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  1. #1

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    maybe it's time for another fantasyland remake?

    it seems that these days Disney is interested in expanding by upgrading old classics

    I mean so far we've got Pirates/Space/Mansion(at a slow but steady pace)/Jungle Cruise as well as a new paint scheme in Tomorrowland and of course Subs and Monsters Inc are both basicaly built off old preexisting ride systems/show buildings

    I know that Disney's got a ways to go with some of these things though like finishing up Tomorrowland

    however looking at things I can't help but feel that Fantasyland could use another remake

    not so much with the outer scenery (at least in the main area behind the castle which is what i'm posting about for now) but in the rides they have

    here's a picture of Fantasyland


    I've highlighted the areas that seem to hold the major attractions

    the green area is the building I believe Peter Pan is housed in
    the blue outlining is were Mr Toad Currently presides
    the Pink is Alice (if you look closely you can see a bit of the outdoor part of the track through the trees)
    Yellow is Snow White
    Red is Pinnochio
    and of course sharing the border with Pinnochio is the Village Haus resturant

    the first thing I've seemed to notice about Fantasyland is that the east side is much more popular then the west

    I mean Peter Pan's popularity is obvious and is mostly due to the fact that it's unique with it's flying aspect and the great London Scene

    Mr Toad is also popular in that it's different from most of the other darkrides in that it is a tribute back to old school darkrides with a slightly faster pace more twists and turns and a general sense of caus

    my biggest problem with these rides (praticularly Peter Pan's with it's long wait times) is that they're over almost as soon as they begin it seems


    my solution would be to take out the two less popular rides in Fantasyland and use the space to enhance the more popular ones


    if Disney were to take out Mr Toad they could use Mr Toads current space to nearly double the size of Peter Pan, with that done they could redo the load area a bit and give us bigger vehicals (maybe whatever they have in Paris) to enhance capacity and with a longer story the ride could utilize the flying aspect more and flesh out the story so it doesn't feel so rushed near the end, that way the rides line would go faster and it would be truly worth the wait

    then after that Disney could simply close down Pinnochio and Snow White which are the two less popular rides (I in praticular don't care for snow white in that not only does it feel constricted by it's space already but it lacks a great ending in alot of ways it always feels like it needs one last scene) and add back Mr Toad, not only would adding back Toad on this side be easy and cheap but Disney could go back to some of the plans they had for the WDW version and use them to enhance props saved from the Disneyland version and give it the same concept with two sides and alternative storylines this would increase capacity and rerideablity (and since some of the scenes would cross each other they would share space thus making the ride overall slightly longer


    after that Disney could save some set pieces from the removed darkrides to see if they couldn't reuse them somehow

    for instance if Snow White were missed too badly they could build a newer larger building for it over were the motorboat cruise is and give the story a more complete feel with a final scene to make the story run more smoothly


    or maybe rebuild Pinnochio as a Pleasure Island focased ride over on Paradise Pier they could even swap out it's current vehicals for more of a boat based water flume ride

  2. #2

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    Re: maybe it's time for another fantasyland remake?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jspider
    if Disney were to take out Mr Toad
    Sorry, but I stopped reading there.

    The riot that would cause....

  3. #3

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    Re: maybe it's time for another fantasyland remake?

    Quote Originally Posted by ManaByte
    Sorry, but I stopped reading there.

    The riot that would cause....
    keep reading I suggested doubling it's size

  4. #4

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    Re: maybe it's time for another fantasyland remake?

    I was there this evening, everything was lovely.
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  5. #5

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    Re: maybe it's time for another fantasyland remake?

    Well, the thought is quite admirable, but I think you hit upon an important point without realizing it: Fantasyland is hard to expand upon at all. Look at it geographically. Main Street and the Castle block it from expanding south, Toontown in the north, Tommorrowlandis a pretty big space and the area where they blend is a tad muddy, and it can't expand on the Frontierland side either. It has developed into the dead center of the park, and anything that is done to it must occur within it unlike the additions of ToonTown and New Orleans Square. If it could be expanded, a lot could easily be done.

    But I like the idea of movinf stuff around a little. I think Snow White should stay mainly because it is the only Princess ride in the park with the trend of Princess popularity going on
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    Re: maybe it's time for another fantasyland remake?

    Let's blow up the castle why we're at it! Geeze! I'm just kidding Jspider, why your ideas do make sense I just would hate to see Mr. Toad go. It was an original ride and I think it should stay. But then what do I know, I'm not an imagineer and things will change weather I like it or not. If anything does go I just hope it will replaced with something that will make it worth it, and not just some cookie cutter replica of another ride at another park.

  7. #7

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    Re: maybe it's time for another fantasyland remake?

    Quote Originally Posted by Degenerate
    Let's blow up the castle why we're at it! Geeze! I'm just kidding Jspider, why your ideas do make sense I just would hate to see Mr. Toad go. It was an original ride and I think it should stay. But then what do I know, I'm not an imagineer and things will change weather I like it or not. If anything does go I just hope it will replaced with something that will make it worth it, and not just some cookie cutter replica of another ride at another park.
    I like Toad alot too really it's one of my favorate attractions in Fantasyland (I actualy Perfer it over Peter Pan mostly because like I said earlier Peter Pan has a long wait and increadibly short ridetime) that's half the reason why I'd be kinda interested in changes like this

    Toad was already altered once and from what I heard it was altered to include details from it's now closed WDW Brother

    with a new show building and two route system Disneyland could recreate some of what made the WDW one intreging to me

    two different storylines with paths crisscrossing so that they share a few scenes in common it would increase the sense of caus and make me want to ride twice

    the sets in the Toad we have now would be easy enough to perserve and simply move over and utilize in the new attraction and then they could use a few old scenes and a few new scenes to bring out a multi storyline type deal

    with the space they have available there is simply no way they could do a cookie cutter replica though

  8. #8

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    Re: maybe it's time for another fantasyland remake?

    Quote Originally Posted by sorceress1986
    Well, the thought is quite admirable, but I think you hit upon an important point without realizing it: Fantasyland is hard to expand upon at all. Look at it geographically. Main Street and the Castle block it from expanding south, Toontown in the north, Tommorrowlandis a pretty big space and the area where they blend is a tad muddy, and it can't expand on the Frontierland side either. It has developed into the dead center of the park, and anything that is done to it must occur within it unlike the additions of ToonTown and New Orleans Square. If it could be expanded, a lot could easily be done.

    But I like the idea of movinf stuff around a little. I think Snow White should stay mainly because it is the only Princess ride in the park with the trend of Princess popularity going on
    very true

    remodling like this could easily require a second closure of fantasyland for the redo

    however honestly with a few exceptions (motor boat cruise area and the Hunchback theater area in Frontierland) there just isn't much empty space left to expand in for Disneyland

    redevelopment seems to becoming one of the only ways for Disney to expand this park so in my opinion Disney should enhance the attractions that work best to their highest quality and perhaps cut off the weaklings a bit


    I do agree a bit on the princess presence behind the castle area a bit and I'll even admit for a while I was toying with the idea of including in this Post to rebuild Toad in a combination of the Pinochio building and the Villiage Haus and simply combine the Snow white building with some of the castle areas and create a princess dining experience that they could sell to the public like what WDW does


    in my opinion Snow White is flawed and needs expanding itself if it were to survive a remake like this

    the ending just didn't work for me it felt way to abrupt

    the Queen falling shadow lighting effect or whatever it is just doesn't work well enough to close the story and in my opinion at the very least they should include Snow White kissing the prince before they go to the happily ever after part of the ride


    if they were to rebuild it in the motorboat cruise area with the story just slightly more fleshed out it'd work better

    they could have forest theming and a lead up to the Dwarvs house for the que and they could even rebuild that Pirate Ship/Skull Rock resturant that some people complain about in that part of the park

  9. #9

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    Re: maybe it's time for another fantasyland remake?

    I've thought about this situation before, too, because Fantasyland does not satisfy me. "Dark rides" are not very convincing, and some of the existing attractions fail to do justice to the stories.

    The three attractions on the East side of the court are not as much of a concern as Pinocchio and Snow White are. I would eliminate one of these two (probably Snow White) or reconfigure everything by, perhaps, using the existing site of Plaza Gardens.

    I would additionally reconfigure these attractions so that the queues become walk-through expositions and the ride-through portions follow the rising action, climax, and falling action of the stories.

    The characters need to be more fully animated, and the stage flats and the paint that fluoresces under ultraviolet light need to be minimized.

    Both Snow White and Pinocchio have vehicles that do not support the story very well, so it might be nice to, perhaps, have mine cars in Snow White or gypsy carts or coaches or steamboats in Pinocchio, as well. Additionally, I'd like to have a new version of FastPass available for these attractions along with centralized ticket dispensers and alternative experiences in the vicinity.

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    Re: maybe it's time for another fantasyland remake?

    Hi sorceress!
    I think that if such a change were ever going to happen, they would have to make darn sure that the re-makes are done very well, as taking out Snow White could have its backlash. I don't mind the idea of moving them over to the Motor Boat area, as it could clear some of that congestion right behind the castle, but there should still be a place for the queen to look out over the park.

    How viable is an underground show building for one of these rides?

  11. #11

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    Re: maybe it's time for another fantasyland remake?

    I also advocate rechristening Sleeping Beauty Castle "Snow White Castle", and I believe Fantasyland needs to be expanded in the direction of Festival Arena.

  12. #12

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    Re: maybe it's time for another fantasyland remake?

    ***scratchin my head***

    are we talking Anaheim? Cause if we are..well we are discussing DEMO the likes of which we have not seen since a parking lot became DCA.
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  13. #13

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    Re: maybe it's time for another fantasyland remake?

    I think people are a little too quick to accept Paul Pressler's excuse that there is not enough room in Disneyland to build or expand attractions.

    The real reason Disneyland has not added a new major attraction in more than twelve years has more to do with there not being an incentive to do so.

    There is plenty of room to maneuver in Fantasyland if one exercises a little imagination. The Village Haus is another possibility. It occupies a very large footprint, and the currently-closed Big Thunder Barbecue is only a few feet away.

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    Re: maybe it's time for another fantasyland remake?

    Actually JSpider I really like this idea you've come up with and can see a hell of a lot of potential. I believe there is another angle to Fantasyland that has not yet been explored- UPWARDS!! New dark ride attractions could feasibly be built above the existing ones (and whilst we're at it - why not revitilise the existing favourites, give Snow White the ending she always deserved!)

    Potentially, another 4 new Dark Rides (Beauty and the Beast, Alladin, Little Mermaid, Sleeping Beauty) could be added to the landscape.

    The People out there don't want to see their favourites go - so why let them???? Build upward and Disneyland can solve a whole range of problems in the area. Largely capacity and customer satisfaction

    I applause this idea - Well done on coming up with it. I hope it runs far...
    Last edited by Mickey_D; 06-03-2006 at 03:11 AM.
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  15. #15

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    Re: maybe it's time for another fantasyland remake?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mickey_D
    Actually JSpider I really like this idea you've come up with and can see a hell of a lot of potential. I believe there is another angle to Fantasyland that has not yet been explored- UPWARDS!! New dark ride attractions could feasibly be built above the existing ones (and whilst we're at it - why not revitilise the existing favourites, give Snow White the ending she always deserved!)

    Potentially, another 4 new Dark Rides (Beauty and the Beast, Alladin, Little Mermaid, Sleeping Beauty) could be added to the landscape.

    The People out there don't want to see their favourites go - so why let them???? Build upward and Disneyland can solve a whole range of problems in the area. Largely capacity and customer satisfaction

    I applause this idea - Well done on coming up with it. I hope it runs far...
    I think disney have look into upwards.
    One you need to have fire exit that meet ADA Americans with Disabilities Act .
    It can get very costly. I can tell you it take planding and time, most of all money to update a facilitiies.

    That why the Autopia Ride have longs ramps. so you the guest can get to the load area for the ride.
    Last edited by akfandisney; 06-03-2006 at 06:51 AM.
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