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  1. #1

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    New Bug's concepts

    I wrestled with the thought of actually writing this. A part of me is always looking at things through a slightly off window and I am constantly thinking of what could have been done despite what is. That said, I really do not believe in theming an entire land around a specific movie, and I feel my decision to write this may be misinterpreted as support of WDI's choice.

    So... where to begin

    It's been a while since I watched Bug's Life but there are specific things that were done, and several things that were not, that prompted this thread. I love Flick's Flyers, but I am not a huge fan of the real estate taken by all the water distractions. My first thought would be to combine both sections of the water area into one. It would be fairly simple to combine a leaky hose with a giant fallen nozzle that could easily drench people.

    My next headache is Heimlich. I am not sure what is more annoying, the fact that you are inside of Heimlich, the fact that he is gorging himself, or the fact that there is NO POINT to the entire trip. Solving the first problem would be simple... Make Heimlich a solid caterpillar, add multiple saddles to his back, and then allow for left/right/up/down movement as he lurches forward like a normal caterpillar. Aside from that I have no clue how to draw a more immersive story, or how to ditch all the food.

    I am a HUGE bumper car fan, but I really really do not like the whole Tuck n Roll setup. For starters it takes up a LOT of the real estate in Flick's. Then there is the added insult of not having the Bumpers in Paradise Pier where they belong. Personally I would advocate it's removal in favor of a much better attraction. I am not sure what it would be called, but think of it like the current ant farms. It would be interesting, multi storied, and on the top level you would have a section with a giant eye starring at you... what better tribute to ATIS then this... just a thought. It could easily be themed around the giant beetle since nothing else is.

    While I do not remember their names, both the spider and the stick bug are completely unused. How about a complete walk around the entire area, similar to the Ewok Village or Fort Wilderness. Nothing special, couple bridges etc, just something for the kids to climb on. It would have to be out of the way of Flick's... but they could allow a tunnel into the new "Bug House" that would allow you to see the ride and the ride to see you.

    Now to the Ladybug business... again not a big fan of being IN a bug. So... acorns... they are round, shaped like a top, and can be spun in a similar fashion. If I remember correctly the grasshoppers were after these nuts... so that would allow you to incorporate them into the land as well, possibly one opening the bottle as in the movie.

    All of this was written to make a specific point. Some individuals automatically link theme with attraction quality. I feel that Bugsland has an amazing theme, regardless of how misguided I feel it may be. However, theme is only part of the picture, I feel something similar to what I have proposed would possibly complete it.
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  2. #2

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    Re: New Bug's concepts

    Your concept for Heimlich would never pass DOSH and in particular not for the age group that Fliks Fun Fair is aimed at.

    People need to get it through their noggins, the Fun Fair is aimed at the youngest of the young and that puts significant constraints on the ride systems and the riding rules.

    If you find it boring and repetitive, we understand but it's not designed for you. Go ride Tower of Terror - but don't try and reach it through Fliks.

  3. #3

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    Re: New Bug's concepts

    Sesame Street (at least back in the olden days) was aimed at small children but still managed to be smart, innovative and watchable for adults (I saw a clip where the was a reference to Watergate - a news report on "Cookiegate" involving the Cookie Monster. Also, my stepfather has a Sesame Street music box set that he listens to occasionally, which I enjoy as well.)

    I don't think the, "well, if you don't like it, go ride ToT" argument really flies either. I've seen some very young children (apparently over the height restriction, but still very young) happily standing in like for ToT. As a kid, I wouldn't have been one of them, but I wouldn't have been in line for the bug's land attractions either. My fascination with carnival rides ended the moment I saw what a full-fledged Disney attraction was like - the kiddie car carousel at the local Lompoc Flower Festival was never the same again.

    The other issue is that, except for the 3D movie, which is far from the Fun Fair, everything in that land is off-the-shelf. I don't think you can say that about Fantasyland. Even that glorified, half-shuddered McDonald's Playland Toontown (the theming of which I love, BTW) has two attractions that aren't off-the-shelf (Roger Rabbit and the Mickey's House walk through. Three if you count Minnie's House). The other issue is that DCA already had a land almost entirely dominated by off-the-shelf rides - Paradise Pier, with the exception of California Screamin'.

    I don't think the issue is so much the existance of the off-the-shelf rides as it is the concentration of them, and the lack of anything else.

    Also, it's bewildering that Pixar, one of the most adult-friendly animation studios out there, is being used to theme for "just for kids" attractions. I'm not as familiar with Bug's Life as I am with the other Pixar movies, but it doesn't strike me as the kind of property that would be lumped in with Barney/Elmo/Teletubbies/Playhouse Disney/Nick, Jr. just for kids type thing. Also, even for those not familiar with the movie, the idea of a land where you're shrunk to the size of a bug is a very interesting idea that's just bursting with possibilities.

    I'd like to see a suspended ride (either Peter Pan-type dark ride or suspended coaster) where we fly inside the fake bird.
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  4. #4

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    Re: New Bug's concepts

    Quote Originally Posted by JeffYardDog View Post
    Your concept for Heimlich would never pass DOSH and in particular not for the age group that Fliks Fun Fair is aimed at.

    People need to get it through their noggins, the Fun Fair is aimed at the youngest of the young and that puts significant constraints on the ride systems and the riding rules.

    If you find it boring and repetitive, we understand but it's not designed for you. Go ride Tower of Terror - but don't try and reach it through Fliks.
    Thank you JYD for remaining so positive when I did not attack Flicks. As to DOSH... Pooh has the motions described and they passed. For that matter Elephant rides have been around many many years and they pass. It would take minimal effort to combine a saddle type seating arrangement with the motion base described and believe it or not if a baby can ride on Astro then I think they would be able to ride on this. I am not talking MASSIVE drop you seat of the pants thrills, I am talking some level or realism and movement. At the least I would hope Disney would take more care in designing ride vehicles that adults actually fit in, so we can comfortably ride with our little ones.
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  5. #5

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    Re: New Bug's concepts

    Quote Originally Posted by techskip View Post
    Thank you JYD for remaining so positive when I did not attack Flicks. As to DOSH... Pooh has the motions described and they passed. For that matter Elephant rides have been around many many years and they pass. It would take minimal effort to combine a saddle type seating arrangement with the motion base described and believe it or not if a baby can ride on Astro then I think they would be able to ride on this. I am not talking MASSIVE drop you seat of the pants thrills, I am talking some level or realism and movement. At the least I would hope Disney would take more care in designing ride vehicles that adults actually fit in, so we can comfortably ride with our little ones.
    With all due respect, it's not what you think it's what DOSH thinks and you would be surprised what they pick apart during inspections of the equipment AND procedures. The so-called operational and evacuation procedures for Heimlich are amazingly well-defined and strict for such a seemlingly simple ride. Despite their slow speed, the trains still have mass and resultant momentum that is capable of causing harm and, as you well know, it's Safety Above All.

    And, of course, being a recent product, Fliks is not grandfathered under various laws and regulations. I don't know what effect that has with respect to you other examples, so someone will have to clarify that situation.

    And you miss the point. It's not designed to be minimally offensive, it's intended to be completely inoffensive so that parents can take the very youngest on it without causing them to be scared. And yet some kids are still scared to get on though they do not come out that way. That's the goal.

    I'm sorry that you don't fit the ride vehicles. I assume that you're talking about the Tuck and Roll 'cars'. I'm a smidgen over 6 feet and weigh nearly 250 and still manage to fold myself into them for an occasional ride-along. It's tight but manageable for a short time.

  6. #6

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    Re: New Bug's concepts

    Jeffyarddog, with all due respect, do you absolutely love Flik's Fun Fair 100%? Ignore who and why it was built. Do you love it and think it's the best that Disney can do?


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  7. #7

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    Re: New Bug's concepts

    Quote Originally Posted by JeffYardDog View Post
    With all due respect, it's not what you think it's what DOSH thinks and you would be surprised what they pick apart during inspections of the equipment AND procedures. The so-called operational and evacuation procedures for Heimlich are amazingly well-defined and strict for such a seemlingly simple ride. Despite their slow speed, the trains still have mass and resultant momentum that is capable of causing harm and, as you well know, it's Safety Above All.
    Preaching to the choir amigo... they took our dock umbrella because it was a "trip hazard" even though we have never had anyone; cast, management, guest, trip on, over, or around it!

    And, of course, being a recent product, Fliks is not grandfathered under various laws and regulations. I don't know what effect that has with respect to you other examples, so someone will have to clarify that situation.
    No effect since Astro lost it's grandfather status when it was moved. For that matter you can take an infant on Dumbo!

    And you miss the point. It's not designed to be minimally offensive, it's intended to be completely inoffensive so that parents can take the very youngest on it without causing them to be scared. And yet some kids are still scared to get on though they do not come out that way. That's the goal.
    Who said anything about making it offensive? Or thrill packed? The entire point is to keep it a kids ride but add motion similar to Pooh so Heimlich isn't floating on air and perfectly level. If they are making that adjustment then why not naturally change it so you sit on him instead of in him!

    I'm sorry that you don't fit the ride vehicles. I assume that you're talking about the Tuck and Roll 'cars'. I'm a smidgen over 6 feet and weigh nearly 250 and still manage to fold myself into them for an occasional ride-along. It's tight but manageable for a short time.
    6'4 230lbs... I can squeeze in a variety of vehicles with minimal pain. Heimlich has minimal legroom, same as the Lady Bugs or the Bumper Cars. However you're also 6ft so I can stop there before I preach to the choir!

    I realize you are very defensive of DCA, and I am honestly not a huge fan of DCA overall. BUT I enjoy Flick's and would welcome modest improvements that would maintain the theme and the small kid type atmosphere. I am not suggesting to turn anything into a thrill ride, or speed anything up in the slightest. I am suggesting that they make it more realistic. Like I alluded to in the example, use the gentle motion base of Pooh... not the rip you out of your seat base of Indy... gentle, so it doesn't scare kids but makes it even more immersive because they are RIDING on a caterpiller.

    I have no clue if you have ever ridden a camel, horse, bull, or elephant (I have ridden each of them btw). I will use horse and elephant as the best examples of what I am about to say. To see a child, even a small child, ride one of these creatures for the first time is to see the same expression you see at Disneyland. It is a sense of wonder, excitement, and magic to ride on top of an animal you generally would never ride or see. THAT is what I want to tap into, not thrills, magic and wonder!


    Everything I have described is technology that already exists, most of it is already approved by DOSH. They may say no, they may say yes, fact is Disney will likely never ask them. This is more or less a "wow wish they did this" concept. To be perfectly honest you never know. I think it is very likely that TSMM and the additions to Paradise Pier have been in the planning stages for years, but I find it ironic that a lot of the changes to the architecture mimic the thread about Boardwalks! I think Micechat has a microscopic influence on Disney at the most... but even then it is fun to throw ideas out there.
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  8. #8

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    Re: New Bug's concepts

    Your Heimlich concept would pass, it'd' just be like a carousel on a track.

    As far as your ride concept, I've thought about this for awhile. I LOVED Adventure Through Innerspace and would love a ride where you would be shrunk down and see bugs, even Pixar bugs. I even think for your "Play" area, they could move Redwood Creek over in that area and re-theme it to an ant-hill.

    Of course, the ride would probably not work as long as Tough to be a bug is around, too many bug cartoons.

    I think you could use the Big Life building for the ride, even using the same queue to show you "Shrinking" down to bug size. That building is probably big enough for a decent enough C-D ticket ride.

    Expand the boundries of "A Bugs land" out ot where the farm is, expand Heimlich's to go all around the land (little bridges crossing the entire land. Remove the Bumper Cars and put the play area there. Keep the Flyers and Francis (both have small foot-prints).


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    Re: New Bug's concepts

    I still say that Jumpin Jellyfish could easily be moved and rethemed to fit the Bug's Life theme. The dandelion that Flik flies on is a good use, or even using Rosie, The Spider, having her pulling you up and down on a web. It's a small ride and would fit in the footprint used for the large water hose easily. It could also be a weenie if it's tall enough and could have some nice new lighting effects.

  10. #10

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    Re: New Bug's concepts

    Quote Originally Posted by sir clinksalot View Post
    Your Heimlich concept would pass, it'd' just be like a carousel on a track.

    As far as your ride concept, I've thought about this for awhile. I LOVED Adventure Through Innerspace and would love a ride where you would be shrunk down and see bugs, even Pixar bugs. I even think for your "Play" area, they could move Redwood Creek over in that area and re-theme it to an ant-hill.

    Of course, the ride would probably not work as long as Tough to be a bug is around, too many bug cartoons.

    I think you could use the Big Life building for the ride, even using the same queue to show you "Shrinking" down to bug size. That building is probably big enough for a decent enough C-D ticket ride.

    Expand the boundries of "A Bugs land" out ot where the farm is, expand Heimlich's to go all around the land (little bridges crossing the entire land. Remove the Bumper Cars and put the play area there. Keep the Flyers and Francis (both have small foot-prints).
    One of the more charming features of Flick's Fair is that it is tucked away in a manner that you really have to seek it out. Kind of like some of the shops in New Orleans... nothing forcing you to walk through the streets and visit the shops so some people don't even realize what is back there! I would be afraid of expanding Bugs and possibly causing a break in theme, and a more "present" presentation. I love the anthill thought though.

    Quote Originally Posted by stitchon View Post
    I still say that Jumpin Jellyfish could easily be moved and rethemed to fit the Bug's Life theme. The dandelion that Flik flies on is a good use, or even using Rosie, The Spider, having her pulling you up and down on a web. It's a small ride and would fit in the footprint used for the large water hose easily. It could also be a weenie if it's tall enough and could have some nice new lighting effects.
    Not to go completely off topic but Jumpin Jelly could be easily adapted to almost anything including a kid's parachute training style attraction in Condor Flats. Some time ago I had talked about something similar for Adventureland themed around King Louie and the Jungle Book. I think Flick's Flyer covers the need to be off the ground, anything more would possibly scare little ones. Also I would hate to bring in another height restricted attraction to a land designed for little ones.
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  11. #11

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    Re: New Bug's concepts

    I was thinking about a lot of this recently on a visit to Bugsland. Mainly about Heimlich, and how to allow for the motion base I described. Then it hit me... mechanical bull... not that rough of course but it is the same basic movement and provides the same saddle type design I had previously described. It could be done with minor adaptations, however I am still stuck as to the ride concept itself.
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  12. #12

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    Re: New Bug's concepts

    I think, techskip, that you'd have to keep the food premise with the Heimlich concept. That's what Heimlich is known for, so that's most likely what guests would want and expect. A concept for the ride storyline could be that Heimlich has to travel all over to reach a giant candy corn at the end... on the way, you pass familiar settings from the story, and characters too, until you finally reach the candy (food element) at the very end of the attraction.







  13. #13

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    Re: New Bug's concepts

    Quote Originally Posted by SeaWolf38 View Post
    I think, techskip, that you'd have to keep the food premise with the Heimlich concept. That's what Heimlich is known for, so that's most likely what guests would want and expect. A concept for the ride storyline could be that Heimlich has to travel all over to reach a giant candy corn at the end... on the way, you pass familiar settings from the story, and characters too, until you finally reach the candy (food element) at the very end of the attraction.
    I think part of what bothers me about Heimlich is the lack of anything substantial. I would rather have a multi-level if you will. Allow Heimlich to go over some items and under others.
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    Re: New Bug's concepts

    that's a good idea... it would be very dynamic that way. It would require at least a medium-sized show-building though, or alot of room around Flick's to go over and under scenery items, pathways, etc.







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    Re: New Bug's concepts

    At the same time, I really do not find giant food to be all that exciting. The over/under would not need a great deal of room, especially if it is designed as being multi level... look at Alice as a possible template.
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