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  1. #31

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    Re: It's A "Different" Small World + Rumored Major Attractions + Downtown Disney

    Quote Originally Posted by Ride Warrior View Post
    Thanks for posting the above map, tasman.
    You're most welcome (this map of course does not show Small World, which is going up on the parcel next to the Golden Mickey theatre, but is otherwise pretty good). I would love to see a current satellite image of HKDL. GoogleEarth and VirtualEarth only have old images taken during construction.

    I had heard the rumours of a Caribbean haunted mansion at some point so I took that into account in my armchair imagineering . Having Pirates and HM in the same land is of course not a new idea...all they would have to do is to take the template for New Orleans Square, and substitute Island / Colonial architecture and ambience.

  2. #32

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    Re: It's A "Different" Small World + Rumored Major Attractions + Downtown Disney

    Quote Originally Posted by tasman View Post
    You're most welcome (this map of course does not show Small World, which is going up on the parcel next to the Golden Mickey theatre, but is otherwise pretty good). I would love to see a current satellite image of HKDL. GoogleEarth and VirtualEarth only have old images taken during construction.

    I had heard the rumours of a Caribbean haunted mansion at some point so I took that into account in my armchair imagineering . Having Pirates and HM in the same land is of course not a new idea...all they would have to do is to take the template for New Orleans Square, and substitute Island / Colonial architecture and ambience.
    And if these were unique and excellent versions of Haunted Mansion and POTC, I would become much more interested in HKDL. With what little HKDL offers, they need to act quick. They should make everything be the best quality possible, while adding more than one major attraction a year. After HM and POTC, I would like to see a BTM (or something comparable) and an Indiana Jones Adventure (with at least a slightly different story while still being an EVC Indy ride, like TDS's compared to DL's).

    Also Peter Pan needs to be like the DL version with it's short drops and star field, only longer. They also need a couple of more classical style dark rides. I would love to see Mr. Toad get a new Wild Ride in HKDL.

    What the park needs:
    Unique POTC
    Unique HM
    Unique Indiana Jones Adventure
    Mr. Toad's Wild Ride
    Peter Pan's Flight
    A unique BTM like coatser

    Unique versions of 4 of my favorite E-Tickets, plus new versions of 2 of my favorite D Tickets, would make me really want to go.

  3. #33

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    Re: It's A "Different" Small World + Rumored Major Attractions + Downtown Disney

    Quote Originally Posted by TDLFAN View Post
    I am not going to pay attention to rumors about the future of HKDL. I would advise most of you to do the same.
    I concur.

    I get the impression that lots of possibilities have been discussed but they're completely dependant on how negotiations with the government go and all indications are that they aren't going well. Discussing this or that possible future attraction seems pointless right now beyond "armchair imagineering" discussions. I'd say all bets are off for the time being.

  4. #34

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    Re: It's A "Different" Small World + Rumored Major Attractions + Downtown Disney

    ORDDU: Well, I'm sure that Ride Warrior isn't claiming that what he's heard is a definite, dyed in the wool, green-lighted plan by Disney. He's merely sharing what he's heard--which is the same thing Mr. Lutz does on MiceAge. (Of course he, too, is often crucified for daring to share his information.) But anyone reading the content of message boards, such as these, should automatically know that these kinds of threads are often speculations--which, personally, I and my sisters enjoy reading.

    ORWEN: We're sure not going to hold anyone's feet to the fire about rumors that don't come true--

    ORGOCH: --less'n they turns out ta be a bunch a trouble makers just yankin' our chains. In that case we'll hex 'em from now 'til Ping Pong Dizzyland is a decent park!

  5. #35

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    Re: It's A "Different" Small World + Rumored Major Attractions + Downtown Disney

    Quote Originally Posted by Witches of Morva View Post
    ORDDU: Well, I'm sure that Ride Warrior isn't claiming that what he's heard is a definite, dyed in the wool, green-lighted plan by Disney. He's merely sharing what he's heard--which is the same thing Mr. Lutz does on MiceAge. (Of course he, too, is often crucified for daring to share his information.) But anyone reading the content of message boards, such as these, should automatically know that these kinds of threads are often speculations--which, personally, I and my sisters enjoy reading.

    ORWEN: We're sure not going to hold anyone's feet to the fire about rumors that don't come true--

    ORGOCH: --less'n they turns out ta be a bunch a trouble makers just yankin' our chains. In that case we'll hex 'em from now 'til Ping Pong Dizzyland is a decent park!
    I agree...

    The overhaul for DCA was talked about years before Disney formerly announced it. I still feel that if the housing issue had not been brought up, it would still be considered rumor and Disney would have waited a couple of more years to announce these projects as official.

    When the web was buzzing over the DCA rumors, I remember a lot of the same 'Disney failed and will continue to let the park fail' thoughts were shared on the boards. And yet, here we are with a formerly announced $1 billion 'fix it' project.

    Not to say that it is just easy for HKDL to receive the same treatment, but it would be quite welcomed to see Disney give HKDL the much-needed attention it deserves, as they have for the two other struggling parks across the globe.

    It is very refreshing to read an optimistic thread every now and then...

    Thanks for the information Ride Warrior, keep it coming!
    "If you build it right, they will come." - Bob Iger

    "I'm not a literary person. As far as realism is concerned, you can find dirt anyplace you look for it. I'm one of those optimists. There's always a rainbow." - Walt Disney



    "I don't care about critics. Critics take themselves too seriously. They think the only way to be noticed and to be the smart guy is to pick and find fault with things. It's the public I'm making pictures for." - Walt Disney

  6. #36

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    Re: It's A "Different" Small World + Rumored Major Attractions + Downtown Disney

    I didn't mean to imply that people shouldn't post rumours, just that at the moment everything seems to be so up in the air that I don't personally pay much attention to any of them.

    A fundamental difference between DCA and HKDL is that Disney owns DCA and can ultimately plow as much or as little into developing it as they want, so as ideas gather momentum within the company they have a greater chance of becoming reality. HKDL's future is so beholden to the political climate in Hong Kong right now that it seems quite unpredictable when, how much or if funding will be approved for new attractions and not even Disney can do much about that.

  7. #37

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    Re: It's A "Different" Small World + Rumored Major Attractions + Downtown Disney

    Quote Originally Posted by Sir_Cliff View Post
    I didn't mean to imply that people shouldn't post rumours, just that at the moment everything seems to be so up in the air that I don't personally pay much attention to any of them.

    A fundamental difference between DCA and HKDL is that Disney owns DCA and can ultimately plow as much or as little into developing it as they want, so as ideas gather momentum within the company they have a greater chance of becoming reality. HKDL's future is so beholden to the political climate in Hong Kong right now that it seems quite unpredictable when, how much or if funding will be approved for new attractions and not even Disney can do much about that.
    Points well taken, Sir Cliff. I agree that it may be a bit more difficult for Disney to take charge and make a commitment to help HKDL. Both the bright and gloomy outlooks for HKDL are circulated around word of mouth and I feel that both have a fair bit of truth behind them.

    I simply choose to support the brighter outlook and am hoping for the best


    EDIT:

    Hong Kong Disney In Trouble

    04-01-08

    The Government of Hong Kong has announced that it has entered into talks with American entertainment giant Walt Disney Company over financial options at its theme park in the former British colony after recent poor performances.

    Frederick Ma, Secretary for Commerce and Economic Development, stated that the Government had begun discussions on the park's expansion and was carefully examining its financial arrangements including a possible cash injection.

    However, he expressed concerns over Hong Kong Disneyland’s unsatisfactory performance and stated that a cash injection was not a certainty as the Government was still assessing its financial prospects.

    'The Government will carefully consider the merits and demerits of various financing options including the possibility of a government injection and the carrying out of preliminary feasibility assessments,' said Ma.
    'The discussion is still at an initial stage and no agreement has yet been reached.'

    Ma stated that the Government would make a decision after taking into account the economic benefits to the territory and the development of other large-scale tourist attractions in the region.
    http://www.igamingbusiness.com/artic...rticleID=15750
    Last edited by ROBONICS95; 01-04-2008 at 09:06 AM.
    "If you build it right, they will come." - Bob Iger

    "I'm not a literary person. As far as realism is concerned, you can find dirt anyplace you look for it. I'm one of those optimists. There's always a rainbow." - Walt Disney



    "I don't care about critics. Critics take themselves too seriously. They think the only way to be noticed and to be the smart guy is to pick and find fault with things. It's the public I'm making pictures for." - Walt Disney

  8. #38

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    Exclamation Re: It's A "Different" Small World + Rumored Major Attractions + Downtown Disney

    ^^ Well HK govt would not prevent Disney from investing more in the park if Disney wanted to, would they? When HKDL opened, didn't HK govt invest something like $ 3.2 billion and Disney about $ 300 million? (Most of the govt's money went to the landfill.) But if f I remember correctly Disney owns 47% of HKDL. So as I see it HK govt has done its part but Disney hasn't done theirs.

    As far as posting rumours...a little armchair imagineering never hurt. Of course nothing has been confirmed beyond Small World and we know that. With the pace at which things have been moving I think 2010 is the earliest we can expect anything significant at HKDL...more likely 2011.

  9. #39

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    Re: It's A "Different" Small World + Rumored Major Attractions + Downtown Disney

    Quote Originally Posted by tasman View Post
    ^^ Well HK govt would not prevent Disney from investing more in the park if Disney wanted to, would they? When HKDL opened, didn't HK govt invest something like $ 3.2 billion and Disney about $ 300 million? (Most of the govt's money went to the landfill.) But if f I remember correctly Disney owns 47% of HKDL. So as I see it HK govt has done its part but Disney hasn't done theirs.

    As far as posting rumours...a little armchair imagineering never hurt. Of course nothing has been confirmed beyond Small World and we know that. With the pace at which things have been moving I think 2010 is the earliest we can expect anything significant at HKDL...more likely 2011.
    The HK Government owns 57%, Disney 43%

    Someone else can probably explain this in greater detail but I think the primary concern is how much the government is willing to allow Disney to invest. As Disney continues to inject into HKDL they continue to increase their holding percentage. The government may lose a majority of the ownership and may not be willing to accept such a position.

    I think
    Last edited by ROBONICS95; 01-04-2008 at 01:24 PM.
    "If you build it right, they will come." - Bob Iger

    "I'm not a literary person. As far as realism is concerned, you can find dirt anyplace you look for it. I'm one of those optimists. There's always a rainbow." - Walt Disney



    "I don't care about critics. Critics take themselves too seriously. They think the only way to be noticed and to be the smart guy is to pick and find fault with things. It's the public I'm making pictures for." - Walt Disney

  10. #40

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    Re: It's A "Different" Small World + Rumored Major Attractions + Downtown Disney

    Quote Originally Posted by tasman View Post
    ^^ Well HK govt would not prevent Disney from investing more in the park if Disney wanted to, would they? When HKDL opened, didn't HK govt invest something like $ 3.2 billion and Disney about $ 300 million? (Most of the govt's money went to the landfill.) But if f I remember correctly Disney owns 47% of HKDL. So as I see it HK govt has done its part but Disney hasn't done theirs.
    I've had this thought as well. Disney and the HK gvt didn't foot anything like 43% of the bill to construct the resort in the first place so it seems only fair now that the park Disney built is underperforming that it be Disney that pays most of the cost for new additions. It might even create some goodwill toward Disney in HK.

    And, yes, I do agree that a little armchair imagineering never hurt. The possibilities at HKDL are pretty much endless, though it will certainly be a while before anything significant gets built.

  11. #41

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    Re: It's A "Different" Small World + Rumored Major Attractions + Downtown Disney

    Quote Originally Posted by tasman View Post
    You're most welcome (this map of course does not show Small World, which is going up on the parcel next to the Golden Mickey theatre, but is otherwise pretty good). I would love to see a current satellite image of HKDL. GoogleEarth and VirtualEarth only have old images taken during construction.

    I had heard the rumours of a Caribbean haunted mansion at some point so I took that into account in my armchair imagineering . Having Pirates and HM in the same land is of course not a new idea...all they would have to do is to take the template for New Orleans Square, and substitute Island / Colonial architecture and ambience.
    GE and VE would be wise to keep their repective sites updated if they expect people to continue to hit them for information.

    Quote Originally Posted by GhostHost2 View Post
    And if these were unique and excellent versions of Haunted Mansion and POTC, I would become much more interested in HKDL. With what little HKDL offers, they need to act quick. They should make everything be the best quality possible, while adding more than one major attraction a year. After HM and POTC, I would like to see a BTM (or something comparable) and an Indiana Jones Adventure (with at least a slightly different story while still being an EVC Indy ride, like TDS's compared to DL's).

    Also Peter Pan needs to be like the DL version with it's short drops and star field, only longer. They also need a couple of more classical style dark rides. I would love to see Mr. Toad get a new Wild Ride in HKDL.

    What the park needs:
    Unique POTC
    Unique HM
    Unique Indiana Jones Adventure
    Mr. Toad's Wild Ride
    Peter Pan's Flight
    A unique BTM like coatser

    Unique versions of 4 of my favorite E-Tickets, plus new versions of 2 of my favorite D Tickets, would make me really want to go.
    According to rumor (and as previously stated), POTC and Haunted Housewould be original attractions.

    So far, the EVC rides have been different at each park - DL's Indiana Jones Adventure and TDS's Crystal Skull have different storylines, props and effects, while DAK's Dinosaur is a different ride all together. there's no reason to think that any HKDL Indy ride wouldn't be a breed of it's own as well.

    Fortunately, we still have Mr. Toads Wild Ride at Disneyland. It's one of the wonderful things that makes DL unique.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sir_Cliff View Post
    I concur.

    I get the impression that lots of possibilities have been discussed but they're completely dependant on how negotiations with the government go and all indications are that they aren't going well. Discussing this or that possible future attraction seems pointless right now beyond "armchair imagineering" discussions. I'd say all bets are off for the time being.
    It's far too early to be so pesimistic. The Walt Disney Company's overall worldwide net profits are way up. The company is gaining international influence - not losing it. Should Disney decide that it wants to spend millions more on new e-tickets, a Downtown Disney district, etc, I doubt that the Chinese government will stand in the way - regardless of an unimpressed public thus far.

    According to recent news, the Chinese government recently implimented new airline routes between itself and India. They did this in part to facilitate better access to it's Hong Kong parks. I would hardly call that "giving up".

    Quote Originally Posted by Witches of Morva View Post
    ORDDU: Well, I'm sure that Ride Warrior isn't claiming that what he's heard is a definite, dyed in the wool, green-lighted plan by Disney. He's merely sharing what he's heard--which is the same thing Mr. Lutz does on MiceAge. (Of course he, too, is often crucified for daring to share his information.) But anyone reading the content of message boards, such as these, should automatically know that these kinds of threads are often speculations--which, personally, I and my sisters enjoy reading.

    ORWEN: We're sure not going to hold anyone's feet to the fire about rumors that don't come true--

    ORGOCH: --less'n they turns out ta be a bunch a trouble makers just yankin' our chains. In that case we'll hex 'em from now 'til Ping Pong Dizzyland is a decent park!
    You pretty much read my like a book ladies. My intent is to offer information that is uplifting and fun to discuss.. Other than IASW being built, all the rest is rumor. I have made that clear. I do so hope that IASW will be a non-cloned original - according to what has been indicated. This is certainly not the only rumor-based thread in MC's TDL section. Each of them have lent themselves to fascinating conversations and conjectures.

    In the absence of news and rumors threads, about all that would appear in this section is trip reports - primarily from the same people.

    Quote Originally Posted by ROBONICS95 View Post
    I agree...

    The overhaul for DCA was talked about years before Disney formerly announced it. I still feel that if the housing issue had not been brought up, it would still be considered rumor and Disney would have waited a couple of more years to announce these projects as official.

    When the web was buzzing over the DCA rumors, I remember a lot of the same 'Disney failed and will continue to let the park fail' thoughts were shared on the boards. And yet, here we are with a formerly announced $1 billion 'fix it' project.

    Not to say that it is just easy for HKDL to receive the same treatment, but it would be quite welcomed to see Disney give HKDL the much-needed attention it deserves, as they have for the two other struggling parks across the globe.

    It is very refreshing to read an optimistic thread every now and then...

    Thanks for the information Ride Warrior, keep it coming!
    Will do ROBONICS. Thank you for your insightful optimism as well. Let's hope Disney and the government work together to make HKDL a world class resort. Should things turn around, China's 57% ownership and disney's 43% stake could become an annual fiscal windfall for both parties - not to mention a cultural rose that attracts nothing but good will.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sir_Cliff View Post
    I didn't mean to imply that people shouldn't post rumours, just that at the moment everything seems to be so up in the air that I don't personally pay much attention to any of them.

    A fundamental difference between DCA and HKDL is that Disney owns DCA and can ultimately plow as much or as little into developing it as they want, so as ideas gather momentum within the company they have a greater chance of becoming reality. HKDL's future is so beholden to the political climate in Hong Kong right now that it seems quite unpredictable when, how much or if funding will be approved for new attractions and not even Disney can do much about that.
    According to the New York Times, Disney's revenue from the past year has rose 21%, from $1.72 billion to $2.08 billion. This is primarily due to stateside profits and the worldwide animated feature film success. Again, i doubt that the Chinese government will attempt to throw a wrench into any major investing that Disney may wish to do in order to improve HKDL.
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  12. #42

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    Re: It's A "Different" Small World + Rumored Major Attractions + Downtown Disney

    Quote Originally Posted by ROBONICS95 View Post
    Points well taken, Sir Cliff. I agree that it may be a bit more difficult for Disney to take charge and make a commitment to help HKDL. Both the bright and gloomy outlooks for HKDL are circulated around word of mouth and I feel that both have a fair bit of truth behind them.

    I simply choose to support the brighter outlook and am hoping for the best
    I am the brighter outlook.
    To Boldly Go Where No MiceChatter Has Gone Before!


  13. #43

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    Re: It's A "Different" Small World + Rumored Major Attractions + Downtown Disney

    Quote Originally Posted by Ride Warrior View Post
    I am the brighter outlook.
    You have my support...
    "If you build it right, they will come." - Bob Iger

    "I'm not a literary person. As far as realism is concerned, you can find dirt anyplace you look for it. I'm one of those optimists. There's always a rainbow." - Walt Disney



    "I don't care about critics. Critics take themselves too seriously. They think the only way to be noticed and to be the smart guy is to pick and find fault with things. It's the public I'm making pictures for." - Walt Disney

  14. #44

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    Re: It's A "Different" Small World + Rumored Major Attractions + Downtown Disney

    ORDDU: You have our support, too, Ride Warrior, dear. Feel free to let us know what you've heard because we enjoy mulling over the speculations. A lot of them actually DO come true. In this particular case, Hong Kong Disneyland NEEDS them to come true!

  15. #45

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    Re: It's A "Different" Small World + Rumored Major Attractions + Downtown Disney

    Quote Originally Posted by tasman View Post
    ^^ Well HK govt would not prevent Disney from investing more in the park if Disney wanted to, would they? When HKDL opened, didn't HK govt invest something like $ 3.2 billion and Disney about $ 300 million? (Most of the govt's money went to the landfill.) But if f I remember correctly Disney owns 47% of HKDL. So as I see it HK govt has done its part but Disney hasn't done theirs.

    As far as posting rumours...a little armchair imagineering never hurt. Of course nothing has been confirmed beyond Small World and we know that. With the pace at which things have been moving I think 2010 is the earliest we can expect anything significant at HKDL...more likely 2011.
    Absolutely not. The government would not prevent any effort on Disney's part to turn the park around. I believe that we'll see big things happening between 2009 and 2010.

    Quote Originally Posted by ROBONICS95 View Post
    The HK Government owns 57%, Disney 43%

    Someone else can probably explain this in greater detail but I think the primary concern is how much the government is willing to allow Disney to invest. As Disney continues to inject into HKDL they continue to increase their holding percentage. The government may lose a majority of the ownership and may not be willing to accept such a position.

    I think
    If the percentage of ownership would change based on disney's increased investment, the government would likely renegotiate in order to keep it close as possible to the current ratio. The current percentage ratio would bring plenty of return profit gains should said investment pay off. The implementation of current runored attractions would more than get the park on it's feet. Plus, the percentage may naturally remain the same anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sir_Cliff View Post
    I've had this thought as well. Disney and the HK gvt didn't foot anything like 43% of the bill to construct the resort in the first place so it seems only fair now that the park Disney built is underperforming that it be Disney that pays most of the cost for new additions. It might even create some goodwill toward Disney in HK.

    And, yes, I do agree that a little armchair imagineering never hurt. The possibilities at HKDL are pretty much endless, though it will certainly be a while before anything significant gets built.
    Love your positive affirmation that new attraction possibilities at HKDL are virtually endless. However, you should not expect a repeat of the DCA mistake - even with the conjectured possibility of the government complicating the issue.
    To Boldly Go Where No MiceChatter Has Gone Before!


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