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  1. #46

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    Re: Tom Staggs Says -- "It Can't Just Be About Nostalgia"

    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorQ9 View Post
    I wholeheartedly agree. Meet & Greets or Playgrounds do not count as true attractions in my book...
    Well when said meet and greet attracts a line longer than some rides, your book is outdated.

  2. #47

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    Re: Tom Staggs Says -- "It Can't Just Be About Nostalgia"

    Quote Originally Posted by MrLiver View Post
    You may not agree with it personally, but that doesn't mean it didn't make good sense. There are many times when the lines for the meet n greets exceed 30 to 40 minutes in length, and times that you basically have to beg people to ride Snow White and Pinocchio.

    It isn't about nostalgia and it's not about changing things for the sake of change. It is trying to make people (the most amount of people) happy.
    I'd agree with you if the park was filled to the brim and there was no room anywhere to fit a meet and greet. The only problem is, they could have fit the Princess meet and greet somewhere else and kept the ride. Meet and greets don't need to take up much room.

  3. #48

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    Re: Tom Staggs Says -- "It Can't Just Be About Nostalgia"

    Quote Originally Posted by DARTH MAUL View Post
    Well when said meet and greet attracts a line longer than some rides, your book is outdated.
    A ride can work through people much faster then a meet and greet. People go through meet and greets at about 1 person/group a minute. I'm sure every ride thats ever existed can work through people faster than that.

  4. #49

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    Re: Tom Staggs Says -- "It Can't Just Be About Nostalgia"

    Quote Originally Posted by Timicus View Post
    Did either of you bother to read the article? Tom Stagg never said either thing you both attributed to him. Tom Stagg was quoted once the entire article which consisted of:



    Both of the lines, incorrectly credited to Stagg (not by the article), are the view of the author of the article, Stephanie Rosenbloom. They are her thoughts about Disney and in fact the entire bit was:



    She wasn't quoting Stagg, she was expressing her view. If there is the need to rage against someone, Rosenbloom used the words "Purists grumble" as a shot at a certain Disney fandom. There is enough vitriol between the various viewpoints without anyone having to, either through laziness or agenda, spread inaccuracies to these discussions.

    If anyone wants to read it, here is the link to the article: http://travel.nytimes.com/2012/12/23...anted=all&_r=0

    Thx for pointing this out!
    ~Jay

    "Ahh-chooo!" ~ Walt Disney
    "Bless you." ~ My Grandfather
    (Disneyland, circa 1957)


  5. #50

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    Re: Tom Staggs Says -- "It Can't Just Be About Nostalgia"

    Quote Originally Posted by ssaamm View Post
    A ride can work through people much faster then a meet and greet. People go through meet and greets at about 1 person/group a minute. I'm sure every ride thats ever existed can work through people faster than that.
    While I don't neccessarily agree with ripping out the SW ride in the way that they did it, I do need to say your point above is one reason WHYSW was taken out. SW will mull thru the crowds faster, ok... so now what? Where do those crowds go? Right back into the walkways. A M&G line is a fantastic way to soak up guests.

    This idea about not having M&G b/c they don't move crowds thru to the next experience fast enough is just plain short-sighted. I hope you see that M&G's do play an important part. The bennifit is quite great to other guests.
    ~Jay

    "Ahh-chooo!" ~ Walt Disney
    "Bless you." ~ My Grandfather
    (Disneyland, circa 1957)


  6. #51

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    Re: Tom Staggs Says -- "It Can't Just Be About Nostalgia"

    Quote Originally Posted by Timicus View Post
    Did either of you bother to read the article? Tom Stagg never said either thing you both attributed to him.
    Do you really need to ask us if we "bothered" to read the article that was never linked to, in that tone?

    Quote Originally Posted by Timicus View Post
    She wasn't quoting Stagg, she was expressing her view. If there is the need to rage against someone, Rosenbloom used the words "Purists grumble" as a shot at a certain Disney fandom. There is enough vitriol between the various viewpoints without anyone having to, either through laziness or agenda, spread inaccuracies to these discussions.
    Your choice of words are uncalled for, Timicus. You are out of line for calling I, Mr Wiggins or any other member on this board "lazy". You can disagree with opinions, but you should not call anyone names as it is a personal attack. And what you might call "agenda", is an unkind way of saying "opinion" that everyone has a right to have on this board.

    I simply misread the excerpt thinking it was a inteview of Stagg's and this was the excerpt of what he said. Not what the writer said. I have poor eye sight and didn't see the quotes just around that one line. I wasn't even attacking stagg's directly. I just disagreed with the comment. I don't care who said it, I would still disagree with it.

    I have given credit to Stephanie Rosenbloom for saying such a thing.

  7. #52

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    Re: Tom Staggs Says -- "It Can't Just Be About Nostalgia"

    Quote Originally Posted by JMazz View Post
    While I don't neccessarily agree with ripping out the SW ride in the way that they did it, I do need to say your point above is one reason WHYSW was taken out. SW will mull thru the crowds faster, ok... so now what? Where do those crowds go? Right back into the walkways. A M&G line is a fantastic way to soak up guests.

    This idea about not having M&G b/c they don't move crowds thru to the next experience fast enough is just plain short-sighted. I hope you see that M&G's do play an important part. The bennifit is quite great to other guests.
    You've missed my point. A meet and greet could have been put almost anywhere in the park. Both the ride and meet and greet could easily fit in the park. Theres no real reason for getting rid of the ride other than cost cutting. Having both a meet and greet and ride would increase capacity much more then having just one of them

  8. #53

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    Re: Tom Staggs Says -- "It Can't Just Be About Nostalgia"

    Quote Originally Posted by orbitalpunk View Post
    Do you really need to ask us if we "bothered" to read the article that was never linked to, in that tone?
    Tone? I think it is legitimate if you question the use of the word "bothered" but I contend the question was appropriate. It took me all of five seconds to type in "New York Times New Fantasyland" in the google search line and found the link before I commented in this thread.


    Quote Originally Posted by orbitalpunk View Post
    Your choice of words are uncalled for, Timicus. You are out of line for calling I, Mr Wiggins or any other member on this board "lazy". You can disagree with opinions, but you should not call anyone names as it is a personal attack. And what you might call "agenda", is an unkind way of saying "opinion" that everyone has a right to have on this board.
    Are you addressing me as a moderator or a user? I didn't call anyone a name. Describing someone's inaction as "laziness" is not the same as calling someone a name. I didn't decide to post what I did because I wanted to attack another poster. I read the first post and found the article that was excerpted. I discovered that people were commenting out of ignorance (not used as a descriptor). Opinion without regard for fact is lazy. A word used in one context does not mean it applies to any context the reader decides.

    Why suggest that I am against others having an opinion because I use the word agenda? Are we, as users, supposed to read each thread/post as if it existed independently and not take the sum of someone's thoughts, posted over time? Some agendas I agree with, some I don't. A reader inferring is not the same as the author implying.

    Quote Originally Posted by orbitalpunk View Post
    I simply misread the excerpt thinking it was a inteview of Stagg's and this was the excerpt of what he said. Not what the writer said. I have poor eye sight and didn't see the quotes just around that one line. I wasn't even attacking stagg's directly. I just disagreed with the comment. I don't care who said it, I would still disagree with it.

    I have given credit to Stephanie Rosenbloom for saying such a thing.
    Than why not just respond with those two paragraphs and not include the previous two? I am, I believe legitimately, confused on whether this is an official moderator response or another user's opinion of my post.
    Feel free to add me as a friend on Facebook (Just mention MiceChat)

    "The thing that makes us different is our way of thinking, our judgement and experience acquired over the years. Giving it 'heart.' Others haven't understood the public. We developed a psychological approach to everything we do here. We seem to know when to 'tap the heart.' Others have hit the intellect. We can hit them in an emotional way. Those that appeal to the intellect only appeal to a very limited group. Let's not let the mechanics get in here and foul the whole thing." -Walt Disney

  9. #54

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    Re: Tom Staggs Says -- "It Can't Just Be About Nostalgia"

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Weaver View Post
    We’re nostalgic for imagination.
    We’re nostalgic for originality.
    We’re nostalgic for creativity.
    We’re nostalgic for interactivity.
    We’re nostalgic for storyline.
    We’re nostalgic for atmosphere.
    We’re nostalgic for characters.
    We’re nostalgic for humor.
    We’re nostalgic for drama.
    We’re nostalgic for surprise.
    We’re nostalgic for design.
    We’re nostalgic for details.
    We’re nostalgic for verisimilitude.
    We’re nostalgic for the suspension of disbelief.
    We’re nostalgic for theme as a unifying concept.
    We’re nostalgic for experiences that can be found at no other park.
    We’re nostalgic for merchandise unique to a land, or even attraction-specific, that can be bought nowhere else.
    We’re nostalgic for “the magic” which is still being sold by the park’s advertising while getting harder and harder to find in the park itself.
    We’re nostalgic for “the happiest place on Earth.”
    It’s not specific bygone attractions we’re nostalgic for, it’s the intangible qualities that they had. Intangibles that can’t be bought, only created by the minds of the Imagineers.
    we need to print this onto a tshirt. Bravo Mr. Weaver!!

  10. #55

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    Re: Tom Staggs Says -- "It Can't Just Be About Nostalgia"

    If a attraction is considered good and gets the people like Pirates, ToT, Indy and Splash there is never a reason to close it....but when a ride like Pooh, Monsters and Goofy Sky school are around that are consider nothing special and get low lines then why keep them?

    But I see no reason to not keep classic's that people enjoy

    As for the snow white ride.....while it sucks it's getting replaced with a meet and greet....in my opinion the new coaster looks VERY cool and really the only other thing they could have down with the snow white ride is replace it with a new dark ride but considering how much they spent on the new fantasyland it seems they were at there limit...maybe one day the meet and greet will become a dark ride again

  11. #56

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    Re: Tom Staggs Says -- "It Can't Just Be About Nostalgia"

    Quote Originally Posted by JerrodDRagon View Post
    As for the snow white ride.....while it sucks it's getting replaced with a meet and greet....in my opinion the new coaster looks VERY cool and really the only other thing they could have down with the snow white ride is replace it with a new dark ride but considering how much they spent on the new fantasyland it seems they were at there limit...maybe one day the meet and greet will become a dark ride again
    Well said.
    My top favorite Disneyland attractions:

    1. Big Thunder Mountain Railroad
    2. Pirates of the Caribbean
    3. Splash Mountain
    4. Mad Tea Party
    5. Peter Pan's Flight
    6. Roger Rabbit's Car Toon Spin

  12. #57

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    Re: Tom Staggs Says -- "It Can't Just Be About Nostalgia"

    The issue I always have isn't so much the shuttering of an old favorite, but the quality of what replaces it. CBJ, great example. Sure it was a fun show, but it cost a fortune to run and hardly ever had a line. So they replace it with Pooh... which cost a lot more, looks cheap, and still hardly has a line (unless the park is so crowded there is literally nothing else to do).

    In that respect all they did was sacrifice an old favorite for the sake of something new. There wasn't an upgrade in experience or quality. Someone else pointed out TL 98... the "let's spraypaint everything gold" edition... We "lost" People Mover which hardly had a line. We "gained" Rocket Rods which was plagued with so many problems it only lasted 2 years.
    "Happiness is a Low Water Level"


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  13. #58

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    Re: Tom Staggs Says -- "It Can't Just Be About Nostalgia"

    Quote Originally Posted by ssaamm View Post
    You've missed my point. A meet and greet could have been put almost anywhere in the park. Both the ride and meet and greet could easily fit in the park. Theres no real reason for getting rid of the ride other than cost cutting. Having both a meet and greet and ride would increase capacity much more then having just one of them
    Oy.
    I haven't missed a thing. SW goes from a small and cut-out A-ticket to a full-on E-ticket. The footprint of said A-ticket is a great place for the M&G based on foot traffic. Now all the kids can have facetime w/ characters and everyone gets a great new E-ticket.
    M&G plus SW new ride = 2 attractions
    Did you want Old SW and New SW plus a M&G?
    ~Jay

    "Ahh-chooo!" ~ Walt Disney
    "Bless you." ~ My Grandfather
    (Disneyland, circa 1957)


  14. #59

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    Re: Tom Staggs Says -- "It Can't Just Be About Nostalgia"

    Timicus,
    If you hadn't pointed that out, I would have skip right on thru.
    I feel you did a service to the forum by showing us what we missed and yes, it was lazy of me to not have checked.
    ~Jay

    "Ahh-chooo!" ~ Walt Disney
    "Bless you." ~ My Grandfather
    (Disneyland, circa 1957)


  15. #60

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    Re: Tom Staggs Says -- "It Can't Just Be About Nostalgia"

    Quote Originally Posted by CAspace View Post
    we need to print this onto a tshirt. Bravo Mr. Weaver!!
    Is it strange that I started to read it in verse by the third line and was in full singing mode to the tune of "it's a small world" by the fifth line!?!?
    ~Jay

    "Ahh-chooo!" ~ Walt Disney
    "Bless you." ~ My Grandfather
    (Disneyland, circa 1957)


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