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  1. #46

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    Re: How Does DCA Really Compare To Other Disney Parks?

    Quote Originally Posted by TDR_Fan View Post
    Not I. I can list several reasons why DCA's version is better.


    Not really. It's much longer, has more thrills, and gets you more wet.



    There is a clone of this at Walt Disney Studios in Paris.



    There is a version of this (which I feel is better) at Tokyo DisneySea
    ToT is the same ride at both parks except our ride does the samething over and over again while theres does a random numbers of drops.

    I agree its better but its still a clone off of that ride.

    And the last ones not at only DCA making it less speical.

    DCA only has like 5 great rides while DL has at least 8 if not more. Plus the Subs are coming back in 07 so yeah DCA is nothing special.

  2. #47

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    Re: How Does DCA Really Compare To Other Disney Parks?

    Alrighty, here's my ranking (bias alert- current DL CM and former MGM CM)

    1. DL- a given. The classic, the theming, the attractions, the history, the intimacy.

    2. EPCOT- that's right. It might feel sterile, but... Mission: Space and Living with the Land are awesome, there is actually a selection of food to eat, the entertainment is grand, and it has an incredible nightime show. It and AK are best enjoyed a leisurely pace to soak everything end other than the vacation warrior style that DL can be appreciated through.

    3. AK- I love this park. Kilimanjaro Safaris alone is great. The theming and naturalness is beautfiul.

    4. MGM- Star Tours, Rockin' Rollercoaster, ToT, two stunt shows and a Fantasmic! that you don't have to camp out for hours on end on the ground just to have some idiot waltz infront of you when the show starts, you actually have a SEAT!

    5. DCA- ToT, Screamin', Orange Stinger- the park is also well-themed, they just chose a BAD theme. It needs time to develop and iron out the uneveness.

    6. MK- a pale imitation to the original. It really should not exist in its current state.
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  3. #48

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    Re: How Does DCA Really Compare To Other Disney Parks?

    Quote Originally Posted by JerrodDRagon View Post
    ToT is the same ride at both parks except our ride does the samething over and over again while theres does a random numbers of drops.

    I agree its better but its still a clone off of that ride.

    And the last ones not at only DCA making it less speical.

    DCA only has like 5 great rides while DL has at least 8 if not more. Plus the Subs are coming back in 07 so yeah DCA is nothing special.

    To me, the random drop profile is not as good as everyone makes it out to be. DCA's gives you way more airtime than any of the current "random" drop profiles for MGM.

    I don't judge a park by the attractions alone. As for as a park goes, DCA is pretty good. It's theming is average by Disney standards, but they tried their best. I wouldn't say it's "nothing special" because honestly, it beats out a lot of other parks. It just looks lame sitting next door to the one and only Disneyland. Then again, doesn't any other second gate (except Tokyo DisneySea)?
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  4. #49

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    Re: How Does DCA Really Compare To Other Disney Parks?

    Quote Originally Posted by JerrodDRagon View Post
    DCA only has like 5 great rides while DL has at least 8 if not more. Plus the Subs are coming back in 07 so yeah DCA is nothing special.
    DL is the truly the exception, not DCA.

    MK itself only has five great rides, counting Space Mtn which looks pretty weak compared to the revamp at DL

    Epcot has only four great rides IMO, counting Turtle Talk With Crush

    MGM has two great rides

    AK has two great rides, maybe three

  5. #50

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    Re: How Does DCA Really Compare To Other Disney Parks?

    I was at DCA just last week and after spending a few hours there with my family I had a sudden epiphany:

    I no longer hate DCA.

    I have moved from the "hate" camp into the "I almost like this park" camp. The Rapids, the warm tortillas, Soarin, the drawing class...all of this was good stuff, and my family had a great time.

    So...I don't quite know what to do with myself now. I can't use my favorite DCA jokes if I don't hate it.

    Maybe it was just a fluke.

  6. #51

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    Re: How Does DCA Really Compare To Other Disney Parks?

    Quote Originally Posted by localdisnyfan View Post
    I was at DCA just last week and after spending a few hours there with my family I had a sudden epiphany:

    I no longer hate DCA.

    I have moved from the "hate" camp into the "I almost like this park" camp. The Rapids, the warm tortillas, Soarin, the drawing class...all of this was good stuff, and my family had a great time.

    So...I don't quite know what to do with myself now. I can't use my favorite DCA jokes if I don't hate it.

    Maybe it was just a fluke.
    Sounds like you need to re-double your efforts.

  7. #52

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    Re: How Does DCA Really Compare To Other Disney Parks?

    I think there's a twofold problem:

    1) DL is so good that any other Disney park would look bad sitting fifty feet away from it.

    This pretty much states itself. No matter what they would have built, it never would have been as impressive as DL and the DL hardcores would have a hard time accepting it as the twin to DL.

    2) A lot of hardcore DL folk just have never been to WDW

    Truth is, a lot of the faults of DCA are shared by every non-MK park at WDW. Not enough shade, for instance. Epcot and MGM also lack in the shade department. Epcot's main entrance dumps you into a giant open space with no shade aside from the big marble stones sticking up out of the ground, and during extreme temperatures the entrance to MGM will have you ducking into shops just to avoid the heat or the cold. DAK has quite a bit of shade in some places but the environment of the attractions demand it.

    Excuse two is lack of imaginative atmosphere theming. To a certain extent the other parks have this as well. MGM has a bit more detail for it than DCA, but Epcot's architecture, beyond the geosphere and a few national pavillions, is not so hot either.

    DCA's biggest weakness is it's architecture and atmosphere, though. I actually like the hubcap fountain, but gigantic show buildings for both parks are now far more obvious than they were in the parking lot era. Can somebody please do SOMETHING about the large show buildings on either side of the entrance (Soarin and I forget what)?? I look at these big ugly beige buildings and the bland entrance and feel like I'm walking across the street to the county fair.

  8. #53

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    Re: How Does DCA Really Compare To Other Disney Parks?

    Quote Originally Posted by MickeyMania View Post

    1) DL is so good that any other Disney park would look bad sitting fifty feet away from it.

    This pretty much states itself. No matter what they would have built, it never would have been as impressive as DL and the DL hardcores would have a hard time accepting it as the twin to DL.

    Not Tokyo DisneySea. That park definitely matches, if not surpasses Tokyo Disneyland in my opinion. It's the only Disney park that actually makes the Magic Kingdom style park next door look average (theming wise that is). During my 4 day stay at Tokyo Disney Resort, I spent 3 of my days at Tokyo DisneySea. It's definitely a worth companion of a second gate.
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  9. #54

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    Re: How Does DCA Really Compare To Other Disney Parks?

    Quote Originally Posted by MickeyMania View Post
    I think there's a twofold problem:

    1) DL is so good that any other Disney park would look bad sitting fifty feet away from it.

    This pretty much states itself. No matter what they would have built, it never would have been as impressive as DL and the DL hardcores would have a hard time accepting it as the twin to DL.
    Now I have to disagree there. The original plans for a second park was a Westcot idea similar to Epcot. If an Epcot type park were to be built, I believe that the second park WOULD have made its attendance projections the first year. Californians LOVE international cultures. It is a hard sell to Californians to go to a park about California when NOTHING there is as good as the real places one can easily drive to.

    Quote Originally Posted by MickeyMania View Post
    2) A lot of hardcore DL folk just have never been to WDW

    Truth is, a lot of the faults of DCA are shared by every non-MK park at WDW. Not enough shade, for instance. Epcot and MGM also lack in the shade department. Epcot's main entrance dumps you into a giant open space with no shade aside from the big marble stones sticking up out of the ground, and during extreme temperatures the entrance to MGM will have you ducking into shops just to avoid the heat or the cold. DAK has quite a bit of shade in some places but the environment of the attractions demand it.

    Excuse two is lack of imaginative atmosphere theming. To a certain extent the other parks have this as well. MGM has a bit more detail for it than DCA, but Epcot's architecture, beyond the geosphere and a few national pavillions, is not so hot either.
    All Disney parks could have been done better. Even Walt felt he could have designed DL better. He learned from DL and if he had lived, he would have made MK better than DL. Why do I know that? Because he tried to out do all his movies. He never wanted to repeat himself. As he said when people wanted him to do sequels to "The Three Little Pigs," You cannot top pigs with pigs!" The shade problem at Epcot could be corrected. It stemmed from having SO much land that the scale of the place was a little beyond human scale. They today could put in more shade.

    Quote Originally Posted by MickeyMania View Post
    DCA's biggest weakness is it's architecture and atmosphere, though. I actually like the hubcap fountain, but gigantic show buildings for both parks are now far more obvious than they were in the parking lot era. Can somebody please do SOMETHING about the large show buildings on either side of the entrance (Soarin and I forget what)?? I look at these big ugly beige buildings and the bland entrance and feel like I'm walking across the street to the county fair.
    On both sides of the entrance to DCA are shops near the Hubcap. A candy store near Hollywood back-lot and a toy-store on the other side near Sourin. I think the biggest weakness is that DCA does not take you to a different place or time. Epcot has all those wonderful international pavillions which make you feel you are in France or England or China. Nothing like that is at DCA. DMGMS has the street that takes the guest back to the golden age of Hollywood. One feels like one is there with the antique autos and art nouveau architecture. DCA has Hollywood back-lot that recreates the feeling of a junk pile that most studios have on their back-lot.

    BOTTOM LINE: If Epcot or something similar was built instead of DCA, I and many others would be singing its praises.
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  10. #55

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    Re: How Does DCA Really Compare To Other Disney Parks?

    Quote Originally Posted by MickeyMania View Post
    I think there's a twofold problem:

    1) DL is so good that any other Disney park would look bad sitting fifty feet away from it.

    This pretty much states itself. No matter what they would have built, it never would have been as impressive as DL and the DL hardcores would have a hard time accepting it as the twin to DL.

    2) A lot of hardcore DL folk just have never been to WDW

    Truth is, a lot of the faults of DCA are shared by every non-MK park at WDW. Not enough shade, for instance. Epcot and MGM also lack in the shade department. Epcot's main entrance dumps you into a giant open space with no shade aside from the big marble stones sticking up out of the ground, and during extreme temperatures the entrance to MGM will have you ducking into shops just to avoid the heat or the cold. DAK has quite a bit of shade in some places but the environment of the attractions demand it.

    Excuse two is lack of imaginative atmosphere theming. To a certain extent the other parks have this as well. MGM has a bit more detail for it than DCA, but Epcot's architecture, beyond the geosphere and a few national pavillions, is not so hot either.

    DCA's biggest weakness is it's architecture and atmosphere, though. I actually like the hubcap fountain, but gigantic show buildings for both parks are now far more obvious than they were in the parking lot era. Can somebody please do SOMETHING about the large show buildings on either side of the entrance (Soarin and I forget what)?? I look at these big ugly beige buildings and the bland entrance and feel like I'm walking across the street to the county fair.
    Something you did not mention is AK's entrance. First, outside the turnstiles really gets you in the mood for what is inside the park - it is a complete zoo first thing in the morning. What a confusing disaster of an experience getting into AK for rope drop (which we did twice). Then once you are inside you are hit with...nothing - except for a lot of greenery and a few small animal exhibits. You have to walk quite a ways to get a clear view of the Tree of Life and feel like you have really entered the park. DCA's entrance can be improved, but it is light years ahead of AK's.

    I liked the MGM Studios entrance, while I felt a bit funneled by Epcot's main entrance although it was not too bad.
    Last edited by HydroGuy; 08-28-2006 at 08:53 PM. Reason: typo

  11. #56

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    Re: How Does DCA Really Compare To Other Disney Parks?

    Quote Originally Posted by HydroGuy View Post
    This thread is not for or against DCA. I know this is a hot button topic around here. Those of you who are tired of discussing the DCA pros and cons may want to just skip this thread.

    I am not part of the DCA Haters or DCA Lovers Club and have no emotional stake in the answer to this question.
    Hmmm...despite your statement above, you seem to have a very stong emotional commitment to this question. I have never seen a member of the DCA Lovers Alliance put as much effort as you have in your PDA for DCA.

    It seems to me the things you find "Disney" are completely opposite of what I find "Disney." To sugest the World Showcase (by far the least commercial piece of the Disney Theme park empire) is somehow un-Disney and then defend DCA (by far the most comercial) suggests your concept of "Disney" is not the same as mine. I can't honestly take anything you say seriously. It seems like a thinly vailed attempt to promote a poorly-designed park which happens to appeal to your specific sensabilities. The fact of the matter is the public at large does not like DCA. Sorry, attendance does not lie.

  12. #57

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    Re: How Does DCA Really Compare To Other Disney Parks?

    It isn't a matter of how DCA compares with other Disney themeparks around the world, as much as it is a problem of DCA comparing with Disneyland Park.

    Being the little sister of Disneyland, you have a LOT to live up to, whether it's fair to expect it or not. The fact of the matter is is that DCA only performs as well as it does due to park hopper tickets, and the fact that it's right across from Disneyland.

    If California Adventure was placed as we know it in Long Beach, where WestCot was planned to be placed, it would have been struggling just as hard as Magic Mountain right now.

    People who defend DCA or compare it by numbers do not stop to realize that it's performance isn't based on it's popularity as much as it's based on it's relationship in terms of location and packaging with Walt's Original Magic Kingdom.

    DCA is a decent park, I give it that, but it has horribly underutilized areas, facilities, and themes. The Hollywood Pictures Backlot has two huge buildings calling out for attractions right now (WWTBAM-PI! and Hollywood & Dine), the San Francisco part of the park could house unique shopping experiences and become the New Orleans Square of DCA in terms of shopping experiences. The Pacific Wharf is a wasteland of empty kitchens. Paradise Pier is plagued by off-the-shelf attractions and poor themeing which neither impress or excite. Sure, there are winners in this park - the Tower of Terror is underrated, in my opinion. Soain' Over California is a truly classic Disney attraction, so good it was cloned at WDW and is said to be making a move to WDSP as well. And the Golden State/Grizzly Peak Recreation Area is wonderfully themed. But DCA buckles under the pressure of Disneyland, which is so rich in themeing in every area and corner (except for maybe Tomorrowland).

    When you have a park like Disneyland, you have to be able to create a park that can stand up next to it and offer a worthwhile experience. From my understanding, Disney's Animal Kingdom isn't particularly the most frequented WDW park either, probably because it lacks enough things to do in a whole day compared to the MK or Epcot. And MGM lucks out because everybody is fascinated with Hollywood, and MGM presents that stereotypical image of Hollywood that everybody is so in love with.


    So does DCA compare well with other U.S. Disney theme parks? Sure. Does it compare well with Disneyland Park. No. And there inlies the problem.




    Quote Originally Posted by TDR_Fan View Post
    I"m afraid I disagree with that comment. I'm one of the few that prefer DCA's and for many reasons too. The biggest one is that I absolutely hate the 5th dimension room. It's cheesy, boring, and pointless in my opinion. It doesn't add anything to the ride at all, and felt it was just thrown in for the sake of an extra show scene. I'd take the mirror effect over that any day

    The second major reason is the drop profile. Don't get me wrong....I love the random drop sequence, but the major reason I don't enjoy it is that it barely gives you any airtime like DCA's does anymore. It seems to only make small ascents and descents with the occasional full drop.

    With that in mind, MGM's Tower of Terror does have some advantages to it like the beautiful garden queue outdoors. I also love their show building, nowhere near as elaborate as Tokyo DisneySea's, but better than what DCA has now.
    I agree. When I rode the TOT at MGM I felt like the use of the shattering window, and other title sequence images from the Twilight Zone we grossly mis-used. We KNOW that this is the Twilight Zone - we already saw the title sequence in the library. We hear Rod Serling's voice. We KNOW that we're in the Twilight Zone. I felt like the Imagineers just kept throwing Twilight Zone references at us just for the hell of it without concern to the overall story and experience. Like they were using Twlight Zone images just for the sake of using them, not because they were adding to the experience. I think the show scenes at DCA are very much better planned and executed. The mirror scene is a perfect replacement for the 5th Demension room, and it gets guests involved in the ride. The 5th demension room is pointless in that all it is is a big room with title sequence images around you. Why? How is that adding to the story?? And the hallway sequence with the 1939 guests dropping in their elevator is LIGHTYEARS better than the shattering window at the end of the hallway at the MGM Tower. At DCA, the story just "works" far, far better than it does at MGM, in my opinion. [/off topic]
    Last edited by MasterGracey; 08-28-2006 at 10:49 PM.

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  13. #58

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    Re: How Does DCA Really Compare To Other Disney Parks?

    Quote Originally Posted by TDR_Fan View Post
    Not Tokyo DisneySea. That park definitely matches, if not surpasses Tokyo Disneyland in my opinion.
    Tokyo Disneysea would be snubbed if put across from DL. Not just because it shares DL's hub/lands layout a little too closely for comfort, but also because it's heavy on small-potato attractions that exist to add atmosphere or just give people something to do (some but not all examples include: Gondolas, Aquatopia, the stuff in Mermaid's Lagoon, and more.) It has been lacking massive "let's do that AGAIN" attractions that DL's regular base of repeat-to-constant visitors enjoy, which is part of the reason why all expansion has been going into big thrill rides.

    TOT and Journey are pretty much the only things in DisneySea that would really click with DL's base guest profile, and one of those two things is more or less there already.

  14. #59

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    Re: How Does DCA Really Compare To Other Disney Parks?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Eggz View Post
    Hmmm...despite your statement above, you seem to have a very stong emotional commitment to this question. I have never seen a member of the DCA Lovers Alliance put as much effort as you have in your PDA for DCA.
    I agree I have developed a position on DCA based on recent experience. But it is not because I just visited DCA and said "wow, this is great". My position in this thread is trying to make honest comparisons to other Disney parks, especially the WDW parks.

    Personally, I would rather focus on the positives of all of the DLR and WDW parks. When I see someone make some comment about a DCA deficiency, I have to stop, put on my "negative thinking hat", and think "is there a similar (or worse) deficiency at the WDW parks?" When I think there is one, I point it out. Then I take off my "negative hat" because I do not like the negative energy it carries. I do not enjoy criticizing aspects of the WDW parks, because I thought they were all fun in different ways.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Eggz View Post
    It seems to me the things you find "Disney" are completely opposite of what I find "Disney." To sugest the World Showcase (by far the least commercial piece of the Disney Theme park empire) is somehow un-Disney and then defend DCA (by far the most comercial) suggests your concept of "Disney" is not the same as mine.
    Probably so. I tried very hard to put all the comments about Epcot into "this was my personal opinion based on a couple of days at Epcot", and my opinion is that Epcot was a neat place but I did not feel very much Disney connection there. Some others obviously do. Like you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Eggz View Post
    I can't honestly take anything you say seriously. It seems like a thinly vailed attempt to promote a poorly-designed park which happens to appeal to your specific sensabilities. The fact of the matter is the public at large does not like DCA. Sorry, attendance does not lie.
    Wow, why do some folks feel it necessary to resort to personal attacks and imputed motives when discussing this subject? In typical human discourse people who use personal attacks often feel it is necessary because they are afraid their arguments are weak.

  15. #60

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    Re: How Does DCA Really Compare To Other Disney Parks?

    Quote Originally Posted by MasterGracey View Post
    It isn't a matter of how DCA compares with other Disney themeparks around the world, as much as it is a problem of DCA comparing with Disneyland Park.

    ...

    So does DCA compare well with other U.S. Disney theme parks? Sure. Does it compare well with Disneyland Park. No. And there inlies the problem.
    I agree.

    DL people who read forums like this and have not been to the WDW parks could all too easily buy into the "DCA is not a true Disney park" complaints, as if the four WDW parks are all far above it. My purpose here was to address this based on recent experience.

    If we can get past this, we can focus on your points above and what can be done about it.

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