span of a lot people nowadays is zilch. There was never the need for all the safety crud back when because people paid attention.
    “No worries, stay calm, one question. 
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  13. #43

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    Re: Disneyland "Safety" & other debaucheries

    They have taken out the Display/Photo-Op Teacup from in front of the Mad Hatter Shop.
    It will not return, as they have welded in a new fence, and planted grass.

    It must have been too much of a Hazard....



  14. #44

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    Re: Disneyland "Safety" & other debaucheries

    Quote Originally Posted by D3COY View Post
    The issue is if they are going over board. I think those little "safety" nets on the Jungle Cruise boats are a good example. No one has ever fallen out of a boat. They seem quite unnecessary.
    The nets are not there to keep people from falling out. They're too small for that. The nets are there to help ensure that peoples arms/hands don't slip in between the boat and the dock. The distance between the two is narrower now and the chances of a serious injury are greater. Hence the nets.

    Quote Originally Posted by Disneymike View Post
    Anybody else think that if an accident occurs at the Park and it is found to be the guests fault that Disney should sue them? I do, maybe then people won't be so careless and pay attention. IMO, the attention span of a lot people nowadays is zilch. There was never the need for all the safety crud back when because people paid attention.
    What would be the grounds for which Disney would sue them? Unless there is damage to Disney property in the accident, what damage would Disney recover?

    What Disney can do (and probably does) is raise affirmative defenses like comparative negligence to shift the some or all of the causation off of them and back on to the guest.
    "You can cut me off from the civilized world. You can incarcerate me with two moronic cellmates. You can torture me with your thrice daily swill, but you cannot break the spirit of a Winchester. My voice shall be heard from this wilderness and I shall be delivered from this fetid and festering sewer."

  15. #45

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    Re: Disneyland "Safety" & other debaucheries

    Quote Originally Posted by calsig31 View Post

    What would be the grounds for which Disney would sue them? Unless there is damage to Disney property in the accident, what damage would Disney recover?

    What Disney can do (and probably does) is raise affirmative defenses like comparative negligence to shift the some or all of the causation off of them and back on to the guest.
    Not sure about what kind of damages Disney could recover, maybe a ban from the parks for a certain time period? Maybe if it got out that Disney would do something like that people might think a little bit when visiting the parks? It just seems like some people are too dense to actually watch their kids when getting on a Jungle Cruise boat or something as easy as that.
    And for crying out loud, who would actually let their kids do this:

    "Jason looked but almost couldn't believe what he saw: a little girl lying on the station platform near the track, her eyes turned away from the approaching train, and her head resting on the rail! The girls befuddled parents didn't the harm of allowing their daughter to put her ear on the rail in order to listen for the approaching train!"

    Really???? And we as guests who have seen the park as the safest around now have to put up with garish railings and little nets all because of the lack of an attention span of the modern day guest?
    “No worries, stay calm, one question. 
Do you happen to know how to fly this thing?”

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