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Thread: The State of DL

  1. #166

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    Re: The State of DL

    Quote Originally Posted by calsig31 View Post
    While Disney should pay more for the demands that it is claimed are put on their workers, that is no excuse for poor performance. The workers agreed on a rate of pay when they signed up, they need to live up to their end of the agreement and perform their duties. If the rate of pay wasn’t enough, they should not have excepted the position.
    It's not an excuse, but it's a reason. That along with the low pay and morale and training that went from world class to nonexistent. They can still pull it off if management is all over it, but I'm guessing the lower level managers are just as affected by the same things.

    (In other news I came home today to find my central AC had died at some point. And I live in the valley. Thank goodness the cat was still alive otherwise my ex would make sure I wasn't)

  2. #167

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    Re: The State of DL

    Quote Originally Posted by calsig31 View Post
    While Disney should pay more for the demands that it is claimed are put on their workers, that is no excuse for poor performance. The workers agreed on a rate of pay when they signed up, they need to live up to their end of the agreement and perform their duties. If the rate of pay wasn’t enough, they should not have excepted the position.
    In a perfect world maybe, but sometimes we need a job, and have to take jobs not suited to us. I hate customer service, customers annoy me, but I need a job, and have to take a customer service job to pay the bills, I can fake it only so much, but I suck at customer service but a job is a job.

  3. #168

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    Re: The State of DL

    Quote Originally Posted by TylerDurden View Post

    The example about one CM doing two or three CMs jobs and not being able to provide ample service--that's a terrible example. At CVS, sure I'd buy that, but at Disneyland, if you have to do more work than you should, your focus should still be on the guests, not on getting as much work done as possible. It used to be that, while getting the job done was obviously important, catering to the guests and keeping them happy was of the utmost importance. Say a cart stocker has to drop off ice cream to the nearest cart because they're completely out--you're arguing that it's ok for them to blow everyone off because they have a job to do. However, in a proper service environment, the CM would first take care of the guests should they need anything and be polite.
    Nobody's saying anything about slacking off.

    People are people - and just like the CVS employees, the CMs are only human. They're not robots. When they're short staffed the service will suffer in some way, not because they are slacking, but because they can't physically or logistically juggle so much. And any way they go, they're going to anger guests.

    Some examples:

    Your cashier at the Village Haus. There's one cashier for, say, 25 separate parties. Assuming each transaction takes 2 minutes, one cashier will take almost an hour to complete that line. Two cashiers will take half that time.

    If you're on that line and that one cashier is going as fast as he can, you're still going to wait longer and you are still going to be annoyed. Is that the CM's fault, or the management's fault for not properly staffing the line?

    The cashier chose to ring up a family with separate payment methods. That made you upset. If he'd rung up one person and then gone over to you, that family would have been upset.

    Let's take your cart stocker. Let's say that she is stopped by three different guests as she's going to the cart, and she has to stop and give them directions. It's going to hold her up. If you're waiting at that cart, you're going to be angry because there isn't any ice cream and you might complain that the CM was talking to someone instead of stocking the cart.

    If that CM chooses to tell the guests asking for directions "I'm sorry, but I have to hurry somewhere else," they're going to be in a snit because OMG, that cast member couldn't even stop for two seconds. Then the ice cream guests are happy; the lost ones aren't. And maybe if Disney had more roaming CMs, they wouldn't have needed to stop her and their needs would have been met without interfering with the stocker's work. Who is to blame there: the CM who is doing the best she can, or the management?

    Point being, there's a big picture. Are there some CMs who have the IQs of snails? Sure. Are there some who are doing the best they can with little training, low pay and too much to multi-task with? Yes. And in the latter case, the blame falls on management for not supporting and training their workforce and not properly staffing their parks.

    And one more thing: if common courtesy is not common anymore, where will the CMs learn it from?
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  4. #169

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    Re: The State of DL

    Quote Originally Posted by jsmith11618 View Post
    In a perfect world maybe, but sometimes we need a job, and have to take jobs not suited to us. I hate customer service, customers annoy me, but I need a job, and have to take a customer service job to pay the bills, I can fake it only so much, but I suck at customer service but a job is a job.
    Yep. Let's not forget that in this economy it can be very difficult to find new jobs, and a lot of people end up getting stuck in something they hate, simply because they are desperate for a paycheck.

    Quote Originally Posted by The International View Post
    On the other hand in the real world if you want people to behave a certain way at work you need to pay them accordingly. A bunch of teenagers getting minimum wage are not going to be as well-behaved (for lack of a better word) as waiters at high-end restaurants, regardless of how much you require it.
    This. You get what you pay for, and that goes for employees, too.
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  5. #170

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    Re: The State of DL

    Quote Originally Posted by Malina View Post
    Yep. Let's not forget that in this economy it can be very difficult to find new jobs, and a lot of people end up getting stuck in something they hate, simply because they are desperate for a paycheck.
    This is true, but I feel that so many are taking on the attitude of "getting stuck with a job I hate" rather than "I'm grateful to have a job". We all have bad days, and may hate our job, but for the most part I'd expect that we're better off having the job we hate than no job at all.

    I think everyone has made great points - low pay is not a morale booster, but these people agreed to do a job for that pay. Being understaffed creates a bad situation for a CM, but it's not an excuse to be rude to the guests.

    It all comes down to attitude and professionalism. These are traits that should be displayed no matter what your pay grade. If a lack of these is displayed, discipline should follow. Unfortunately, there's a great imbalance and lack of training, and it's difficult to place blame on any one person. There will always be unhappy people, on both sides of the situation (employee and customer), and there will always be room for improvement.

    It all comes down to choosing to be upset, or choosing to make the best of the situation.

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  6. #171

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    Re: The State of DL

    Quote Originally Posted by Malina View Post
    Nobody's saying anything about slacking off.

    People are people - and just like the CVS employees, the CMs are only human. They're not robots. When they're short staffed the service will suffer in some way, not because they are slacking, but because they can't physically or logistically juggle so much. And any way they go, they're going to anger guests.

    Some examples:

    Your cashier at the Village Haus. There's one cashier for, say, 25 separate parties. Assuming each transaction takes 2 minutes, one cashier will take almost an hour to complete that line. Two cashiers will take half that time.

    If you're on that line and that one cashier is going as fast as he can, you're still going to wait longer and you are still going to be annoyed. Is that the CM's fault, or the management's fault for not properly staffing the line?

    The cashier chose to ring up a family with separate payment methods. That made you upset. If he'd rung up one person and then gone over to you, that family would have been upset.

    Let's take your cart stocker. Let's say that she is stopped by three different guests as she's going to the cart, and she has to stop and give them directions. It's going to hold her up. If you're waiting at that cart, you're going to be angry because there isn't any ice cream and you might complain that the CM was talking to someone instead of stocking the cart.

    If that CM chooses to tell the guests asking for directions "I'm sorry, but I have to hurry somewhere else," they're going to be in a snit because OMG, that cast member couldn't even stop for two seconds. Then the ice cream guests are happy; the lost ones aren't. And maybe if Disney had more roaming CMs, they wouldn't have needed to stop her and their needs would have been met without interfering with the stocker's work. Who is to blame there: the CM who is doing the best she can, or the management?

    Point being, there's a big picture. Are there some CMs who have the IQs of snails? Sure. Are there some who are doing the best they can with little training, low pay and too much to multi-task with? Yes. And in the latter case, the blame falls on management for not supporting and training their workforce and not properly staffing their parks.

    And one more thing: if common courtesy is not common anymore, where will the CMs learn it from?
    I agree there are reasons for the situation as it is. But all of this sounds more like a defense of it. Customers being in a "snit" and overworked CM's doing their absolute best in a no win situation. I don't see that's always the case. For example, what I've often experienced is my party walking up for our turn in line, smiling and polite, and getting a dirty look, or a sigh and rolling eyes, or someone unable to tear himself away from a conversation with another CM to even look at us, or being barked at, etc. Not the end of the world and it's something I've come to expect, but it sounds like it was a surprise to the OP.

    Back in college I had one job where I HATED my boss, felt he was unfair and treated me poorly, and was actively searching for a different job. But when a customer came up to me and asked for help on something, I knew it wasn't THEIR fault and I did my best to help them as nicely as I could. Many of us have posted what we see as the reasons for the way things are, but I don't think we should defend the status quo or that it makes the OP's opinions any less valid.

    Edit to add: Disney should pay their CM's better, train them, and just treat them more like valued team members. The increased expense would be paid for many times over in the long run by happier customers equaling increased revenue. But in the meantime, I'm not about to blame the customer for having too high of expectations or defend every CM who has a bad attitude.
    Last edited by Steveman; 07-01-2013 at 10:01 PM.

  7. #172

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    Re: The State of DL

    Quote Originally Posted by Steveman View Post
    I agree there are reasons for the situation as it is. But all of this sounds more like a defense of it. Customers being in a "snit" and overworked CM's doing their absolute best in a no win situation. I don't see that's always the case. For example, what I've often experienced is my party walking up for our turn in line, smiling and polite, and getting a dirty look, or a sigh and rolling eyes, or someone unable to tear himself away from a conversation with another CM to even look at us, or being barked at, etc. Not the end of the world and it's something I've come to expect, but it sounds like it was a surprise to the OP.

    Back in college I had one job where I HATED my boss, felt he was unfair and treated me poorly, and was actively searching for a different job. But when a customer came up to me and asked for help on something, I knew it wasn't THEIR fault and I did my best to help them as nicely as I could. Many of us have posted what we see as the reasons for the way things are, but I don't think we should defend the status quo or that it makes the OP's opinions any less valid.

    Edit to add: Disney should pay their CM's better, train them, and just treat them more like valued team members. The increased expense would be paid for many times over in the long run by happier customers equaling increased revenue. But in the meantime, I'm not about to blame the customer for having too high of expectations or defend every CM who has a bad attitude.
    I'm not defending every CM with a bad attitude, either. I certainly don't think there is any excuse for rudeness from a customer service worker. I've come across unacceptably rude CMs at Disneyland and I've reported them.

    I'm just wondering if perhaps a lot of CM interactions where the CM is seen as "rude" or "incompetent" are the result of things that have nothing to do with the CM, such as understaffing, and the fact that when there are numerous guests involved with different needs, there's no way to avoid leaving at least one person unhappy (such as choosing which guest to ring up first. One of those two is going to be happy; one isn't.).

    And I'm also pointing out, as others have, and as you have - that if Disney doesn't invest in their workers in terms of wages, training and fair and adequate scheduling and managerial support, they're never going to raise the bar with the CMs. The overall blame for the culture and attitudes might go back to management and their expectations - or lack thereof - for the staff.
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  8. #173

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    Re: The State of DL

    I don't get all the complaining and everything. Sure, it's not perfect. Why, on my last trip, just a few days ago, I saw several AAs frozen at Splash Mountain. But I decided not to say anything. As a fan, I thought it was best to pick my battles. So I just gritted my teeth and let it go at that. They'll probably take care of Splash soon enough.
    My top favorite Disneyland attractions:

    1. Big Thunder Mountain Railroad
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    4. Mad Tea Party
    5. Peter Pan's Flight
    6. Roger Rabbit's Car Toon Spin

  9. #174

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    Re: The State of DL

    Quote Originally Posted by jsmith11618 View Post
    In a perfect world maybe, but sometimes we need a job, and have to take jobs not suited to us. I hate customer service, customers annoy me, but I need a job, and have to take a customer service job to pay the bills, I can fake it only so much, but I suck at customer service but a job is a job.
    So you are advocating not performing well at a job if you don't like the job?
    "You can cut me off from the civilized world. You can incarcerate me with two moronic cellmates. You can torture me with your thrice daily swill, but you cannot break the spirit of a Winchester. My voice shall be heard from this wilderness and I shall be delivered from this fetid and festering sewer."

  10. #175

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    Re: The State of DL

    I think we're advocating "being human" which occasionally means taking a job other than your dream job because you need the money. It's easy to say "Well, it's your job, you're responsible for doing it as best you can!" but in the real world people, you know, need money to live and will take jobs that pay. Is it reasonable to expect a McDonald's employee, at minimum wage, to fully live and breathe McDonalds? Are Wal-Mart's employees expected to be complete devotees of the entire Wal-Mart philosophy?

  11. #176

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    Re: The State of DL

    Year after year, the more Disney lowers its standards of customer service the more appropriate it becomes to compare them to fast food corporations and big box stores.

    The difference is that in exchange for lowered standards of customer service, Disney charges ever-rising prices.

    Of course, it's no surprise that the two go together.
    "With the acquisition of Marvel and now of Lucasfilm,
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  12. #177

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    Re: The State of DL

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Wiggins View Post
    Year after year, the more Disney lowers its standards of customer service the more appropriate it becomes to compare them to fast food corporations and big box stores.

    The difference is that in exchange for lowered standards of customer service, Disney charges ever-rising prices.

    Of course, it's no surprise that the two go together.
    Exactly, that's why Bob Iger and his team of greedy executives need to be shown the door.

  13. #178

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    Re: The State of DL

    Quote Originally Posted by The International View Post
    I think we're advocating "being human" which occasionally means taking a job other than your dream job because you need the money. It's easy to say "Well, it's your job, you're responsible for doing it as best you can!" but in the real world people, you know, need money to live and will take jobs that pay. Is it reasonable to expect a McDonald's employee, at minimum wage, to fully live and breathe McDonalds? Are Wal-Mart's employees expected to be complete devotees of the entire Wal-Mart philosophy?
    It's one thing to take a job because you need it. It is quite another to turn in sub-par work just because you don't like the job that you had to take.
    "You can cut me off from the civilized world. You can incarcerate me with two moronic cellmates. You can torture me with your thrice daily swill, but you cannot break the spirit of a Winchester. My voice shall be heard from this wilderness and I shall be delivered from this fetid and festering sewer."

  14. #179

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    Re: The State of DL

    Quote Originally Posted by planodisney View Post
    From todays miceage article, it looks like they have fixed much of RSR's not working tech. and will have the rest fixed or replaced by next week.
    This is realy, realy good news to me. I was worried they were going to go the way of the Expedition Everest Yeti with RSR.
    This is funny to read after returning from a vacation to the parks. On Saturday, RSR broke down BEFORE the park even opened (prior to the rope drop, while many of us where waiting in the RSR Fast Pass Line ready to get to the Fast Pass kiosks.) Then, after being told they were fixing the ride once at the official Fast Pass line, the Fast Pass kiosks broke down. It took two hours for the system to reload. In the meantime, the ride reopened, though our party had our pregnant member stay for the fast passes while we rode rides that she was unable to do. It was frustrating, especially after hearing that the ride ALWAYS breaks down. Some CM's had no clue how to handle the situation, but others were great. Eventually, they passed out two fast passes (one that could be used anytime that day) to every person waiting in that line for their patience and understanding. It was my first time experiencing the new re-vamped DCA, so I thoroughly enjoyed the ride and was thankful that they gave us an opportunity to ride it again, a luxury with that one!


    Quote Originally Posted by TylerDurden View Post
    Exactly. A smile and "have a nice day" isn't that difficult to manage. And it's true, I'm not expecting perfection--I'm not even upset about not getting smiles or greetings...just surprised because DL used to be THE place to go for stellar customer service, and I simply noticed that that isn't the case anymore.
    My boyfriend and I commented on a few CM's that were definitely grumpy and displayed little to no personality. Considering that most of the CM's that I have come across over the years have been friendly, informative and helpful, these few really stood out. As stated above, a simple smile goes a LONG way - especially on a long, hot day!

    As for CM's salaries, it's a shame that they are so poor. I have CM friends in entertainment and I believe their salaries are far better than the rest, primarily because they are union employees. Since it's Disney, I think people expect far more from this company and it's a shame that they don't deliver.

    Also of note: I wish the parks would get back to the amount of detail that Walt had back in his day. For me, reading about his attention to detail and the importance of the guest experience, it amazes me how much has changed...
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  15. #180

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    Re: The State of DL

    Quote Originally Posted by BwaySaint View Post
    This is funny to read after returning from a vacation to the parks. On Saturday, RSR broke down BEFORE the park even opened (prior to the rope drop, while many of us where waiting in the RSR Fast Pass Line ready to get to the Fast Pass kiosks.) Then, after being told they were fixing the ride once at the official Fast Pass line, the Fast Pass kiosks broke down. It took two hours for the system to reload. In the meantime, the ride reopened, though our party had our pregnant member stay for the fast passes while we rode rides that she was unable to do. It was frustrating, especially after hearing that the ride ALWAYS breaks down. Some CM's had no clue how to handle the situation, but others were great. Eventually, they passed out two fast passes (one that could be used anytime that day) to every person waiting in that line for their patience and understanding. It was my first time experiencing the new re-vamped DCA, so I thoroughly enjoyed the ride and was thankful that they gave us an opportunity to ride it again, a luxury with that one!
    This story is disappointing and representative of the poor maintenance I also encountered on my trip. But your sentence in bold is what the old Disneyland that we all know and love is about. I'm glad they recognized your inconvenience and compensated for it--it seemed that the general attitude toward guest inconvenience was "tough" in my trip, but that's a good example of doing things right and that's what I would've loved to see, and expect from DL.

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