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  1. #91

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    Re: 6/26: Bon Voyage?

    Quote Originally Posted by sediment View Post
    Again, the solution is simple: Stop selling (and including) heavily discounting parking with AP's!
    That will raise the number of passengers per vehicle, and no further creating of new problems to fix old ones.

    Easier said than done. They still need to create new spots regardless of APs. If a third park is going to be built, they'll need more spots all around to accommodate guests coming to THREE of their parks and shopping.


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  2. #92

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    Re: 6/26: Bon Voyage?

    Hello. Long time lurker and first post here. I'm a current AP holder living in San Diego. I'm a mid 20's guy that has always had a special place in my grim heart for Disneyland

    It'll be very very interesting to see how the next year plays out for Disney in Anaheim. I've been one that's paid the daily one park fee (70-ish American dollars) for a few years now and gladly shelled out the 500 for the Premium I now hold. In this time, I believe I've gained a higher understanding of what I expect out of Disney and what they expect us, the consumer, to be content with. Thankfully, they've been listening and exploring these options Mr. Lutz has shared with us.

    First off, Car Land is indeed amazing. I've been fortunate enough to visit twice since it's opening and the sources don't lie, it is outperforming. The shops are in need of merchandise and 2+ hour waits for every ride is outstanding demand. Bravo for pulling out the stops on designing a very immersive land and a very impressive ride in RSR. The animatronics are topnotch and may even put Little Mermaids to shame a tad.

    That being said, the bigger news now is where do they go from here? Smart business demands a probation period to see if DCA can sustain the crowd attracting and crowd holding abilities it has flawlessly demonstrated in the two weeks since. As nature dictates, we will always be looking ahead to the next best thing even when it's less than a month old and staring right at us. Disneyland is in need of the TLC Disney has demonstrated that it is still very capable of delivering.

    I rode Autopia this past Sunday. My girlfriend and I were discussing this very topic. That it was a "crappy, dated ride" that "made it look like a back woods carnival attempt at delivering Cars Land". The argument could be made that in a few years you could place a new electric Autopia where Bugsland currently sits. In fact you might not even need to rip ALL of Bugsland out.

    In all actuality I hate the idea of simply "moving attractions" to DCA as if it were as easy as packing it into neatly labeled boxes and setting up shop all over again. Autopia. Roger Rabbit. etc. But be as it may, Autopia would fit lovely in between the Bugs and the Cars. The bottom line though.. Autopia needs to go. I'm no cherisher of nostalgia (although you will see me cry and whine when Indiana Jones gets ripped out for the next new fangled attraction) so this decision comes easy to me. Those long lines you see today? It's because half the ride is backed up with riders waiting 5-10 minutes behind the pits to disembark which leaves inexcusable wait times for those still waiting to ride. I see it every time I ride them and make no mistake, Autopia is NOT a people mover as Pirates and Haunted Mansion and The Little Mermaid are. So goodbye crappy backwoods Cars knockoff.

    The Subs are in a similar predicament. Bad wait times for a slow loading ride. A quick retelling of a great movie that doesn't do it justice. I will be happy to see the Subs go. I've been on them before and after the Nemo update and fortunately, I don't let nostalgia get in the way of an inefficent ride.

    Innoventions? Enough said. We are all inagreement.

    Space Mountain needs ALOT of love. But mostly in the queue, to be absolutely honest. It's one of the worst and unthemed in all of the parks. Specifically the outside and it gets really hot in the afternoons. Whoever made the comment about a 60's-70's SoCal mall hit the nail on the head. Tomorrowland reeks of it. Star Tours could use some monitors or something in the pre-queue area with all the pretty planets. Buzz is Buzz and really just needs a new coat of paint. Maybe some new interior queue work with more dazzling displays.

    My biggest problem is the Astro Orbiter. Why did it EVER move down from it's lofty perch? If there is any nostalgia inside me, it rests firmly inside those spinning rocket ships. That needs to be moved back up ASAP. And then rip out the People Mover tracks so everyone can let it die the quick death it deserves and not the slow one it's been rotting in for a while now. Actually, rig up some lightcycles and let it be a kinetic racing display adding more light and movement to what used to be THE place to chill at night and soak in the ambiance.

    Do I have any ideas as to what you can use 20% of Disneylands land for? No. But I know that my faith in Disney is being restored. I know they can rebuild and revitalize what should be the #1 or #2 land in the park.

  3. #93

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    Re: 6/26: Bon Voyage?

    Welcome to MiceChat, Grimmetal! Thanks for your thoughtful first post and we look forward to more!


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  4. #94

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    Re: 6/26: Bon Voyage?

    Keep one sub that is all I want

  5. #95

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    Re: 6/26: Bon Voyage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Baloo View Post
    The reconfiguration of the monorail would not be too much of a problem. They could easily find a way of moving the load area to edge of park and making a platform that could be used as a train station on first level and monorail on second level.
    I just wanted to say that this is a brilliant idea.
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  6. #96

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    Re: 6/26: Bon Voyage?

    Well, Well, Well. Getting rid of the subs. I think it is a great idea. The vintage ride was better than the current. I don't know if it really and truly was or if I am just remembering it that way with childhood nostalgia. I also remember Autotopia with nostalgia because it was so thrilling to be able to drive a car at that age. My kids have all had the same reaction so I hate to see it disappear entirely. Why not make a smaller version of Autotopia over at Cars Land and make the cars look like ones from the movies? Every little kid would love that and stand in line for hours to drive them. They could replace Luigi's with it because that ride (I'm very sorry) was lame (in my opinion) from what I saw last week when I visited DCA.

    The issue with the closed doors on Buena Vista Street. I went to immerse myself in BVS while my family was on a ride and kept encountering closed doors. It was very strange. I thought the shops were closed. Especially when I tried one door and it was locked. When I finally got in the first thing I thought was, "Why aren't the doors propped open?" I actually tried to do that to one. I thought maybe they had just forgotten. Maybe some door men could stand outside and invite people in - that would probably cost more in man hours than keeping the doors open.

    I must say one thing that has nothing to do with Al's post. I was sorry to see the pot pies disappear from the Carnation menu.

    Wonderful post, can't wait to hear more on the subject of DL expansion.

  7. #97

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    Re: 6/26: Bon Voyage?

    Quote Originally Posted by bfdf55 View Post
    TDA shouldn't be surprised with the success of Carsland. AND, they had better not let it go to their heads. This enormous attendance boost will eventually settle down. The critical point will be after a year, when most everyone will have experienced the area.
    You know what would have made it even more successful? Each guest paying about $60 to enter DCA.
    Let's see....
    $60*30000 = $1,800,000
    $1,800,000*365 = $657 million.
    So, 1.5 years to recoup construction investment.

    Lots of money taken off the table due to the one thing causing every problem in the DLr.

    ---------- Post added 06-28-2012 at 12:38 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Coheteboy View Post
    Easier said than done. They still need to create new spots regardless of APs. If a third park is going to be built, they'll need more spots all around to accommodate guests coming to THREE of their parks and shopping.
    Well, the traffic will be a lot worse.
    I'll have to check past updates, but Al says the guests per car number has increased a lot in the past few years. If there are half as many guests per car, that means twice as many cars for the same number of guests. Only one way to get that back to "traditional" Disneyland metrics. It would take a year to fully implement. Renewals would simply say that the parking pass is not included, here's a drop in the price, oh, and this is the last AP you'll be able to renew. Thanks!
    (That last part is my dream.)
    Last edited by sediment; 06-29-2012 at 02:37 PM.
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  8. #98

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    Re: 6/26: Bon Voyage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimmetal View Post
    My biggest problem is the Astro Orbiter. Why did it EVER move down from it's lofty perch? If there is any nostalgia inside me, it rests firmly inside those spinning rocket ships. That needs to be moved back up ASAP. And then rip out the People Mover tracks so everyone can let it die the quick death it deserves and not the slow one it's been rotting in for a while now.
    There will be no official Disney accounting of this story, yet when I worked in the park in the 90's I heard from a highly placed source at WDI the Astro Jets were moved for two reasons. The entire platform structure holding both the People Mover and Astro Jets is cracked and cannot withstand the force placed upon it by the newer version of the Astro Jets. Additionally the elevators were slow loaders and did not do a good job at moving people through the que. Those two factors moved the Astro Jets to the entry way of Tomorrowland. To move the Astro Jets back to their original location require a demolition, removal, and a new platform to be engineered to withstand the extra weight of the New Astro Jets.

    Given the popularity of the spinner type attractions, chances are we will see a newer higher version of the beloved attraction in a New Tomorrow land.

  9. #99

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    Re: 6/26: Bon Voyage?

    I think they should still keep the Autopia, but update it like have in HKDL. As for nemo, I would wait for it, because I think it still has some time left.



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  10. #100

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    Re: 6/26: Bon Voyage?

    Here are my thoughts:

    NO.

    Even though it takes up lots of real estate, why would they get rid of Autopia? Walt himself rode it if I recall correctly, and I still have yet to drive an Autopia car on my own because I'm so darn short.

    And the Marvel theme park? That would be great anywhere else, but it's way too tacky for Disney.

    So no.

  11. #101

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    Re: 6/26: Bon Voyage?

    Quote Originally Posted by AarontheEpic View Post
    And the Marvel theme park? That would be great anywhere else, but it's way too tacky for Disney.

    So no.

    You're lacking vision. We've only seen superheroes executed so far by Universal Studios Orlando and all the roller coasters at Six Flags Magic Mountain (and the other Six Flags). I highly doubt Disney will duplicate the mistake that was DCA 1.0 and screw up a Marvel park.

    I personally don't think there's enough strong content for an ENTIRE Marvel park though and you would be limiting your audience by doing so. It should have a mix of Marvel and other things that no longer fit the themes of Disneyland and DCA.


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  12. #102

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    Re: 6/26: Bon Voyage?

    Love the idea about re- purposing the areas of the subs and autopia and innovations,With a little re-design ,The monorail could be themed into the area with no problem, it is still very popular and the only way off property to downtown D. Like Walt always said Disneyland will constantly changing and re-inventing itself, He knew that change was good and as long as the ride was relevant then it would be around for guest to enjoy,why keep something that isn't really relevant anymore.Tomorrowland is about things to expect in the future,Autopia is way overdue for change along with the rest cited for removal,including the subs the were great for the time and now need to go they just don't fit in Tomorrowland anymore,time to move on! With the nice way Carsland turned out I for one think Lassiter is moving in the right direction,Walt would be proud of what WDI have turned out.Great job so far, as for a third park yes yes yes ! There can never be enough Disney, if you can't fit an idea into a certain land you got to create a new one to hold it! So, put forth a new plan and go with it, if you build it they will come!

  13. #103

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    Re: 6/26: Bon Voyage?

    Quote Originally Posted by BuzzedLightyear View Post
    Agree about Paradise Pier Hotel. I don't know much about architecture, but couldn't you level Paradise Pier Hotel and the Lion King Parking lot back there, and build a giant underground structure with hotels and a DTD expansion at ground level? For example:

    Attachment 21317
    Great idea! I have seen many good ones in this thread and this one stands out. I have seen this concept in practical use at City Center in Las Vegas (with the modern and nifty lights and numbers that tell you where to park, something M&F parking structure needs IMO>)

    ---------- Post added 07-01-2012 at 06:58 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by chesirecat View Post
    Hong Kong Disneyland's Autopia

    Autopia HKDL HD by Dolbyman - YouTube
    LOL! Litteral Chinese Fire Drill @ TP 2:00 LOVE IT!!! It is something one of my family members would do (before I scolded them for doing it!)

    ---------- Post added 07-01-2012 at 08:16 AM ----------

    My blue sky predictions…

    I think there will be some sort of autopia, it will be pushed to the northwest towards FL (and may even become part of it). It will be in the area of the former motor boat cruise.

    The lagoon will still be a major feature in TL. It will be the climax to a water ride (though the lagoon is much deeper than any climax at any theme park water ride currently in existence …recycling would be a great thing on more than one level). This ride will most likely be an aqua coaster.

    The hotel at the transit terminal will be built over the existing terminal, and this terminal will be made much more efficient. The hotel will be connected to DCA (HL) and DL (TL). I think (in my blue sky theory) that the TL expansion won’t just be to the north of the subs, it will push downward to meet the new hotel. If the TL modifications don’t extend that far south and the back stage is still needed, there is room for the new hotel to have its own gate just north/inside of the berm near the right entry tunnel.

    Monorail will stop at this new hotel as well as GCH. Despite being such a short distance between stops, it will work rather well b/c a new line will run south to the third gate with access to the parking structure at AGW. This will essentially make the lower levels of this new hotel a transit hub.

    People Mover will be demo’d once and for all. Even though it is part of many show buildings, it will not be an issue. Just the outer segments will be torn down and the inner segments will be walled off.
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  14. #104

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    Re: 6/26: Bon Voyage?

    I believe that Tomorrow land needs to be upgraded, but the submarine voyage ride is such a part of the fabric of Disneyland, like the Matterhorn ride or the Monorail and as such it would be a big mistake to take them out. Hasn't the new management team learned a lesson from the last management teams past mistakes when they took out the submarines and only to find out later how the people were outraged for them being taken out.
    Last edited by sfcrzer; 07-01-2012 at 03:52 PM.

  15. #105

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    Re: 6/26: Bon Voyage?

    Like Walt, I'm a big fan of nostalgia, but the subs have been a pale shadow of their former selves for years. Autopia in its current form is smelly and cumbersome, and the success of RSR seems likely to make Autopia suffer by comparison. It seems like the time has come to pull the plug on both and start fresh.

    I wonder if some of the freed-up real estate might be used to expand Fantasyland, as well. It's a jewel as-is, but some of the older rides are slower loaders. I guess they wouldn't make any decisions about that until they see how the WDW Fantasyland expansion goes.

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