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  1. #1

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    Follow Up On The Issue Of ECV Abuse At Disneyland Park

    I just returned from my vacation to DLR (10/17-10/23. 2012. Full report coming soon in the report section). I did however want to follow up on the abuse of ecv's at DLR.

    A little background- My family and I have been going at least once a year (Usually multiple times a year) since my oldest son was born in 1993. This continued until our last trip in 2009. In 2010 & 2011 life and the real estate market (my profession) got in the way and we were not able to make it until this last week. My wife has had to use an ECV since her back surgery in 2001, I have had to use one since 2008 due to a medical problem that makes it impossible for me to walk or stand for extended periods. From 2001-2009 there was never a problem with ECV's or wheelchairs, and I did not notice much if any abuse of the system. This year however was a totally different story.

    I was literally shocked at the amount of people using the ECV's and worse, the amount of people "with" them......

    I counted on most rides (especially the popular ones like Space Mountain, Thunder Mountain, Haunted Mansion, Pirates and more) groups of 5-10 people waiting in the accessible lines with only 1 person in a wheelchair/ecv. Space Mountain (Ghost Galaxy) was the worst where I counted a group of 16 people all in the same group and only 1 person with them on an ecv, and the ecv was a rental.

    And while I understand and dont have a problem having to wait in a line like everyone else (as long as the line is accessible and we can stay in our chairs/ecv's while waiting) having 16 people all in a same group with 1 ecv is just plain wrong. Even the cast members that I spoke with (and I spoke with quite a few) were all very frustrated with the whole thing.

    My solution (and one I think that Dlr should really look into) is limiting the amount of attendants per wheelchair/ecv. As a person who has to use an ecv not just at Disneyland but even to go to the store, I see absolutely no reason why you would need more then 2 people per wheelchair/ECV.

    That is how we do it (even though we had a group of 6) and it works just fine, and in fact most times it is just my wife and I who are riding the rides (both of us being in our evc's). My teenagers have asked to go with us so they would not have to wait and I always tell them no because that is not how it is done.

    The most ridiculous thing that I saw in the accessible line was a rather large person who was in the line for Thunder Mountain, and I causally asked him if he knew that he was in the accessible line. His response was "I cant fit through the turnstiles".... Now I am not trying to bad mouth those who are of large size (I myself am overweight), but I could not help but wonder if he could not fit through the turnstiles, how was it safe for him to ride the ride as the bars might have a problem closing down and holding him in......

    My point is, I just see no reason why you would need more than 2 people with you (really you could get along fine with 1) in order to get on a ride. I do not think this is an unreasonable policy.

    The use of ECV's has gotten way out of hand (IMHO) at Disneyland and something will have to be done.........................

  2. #2

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    Re: Follow Up On The Issue Of ECV Abuse At Disneyland Park

    I completely agree with the abuse. However, what happens when a family goes that has someone in a wheelchair.

    For example, I went with my family when I was younger and my younger sister needed a wheelchair due to battling cancer. The limit at the time was 6 people per pass, but we were a family of 7. They had to get a special written pass for al 7 of us. There will be legitimate reasons for needing passes for more than just 2 people.

    Overall, I do agree that they need to crack down. Especially your example for the large individual who couldn't fit through the turnstile.

  3. #3

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    Re: Follow Up On The Issue Of ECV Abuse At Disneyland Park

    when you use a parent trade-off pass, they have a limit of one person to accompany the new rider through the exit and the system works well in terms of passes. therefore, i don't see a problem implementing a system that limits the amount of people who can accompany a person in an ecv; it could easily be done.
    however, i think a problem might come about in terms of how many if, say, a family with two young children, a parent, and a parent in an ecv are in the park. is it really fair to split up the family? i think passes could be distributed at the box offices and cast members could take in to account total party amount, ages, co-parent etc. when distributing passes (of course with set rules by the park)...if that makes sense.

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  4. #4

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    Re: Follow Up On The Issue Of ECV Abuse At Disneyland Park

    I think it's fine to require that people get a special written pass for certain people. It would limit the abuse even though it would create a little extra work by legitimate groups as well.

  5. #5

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    Re: Follow Up On The Issue Of ECV Abuse At Disneyland Park

    I could have sworn that they used to limit the people in a wheelchair/ecv group to 1 or 2. If the group was bigger, the others waited in line, and when they got to the front the person/people in the ecv group rode with them.

    Why not do it that way?

  6. #6

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    Re: Follow Up On The Issue Of ECV Abuse At Disneyland Park

    It is limited to 6 people (including the person who gets the card). When I went with my family, it was 6 people plus a 3 month old baby. They wouldn't let all 7 of us on at one time, so our group had to split up.

    Either they stopped enforcing this rule, or someone was trying to cheat the system.

  7. #7

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    Re: Follow Up On The Issue Of ECV Abuse At Disneyland Park

    So the take away from this thread is that if you want to get a good place in line, rent an ECV?

    If the ECV lines starts to get backed up with everyone renting ECVs to get a better place in line, then maybe Disney might change their policy, or they might just buy more ECVs to rent. It's a gamble.


  8. #8

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    Re: Follow Up On The Issue Of ECV Abuse At Disneyland Park

    Quote Originally Posted by thedude76 View Post
    So the take away from this thread is that if you want to get a good place in line, rent an ECV?
    Have you ever just stopped and watched how slow those ECV lines go? I've got 4 years of data due to the fact that I've got little ones and I've always let the missus go first leaving me to camp out with the baby at the exits waiting for her to get out. It is NOT the free ride that some might think it is.

    That said, if you want to see ECV abuse at it's most blatant go find a seat outside the exit of Space Mountain anytime in the afternoon before the parades (because ECV's do get you some swanky parade viewing). Watch the party of 4-6 with the 16 year old teenage girl (they're usually female for some reason) as they wait and wait for their turn. Right around the 10 minute mark the girl will either get up for a stretch, let someone else use her comfy ECV chair for awhile, walk to the bathroom, or giddy shenannigans will happen and the girl will start chasing her friends around the open back area.

    And to think, if those teens had been screened better then maybe those lines wouldn't be so long.
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  9. #9

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    Re: Follow Up On The Issue Of ECV Abuse At Disneyland Park

    Lots of people have handicaps that can't be accomodated in the regular lines, but don't need to use an ECV or WC.

  10. #10

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    Re: Follow Up On The Issue Of ECV Abuse At Disneyland Park

    I said this in the other thread about ECVs, but I think the best way to stop abuse is going to be to just ensure that all queues are accessible, so that ECVs wait in the regular line. A lot of the time, the "front of line" situations exist because the ECVs simply can't get through the normal queues, there are steps, etc.

    Sending ECVs through the normal queue would end the questions about the group size, too. If it's a special circumstance, like a kid on her Make a Wish trip, they will always get a special front of line pass and they will be able to bring all their companions. If not, sending everyone through the regular queue solves the problem.

  11. #11

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    Re: Follow Up On The Issue Of ECV Abuse At Disneyland Park

    I never understood why they don't just send the rest of the party (except maybe one person to keep company) through the regular line, and have them meet up with the person who has the disability at the loading area. Then no one is waiting any more or less than anyone else.

    Also, why not require a doctor's note? Any disability (obesity, cancer, broken ankle, etc) would be able to easily have this... And for anyone who says they can't be "inconvenienced" with a physician's note - it's no more difficult than planning a trip to Disneyland. If your physician requires you to make an appointment or pay for a note like this, you either were due for an appointment anyway (they legitimately need to assess you), or need to switch physicians.

    I know this has been a controversial topic in the past, but these seem like two very easy and doable solutions with no extra cost to either party. Just my two cents!

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  12. #12

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    Re: Follow Up On The Issue Of ECV Abuse At Disneyland Park

    I will weigh in here as with the other and mention that simply because you cannot see an ailment on a person, does not mean that there is nothing there. And simply by not having your own ecv does not mean you do not have an issue. Mentioning my friend again, she has Fibro which causes constant pain, some days more than others. She works from home so that limits her movement there and plans any trip away from home meticulously. She loves Disneyland, and when she goes, some days she attempts to walk it and some she rents an ecv. To the outside world, she would look like a chubby gal riding an ecv with little showing wrong. You cannot see her fibro or the asthma and allergies that usually require her to take breathing treatments while in the park as well.

    Having said that, I would have no trouble with a limiting the number of people with the person. With both GAC and anyone in a Wheelchair or ECV, I thought the limit was 6 including the person, but I have seen large groups go through that were well over 9.
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    Re: Follow Up On The Issue Of ECV Abuse At Disneyland Park

    Quote Originally Posted by KellyMcG86 View Post

    Also, why not require a doctor's note? Any disability (obesity, cancer, broken ankle, etc) would be able to easily have this... And for anyone who says they can't be "inconvenienced" with a physician's note - it's no more difficult than planning a trip to Disneyland. If your physician requires you to make an appointment or pay for a note like this, you either were due for an appointment anyway (they legitimately need to assess you), or need to switch physicians.
    Because requiring proof of a disability violates the ADA laws.

  14. #14

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    Re: Follow Up On The Issue Of ECV Abuse At Disneyland Park

    Disney could easily stop this problem is they simply stated that in order to protect the people in the parks from hurting themselves, that they will no longer allow anyone that is using a EVC to ride the more extreme rides.

    It has always baffled me that on nearly every ride except the very slow ones, there is a sign stating that only people in good health that are not suffering from head, neck, back injuries, high blood pressure, pregnancy, heart issues... and the list goes on.... Yet I see people that are on those EVCs scooting up to get on the ride and the cast members dutifully helping them on the ride.

    While I can understand someone that simply has a broken ankle needing a scooter and otherwise being in good health, the vast majority of people I see on those scooters don't have their legs in a cast.

    I would guess that if they simply said sorry, your aren't healthy enough to walk but don't have a broken legs, well then you aren't healthy enough to ride the ride and we aren't going to let you do something that might injury yourself..... The number of people using scooters would drop like a rock.

    ---------- Post added 10-24-2012 at 06:18 AM ----------

    That would be a good start... they should also lower the speed of the ECVs so they move slower and run over people that are walking less frequently.

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    Re: Follow Up On The Issue Of ECV Abuse At Disneyland Park

    Quote Originally Posted by dougeebear View Post
    Because requiring proof of a disability violates the ADA laws.
    I wasn't aware. Thank you for letting me know. I guess that one is out of the running for options, then!

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