Will DLR be more or less Pixarized now?

**Ride Warrior** · 01-30-2006, 12:00 PM

Originally Posted by Radiobarry

BTW...I've heard the Walt "as long as there is imagination left in the world" quote hundreds of times. I'd like to know if anyone has information about the context in which he said that...

Here is Walt's famous quote:

"Disneyland will never be completed. It will continue to grow as long as there is imagination left in the world."

Although the intent of his words are self explanatory, I am including another quote from Mr. Disney in order to clarify and verify "the context":

"It's something that will never be finished. Something that I can keep developing...and adding to."

Walt based much of his rationale for building the park on what was relative to him as a child, in terms of creativity and fun:

"It has that thing - the imagination, and the feeling of happy excitement- I knew when I was a kid."

"We believed in our idea - a family park where parents and children could have fun- together."

Today, more than ever Disneyland is a place that kids and adults can enjoy together. PIXAR has produced the top kids films of the current era. The Disneyland Resort offers high quality attractions that appeal to kids and adults that enjoy contemporary films of all kinds, as well as folks who like non-movie based attractions.

Pixar based attractions are popular because they are filled with imagination and warmth, aka quality. Pixar's John Lasseter used to be a Disneyland CM, and repects Disney tradition.. It is awesome that he's going to have a lot of say with respect to Disney's creative end.

We, cannot expect, however, for Disneyland to remain as it did 40 or 50 years ago - or for any new attractions that are developed to resemble what existed in a distant yesterday. True imagination holds a reverence for the past, but is by its very nature progressive. Long live creativity and the positive change that it represents.

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**Lore** · 01-30-2006, 12:06 PM

Pixarization seems to combine the disturbing trends of Cartoonization and Toyization in a seriously off theme way.

Cartoonization might be represented by Tarzan's Tree House. Here you have the almost reasonble theme of Tarzan. Sure, he didn't really live much in a tree, but it is a classic adventure story placed in Adventureland. The off-theme problem most people have is with the giant cartoon characters used in the attraction. Cheapness(tm) aside (which is a whole other issue), the sight of such characters jars one out of the reality of the land. Adventureland preps you for reality and you get Disney Store props.

Toyization is something often combined with Cartoonization and Cheapness(tm) and is best represented by Pooh or Club Buzz. Here a cartoon toy is placed in an otherwise realistic setting. One might also question what British woods are doing near the American south. Pooh is based on a classic British story and would be perfect in Fantasyland. The basic problem with Toyization is one of being off theme. A living toyland near the Small World would be fine. Imagine the outrage if Disney re-themed "Great Moments with Mr. Lincoln" to "Great Moments with a Living Lincoln Toy." It's just not the same.

As a kid I always wanted to "Live the Story". That meant I wanted to ride canoes in the old west, see the old west from the canoes, and still be in the old west when I got off those canoes. Staying on-theme makes the whole experience so much richer. Otherwise, I might just have wanted to stay home and play with my own toys.

**XCLIPSE129** · 01-30-2006, 12:44 PM

A corporate entity capitalizing on a large profitable engagement... no thats not TDA's motto. Facial Image: Sacastic Hand postion: on fore head. =)

**Ride Warrior** · 01-30-2006, 12:55 PM

Originally Posted by Lore

Pixarization seems to combine the disturbing trends of Cartoonization and Toyization in a seriously off theme way.

Walt once said, "All cartoon characters and fables must be exaggeration, caricatures. It is the very nature of fantasy and fable." Pixar characters are 21at Century exaggerated characatures. this is what makes them appeling to both kids and adults everywhere today. The dynamic success of Pixar based rides such as Buzz Lightyear's Laser Blast, It's Tough To Be a Bug stand as testiments to the quality of Pixar characters.

The new Monsters ride has started out far more popular than it's predecessor,,,and some are already predicting that it will be a modern day Peter Pan ride, in terms of its appeal to guests.

It sounds like that you, Lore, disagree with Walt's idea of cartoon characters being exagerated characatures. Would you have them all be more dignified and realistic, whether 2-D or 3-D? If you do believe in Walt's idea, I'd love to see some of your ideas for characters that would be better and more popular than those of Disney and Pixar, over the course of the past 15 years.

All of the incessant criticism must mean that you and others that apparently don't care for the present have something superior to offer. So, let's see it. Surely cynicism isn't all that you have to offer.
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**PragmaticIdealist** · 01-30-2006, 01:21 PM

Originally Posted by Lore

Pixarization seems to combine the disturbing trends of Cartoonization and Toyization in a seriously off theme way.

As a kid I always wanted to "Live the Story". That meant I wanted to ride canoes in the old west, see the old west from the canoes, and still be in the old west when I got off those canoes. Staying on-theme makes the whole experience so much richer. Otherwise, I might just have wanted to stay home and play with my own toys.

Disneyland is theatre. The more believable the fiction is, the more effective it will be.

Storytelling requires the dramatic unities of space and time, so the ways that all the attractions and other features of Disneyland relate to each other are vitally important. All of these experiences must contribute to an overall effect.

Pixar's existing properties simply do not fit in the timeless settings of The Magic Kingdom.

The stories and characters belong to a world that is closely tied to contemporary reality, so any inclusion of Pixar's properties in Disneyland will, ultimately, weaken The Magic Kingdom.

**Ride Warrior** · 01-30-2006, 09:16 PM

Originally Posted by PragmaticIdealist

Pixar's existing properties simply do not fit in the timeless settings of The Magic Kingdom.

The stories and characters belong to a world that is closely tied to contemporary reality, so any inclusion of Pixar's properties in Disneyland will, ultimately, weaken The Magic Kingdom.

Once again, Walt said "All cartoon characters and fables must be exaggeration, caricatures. It is the very nature of fantasy and fable."

Have ever seen a Disney cartoon, cartoon movie or comic book that features one or more of the fab five. Mickey, Minnie. Donald, Daisy and Goofy storylines have been closely tied to contemporary reality even before Disneyland was created. This is not two mention Pluto, Huey, Duey and Luie, Uncle Scrooge, the Bugle Boys, Mickey's nephews, Goofy's son, Chip 'N Dale, Gyro Gearloose, and a host of others.
Should you have known Walt in the 50's and 60's, PragmaticIdealist, would you have advised Walt to stick with the fairytale characters as they "fit into timeless settings", but dump Mickey and the rest of the Fab Five exagerated characature types. Let's face it, a "Goofy" looking mouse that is "closely associated with contemporary reality" appears rather out of place next to Cinderwlla and Prince Charming.

Pixar and Fab Five characters are alike in the sense that they each represent contemporary reality, and they are each exagerated characatures. Based on your logic, if you're gonna trash Toy Story, Mickey's Magical Christmas will also have to go. If your gonna can It's a Bugs Life, you'll have to wave goodby to Duck Tales (featuring Donald).

Continuing along these lines, should the anihilation of Monsters, Inc. be what you're after, you'll also have to destroy Chip 'n Dales's Rescue Rangers. When you set out to sink Finding Nemo, you might as well blow Donald Duck Goes Wuackers out of the Water. If you put an end to The Incredibles, you will have to put an end to Super Goof and A Goofey Movie as well. Upon tearing down DCA's new Monsters, Inc. ride, you'll also be obliged to bring down Mickey's and Minnies houses at toontown.

Should you have traveled back in time and convinced Walt to drop the contemporary cartoons and keep only the time proven fairytales, you would have denied millions of kids laughter , wholesome entertainment, and the opportunity to enrich their imagination. Perhaps you would have destroyed these things for yourself as a kid as well. Today's children adore Pixar characters (now Disney characters officially).

The Sisney empire did not begin with a timetested fable. In reality Walt and his brother Roy risked everything they had (which wasn't much at the time) on an exagerated characature named Micke, who was then, and remains closely tied to contemporary reality. The world is a far happier, magical and more civilized than it woulf be otherwise. For one thing, there never would have been a Disneyland.

You seem to have forgotten that "it all started with a mouse"...and the Disney legend received a revitalizing jump start early in the 21st Century, so the Toy Story goes.

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**Lore** · 01-30-2006, 10:15 PM

Originally Posted by Ride Warrior

Walt once said, "All cartoon characters and fables must be exaggeration, caricatures. It is the very nature of fantasy and fable."

You've rather missed my point. I'm simply saying Disney can do better with immersion by putting the right rides in the right spots and not cheaping out. The Pirates are exaggerated, and I love them. You're prepped for it with the art in the queue. The creature in Expedition Everest looks a bit exaggerated, but I suspect I'll enjoy the ride. I even enjoy the Fantasyland rides because, well, that's what I expect from the area. As for being critical, I think Mission:Space is well located and themed and not cheap. I even like Tower of Terror and so does my 70 year old mother. I'm not a fan of the Pixar rides, only because they are cheap and weaken the immersion of the whole experience by being off-theme. If Disney had put the 1977 Space Mountain, which I loved, next to the Haunted Mansion, which I also love, I would be complaining, despite the strong thematic tie-in of speed ramps.

**Disneyfreak** · 01-31-2006, 03:00 AM

No more pixar in Disneyland PERIOD!!!!! If you add anymore pixar to Disneyland the whole feel to the park will be gone. The more they add the more it feels like DCA which is totally horrible.