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  1. #46

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    Re: Winter refub schedule updated

    I haven't been to Disneyland since the beginning of 2007. I'm going on the 7th...I'M SERIOUSLY GOING TO MISS THE SUBS?! I don't think I'm ever going to be able to ride them. Holy balls. To be honest, I was only excited to go on the ride and think about what USED to be there. Hopefully they actually make it a good ride now.

  2. #47

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    Re: Winter refub schedule updated

    Quote Originally Posted by C-HOX View Post
    I haven't been to Disneyland since the beginning of 2007. I'm going on the 7th...I'M SERIOUSLY GOING TO MISS THE SUBS?! I don't think I'm ever going to be able to ride them. Holy balls. To be honest, I was only excited to go on the ride and think about what USED to be there. Hopefully they actually make it a good ride now.
    If you're referring to the Finding Nemo subs and are hoping they're making substantial changes, you're probably going to be disappointed. I don't think they'd do much as far as story, effect, layout or anything more than refurbish, repaint and reopen.
    Credibility is to be sought for. Credulity is not. Sadly the latter is our normal human state.

  3. #48

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    Re: Winter refub schedule updated

    Considering the subs overhaul in 2004 through 2007 ran up some 173 million ... and Finding Dory coming in a few years, and now a nearly 10 month rehab scheduled ..... I think it's safe to say - the subs are going nowhere!

    It's now a one-of-a-kind in the world. WDW got rid of theirs. Mall of America got rid of theirs. DL's is the last of it's kind.

    Whatever happens to TL's future ... I think it's safe to say - the ride will be with us for quite some time.

    The figure-8 loop of the monorail was also rumored as well to go. Well .. we've seen the awnings go up .. just under the old Motor Boat Cruise lagoon. They wouldn't bother with that ... if the that track piece was slated for removal for these "Star Wars" rumors.

    I'm beginning to think all those "Star Wars" rumors .. are nothing but hot air.

    I'm careful with what I say ... I could be wrong ... but I'm not, necessarily, holding my breath on it.
    MY SIGNATURE:
    Dear Peoplemover Fans, If you want to see a new attraction that at least mimics the 1967 Peoplemover in a future Tomorrowland remodel, you need to write to the powers-that-be, and let them know. If you don't - Then the next time Tomorrowland is remodeled, you will see a land barren of any "Peoplemover" type attraction.

  4. #49

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    Re: Winter refub schedule updated

    Gotta love how this thread turned into one about how expensive the subs are to run. You learn new stuff all the time.
    Please... put Guardians of the Galaxy in Tomorrowland.













  5. #50

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    Re: Winter refub schedule updated

    Quote Originally Posted by chesirecat View Post
    long quote
    Ok fine don't believe me. I'm simply going to say they're expensive to operate yet not as cost effective as they (TDA) are and nothing more. You don't want to believe me just because you feel you know more ok then. You provide examples that don't prove that they're more expensive despite me and a few others provide information regarding the attraction fine. They are end of story.

    ...As I see it

  6. #51

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    Re: Winter refub schedule updated

    The TL makeover does sound dubious but the "spirited" insider at the other forum has a long track record of reliable information which lends credibility to the rumor. He adds that the Monsters project is progressing full speed ahead and that MyMagic+ cost overruns have delayed the Star Wars expansion in Florida.

    It'll be interesting to look back a year from now and see what actually happens.

  7. #52

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    Re: Winter refub schedule updated

    Quote Originally Posted by sheetz View Post
    The TL makeover does sound dubious but the "spirited" insider at the other forum has a long track record of reliable information which lends credibility to the rumor. He adds that the Monsters project is progressing full speed ahead and that MyMagic+ cost overruns have delayed the Star Wars expansion in Florida.

    It'll be interesting to look back a year from now and see what actually happens.
    Disney's financials are in the public domain, and there sure isn't a massive hole in the budget regarding MyMagic+, the total $1 billion price tag will be spread out over many years, and be realized only if all Disney theme parks use MyMagic+, which is expected, and includes the cost of other NextGen offerings such as the World of Color hats.

    It is public knowledge that Disney is initiating a stock buy back in 2014 and will spend between $6 to $8 billion to repurchase it's own stock, after heavy capital expenditures such as $4 billion for Star Wars, $4 billion for Marvel, and billions spent on Carsland and the New Fantasyland. Publicly, the only major projects for 2014/5 timeline are finishing Shanghai, in which Disney will invest about $2 billion of its own money, Avatarland, and finishing the Seven Dwarfs Mine Train attraction. Shareholders have been pressuring the company to hold back on theme park investments which are, by their nature, expensive and very much longterm investments in terms of seeing a return.

    WDI has ambitious plans for Star Wars land, re-creating beloved Star Wars locales, many of which may make appearances in the upcoming sequels and spin-offs, to which Disney is heavily committed. Hence, Star Wars land won't be a small new facade to an existing land, but will need a good amount of unused acreage for its construction. There are only a couple of places where a Star Wars land could go at DLR:

    1. Simba parking lot next to DCA, adding another draw for DCA, and providing a weenie for guests to walk through the under-utilized Paradise Pier section of the park.

    2. 3rd Gate, but would pose logistical issues, besides the cost of building things that a third gate needs such as First Aid, ticket booths, guest relations, backstage areas . . .

    3. Land outside of DLR's immediate vicinity, such as in Fountain Valley and utilizing bus/monorail transportation, a bit more blue sky.

    It takes time to develop new attractions, let alone new lands, despite Walt's "lost weekend" with Herb Ryman, Walt had been thinking about the little park behind the studio for a while. Disney announced Carsland, DCA 2.0 in 2007 . . . the thing just opened in 2012. Rest assured, WDI is working on Star Wars land, and it hasn't been "delayed", but that it takes time to come up with the technology and creative plans for such a product.

    Realistically, Burbank is going to wait until Episode VII opens in December 2015 to decide when to pull the trigger on Star Wars land, also when Shanghai opens, and in the following months they'll know if they have a super mega hit with Star Wars, or just a moderate b.o. success, and if Shanghai will run out of the gates, or be a slow starter like Hong Kong, and hence requiring a cash infusion earlier than thought. If Shanghai fails, stockholders will be jittery about new theme park investments that don't fix Shanghai. Disney has a sweetheart deal with regards to Hong Kong, meaning they pretty much make money regardless of what happens with the park.

    Best case scenario would be that Episode VII makes a global box record, and that Shanghia hits attendance projections in the first year.
    Last edited by chesirecat; 11-23-2013 at 08:27 AM.

  8. #53

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    Re: Winter refub schedule updated

    Quote Originally Posted by chesirecat View Post
    Individual projectors can be swapped out for digital versions
    ...but haven't been. Come on, when you debate the cost of maintenance, you have to deal with the reality of the situation. You can hypothesize as much as you want about how cheap it could be, but the reality is, when the ride was created, they made a special projector with a special bulb that is proprietary and outrageously expensive.

    Bulbs of that magnitude require bulletproof protection to replace. I've been a projectionist, I've seen bulbs explode and known projectionists who thought it would never happen to them and been injured and died. I was not union, our operation was a 4 screen theater, but my manager gave me the information if I wanted to join and we were always insanely cautious. Projection bulbs are grenades. The size of DLR, the number of employees, the number of unions they work with regularly, and the insane amplitude of safety regulations being put in place to deal with OSHA tell me they likely have a union projectionist to work on these projectors who would have to be highly specialized in their bulbs.

    I have no inside information, and from the sounds of it, neither do you. I, however, am basing my hypothesis on what is known. It is known they made these projectors in house. It is known that many sources have said the subs have one of the highest costs to run of any ride in the park. Please, if you have anything other than your own hypothesis to support the claim that the subs are not high cost, I would LOVE to read it. Otherwise, you really need to stop. Defend your love of the subs, absolutely, I have no problem with that, but stop trying to say they are something other than what they are while making that statement. They are not low cost. They are not high capacity. They are a huge investment of land.

    All said, a nine-month refurb does signal a major investment, and it does seem to point to at least several more years of operation.

  9. #54

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    Re: Winter refub schedule updated

    Quote Originally Posted by lightofdarkness View Post
    ...but haven't been. Come on, when you debate the cost of maintenance, you have to deal with the reality of the situation. You can hypothesize as much as you want about how cheap it could be, but the reality is, when the ride was created, they made a special projector with a special bulb that is proprietary and outrageously expensive.
    ??? Nemo doesn't require high intensity projectors typically used in theater applications, the size of the projections is actually quite small and achieved with a number of home theater sized projectors, no special bulbs were invented for the ride (in fact, a Miceage update stated they were rumored to be spending tens of thousands a month buying bulbs), the new technology is what the projections are projected on to. Nemo also requires DLP due to synchronization issues with the subs, and large number of projectors, that are most easily handled if everything is controlled by a computer, vs using film.

    You can even build a do it yourself Nemo/Tupac-style "hologram"

    Last edited by chesirecat; 11-25-2013 at 01:06 PM.

  10. #55

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    Re: Winter refub schedule updated

    Quote Originally Posted by lightofdarkness View Post

    I have no inside information, and from the sounds of it, neither do you.
    I know some people who do electrical at Disneyland, as well as some former imagineers and others, I received their assistance with building an exact replica of the hub's twinkle lights for my front yard by using the same bulbs, and probably same supplier, as they do.
    Last edited by chesirecat; 11-25-2013 at 10:40 AM.

  11. #56

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    Re: Winter refub schedule updated

    Quote Originally Posted by lightofdarkness View Post
    Projection bulbs are grenades. The size of DLR, the number of employees, the number of unions they work with regularly, and the insane amplitude of safety regulations being put in place to deal with OSHA tell me they likely have a union projectionist to work on these projectors who would have to be highly specialized in their bulbs.
    DLR has employed projectionists for Muppets, Soarin', but not for Nemo as far as I am aware as the size of the "screens" are much smaller and they used high-end digital projectors for home theaters.

    Quote Originally Posted by lightofdarkness View Post
    Bulbs of that magnitude require bulletproof protection to replace. I've been a projectionist, I've seen bulbs explode and known projectionists who thought it would never happen to them and been injured and died.
    That's very sad. Everything mechanical has a S.O.P. for replacement/maintenance in DLR that must be adhered to in every situation.

    Quote Originally Posted by lightofdarkness View Post

    All said, a nine-month refurb does signal a major investment, and it does seem to point to at least several more years of operation.
    Very true.

    Not sure how much light bulbs for DLP home projectors are, they could switch over to LED "lampless" projectors during the refurb, probably mostly save maintenance costs. There are a ton of DLP projectors in Nemo's show building, probably more than most people would figure as they've got to have duplicate show scenes for each side of the boat in the show building.

    Anyway, there are image quality issues with some of the projections when compare side to side, so I think that switching over to LED "lampless" DLP projectors would help with show quality issues in term of projections.

    There's a lot of blue sky stuff they never did. In terms of turning the whole thing into a fish tank, probably wouldn't work as the fish would get caught in the subs propellers and obstruct show scenes, they could built a gigantic plexiglass aquarium that wraps around the sub on the small outside portion, and on each side of the sub, and fill it with fish, or even introduce some robotic fish which prowl the tank . . .
    Last edited by chesirecat; 11-25-2013 at 01:33 PM.

  12. #57

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    Re: Winter refub schedule updated

    So given the new MiceAge article, which I think is a load of you know what, some of these planned refurbs we were talking about might not affect 2014 as expected. Obviously the mandatory OSHA refurbs for Pirates and Splash Mountain are still happening, but apparently the extensive refurbs for Fantasyland have been put on indefinite hold as well as the refurb of the subs being a polite way of saying permanent closure. Disney's My Magic Plus Failure

    Thoughts on this regarding 2014 refurbs?

    As far as I'm concerned at this point, I'm not believing any of this until there is an official announcement from Disney.
    Please... put Guardians of the Galaxy in Tomorrowland.













  13. #58

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    Re: Winter refub schedule updated

    Quote Originally Posted by DrFink View Post
    As far as I'm concerned at this point, I'm not believing any of this until there is an official announcement from Disney.
    I totally agree




  14. #59

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    Re: Winter refub schedule updated

    Quote Originally Posted by DrFink View Post
    As far as I'm concerned at this point, I'm not believing any of this until there is an official announcement from Disney.
    What part aren't you believing? The refurbs posted on the schedule you linked to are straight from Disney. 100% they are happening. What's not to believe?

  15. #60

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    Re: Winter refub schedule updated

    Quote Originally Posted by MrLiver View Post
    What part aren't you believing? The refurbs posted on the schedule you linked to are straight from Disney. 100% they are happening. What's not to believe?
    I was referring to the MiceAge article with that comment. Specifically, their claims that the subs are closing for good and the numerous refurbs that are now apparently not happening despite them never being officially announced in the first place.
    Please... put Guardians of the Galaxy in Tomorrowland.













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