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  1. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by MiceMan
    I honestly think that waiting in line is part of the point of Disneyland. I realize that it may make it difficult to get to some rides but Disneyland lived for at least 40 years without it and really should go back to the way it was. People are just too darn impatient.
    yes, they are and most peole love fast pass...so I thnk it will stay. I have never liked the lines at DL. When I was a teenager we would never wait in them. We would just hang out until it got dark and the lines got shorter. My child, who was raised on fastpass, does not like to get in line when it's 15 to 20 min. I don't know if it's impatience or just being used to the way things are now.

  2. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by fearsnda
    I agree, people are way too impatient. The line is also part of the fun, the anticipation... you also get more out of the story as is the case with roger rabbit and indiana jones.
    Whats so fun? Waiting in line for an hour or more just for a 5-10 minute ride.It's soo cold inside Indy. The less time I spend in line, the more time I have for other attractions.



  3. #33

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    like I said just keep it to were it's most convienent and needed

    one per land would be a good rule, basicaly they need enough that you can be waiting in line and eating a nice lunch or dinner at the same time

    or maybe while your waiting in line for Space you could be going on Star Tours or HISTA

  4. #34

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    I personally love fastpass and have gotten it down to a science! It's espeically nice to have a fastpass for a ride or two while you're eating so you don't feel like you're wasting as much time.

  5. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by MiceMan
    I honestly think that waiting in line is part of the point of Disneyland. I realize that it may make it difficult to get to some rides but Disneyland lived for at least 40 years without it and really should go back to the way it was. People are just too darn impatient.
    I don't like waiting in line at all, but that isn't because I'm impatient, it's because I've been to the park so many times, that I know how the story is for each attraction. Indy and Roger Rabbit have great queues, but after you've been through them a few dozen times, they just seem unfortunate!

  6. #36

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    I love fastpass because the very rare vacations that I finally get to go to DL, I can do pretty close to every ride in one day. And I love how I can spend time shopping and looking around instead of waiting in line, previous to FP, we never had much time at all to shop if it hadnt been for the "disneyland shops will remain open one hour after closing for your shopping conveniance" I may have never gotten to see inside shops when I was a kid.

    All that said though I do think FP needs to be used in major moderation, not every ride needs it or should have it. Even though I did FP Indy when we went last, since it was my first time I walked very slowly through the entire que, and stayed in the movie room until the whole film repeated. To me the que is a huge part of the ride experience, I dont think TOT in wdw would be even half the ride without the awesomely detailed que. I think space mountain probably shouldnt even have a FP, its really almost as much a people eater ride as pirates or HM.

    There is one part of the Disneyland experience that I enjoy in non FP rides; just chatting with your fellow human beings in line, sure sometimes you get freaks or rudies (rude inconsiderate people), but more often than not you get the pleasant experience of chatting with someone else, usually from some other place thats neat to hear about.

    I think personally they should limit the number of FP's you can get in a day; say you can only get 5 FP's ALL DAY. So you have to really choose which attractions are the most important to you to ride right away. This would help with a lot of the congestion problem, and being "sold out" of fastpasses so much.

    As for splash, I think you cant really blame FP for that long long line, its just a low capacity ride; its slow loading, its certaintly no people eater like HM. WDW's splash doesnt have nearly the same lines because it has a much higher capacity with its side by side seating and larger flume. Not to mention for some reason, splash breaks down a LOT, more than a lot of the other rides I cant count the number of times I saw it go down during our vacation.

    I think what ISM was referring to as the "caste" FP creates, is that no matter how you get around it there is always going to be a group of people that know nothing about FP, or do not understand how it works correctly. I saw quite a few people who were just scratching their heads over the system; some thought you could only do it once the whole day, others couldnt figure out where or how to get the tickets, some thought you could get as many FP's as you wanted with no waits in between. The only reason I knew how to use it was because I did internet research before we went, but if I had no acess to that kind of thing I think I would be going crazy how to figure it out too. The guide pamphlet really didnt explain it very well, and neither did much signage. Then you come to the fact that those that really know the system intimately, can maximize it to the point of almost cheating the system, at the expense of all those other poor schmucks that have no idea how it really works.

  7. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tigertail777
    snip

    I think what ISM was referring to as the "caste" FP creates, is that no matter how you get around it there is always going to be a group of people that know nothing about FP, or do not understand how it works correctly. I saw quite a few people who were just scratching their heads over the system; some thought you could only do it once the whole day, others couldnt figure out where or how to get the tickets, some thought you could get as many FP's as you wanted with no waits in between. The only reason I knew how to use it was because I did internet research before we went, but if I had no acess to that kind of thing I think I would be going crazy how to figure it out too. The guide pamphlet really didnt explain it very well, and neither did much signage. Then you come to the fact that those that really know the system intimately, can maximize it to the point of almost cheating the system, at the expense of all those other poor schmucks that have no idea how it really works.
    Perhaps the Disney folks could add in-depth FP instructions to the stand-by queues ..... like Burma-Shave signs ..... hand out in-depth pamphlets at the front gate, and expand the discussion of FP on their website ....
    "She's taking everything. She's taking the house, she's taking the kid, she's taking the dog. IT'S NOT EVEN HER DOG. IT'S MY DOG! SHE'S TAKING . . . MY DOG!"
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  8. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by MiceMan
    I honestly think that waiting in line is part of the point of Disneyland. I realize that it may make it difficult to get to some rides but Disneyland lived for at least 40 years without it and really should go back to the way it was.
    Agreed 100%. My best visits to DL were during the pre-fastpass era. Believe it or not, some of my best memories as a child and teenager at DL were in line! In addition to the story being told with visual elements you can touch and feel in the queue, you spend quality time with your friends, family or soon-to-be-girlfriend .

    Fastpass defeats the purpose of a themed ride. You no longer need an elaborate facade on the outside nor do you need a themed queue. You might as well expose the entire structure of the ride like 6 flags does since the thrill factor is the only thing to be desired.
    People are just too darn impatient.
    Yes, they are. Call me old fashioned, but FP is like fast forwarding a favorite movie to the action sequence or the climax. It is similar to eliminating a family sit-down dinner for fast food.

    Disneyland was not designed to be a drive thru.
    Disneyland allows me to escape the everyday stresses and routines of a Southern Californian resident.

    California Adventure brings me right back to the place I was trying to avoid in the first place.

  9. #39

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    I prefer the random sense of discovery of the park versus the whole "look at your watch and run to get passes" each hour aspect. The blowing off of the preshow was never intended, but i guess waiting in line for 3 hours wasn't either. sigh.
    "As usual he's taken over the coolest spot in the house"- Father re: Orville 1963

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  10. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by wolfy999
    Amazing but true, most people would be able to enjoy more rides in a given day. Just think about it........Matterhorn, no Fast Pass, line moves quickly, so you don't mind the wait. Ever wait for Splash Mountain in the regular line, it hardly moves and takes forever! What does everyone else think? It does come in handy, but you can only get a couple of them a day. I would prefer no Fast Passes, no tickets, just wait in line and move right along.
    I'm wit you! I have never liked them, and to this point, and after using the system about 1 dozen times, I can say I am still not a fan.

    I will say kutos to Matt and the boys for reducing the amount of them in the park a few months back.

  11. #41

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    I still say Space Mountain is the best use of fastpass, the que isn't also that great but still pretty entertaining, I'm sure it will be better when it reopens

    my other complaint is the unnetworked fastpass machines, who thought up that idea? it totaly blows any fastpassers argument that people need to just adjust out of the water for me, it seems like somethin only an APer or somebody that posts on boards like this would know, it's completly unfair to a tourist that somebody who can visit anyday they want is waiting in three lines at once. And it's not like they can announce unnetworked machines on the park map that would totaly ruin the system, unnetworked fastpass's are something that unnecisarily favor the APer as opposed to the tourist.

  12. #42

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    I've never used FastPass. I go with my sister, and we enjoy hanging out in line talking...it's the only time we ever have to visit with each other.

  13. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jspider
    my other complaint is the unnetworked fastpass machines, who thought up that idea? it totaly blows any fastpassers argument that people need to just adjust out of the water for me, it seems like somethin only an APer or somebody that posts on boards like this would know, it's completly unfair to a tourist that somebody who can visit anyday they want is waiting in three lines at once. And it's not like they can announce unnetworked machines on the park map that would totaly ruin the system, unnetworked fastpass's are something that unnecisarily favor the APer as opposed to the tourist.
    If you don't know, I was the one who came up with the detailed FASTPASS guide that has been on a few boards, plus Kevin Yee wrote an article about it a while back. Now, the folks at the Unofficial Guide to Disneyland, 2005 version have worked the details into their book, including the tour plans.

    I have tried to get the information to as many folks as possible, and will continue to do so. I agree that it is unfair that some folks know about it, and some don't. But I understand that Disney believes that it would confuse too many folks. Heck, many guests don't understand the simple system that is posted in Guide to the Magic.
    Check out my Theme Park Photos at http://darkbeer.smugmug.com

  14. #44

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    Here is my Joy of FASTPASS guide

    The best place to start is the official Disney description of FASTPASS...

    http://disneyland.disney.go.com/disn...ssGSDetailPage

    Well, it sounds so nice and easy... well, the system is actually quite complex, and keeps changing. The newest change started at the beginning of 2003, with the introduction of a second "tier" of guests with the "Enhanced aka Unlimited FASTPASS" option.

    So, we have two types of guests in the park now...

    Regular guests

    and

    "Enhanced" guests.

    I am going to start with the "Enhanced" guests, since regular guests are everyone who isn't an "Enhanced" guest.

    So, how do you get the "Enhanced FASTPASS" option?

    Well, in 2005 it is much more limited than 2003....

    There is only ONE way to get this special benefit!

    You must buy an AAA Travel Hotel/Admission package. They have the "Exclusive" on the Enhanced FASTPASS feature. Thats right, you cannot get this feature if you buy directly from the Walt Disney Travel Company (even though the AAA packages are basically an WDTC package with an "AAA" label.) (Note: there is an exception for packages sold outside North America).

    First, you must buy Hotel and Admission from AAA Travel. Of course, they would love to sell you Air or other transportation, rental car, meal packages, etc... but those are extras and not required.

    Second, you MUST stay at one of the three Disneyland Resort Hotels; Grand Californian, Disneyland Hotel or the Paradise Pier.

    These packages can be much more expensive than a Good Neighbor Hotel (aka non-Disney), so the question is, is it worth the extra money, especially if you know how the "regular" system works.... Only you can answer that....

    So, you become an "Enhanced" user by buying a special vacation package from AAA.

    All other folks in the Park are "Regular" users, that is AP holders, single day tickets, Multi-day tickets, Complementary Tickets and any other type of admission that does not specifically come with the "Enhanced" option.

    Since the "Enhanced" option is the easier of the two to understand, let's start there....

    First off, the old term "Unlimited" is a bit misleading, you can't get ALL the FASTPASSES you want, but you can get one for each attraction at the same time. A better term now being used is "Enhanced" FASTPASS.

    Well, the Disneyland Resort Passports that comes with the AAA package has a special barcode that tells the FASTPASS machine that you are eligible for the special benefit. (So do NOT upgrade to an AP until the end of the last day, because the minute you switch from the passport to the AP, you lose the Unlimited FASTPASS option!) (Though some folks have reported that the CM's at the AP processing center can transfer the special feature, so ASK before you upgrade.)

    Now, how does it work, well, think of the FASTPASS machines as a computer network, with each attraction being a "unit" in the network. When a "regular" user attempts to get a FASTPASS, the machine does two things, the first test is that it checks to see if you have a current FASTPASS for the same attraction (that is a FASTPASS whose start time is later than the current time aka not yet valid), and the second test is to see if you have received another FASTPASS in the same park (There are two separate networks, one for Disneyland, and another for DCA). The rule here is you are not allowed to get another FASTPASS until the starting time of the first FASTPASS, or after 2 hours of issuance of the first FASTPASS. The easiest way to check this is to look at the bottom of the first FASTPASS, it will state "Another FASTPASS will be available at XX:XX" Now certain FASTPASS machines have not been connected to the network. In this case, the machine only cares about the first test, do you have another FASTPASS for THIS ride?, and will issue you one only if the starting time has passed. (For example, you go to Roger Rabbit, and get a FASTPASS for 11:30 AM to 12:30 PM at about 10 AM. The machine will refuse to issue you another FASTPASS until 11:30 AM, at which time, the machine would issue one for say 1:40 to 2:40 PM, once again, you will be blocked out until 1:40 PM, when the machine will once again give you a new FASTPASS for say 3:10 to 4:10 PM....)

    Now, with one of the special AAA Hotel package passports, when you stick the passport into a FASTPASS machine, it reads the barcode, and will treat the machine as being "disconnected" from the network, and will only apply the first test, do you have a current FASTPASS for THIS ride?, it doesn't care about any other ride. Also, the machine does print "AAA Travel" on the FASTPASS.

    So, what is the best strategy if you have one of the special passports.

    Well, lets say you are a family, what I would do is gather all the passports after entering the park, and have one designated "runner", let's say Dad, and then have the rest of the family (Mom and the kids) can go straight to Fantasyland. Or if the kids are too old for Fantasyland, or if it is a group of adults, you could go on the Matterhorn (a non FASTPASS attraction) or just go sit down and have some breakfast. The one "runner" will go to EVERY ride that offers FASTPASS and get FASTPASSES for each member of the group. After he collects the entire set, he/she meets up with the rest of the group.

    Now, sit down and sort out the FASTPASSES by area (Tomorrowland - Space Mountain, Buzz Lightyear and Autopia) (Fantasyland/Toontown - Roger Rabbit) (Westside - Big Thunder Mountain RR, Indiana Jones and Splash Mountain).

    Now, figure out which way you want to start (the starting times of the FASTPASSES might help make this decision for you!). Remember a big rule about FASTPASSES in general, the Cast Members care about two things, the date of the FASTPASS, and the STARTING time, they will not let you use the FASTPASS until the starting time. What they do NOT care about is the ending time, they will allow the use of the FASTPASS after the ending time!

    So, lets say you decide to start at Tomorrowland.. it is now 9:45 PM, and you have a (starting time) 10:00 AM Buzz Lightyear, and a 10:30 Autopia, well, walk on over to Star Tours, at 10:00, BEFORE you go on Star Tours, get another FASTPASS (this is the key of maximizing your use of the feature) The machine will check, and since your first FASTPASS started at 10:00, and it is now a few minutes after 10 AM, the machine will issue you a new FASTPASS). Ride Buzz Lightyear, it is now about 10:15, so go check out the shop, arcade, and the spinning marble until 10:30. Then off to Autopia, and before riding, get a new Autopia FASTPASS.

    Now, you move to the next area you want to go to, and repeat the same procedure. This way you will always have a FASTPASS for each attraction, but save a LOT of walking.

    To sum up the best strategy if you have the "Enhanced FASTPASS" option....

    Have one person in your group go get a FASTPASS for EVERY ride in Disneyland when you first arrive.

    Before you use the current FASTPASS, get a new FASTPASS for the same attraction.



    OK, now the vast majority of us don't get the "Enhanced" option, so we are Regular users of the system... how does this work....

    Well, it is a bit more complicated than the "Enhanced" option, but you can still "collect FASTPASS tickets for multiple attractions at one time", though it is more restrictive.

    No wonder that Disney doesn't advertise these "tricks" I am about to talk about. First off, it hurts the marketing of the AAA Disney Hotel Travel Packages, and, second, it is hard to explain to a Guest. You will find out that many CM's have no idea about what is a "Stand-Alone" machine, or other information talked about in this post. They do know the information as described on the official website, and the Enhanced basics, since this is what Disney has taught them. They have no idea about the "secrets".

    In the Enhanced section, I talked about looking at the FASTPASS system as a computer network, so let's get an overview of the system.

    First off, there are TWO networks, one for the Disneyland Park, and a second for Disney's California Adventure. They are totally separate, so you can always get one FASTPASS for each park. Let's look at the Networked machines....

    In Disneyland, the following rides are networked

    Big Thunder Mountain Railroad
    Indiana Jones Adventure
    Splash Mountain
    Autopia
    Buzz Lightyear Space Rangers
    Space Mountain

    At DCA, the networked attractions are

    California Screamin'
    Mulholland Madness
    Soarin' Over California
    Tower of Terror

    Now, not every attraction is part of the network, 5 attractions (at present, and these attractions have changed many times) don't look at the network.


    Independent Machines (AKA Stand-Alone)

    Roger Rabbit's Car Toon Spin(DL)
    Grizzly River Run (DCA)

    And now we have a new version of machines, one where Disney decides to turn off the machines 7 days a week.

    Non-Operational Machines

    Haunted Mansion (DL)
    Star Tours (DL)
    The Many Adventure of Winnie the Pooh (DL)
    Muppet Vision 3D (DCA)
    It's Tough to be a Bug! (DCA)



    While the machines and signage are still posted at these attractions, they are no longer used.

    A new addition is the decision to not offer FASTPASS on a daily basis on some attractions, but only to offer them on Weekends during the off-season (they should be offered daily during Peak and Holiday seasons).

    During the first week of this new policy, the following attractions did not offer FASTPASS during the week:

    Big Thunder Mountain Railroad
    Mulholland Madness
    Grizzly River Run

    The TIMES Guide handed out at the turnstyles does list which FASTPASS attractions will be offered that day.


    So, our first problem is that we are talking about different types of FASTPASSES, and there is no easy way to tell the difference..


    The independent machines are nice and simple, each of the two rides has its own machine, and you can get ONE FASTPASS for each of the rides without affecting any other FP.....

    PLEASE NOTE : All times are an example, and should not be a reflection of the time you really get on your FASTPASS

    The system does require your passport, let's say it is 10 o'clock, the Star Tours FASTPASS you get is for 11:15 am to 12:15 pm and then at 11 am you get a Roger Rabbit FASTPASS good for 12:50 pm to 1:50 pm.... The system will not allow you to get another FASTPASS until the Start time on the FASTPASS, so you could get another Star Tours FASTPASS at 11:15 am and a Roger Rabbit at 12:50 pm.... (I know that Star Tours is no longer offering the FP's, but there is no other attraction at present to substitute).

    One trick that is important is that the ending time is not important, the CM does check the start time and the date, but they have been told to be very flexible on the ending time, who knows why you have been delayed, you could have been stuck on another ride, etc.... so they almost always never say anything when you show up late with a FASTPASS...

    The trick with the independent machines is to get a NEW FASTPASS prior to riding, for example, it is now 11:15 am, and you want to ride Star Tours, before going in the FASTPASS line to ride, pick up another FASTPASS (the window is now open), and you will be given a new Star Tours FASTPASS for 2:10 pm to 3:10 pm, this will allow you to come back later, after 2:10 pm for a second ride on Star Tours, and get a third FASTPASS for Star Tours later in the day.

    So, what can I have, PRIOR to even accessing the "networked" machines...

    Well, I can have a Roger Rabbit's Car Toon Spin, and a Grizzly River Run.

    OK, now to talk about the "Networked" machines, you can have (in most cases) one DL and one DCA networked FASTPASS in addition to the above FASTPASSES...

    Once you get one networked FASTPASS, you are not allowed another "networked" FASTPASS within the same park (either DL or DCA) until the earlier of these two events happen...

    1. The time window on the FASTPASS becomes valid

    2. Two hours have passed since receiving the FASTPASS

    OK, lets look at some examples...

    It is early in the day, and you go to get a Splash FASTPASS at 9:15 am, the FASTPASS issued to you is valid from 10:20 am to 11:20 am...

    In this case, the next FASTPASS would be available at 10:20 am, and that would be the time printed on the bottom of the FASTPASS

    But, lets say it is a bit later, say around 10:30 am, you get a Splash FASTPASS, but now it is good between 2:40 pm and 3:40 pm...

    In this case, the next FASTPASS would be available at 12:30 pm. (Two hours after the FASTPASS was issued), and the bottom of the FASTPASS would state 12:30pm... there is one additional rule, you would NOT be allowed to get a Splash FASTPASS, you cannot get a new Splash FASTPASS until the window opens at 2:40 pm, but at 12:30 you could get an Autopia, BTMRR, Indiana Jones, etc.....(any networked ride OTHER than Splash)

    And one of the most important tricks to maximize your FASTPASS usage is to get a NEW FASTPASS prior to using the current active one, let's say at 11 AM you got an Indy FASTPASS good for 12:35 pm to 1:35 pm, at 12:30, I would head over to Splash Mountain, and at 12:35, get a Splash FASTPASS (say good for 2:50 pm to 3:50 pm), then ride Indy... at 2:35 pm (don't forget the two hour rule), I would pick up an Autopia FASTPASS, then ride Splash.........

    OK, so now you can have a Roger Rabbit, GRR, plus one or two DL networked rides, and a DCA ride...

    Another thing to think about is the Single Rider Passes available on Splash, Grizzly River Run, Soarin', California Screamin', Mulholland Madness, and Maliboomer. If you are willing to use Single Rider Passes (Which in most cases are quicker than FASTPASSES, with the exception of Soarin', which in many cases can have a longer wait than a FP)... you won't need to pick up FASTPASSES for these rides, and can use the FASTPASSES on other rides, such as Autopia.

    Also, Splash, with its reduced capacity logs has a long wait, so that would be a priority (unless I planned to use the Single Rider Passes), in which case, Autopia and Indiana Jones would be my other top choices.

    To Sum up the "Regular" guests FASTPASS system....

    Think of the systems as DIFFERENT, and that there are FOUR sets of FASTPASS machines, Roger Rabbit, GRR, the DL networked system, and the DCA networked system....by thinking in this manner should help you make the most use out of the FASTPASS system.....
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  15. #45

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jspider
    hopefully Buzz will absorb all those space people, honestly when space first had fastpass things weren't that bad

    anywho I don't think the DCA fastpasses are quite useless, they should leave the ones for ToT and Screamin but the rest are pretty unecessary (is there a rest?)
    I think that is because most of the queue is up on that terrace area, which is a big unsed space anyway. (BTW, they really should do something with that area)
    I think it will work better with Buzz, because it was designed with FP in mind. Indy for example wasn't, and the mojority of the huge queue is now empty most of the time... Same with Splash...

    I'm as impatient as they come, and I think I prefer the park before FP, really.
    Last edited by Whatever; 02-17-2005 at 12:15 PM.

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