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  1. #46

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    Re: Haunted Mansion Holiday: The problem with Jack Skellington

    Quote Originally Posted by MasterGracey View Post
    Agreed.

    However, I do think that the outside overlay of the Mansion is probably the only good thing about the overlay. Its done well - the candles at night look absolutely magical and tells us something is certainly different about the Mansion. And Jack's sleigh on the roof explains how Jack got here and what he's doing. And the removal of the scarols this year in favor of Paris' music box audio was a step in the right direction. What certainly needs to go, however, is the "Haunted Mansion Holiday" banner/arch over the Mansion's gates, and the Jack Skellington still figure with his spinning snowflake.
    Those were exactly the decorations to which I was referring, but I'll add the clock. While it looks great, the show element does not fit into the mansion's story nor Frontierland's story.

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  2. #47

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    Re: Haunted Mansion Holiday: The problem with Jack Skellington

    Quote Originally Posted by PragmaticIdealist View Post
    Those were exactly the decorations to which I was referring, but I'll add the clock. While it looks great, the show element does not fit into the mansion's story nor Frontierland's story.

    Disneyland's success is dependent on The Magic Kingdom's ability to create believable imaginary worlds.
    I understand what you're saying, but Jack's sleigh does create the layer of believability as to how he arrived and for what purpose. The real problem here is the mixing of animated characters in a setting which is supposed to mirror a real place, not a place in an animated film.

    But if we are to ignore that inconsistancy in theming in regard to real world vs animated world, the sleigh does help tell the story of the Mansion... or at least the story of the Mansion during the holidays...

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  3. #48

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    Re: Haunted Mansion Holiday: The problem with Jack Skellington

    The basic fact of HMH is that it all hits you at once with no climatic buildup so basically it begins to become boring because you always know something is going to be in the next scene!
    Friend walks into line of The Many Adventures of Winnie the Pooh-
    "Come on, Let's go see Country Bear- .......Oh."
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  4. #49

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    Re: Haunted Mansion Holiday: The problem with Jack Skellington

    I don't even go to HMH anymore. I can't say the line "no doors and no windows". So, what's the use?

    No, really.


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  5. #50

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    Re: Haunted Mansion Holiday: The problem with Jack Skellington

    I love HMH, but every time I go on it it makes me miss the original even more.

  6. #51

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    Re: Haunted Mansion Holiday: The problem with Jack Skellington

    True some effects seem tacky but theres a certain leeway that has to be given to the Imagineers seeing as its a temporary overlay. The large and complicated and immersive effects just arnt plausible on something thats only there for 4 months a year. Besides if they try to do one effect they might have to tweak an older effect that the newer one is replacing to pull it off. As for the whole unmeshing thing, its an invasion. The mansion is just a victim, its not supposed to mesh exactly and make complete sense. Hell the original mansion doesnt even make complete sense with itself.

  7. #52

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    Wink Re: Haunted Mansion Holiday: The problem with Jack Skellington

    I enjoy both THM & HMH equally myself. As a Southern California native, it's a nice option to see the mansion in both versions twice a year or more.

    Regardsarama,

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  8. #53

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    Re: Haunted Mansion Holiday: The problem with Jack Skellington

    Quote Originally Posted by MasterGracey View Post
    I'm not convinced that in order to get Jack Skellington's story across, we need to be subjected to obnoxiousness throughout the Mansion.

    The incredibly obnoxious singing flowers are unnecessary. The cheap painted plywood flats are unnecessary. The overuse of black lights lighting up the Mansion are unnecessary.

    Jack's vision can be possible in the Mansion without the use of tackyness and on-the-cheap.

    Sure, Jack's Christmas in the film was tacky. But painted 2D plywood flats simply do not mix well in the 3-demensional realm of the Mansion. There are different kinds of tacky - and painted plywood flats, excessive black lights, and obnoxious singing are the wrong kind of tacky.




    Thank you!




    Agreed.

    However, I do think that the outside overlay of the Mansion is probably the only good thing about the overlay. Its done well - the candles at night look absolutely magical and tells us something is certainly different about the Mansion. And Jack's sleigh on the roof explains how Jack got here and what he's doing. And the removal of the scarols this year in favor of Paris' music box audio was a step in the right direction. What certainly needs to go, however, is the "Haunted Mansion Holiday" banner/arch over the Mansion's gates, and the Jack Skellington still figure with his spinning snowflake.

    My take on the HMH:

    This is the best thing to come out of the Pressler/Harriss period. Most
    everything they touched, should be torched, BUT this is one of only
    two or three thing I would thank them for.

    Obviously, even with the "temporary" Jack Holiday Makeover of the Mansion, most every thing that was there before, is still there. Jack
    has added many things, as Monorail Man mentioned alluded too, during
    the Christmas season, some things are different during the Holidays, so
    we do get a different Holiday speil on our journey in the Mansion, we
    get decorations that aren't there during the rest of the year ~ so I
    do think it's a good thing. MG did a detailed list of the things that get his goat, and there are a couple of things that one may question. BUT
    the vast majority of the HMH celebration is very much a nice temporary
    addition/change for this time of year.


    Outside the Mansion: Jack O'lanterns, Spiderweb candelabras, Scarecrow with Jack O'lantern head, decorations at the entry gate, all done very well. Looks Great for October, too.

    Entry Foyer: Garland, and of course this is where the holiday speil begins, great voice work by Cory, and guides you through the entire attraction very much in the style of the original. And just to add, I preferred the 1st year recording of music to the current HMH that has been heard since.

    Stretching Room: The Stained Glass breaking, turning into mouths of monsters with jagged edge teeth, and eyes lighting up above each of
    the Stained glass pictures, as the narrator talks about each of the portraits. Giant Jack head is ok, and doesn't appear to be a cardboard cutout.

    Portrait Hallway: Snow outside instead of rain, neat change. Cardboard cutout outside window actually moves back and forth, so that is actually
    a step ahead of most of the figure in Pooh, so that was certainly a slurge
    by Pressler and Harriss. Changing Portraits are done well and keep Jack's Holiday theme. Like the holiday Spider webs in front of the two busts at the end of the hallway. (don't understand criticism of this by some , should have spiderwebs there in the 1st place if it's a Haunted Mansion)

    Doom Buggy Load Area: Cardboard Cutouts, with movement, granted, this
    is the most tacky and cheapest looking part of the HMH. But this wouldn't be such problem if there would actually BE something to decorate in the area, in the 1st place. This area doesn't have ANYTHING the rest of the year.

    Corridor of Doors: ABSOLUTELY LOVE the 3 different areas of the Maneating Plants, seem perfect in the "floral" arrangement next to the casket. In fact, I would consider That one idea shear genius. Of course the first year they were singing "Deck the Halls"! Gotta love that kind of humor. Then the Wreath shows up immediately above you! In very similar way that the trees are over you as you back down into the graveyard, later in the attraction. In fact this area inspired me to make my own
    Maneating wreath above my front door at Halloween! Have to tell you that the 2nd year of the HMH, I saw another guest in New Orleans Square with a Man Eating Plant Puppet, in the exact style/color as the
    ones in the HMH. I asked where he got that, hoping that they would be for sale in a nearby shop, he told me that he made it himself, as he was
    in the business of creating various props.

    Madame Leota: The floating cards are ok. Although I would prefer the
    newer floating ball effect that was added a year ago.

    Ballroom: kudos!!!! extremely well done. Different Gingerbread House each year, and the one this year is the best, with moving features, and the monster trying to break out of the house! Like how Zero above the table. Only time of the year that library is "visible", tree looks absolutely terrific with jack o'lanterns Spiders going up and down WOW! and I have no problem with the ghosts dancing through the tree, it looks Great!

    Attic: Giant Snake looks ok, Santa Jacks Good and Bad list, Wish they
    would reimagineer this area now that they have added new effects, Of course, that would involve changing the speil for this area, but I'm sure they could come up with something good with what has been added.

    Graveyard: Again, another gigantic success!, Love the Graveyard holiday music, and so glad they added Jack's hill, Jack O'lanterns lighting up to the music, love the singing Jack O'lanterns for this time of year. The Bonedeer even make an appearance !!!!!YAYYYYYY!!!!!!! Even the the Giant angels help balance out the hill on the other side! Very creative touch. Ooogie Boogie is ok at the end, at least it's an audio animatronic, and the lucky few still get Lock Shock and Barrel in teh Mirrors.

    Exit: Little Sally is a nice ending, and really good that the upgraded the ending last year, with Jack and the bonedeer flying over the moon.

  9. #54

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    Re: Haunted Mansion Holiday: The problem with Jack Skellington

    Quote Originally Posted by ecdlanddude View Post
    I agree with Master Gracey except... I think HMH should be gone forever. I hate visiting in Christmas/Halloween and not being able to ride the classic. If Disneyland wants to have a NBC ride, then build one. Stop renting the mansion out for 3 months every year. I'm not saying this because I don't like NBC, I really do... I just think the Mansion is too great of a ride to shut down 5 months every year.

    Okay, That's not a bad idea.. And I agree with it, However..

    1. Where are they going to put it? If not Disneyland, Where? The Tower of Terror? How is that going to go in sync with the elevator?

    2. Disney wouldn't want to spend that much on a new building for a NBC ride unless it would draw guests like a magnet.

    3. None of the Ghost Host's Lines would work. A lot of things would be wasted that are used on Haunted mansion props.

    Although I like your idea, and I totally agree. Disney isn't gonna do it. Unless a majority (And when I mean majority, MILLIONS.) stands out and pushes them too.

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  10. #55

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    Re: Haunted Mansion Holiday: The problem with Jack Skellington

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo! View Post
    Okay, That's not a bad idea.. And I agree with it, However..

    1. Where are they going to put it? If not Disneyland, Where? The Tower of Terror? How is that going to go in sync with the elevator?

    2. Disney wouldn't want to spend that much on a new building for a NBC ride unless it would draw guests like a magnet.

    3. None of the Ghost Host's Lines would work. A lot of things would be wasted that are used on Haunted mansion props.

    Although I like your idea, and I totally agree. Disney isn't gonna do it. Unless a majority (And when I mean majority, MILLIONS.) stands out and pushes them too.
    Who said that it had to be a carbon copy of what we already have, or remain as an overlay? It could have it's own, full-out dark ride that can stand on it's own.

    And it would be popular. You all seem to be ignoring how popular HMH is...it's not because of the Haunted Mansion on it's own with a sprinkle of Jack Skellington. It's popular on the basis of Nightmare Before Christmas. The NBC merch is selling all year round, so why wouldn't it's own attraction, too? The movie is a huge pop icon.

  11. #56

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    Re: Haunted Mansion Holiday: The problem with Jack Skellington

    I still like HMH... they're supposed to be different...

    "You're not thinking fourth dimensionally!" -Back to the Future

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  12. #57

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    Re: Haunted Mansion Holiday: The problem with Jack Skellington

    Personally, I think MasterGracy needs to get a life.
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  13. #58

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    Re: Haunted Mansion Holiday: The problem with Jack Skellington

    Quote Originally Posted by pineapplewhipaddict View Post
    Who said that it had to be a carbon copy of what we already have, or remain as an overlay? It could have it's own, full-out dark ride that can stand on it's own.

    And it would be popular. You all seem to be ignoring how popular HMH is...it's not because of the Haunted Mansion on it's own with a sprinkle of Jack Skellington. It's popular on the basis of Nightmare Before Christmas. The NBC merch is selling all year round, so why wouldn't it's own attraction, too? The movie is a huge pop icon.

    Part of the reason I like the Jack makeover of the Haunted Mansion is
    because it's just "decorated for Christmas". So it draws both HM fans
    and Nightmare fans. (Quite frankly, I'm not a Nightmare fan, but I LOVE
    HMH) I like that it's not a Nightmare only attraction. In fact, as far as I'm concerned, it could just as well be the Addams family that decorated the Mansion. it's doubtful that a Nightmare attraction by itself would have the same drawing power.

  14. #59

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    Re: Haunted Mansion Holiday: The problem with Jack Skellington

    Quote Originally Posted by phruby View Post
    Personally, I think MasterGracy needs to get a life.
    I'd have to back Master Gracey on this one. (And I highly suspect he DOES have a life.) The NBC stuff is SOOOOOO cheaply done compared to the original. It really takes an E ticket attraction and lowers it to...um right around an A (which for you youngsters isn't all that great. It puts it way up there with the fire engine.)

    I really don't see how taking some cardboard and painting it in lurid, bright, neon colors ADDS anything to this classic attraction. The stretching portaits as well as those in the hallway are "blech" at best. The attic is a waste with nothing to look at, and the graveyard is "meh".

    Ok..I like the graveyard, but that's it. Everything else can go.

    I really didn't see the point when they first started this, and for the life of me, I don't see the point today.

    Just sayin.

  15. #60

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    Re: Haunted Mansion Holiday: The problem with Jack Skellington

    Quote Originally Posted by Druggas View Post
    I don't even go to HMH anymore. I can't say the line "no doors and no windows". So, what's the use?

    No, really.

    No offense, but I hope I never ride when you do! I don't like when other guests ruin my experience of just enjoying the ride. Whether it's Haunted Mansion or Haunted Mansion Holiday.


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