No more annual passes in 2013?

[mickdaddy]

It's a revenue game and the simple fact is most local AP holders do not spend money inside the park once they have the AP. SoCal ap's may have driven attendence but it has lowered revenue. I doubt the AP program is going away but I bet there are some major changes coming.

[Pinrar]

I doubt this very much. First off DL is a very local driven park. It depends too much on the reliable stream of cash it gets from the loyal pass holders.

Second, I doubt tourists and once a year locals could support the park in its current state. Back before the AP program, attractions, maintenance and everything about the parks were a lot cheaper. Less codes and regulation and the rides were a lot simpler. But these days, to stay competitive, new offerings need to be bigger and better than the pre AP structure could support. Cars land probably could not be built with tourist dollars alone.

Third, APs probably add a ton of income that most likely doesn't drive up the costs to run the park. What I mean is, disney probably doesn't spend much more to run the parks with the added burden of pass holders. I bet the park runs at full steam well below the guest count reaches full capacity. Anything over that number is extra profit and APs definitely help with that. So even though APs may only spend a few dollars a visit, their presence probably doesn't cost much more if any compared to if they weren't there. Park costs dont increase proportionally with attendance increases.

From a business perspective, there is just far too much to lose for this rumor to be true. The parks depend too heavily on the program and its steady income. And it would be unwise to alienate your biggest, most vocal, and most critical customer group you have. Its highly unlikely that this is gonna happen.

[Malina]

This is probably true on revenue per guest day, but not revenue per guest. Many APHs would only go to the park a day or single trip per year if they didn't have an AP.

I think this is the crux of it. If you add up what each APer spends in the park every year, in terms of parking (if they didn't include it), food, merch and special events like the Halloween Party, it's probably easily double or triple the cost of their AP.

In my own experience, as an AP I do tend to spend more on merch and food than I would if I were buying a hopper ticket. My mindset is "oh, that pin is only $10, dinner is only $11, $3 for that treat isn't bad..." and it adds up. Not "ZOMG. I just paid $100+ for one day. I'd better watch what I spend now..." As an AP, I am giving Disney $300 + for my pass (Southern CA), plus between $10 and $50 every trip. Without an AP I doubt I would come to Disney more than once a year and they'd perhaps get $150 out of me.

Getting rid of the AP program would really tank a lot of Disney's income.

[UbIwerks]

Is there evidence somewhere (actual figures from Disney and not fan conjecture) that AP holders spend less? I'm just curious as I see this trotted out a lot and I'm interested in the source.
As an out of town Premium passholder, I know it certainly isn't the case with my family lol

[calsig31]

I heard a rumor

I believe those are the key words. Until there is something official, we should all just assume it is business as usual with APs.

[Mr Wiggins]

I heard a rumor from that annual passes may be eliminated in 2013.

Where'd you hear it?

[gary94080]

I think that they may either eliminate or raise the Southern California AP passes before they eliminate them all together.

the last time I was at the resort I was looking at my visit numbers to see if they got the bugs worked out. looks like they did. one visit per park per day. anyway this got me thinking that Disney should also let you see things like how much you spend and save with your AP. maybe broken down by category, food, clothes, collectables etc.

I know that the marketing data must exist. it's just a matter of letting us see it.

it may have mixed results though. some may see the numbers and say "wow, I'm getting my money's worth" and renew and others may look at the totals and not renew.

personally, I live about 400 miles away and usually visit 3-4 times a year for 3-4 days per visit. if they eliminated AP, I would probably only go twice a year at most. so the overall gate revenue would be about the same but my time in the parks would be about half.

[DARTH MAUL]

1. While we may not spend as much as tourist, I certainly pay my share of cash on food, and definitely booze in DCA.
2. As others have said, the recent price increase is handling the crowds just fine.
3. APs, not AP's. Cause that's not how an apostrophe works.

[xceemora]

Me n my family have the AP we go once or twice a month to DLR not every week, because we r busy n have things to do.

[Sorcerer's Apprentice]

I don't think so, but more block outs are nearly certainly going to be added as time continues.

[kristibaer]

They won't end the AP program, but I hope they thin it out. I remember when the financing began, Al Lutz had numbers that there 200k AP's and it jumped to 1m within a year. There isn't even an off season that locals used to enjoy.

True DLR lovers like in this forum spend much more than tourists. If DL is worried about dropping renewals, they should have considered that when jacking up the prices and monthly financing the lower passes (really, if you can finance $7/mo, you can pay up front). My whole family had passes for years (8 or 9 of us) and my mom had a list with the dining reservation group that was pages long. We spent plenty until there were too many APers and it was too crowded to even enjoy a half day trip with dinner or something like that.

[calsig31]

They won't end the AP program, but I hope they thin it out. I remember when the financing began, Al Lutz had numbers that there 200k AP's and it jumped to 1m within a year. There isn't even an off season that locals used to enjoy.

True DLR lovers like in this forum spend much more than tourists. If DL is worried about dropping renewals, they should have considered that when jacking up the prices and monthly financing the lower passes (really, if you can finance $7/mo, you can pay up front). My whole family had passes for years (8 or 9 of us) and my mom had a list with the dining reservation group that was pages long. We spent plenty until there were too many APers and it was too crowded to even enjoy a half day trip with dinner or something like that.

I agree with this. The payment option has got to go. If one can't afford it right away, then save up for it. If they really want to make payments on a pass, then that is where a credit card comes in.

3. APs, not AP's. Cause that's not how an apostrophe works.

If we really want to get technical, the proper word here is because. It is also not proper sentence structure to start a sentence with that word.

[JerrodDRagon]

So you're saying the first 34 years of the park were bad?

The World changes...the parks back then was no a resort and people were not use to it but now people are used it to.....
I know for me I'd go much less....and I eat and buy stuff at the parks....so instead of spending over 1,000 bucks a year at the parks....I'd spend maybe 400 every 2 years

[christianAdam]

First let me just say that I have been a Premium AP holder for almost 10 years so I KNOW I am part of the problem

I know I've posted this in another thread but if you look at the actual breakdown of the AP you could kind of see that there would be some validity to removing the Annual Pass due to profit loss.

Lets just look at the Premium AP for instance...

The current price is at $649 which includes parking
while the current 1-day park-hopper ticket for an adult is $125 not including parking at an extra $15

So simple math would say that if you own a premium pass and go at least 5 times in one year (which is not much considering some Premium AP holders) then your pass is all but paid for, correct?

$125 + $15 = $140
$140 x 5 = 700

So if you think about it every trip that is made after that 5th trip becomes money lost on a potential ticket from a regular guest. Especially on the those busy days where AP holders flood the park.

So if you have a Premium AP and have gone more than 5 times, you would have to spend at least $125 per visit per person for Disneyland to see any kind of profit from your visit as opposed to seeing immediate profit from a regular paying guest paying for parking and a 1 day park-hopper.

Then again I could be completely wrong, it's early and I have yet to finish my coffee

[CaliforniaAdventurer]

First let me just say that I have been a Premium AP holder for almost 10 years so I KNOW I am part of the problem

I know I've posted this in another thread but if you look at the actual breakdown of the AP you could kind of see that there would be some validity to removing the Annual Pass due to profit loss.

Lets just look at the Premium AP for instance...

The current price is at $649 which includes parking
while the current 1-day park-hopper ticket for an adult is $125 not including parking at an extra $15

So simple math would say that if you own a premium pass and go at least 5 times in one year (which is not much considering some Premium AP holders) then your pass is all but paid for, correct?

$125 + $15 = $140
$140 x 5 = 700

So if you think about it every trip that is made after that 5th trip becomes money lost on a potential ticket from a regular guest. Especially on the those busy days where AP holders flood the park.

So if you have a Premium AP and have gone more than 5 times, you would have to spend at least $125 per visit per person for Disneyland to see any kind of profit from your visit as opposed to seeing immediate profit from a regular paying guest paying for parking and a 1 day park-hopper.

Then again I could be completely wrong, it's early and I have yet to finish my coffee

Only on a day when Disneyland fills to the point that they stop selling tickets. And you're probably blocked out those days, unless you're a Premium Passholder.

Me n my family have the AP we go once or twice a month to DLR not every week, because we r busy n have things to do.

I see you are able to save lots of time by eliminating vowels from your words.