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  1. #1

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    Do you want ground pepper's ghost with that salad?

    Hello all,
    I was just thinking about having a new restuarant somewhere in DL or maybe near Tower of Terror where they use the Pepper's Ghost trick like they do inside the HM.
    They could have a wall, made of a big mirror and next to the mirror would be various tables up next to it. So picture a table for four, but the fourth seat is behind the mirror. In that fourth seat would be a ghost sitting there as part of your dinner party. Behind the two-way mirror, everything (tables, plants, etc. would have to be in the exact "mirror" position as that of the "real" world where the guests would sit. The Ghost would sit there eating, looking at a paper, etc. What are your thoughts? I hope I explained it well enough.
    -Silent Sentinel of the Deep-


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  2. #2

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    Re: Do you want ground pepper's ghost with that salad?

    Wow...talk about your armchair Imagineering. Cute idea, but could the effect honestly work and be realistic. I mean, surely you're gonna realize there's a mirror next to you and not more restuarant...

  3. #3

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    Re: Do you want ground pepper's ghost with that salad?

    If it is done right, people might not realize there is a mirror, but it would have to be done in a way so that people won't walk
    into the mirror.
    -Silent Sentinel of the Deep-


    We've enjoyed having you aboard on this
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    our last frontier on the planet Earth.







  4. #4

    • SM - 14 TIMES! DLAND!!!
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    Re: Do you want ground pepper's ghost with that salad?

    i think it sounds like a cool and interesting idea.
    "I only hope that we don't lose sight of one thing - that it was all started by a mouse."

    ¡Quédese sentó por favor!

  5. #5

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    Re: Do you want ground pepper's ghost with that salad?

    You have to remember that one of the keys to Pepper's Ghost being successfully implemented is lighting, so that would have to be carefully controlled. Then too, positioning of the people as well. When you ride out the end of HM you are directly facing towards the mirror with the image... shift to the side, or angle, and it loses the impact, i.e. it just is not as convincing, and if you are going to do something like that, it needs to be done right. Ditto the ballroom scene. In the HM they have full control with the Omnimovers... most likely not so in a restaurant. Still, I applaud the creative idea... it could be a starting point for something along those lines. That's how great things happen...start with an idea, turn it over, expand it, refine it. Great concept!
    Always remember the Disney Magic!

  6. #6

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    Re: Do you want ground pepper's ghost with that salad?

    Quote Originally Posted by DisneysMagic
    You have to remember that one of the keys to Pepper's Ghost being successfully implemented is lighting, so that would have to be carefully controlled. Then too, positioning of the people as well. When you ride out the end of HM you are directly facing towards the mirror with the image... shift to the side, or angle, and it loses the impact, i.e. it just is not as convincing, and if you are going to do something like that, it needs to be done right. Ditto the ballroom scene. In the HM they have full control with the Omnimovers... most likely not so in a restaurant. Still, I applaud the creative idea... it could be a starting point for something along those lines. That's how great things happen...start with an idea, turn it over, expand it, refine it. Great concept!
    I was thinking while riding the omnimovers at the end the ghosts are directly in front of you, but in the ballroom they are below you and you see them from the begining of the set to the end. I don't know if it would work having a ghost sitting right at your table, being that close?
    I was originally thinking that there would be two restaurants (one in DL and the other in WDW where a guest at each respective restaurant would be a "ghost" at the other restaurant, but I don't know if that would work with the needed lighting effect.
    It reminds me of that song, at Epcot, start with a Spark....Imagination.... Figment...
    -Silent Sentinel of the Deep-


    We've enjoyed having you aboard on this
    adventerous voyage through Liquidspace...
    our last frontier on the planet Earth.







  7. #7

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    Re: Do you want ground pepper's ghost with that salad?

    The way it's done at the end with the mirrors is that there are solid "ghosts" riding along on poles on a track, positioned such that as the ominimovers travel along on our side of the mirrors, they're moving along exactly the same distance away on the other side of the mirrors. They are lit with just the right amount of light such that what you see looking in the mirror appears to be a ghost, when in actuality, the ghost is solid and YOUR image is the one that's semi-see-through.

    Anyway, you could do the restaurant thing by having a huge wall of two-way mirror. That is, semi-reflective on our side, and with dim but precise lighting on their side. The ghosts would occupy the one spot at their table that corresponds with the empty spot at your own table. If lit properly, it would work just like the hitchhiking ghost effect does, with no bad angles.

    This method of creating a ghost is different than the "pepper's ghost" effect, which relies on a partial reflection of a ghost in a window overlaid on solid surfaces. Instead, this is a solid ghost behind a semi-transmissive mirror such that your reflection is overlaid on the solid ghost.

    Anyway, I think it's a really cool idea. They could even have the ghost try to taste your dinner and interact with you when you got up to leave.
    "Say, uh, ever hear of the devil's paint pots? Real mystery of the desert. Bubblin' pots of mud in all kinds of colors."

  8. #8

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    Re: Do you want ground pepper's ghost with that salad?

    Congratulations for having the best-titled post in recent memory. I had no idea what it meant, but I was absolutely compelled to click and find out.

    Well done!


  9. #9

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    Re: Do you want ground pepper's ghost with that salad?

    That sounds like a blast!

    Send your resume to Imagineering ASAP!

  10. #10

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    Re: Do you want ground pepper's ghost with that salad?

    I would SO eat at a place like this... I think it would be totally possible to do. Just like was said before it would need some tweaking here and there to fully work, but I don't see why it can't. I say bring it on!

    Put it in DCA and say the Ghosts from the Haunted Mansion are/were on vacation and put them in tank tops, shorts... typical vacation wear... heheh.
    Disneyland is the right of all sentient beings.


  11. #11

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    Re: Do you want ground pepper's ghost with that salad?

    I love the idea. Keep in mind that the hitchhiking ghost effect is different from the ballroom effect, which is a true Pepper's Ghost trick. The Pepper's Ghost effect would work marvelously in a restaurant, except the ghosts would have to be on an upper or lower level, as the ballroom is in HM. If it were done this way, guests could stand anywhere they wanted without ruining the effect.

    I can imagine the guests (in their corruptible mortal state) dining on an upper level, looking down at the ghosts dining on a terrace below. The ghosts would look up from their newspapers, shout friendly greetings to the living visitors, and return to their etherial foodstuffs. Boy, that would be quite a restaurant. There's room back behind NOS...

  12. #12

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    Re: Do you want ground pepper's ghost with that salad?

    What if you left it looking just like a mirror, then had one or two AA's that "walk around", which can only be seen by looking in what you "know" to be a mirror?

    (eg: looks like there's someone behind you if you're in the seat facing the "mirror", but you turn around an obviously no one is there)

    Unusually and exceedingly peculiar and altogether quite impossible to describe...



  13. #13

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    Re: Do you want ground pepper's ghost with that salad?

    Quote Originally Posted by Morrigoon
    What if you left it looking just like a mirror, then had one or two AA's that "walk around", which can only be seen by looking in what you "know" to be a mirror?
    Exactly. This is how the hitchhiking ghost effect is done. It looks like a mirror, but it lets through the image of whatever is lit up behind it. Only the ghosts would be lit up; everything else would be left dark. The effect is enhanced in the HM by a layer of greenish gel between the "ghosts" and the two-way mirror. This darkens things up a bit, makes it look ghoulish, and downplays any other reflected light bouncing off non-ghost stuff.
    "Say, uh, ever hear of the devil's paint pots? Real mystery of the desert. Bubblin' pots of mud in all kinds of colors."

  14. #14

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    Re: Do you want ground pepper's ghost with that salad?

    That's an excellent idea. The only problem is: what if your reflection (or anything else's reflection) appears in front of the animatronic? That would ruin the effect because you'd see through your own reflection to the ghost behind. So this idea wouldn't really work; the logistics would be too difficult to manage.

    Unfortunately, I think a true Pepper's Ghost effect would be the only way to do this, and that requires the ghosts to be above or below you.

    Unless if we find a revolutionary way to project 3D images into real space... Any ideas?

  15. #15

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    Re: Do you want ground pepper's ghost with that salad?

    They could get really clever and have the lighting on the solid ghost react to things that move around in "real" space.

    For instance, if someone walks around in front of the ghost, the light projected on the ghost would be shadowed in the shape of the person walking around in front. This wouldn't be that difficult to do: a video camera captures the image of the object passing in the way, the image is passed through a processor to produce a simple silhouette or mask, and this image is passed to a video projector that simply projects white light on the ghost except where the mask image falls.

    On the other hand... people sitting in the middle of one of the ominmover seats end up with a ghost sitting "inside" them and it still looks real enough, so it'd probably be okay without the sophisticated shadow scheme.

    Anything's possible at Disneyland.
    "Say, uh, ever hear of the devil's paint pots? Real mystery of the desert. Bubblin' pots of mud in all kinds of colors."

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