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  1. #1

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    Another Set of APs Not Renewing

    My fiancee and I have been deluxe passholders since last April. In fact, we got them only a couple of weeks before the price raise from 500 to 650. So, it's been a pretty good deal in that regard. We've been to the parks between 15-20 timess this year. We've gotten some good mileage out of it. We don't regret buying them but it's become painfully obvious that the current state of the park has left it far less enjoyable than we thought. Funny enough, the problem really isn't the price point.

    It has really all come down to CarsLand being the culprit. For years, it's been known Disney has been hugely troubled by the lack of interest in California Adventure. Clearly, the fortune has changed with the opening of CarsLand. I will admit that it was an amazing gamble that has paid off handsomely for all involved. The major side effect of all of this is the crowding. Disney wants full parks and that's entirely understandable from a business standpoint. I would want the same thing. They've singled out the annual passholders and they want to force them out sideways since the general viewpoint is they don't spend as much money as the average vacationer. Once again understandable. Maybe it'll start to die down in another year or so but with CarsLand still attracting so many visitors in what used to be known as the offseason, it's become pretty unbearable to try to enjoy the parks. To be completely honest, we've been averaging maybe 1 ride a visit since CarLand opened.

    After taking a stroll through both parks yesterday (both being really crowded again) we've come to the decision that the pass isn't worth it at this time. It's not an alarming revelation, sure. We definitely have a dislike for crowds which doesn't help the situation. But until Disney puts som effort into revitalizing it's namesake park, we won't give Disney our business.

    Tomorrowland needs a lot of help. Frontierland is so underwhelming, why is it even a land? For the most part it's a themed walkway between New Orleans Square and Fantasyland. IMO, Adventureland needs better traffic flow/widening. Toon Town could be leveled or at least cut in half and added to expansion land. That's probably blaspheme to many of the traditionalists but IMO Disneyland is reaching a point where the overcrowding is taking a lot away from the magic of the place. It's losing the personal touches and with the plans to roll out even more effiency in getting people through the gates, it sounds like it will only get worse.

    So I'll step off my soapbox and maybe I'm way offbase with many of my assumptions but it's how I feel about the Parks right now. California Adventure has rebounded nicely. I don't have too many complaints as it's still a growing park and it's getting the attention a theme park should be getting. I just feel Disneyland has been neglected for far too long. Until they start pushing Tomorrowland or the long and oft rumored Frontierland expansion rumors, I can't justify spending 1400 dollars for a park and a half of overcrowding mess.

  2. #2

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    Re: Another Set of APs Not Renewing

    ORDDU: It's interesting that you should be talking about over-crowding at the Disney theme parks, Grimmetal, duckling. Just yesterday 1/20/13 my sisters and I were at the Magic Kingdom in Florida and noticed the same thing--overcrowded conditions that made the entire day a lot less magical. Of course it WAS the Martin Luther King Holiday Weekend. Still, it's true that all those teaming crowds make it difficult for guests to enjoy themselves.

    ORGOCH: Got birth control pills?

  3. #3

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    Re: Another Set of APs Not Renewing

    it'a a holiday weekend. there is gonna be crowds like the witches said.. they are letting tomorrowland lack cause they are gonna be doing a giant overhaul. carsland is just popular! who knew it was gonna still be drawing people! it's a fun little land!

    and this part
    They've singled out the annual passholders and they want to force them out sideways since the general viewpoint is they don't spend as much money as the average vacationer. Once again understandable
    oh this has been talked about before..to me that statement is not true in my own opinion. they may not spend it on hats and tshirts and pins, but we sure as heck do spend it on food, and collectible items, maybe framed peices of art, special edition items...

  4. #4

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    Re: Another Set of APs Not Renewing

    ORDDU: I agree with you, poisoneapples, duckling--about the misconception that annual passholders don't spend as much money at the parks as day guests do. If anything, I believe they spend more! I believe they spend more on the collectible items that most day guests can't afford as easily, since day guests spend most of their money on park admission, food, transportation, etc., etc. After all that, day guests don't often seem to have as much money left over to buy the collectible items that annual passholders do.

  5. #5

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    Re: Another Set of APs Not Renewing

    Just wanted to echo the sentiments above. I was at the DLR on Saturday, and it was really crowded. But, once we realized we had made the mistake of going on a holiday weekend, we made the best of it, and tried to tackle all of the E-tickets in only a few hours. I respect your decision, but think that a holiday weekend may not be the best tipping point.

  6. #6

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    Re: Another Set of APs Not Renewing

    The OP isn't talking about just this weekend, they are talking about overcrowding in general. Sure this weekend had escalated crowds due to the Tinkerbell Half Marathon, as well as the holiday, but that isn't why they are complaining.

    I get where you are coming from, and I understand why you wouldn't want to renew. Most people I know aren't simply because the price hike is getting silly. Overcrowding is a problem as well, but you just have to learn ways to outsmart it. As far as underwhelming lands go, all signs point to Disneyland getting some attention to it's struggling areas soon. With the DCA revamp now done, it's only a matter of time before Disneyland gets some love.

    If I were you, I would not renew and take a break from the parks for a bit. Maybe in a few years the parks will lure you in again and you can experience it like you used to. Sometimes you just need a break.

  7. #7

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    Re: Another Set of APs Not Renewing

    How in the world are you averaging 1 ride per visit? We went to CA yesterday and finished most of the park by 1pm. Then came back at 6pm to ride everything again. Today we went to Disneyland and finished the whole park by 11am. Went back after lunch and rode Space Mountain, Splash Mountain and Indiana again. Left the park at 3pm.
    ​Mama to four beautiful girls!

  8. #8

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    Re: Another Set of APs Not Renewing

    Over time my girlfriend and I have learned to enjoy the little things like viewing and feeding the ducks, I also have used my pass to just go and relax by spending time in areas where people usually bypass or ignore like the animation building or Disneyana. I remember back when I would go to the resort and be focused on the rides. Now its for relaxation and like this last Saturday I just focused on photography.

  9. #9

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    Re: Another Set of APs Not Renewing

    Hi, I went to the park, alone, for the first time in my life. Last Saturday. It was nice. I was in and out of both parks, in 6 hours. I got there at 1pm left at 7pm. I enjoyed every ride I wished to ride, ate a terrific breadbowl of corn chowder, watched street events throughout the day, ate a DELICIOUS cookie and ... Will be back more often. Now, so far as the crowd? I felt it was much lighter than the lightest summer day. Ride waits never were more than 40 minutes for the usual suspects.
    Going in alone also allowed me time to absorb the attractions we usually pass over. And I've fallen in love with the parks even more because of it!

  10. #10

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    Re: Another Set of APs Not Renewing

    One thing that helps me out being a AP is if it;s too busy I just come back on a less crowded day. That's why I have a AP so I can choose when to go. it's not over crowded every day of the week. This past weekend was a holiday as well which brings crowds anywhere.

    As far as the statement about APs spending less I always laugh at this one no one knows these facts at all only insiders at the corporate office have these numbers. Me being a AP I spend a lot on food and merchandise in the parks and I always have. I know for a fact I'm not the only one. The price hikes for APs are a result of price and demand. They will go up as long as people pay the price. Once people stop paying the price and the AP numbers go down they will stabilize.

  11. #11

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    Re: Another Set of APs Not Renewing

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimmetal View Post
    My fiancee and I have been deluxe passholders since last April. In fact, we got them only a couple of weeks before the price raise from 500 to 650. So, it's been a pretty good deal in that regard. We've been to the parks between 15-20 timess this year. We've gotten some good mileage out of it. We don't regret buying them but it's become painfully obvious that the current state of the park has left it far less enjoyable than we thought. Funny enough, the problem really isn't the price point.

    It has really all come down to CarsLand being the culprit. For years, it's been known Disney has been hugely troubled by the lack of interest in California Adventure. Clearly, the fortune has changed with the opening of CarsLand. I will admit that it was an amazing gamble that has paid off handsomely for all involved. The major side effect of all of this is the crowding. Disney wants full parks and that's entirely understandable from a business standpoint. I would want the same thing. They've singled out the annual passholders and they want to force them out sideways since the general viewpoint is they don't spend as much money as the average vacationer. Once again understandable. Maybe it'll start to die down in another year or so but with CarsLand still attracting so many visitors in what used to be known as the offseason, it's become pretty unbearable to try to enjoy the parks. To be completely honest, we've been averaging maybe 1 ride a visit since CarLand opened.

    After taking a stroll through both parks yesterday (both being really crowded again) we've come to the decision that the pass isn't worth it at this time. It's not an alarming revelation, sure. We definitely have a dislike for crowds which doesn't help the situation. But until Disney puts som effort into revitalizing it's namesake park, we won't give Disney our business.

    Tomorrowland needs a lot of help. Frontierland is so underwhelming, why is it even a land? For the most part it's a themed walkway between New Orleans Square and Fantasyland. IMO, Adventureland needs better traffic flow/widening. Toon Town could be leveled or at least cut in half and added to expansion land. That's probably blaspheme to many of the traditionalists but IMO Disneyland is reaching a point where the overcrowding is taking a lot away from the magic of the place. It's losing the personal touches and with the plans to roll out even more effiency in getting people through the gates, it sounds like it will only get worse.

    So I'll step off my soapbox and maybe I'm way offbase with many of my assumptions but it's how I feel about the Parks right now. California Adventure has rebounded nicely. I don't have too many complaints as it's still a growing park and it's getting the attention a theme park should be getting. I just feel Disneyland has been neglected for far too long. Until they start pushing Tomorrowland or the long and oft rumored Frontierland expansion rumors, I can't justify spending 1400 dollars for a park and a half of overcrowding mess.
    I understand your complaints and most are valid, but do understand that yesterday the parks were PACKED. iI was due to the Tinker Bell Run, allot of the runners are AP holders and yesterday was a beautiful day, so they all went to the park. Disney even adjusted the hours to stay open an hour later because of how busy it was. It not like this always, I was just there this past Wednesday night (4pm to 8pm) and every ride had a 20 min wait or under in both parks, except RSR whcich only had a 40min stand by time, which is amazing.

    Yesterday was just a mess at DCA, and had a lack of staffing, only four open turnstiles and each turnstile line had about 200 people in it. This is because Disney is insisting on scanning all normal tickets with iphones now, forcing two employees to run one turnstile, extremely disappointing, they obviously did not schedule enough people.

    Additionally, my experience as an AP holder, You will notice EVERYTHING more than the average guest, things not working, things not running properly, etc.. the average guests will not see this stuff. Believe me, I used to LOVE Disneyland and going there once a year, but ive been about 35 times now since Ive gotten an AP and all these small things drive me nuts now that its lost its magic for me.

    Now I just go to get away form my house now, and only for an hour or two.

  12. #12

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    Re: Another Set of APs Not Renewing

    Personally, I have found that cars land has greatly improved crowding by evenly distributing people between the 2 parks.
    In the quest for quality, I have no problem with the characters footing the bill.

  13. #13

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    Re: Another Set of APs Not Renewing

    Quote Originally Posted by biggsworth View Post
    The price hikes for APs are a result of price and demand. They will go up as long as people pay the price. Once people stop paying the price and the AP numbers go down they will stabilize.
    I don't think that Disney hates APers, and are trying to get ride of them as they represent a steady stream of revenue, and the more they can charge, the more they will charge.

    HOWEVER, I think that the real $$ is made from the hotels, and to a lesser extent, the restaurants. While a certain cut of the price of admission goes to upkeep, the money from hotel rooms I would guess has a higher percentage of pure profit. To get the folks who would book a room at the Grand Californian every 2-3 years, I would guess that they'd want to keep the park crowd levels manageable. Somewhere between 10 cents for an Annual Pass, and $10,000 per year is the sweet spot where they can optimize their profits. Most likely the price of the AP is based on a computer model that predicts park attendance, hotel occupancy, guest satisfaction, etc. . . .

    If the parks are really super crowded (I admit that Carsland is crowded, and forget about it during the holidays), then this would only provide impetus for an expansion at Disneyland, (Main Street, Frontierland expansion), just to be able to soak up the crowds a bit more.

  14. #14

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    Re: Another Set of APs Not Renewing

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimmetal View Post
    My fiancee and I have been deluxe passholders since last April. In fact, we got them only a couple of weeks before the price raise from 500 to 650. So, it's been a pretty good deal in that regard. We've been to the parks between 15-20 timess this year. We've gotten some good mileage out of it. We don't regret buying them but it's become painfully obvious that the current state of the park has left it far less enjoyable than we thought. Funny enough, the problem really isn't the price point.

    It has really all come down to CarsLand being the culprit. For years, it's been known Disney has been hugely troubled by the lack of interest in California Adventure. Clearly, the fortune has changed with the opening of CarsLand. I will admit that it was an amazing gamble that has paid off handsomely for all involved. The major side effect of all of this is the crowding. Disney wants full parks and that's entirely understandable from a business standpoint. I would want the same thing. They've singled out the annual passholders and they want to force them out sideways since the general viewpoint is they don't spend as much money as the average vacationer. Once again understandable. Maybe it'll start to die down in another year or so but with CarsLand still attracting so many visitors in what used to be known as the offseason, it's become pretty unbearable to try to enjoy the parks. To be completely honest, we've been averaging maybe 1 ride a visit since CarLand opened.

    After taking a stroll through both parks yesterday (both being really crowded again) we've come to the decision that the pass isn't worth it at this time. It's not an alarming revelation, sure. We definitely have a dislike for crowds which doesn't help the situation. But until Disney puts som effort into revitalizing it's namesake park, we won't give Disney our business.

    Tomorrowland needs a lot of help. Frontierland is so underwhelming, why is it even a land? For the most part it's a themed walkway between New Orleans Square and Fantasyland. IMO, Adventureland needs better traffic flow/widening. Toon Town could be leveled or at least cut in half and added to expansion land. That's probably blaspheme to many of the traditionalists but IMO Disneyland is reaching a point where the overcrowding is taking a lot away from the magic of the place. It's losing the personal touches and with the plans to roll out even more effiency in getting people through the gates, it sounds like it will only get worse.

    So I'll step off my soapbox and maybe I'm way offbase with many of my assumptions but it's how I feel about the Parks right now. California Adventure has rebounded nicely. I don't have too many complaints as it's still a growing park and it's getting the attention a theme park should be getting. I just feel Disneyland has been neglected for far too long. Until they start pushing Tomorrowland or the long and oft rumored Frontierland expansion rumors, I can't justify spending 1400 dollars for a park and a half of overcrowding mess.
    nice words my ap expires at end of march. iwill be done with disneyland parks for now athe end of march for financial reasons. carsland is meh to me i enjoy buena vista alot more than carsland.

  15. #15

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    Re: Another Set of APs Not Renewing

    Quote Originally Posted by BradleyC View Post
    Additionally, my experience as an AP holder, You will notice EVERYTHING more than the average guest, things not working, things not running properly, etc.. the average guests will not see this stuff. Believe me, I used to LOVE Disneyland and going there once a year, but ive been about 35 times now since Ive gotten an AP and all these small things drive me nuts now that its lost its magic for me.
    .
    I'd just like to add to this, that I think if you space out your visits more often, the thrill of being in Disneyland will make crowds more tolerable. Just this past New Years I went to the park, and while it was packed to the brim, I still enjoyed every minute of it, because I was at a place I love, that I haven't had been to for a while.
    Fear of the unknown.

    They are afraid of new ideas.

    They are loaded with prejudices, not based upon any reality, but based onÖ if something is new, I reject it immediately because itís frightening to me. What they do instead is just stay with the familiar.
    You know, to me, the most beautiful things in all the universe, are the most mysterious.











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