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  1. #1

    • Resident Ghost
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    Why Can't Change Be A Good Thing?

    It seems on these forums, you want change to happen to Disneyland, yet when a change occurs, you feel it's too much, and pretty bad. Not everyone here does it, but many people do.

    First, lets go back to Tom Sawyer Island's refurb. Disney was just trying to get people to a part of the park that not many went to anymore. When it was written that a pirates overlay was going to occur, many went mad over it. What many failed to realize was that although they had a connection to TSI, kids these days aren't big into Westerns like adults were when they were kids. This is a new era!

    Second, lets look at that new Star Tours rumor. For some reason, people aren't digging 3-D. Whats ironic, is people are also saying they want tomorrowland to be more futuristic. Now, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't 3-D viewing THE FUTURE?

    My reasoning for why no one likes the changes? Because...well, they're changes. You ask for change, yet you only want change to things that aren't a childhood memory. Even when pirates was updated, some people weren't happy.

    Now, people got their subs back, but now they want the people mover back. Well, it's probably never going to happen, but because it was a part of the past people remember, they want it back, whether Disney can do it or not.

    What's my point? You have to let go of the idea that the Disneyland you remember will be staying forever. It won't. Changes WILL happen. Some for worse, some for better. Just, when these changes DO occur, don't bash them just because they got rid of something that was from your childhood which wasn't either popular or logical anymore!

    Just my $0.02

  2. #2

    • враг народа
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    Re: Why Can't Change Be A Good Thing?

    Once again the opposition to changes and the love of nostalgia is entirely missed. The motivation is not just memories. The continued insinuation of this belief is simply a falsehood that refuses to die. Change should be warranted.

    I have two major criteria for change: experience and theme.

    Experience is the actual physical representation of the show. It extends from ride vehicles to attraction type. Water rides, roller coasters, and so on an so forth. For a change to be positive, this experience must at least be of an equal quality.

    Theme is the coheesive bond of attractions. The story elements that allow an experience to fit well with its surroundings. Theme strives to create an apparently seamless environment.


    As to Tom Sawyer Island, the inclusion of pirates did not fix the island. Pirate flags everywhere would have been a dud. A new, improved experience was required. I believe experience is what people go for, and theme is what makes the experience work.

  3. #3

    • I'm not really here
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    Re: Why Can't Change Be A Good Thing?

    I am all for change. But I'm with the previous poster, change must have a reason. It can't just be for money. It must be quality of the utmost as well. It can't simply be mindless or just to fill a void.

    Our revels now are ended. These our actors, As I foretold you, were all spirits and Are melted into air, into thin air: And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, The cloud-capp'd towers, the gorgeous palaces, The solemn temples, the great globe itself, Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff As dreams are made on, and our little life Is rounded with a sleep. mycroft16 on Twitter

  4. #4

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    Re: Why Can't Change Be A Good Thing?

    True, changes should be thought out, but, I mean, the pirates island theme wasn't too bad considering westerns are pretty scarce now. And, look at Finding Nemo...yea, it brought back the subs, but wasn't that just for money too?

  5. #5

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    Re: Why Can't Change Be A Good Thing?

    It just makes me wonder how people responded to the changes in the 60's and 70's. Changes like when the older areas were torn down to create new things like BTMRR.

  6. #6

    • a wind to shake the stars
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    Re: Why Can't Change Be A Good Thing?

    Yeah, I also have noticed the horrible aversion to change that plagues Disney message boards. Of course it's justified sometimes but for the most part it seems like any changes of any magnitude whatsoever will spawn "calls to arms" and online petitions and other silly things like that.

    Quote Originally Posted by mycroft16 View Post
    It can't just be for money.
    I hate to break it to you but Disney is a corporation and everything they do is for money.

  7. #7

    • Minion
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    Re: Why Can't Change Be A Good Thing?

    Change is a problem because when the Disney corporation changes things, they usually make them worse. I don't trust the Disney corporation, because during Eisner's era they had no regard for history, intergrity, quality, what fans want, and actually plussing an experience. They wanted to do whatever they could to bring the general public in, for the cheapest amount of money possible. If Walt was behind the changes, I would trust him, but the Disney corporation needs to regain my trust.

    I am all for additions, just be extremely careful when you touch the classics. For example, the captain of the original POTC ride is extremely iconic and replacing him with Barbossa was blasphemy. Also the PC changes to POTC were blasphemy.

  8. #8

    • "I Break Things"
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    Re: Why Can't Change Be A Good Thing?

    I got a real shock when I posted about developing Big Thunder Trail. People who have posted over and over for better rides, baulked at the thought of using this undeveloped area. The park is crowded, this isn't Florida, so you are left with 2 options, find space or tear something out and make space. People have a hard time with either choice but EVERYONE will tell you they would love to see another attraction in ....land!

    I do agree that the change must be made for the best. While it doesn't happen often, Disney does make mistakes. Rocket Rods, Light Magic, and parts of DCA are proof of the "let's just put something there" mentality. Good examples of change were the additions added to Jungle and the holiday makeovers.
    "Happiness is a Low Water Level"


    "Creating magical memories and making Managers cry since 1955!"


  9. #9

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    Re: Why Can't Change Be A Good Thing?

    GOOD CHANGE

    Example: If they removed Country Bears and installed Pooh's Hunny Hunt instead of the cheap dark ride they have there now, I would have been thrilled.

    My problem with TSI wasn't that it was being changed. I thought something had to be done with the island, but I was thinking more like an upgrade of the whole river, not some cheap pirates installation.

    Quote Originally Posted by techskip View Post
    I got a real shock when I posted about developing Big Thunder Trail. People who have posted over and over for better rides, baulked at the thought of using this undeveloped area.
    I don't know they would.

    There is tons of undeveloped space towards the back of RoA, the Festival Arena, and Big Thunder Ranch. It was the proposed site for Discovery Bay and it would have added some much needed flavor to the area while still being low key.

    What do they have there back now? Some rusty Indians telling stories? Move 'em and make way for Discovery Bay. Now that's some good change.

  10. #10

    • Rock Star Minion
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    Re: Why Can't Change Be A Good Thing?

    Change can be a good thing. It's not always a good thing. Each change should be analyzed as to whether it is a good change or a bad change.

    Next question.
    "Here You Leave the World of California Today and Enter the World of, um, er, California Today."

  11. #11

    • Progressive Disneylander
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    Re: Why Can't Change Be A Good Thing?

    I think change in Disneyland is a delicate balancing act -- or should be.

    I'm pro-change in Disneyland to an extent, however I also have my do-not-touch elements of the park. But I do believe that DL simply can't remain as-is or it will get boring.

    Most of the recent DL changes have been good ones, IMO. The Tom Sawyer's Island change was a great decision. The swap out of the Country Bears for Pooh was also an upgrade.

    Of course, not everyone is going to agree, but usually the attendance to a particular attraction has a lot to do with what becomes of them.

    Heck, I'm sure there are a few folks who even love Golden Dreams, but the odds are not good that it will be in DCA's long-term plans because hardly anyone goes in anymore.

    The least popular attractions in either park are often my least favorite as well. In those cases, I am usually up for either a re-theming, a revamping or just getting rid of those attractions altogether.

  12. #12

    • Minion
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    Re: Why Can't Change Be A Good Thing?

    I know. Why can't it? A sad political question...

    Change could be a good thing, but certainly not for its own sake - - only children and Eastern spiritualists see all change as progressive as they have been taught that in school.

    Good change is good - bad change is bad, and we have had too much of the latter to trust blindly.

    The evidence:

    Light Magic
    Tomorrowland 98
    Rocket Rods
    Catpoo paint
    Empty Sub Lagoon
    Observatron
    Murals
    Winnie-the-Pooh
    DCA
    No Skyway
    No Cascade Peak
    No Pirate Ship
    No Can-Can Girls
    No Hula Girls
    Tarzan Treehouse
    Honey
    Innoventions
    no Peoplemover
    Swamp instead of Motor Boats
    PC pirates
    Depp-ity doo
    etc.

  13. #13

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    Re: Why Can't Change Be A Good Thing?

    Quote Originally Posted by sediment View Post
    Change can be a good thing. It's not always a good thing. Each change should be analyzed as to whether it is a good change or a bad change.

    Next question.
    Not all changes are for the best, but change itself is good. It's a far better thing if Disneyland tries something new and fails, than never try to change at all.

  14. #14

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    Re: Why Can't Change Be A Good Thing?

    Quote Originally Posted by merlinjones View Post
    only children and Eastern spiritualists see all change as progressive as they have been taught that in school.
    Children are the future. So is change.

  15. #15

    • Minion
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    Re: Why Can't Change Be A Good Thing?

    >>It's a far better thing if Disneyland tries something new and fails, than never try to change at all.<<

    No, Tomorrowland 98 alone proves you wrong here.

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