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  1. #31

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    Re: 7/3: The Party's Over

    Quote Originally Posted by nursemelis374 View Post
    The last time we went there were a ton of locals that were so annoying! They kept yelling things out and kind of ruined the show for us. It was almost like they thought they were "cooler" than everyone else because they knew all the lines and had beena million times. Trust me. These people were not "cooler". At one point my friend looked at me and said, "Is this how we act as Disneyland locals?" I certainly don't think so.

    I also was interested to see so many children in there, especially when I felt there were definite adult themes throughout the show.
    Sure, there's adult themes the same themes they can get by watching primetime TV (or less).

    As for the locals, I thought that was what made it fun as well. Sure it was the same shtick every night, but the visitors and cast we're having a great time. But when you've got a dedicate group of people that are really into it, it breaks the ice and you can laugh and Kongaloosh your way to a great evening. It had a fun theme, some cute shows, and overall it was the most 'adult Disney' experience at WDW you could have.
    -Monorail Man

  2. #32

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    Re: 7/3: The Party's Over

    This was a good article Kevin, but it does have a few inaccuracies which I must correct. First of all, the clubs at Pleasure Island are not losing money, they are making money. In fact, Keven Lansberry the VP who announced the closing of the clubs said that himself in the press release. The criminal events you mentioned all occurred on the West Side, not Pleasure Island. I know the local media reported some of the events incorrectly and said they took place on Pleasure Island, but I know someone in security at DTD and ALL of these events took place at the West Side.
    This is a huge decline of degrees in many ways. The clubs had grown old and stagnant because Disney refused to spend any money on them to update them and keep them current. BET leaks every time it rains by the rest rooms and they have to repaint the wall repeatedly there. If you live in central Florida, you know it rains every day in the summer. When furniture gets damaged or broken in the Adventurer's Club it is not replaced or repaired. They have always squeezed every penny they could get out of Pleasure Island and have not (in the past 5 - 6 years at least) reinvested in the product. The locals quit coming as much to Pleasure Island because Disney stopped having special events and concerts. There were regularly scheduled event every year (Latin Rythym Nights, Jazz Fest, Mardi Gras...etc) that Disney just stopped having any more. There were special events like Corvette Summer, Decades of Dance, etc which were only scheduled in the summer months which were very popular with the locals. They stopped these as well. The New Year's Eve every night did not really attract the locals but it attracted the visiting guests at the resort. They stopped that too. They also stopped marketing Pleasure Island at all. There were live radio broadcasts on the weekends live from PI, there were radio and TV commercials, Billboards, tables set up at conventions and at Spring Break at Daytona special tickets, etc. All of this stopped. The last marketing effort they had for Pleasure Island was Carpe P.M. Sieze the Night! That ended in 2001 and was never replaced with anything else. Every Disney resort bus used to have adds for Pleasure Island in them and every bus had a tag on the front which read "Pleasure Island Tonight". Pleasure Island had something for everyone when it opened. It had Videopolis East (which later changed to CAGE, and then to 8-Trax), X-Frs Rock and Rollerdrome which had the roller skating rink for the kids while the parents could purchase alchohol on the first floor (there was no access to the first floor from the second floor at the time) and the parents and the kids could enjoy the music together in the same place. Until 2007, parents could take their kids with them into some of the dance clubs as long as they stayed with them at all times (I know people argue this was wrong, but think about it The parents are on vacation and they of course have their kids with them at WDW. They don't want to leave their kids with strangers and they wanted to party. So, they had that option. If you didn't want your kids exposed to that environment, Disney does have babysitting options at the resorts). All of these things were stopped and they were very popular.
    The Disney owned merchandise shops were closed a long time ago because they said no one purchased the merchandise. They did not purchase the merchandise because it was extremely ugly and over priced. For example, there was a T-Shirt with a huge green frog on it and it said Club Hop Non Stop! There was a Black and White striped sweater with glitter effects designed for men! The only merchandise they ever had that was appealing was a few of the baseball caps, but most of them were very strangely colored and were very unattractive. It was not that people did not want the merchandise, it was Disney management had no idea how to pick merchandise for that market.
    The closing of Pleasure Island is definitely a reflection of the horrendous management Disney has these days. For the past 3-4 years it has been obvious they had decided to close Pleasure Island and they had to just figure out how to do it. One way was to stop having special events, no marketing, and of course alienate the guests that were attending the clubs. They changed the age for all dance clubs to 21 but did not bother to inform the internet group, the resorts, or WDW information. So, the customers were constantly being told the old rules only to find out differently when they arrived at Pleasure Island. They removed the re-entry lines at the clubs to make every one have to go through a single file line and show their tickets again AFTER they aleady had a wristband for the clubs. The list goes on and on.
    Let's face it, alchohol is one of the highest profit items you can sell. Why do you think they have put it in every park except the MK and are constantly adding more places you can buy it all over the place? How many companies would die to be able to have access to the Disney customers with night clubs? If the current management cannot keep these clubs open and turning a profit then we have a really BIG problem folks!
    So, that makes you ask yourself what is really going on here? Do you really think if Disney wanted to increase the profits Pleasure Island makes they would not just simply start having special events and concerts again? Or Maybe they can open a new club (people have been asking for a Latin club for years) or something? If you really think about it, the answer is YES! The problems with the undesireable elements hanging out at DTD were made worse when they limited admission to 21 and above to the clubs. If the main problems are happening on the West Side and now they are turning Pleasure Island into more of the same, isn't that going to make the problem worse not better? YES! This change has nothing to do with making anything more family friendly or requests for more restuarants. If you think there is a shortage of restuarants in the Disney area, take a drive down US HWY 192. There are literally rows and rows of out of business restuarants. If there was a shortage of resturants on Disney property wouldn't people have left for 192 looking for other eating options? YES!
    This "needed change" is all about corporate greed! They think they can make more money if they have more third party locations at DTD. They do not care if it makes the customer experience more bland and lessens the quality of what the paying customers get for their money. If they did, they would not be closing Pleasure Island's unique clubs. All the clubs (with the exception of Motion) are unique. Besides the uniqueness of the Adventurer's Club and the Comedy Warehouse, where else can you go and dance on the world's largest rotating dance floor surrounded by over a million dollars worth of lighting and sound? Where can you go and dance to your favorite Madonna hit from 1982 or Donna Summer hit from 1978 and see the original video too? Where else can you go and experience live music (when Rock and Roll Beach Club was still open) in a club and get your drink served to you in a Beach Bucket? And all of this was for one price of around $20. If you go to downtown Orlando, you will have to park down some dark alley, walk through all kinds of undesireable people, pay around $10 for ONE club, and get inside a run down dump!! Pleasure Island also offered Free transportation to and from the paying customers hotel which kept who knows how many drunks and lost tourists off the central Florida streets! Any way you look at this, Pleasure Island is a perfect venue for Walt Disney World. If you are managing a property like that and cannot make it work, then you really should not be managing anything for any company anywhere! The upper management can continue to ignore what the paying customers want and replace it with short term gains for only so long. There was another very large American company that used to do that.....General Motors! Look at how well that business plan has worked out for them! Oh, and one more thing, there is still an option for the kids under 21 at DTD, it is Disney Quest. Even though a one day ticket to Disney Quest is around $40 and Pleasure Island admission is only around $20, the same plus option on your multiple day tickets will work for admission to both locations.
    .So the only problem seems to be that more people shop and spend money at the Marketplace instead of the West Side. So, maybe everyone doesn't need a refrigerator magnet or new glasses, or a new magic trick!!! The problem is they don't have shops that appeal to the larger audience as the Market Place does. That is not Pleasure Island's fault, it is the upper managements fault that has the final decision over which third party locatioins are at the West Side. Since Pleasure Island was built before the West Side and they destroyed the walkway from the West Side to the Market place, the design problem really isn't at Pleasure Island. It is at the West Side. So if anything needs to be redeveloped to supply the needs of the paying customers, it is the West Side. Correct me if I am wrong, but I a pretty sure you can tether a Hot Air Balloon at the West Side just as easily as the Market Place or Pleasure Island. Another thing that makes no sense is that they tore down the West End Stage at Pleasure Island and now they are building a new version of it at the Market place! All I see from all of this is an upper management that has no plan, no vision, no idea what their customer wants, and pretty much no common sense. I really think the closing of Pleasure Island should be topic number 1 at the next Stock holder meeting for a full explanation for all of this. If they cannot provide a reasonable explanation, maybe we need a major shakeup in upper management and replace the bean counters with the ones who really do care about the paying guests and the what is best for the overall customer experience, instead what will get them a bigger bonus becuase of short lived short term gains in third party leases. This is very sad indeed. Now, if these new shops and restuarants don't do well, what are they going to do next? I thinking we are getting past the tipping point where customers will just choose to take their vacations elsewhere since Disney apparently does not care or does not want to provide them with the entertainment options they want on vacation. If people don't want to go to clubs and drink alchohol when they are on vacation with their kids, why are there clubs on both the Disney Wonder and Disney Magic?

  3. #33

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    Re: 7/3: The Party's Over

    Thanks for writing that Walle! I think that's a much more accurate view than the article that inspired it.

    WDW has so much space available, and it should have a wide variety of exclusive entertainment venues to appeal to the wide variety of people that DO visit WDW! To just turn some of the most unique attractions that WDW offers, into a generic shopping mall is a certain way to kill off repeat visits. Of course, not adding and not updating Pleasure Island was a great way to try and manage it into non-existance. BUT the weird thing is that The Adventurers Club remained popular, even with management giving up on Pleasure Island. So instead, Disney has to kill it off, instead. BAD MANAGEMENT!

  4. #34

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    Re: 7/3: The Party's Over

    I just got a call from WDW Guest Relations regarding a letter (unrelated to PI) I'd sent them a while back. Toward the end of the call, the cast member ran through some standard questions, including whether or not we plan to return to the resort (actually, they know we're DVC, so the question was more like "when"). I brought up PI's closure as a factor - we'd planned to go back in June next year, but are re-thinking that since a major part of that visit would have been PI-based, and that obviously is no longer an option. She said she was also disappointed by the closure.

    She also said that, just this morning, they were issued a memo regarding PI. She was kind enough to read it to me - it was intended to help inform guests (e.g., it wasn't an internal-only memo), and is clearly a reaction to all the buzz about Adventurer's Club.

    In short, it said that some of the new PI venues will be "immersive, character-based dining and nightlife" (with a note that "character" doesn't necessarily mean Mickey et al). The memo specifically answered two common questions: Will Adventurer's Club still be closing (yes)? Will the A.C. building be renovated (no - it will be demolished). The memo specific prohibits further comment or speculation by cast when conversing with guests, but it seems as if Disney's not unaware of the popularity of A.C. and Comedy Warehouse and has plans to bring something along those lines to the new PI.

    It doesn't mention if these will be Disney-owned venues, or some third-party effort - like a "murder mystery" dinner or some other thing. But, Disney certainly likes to hold things like this close to the vest - it's possible that this re-do of PI will bring something even more beloved. Certainly, more seems to be on the table than just pure shopping and dining.

  5. #35

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    Re: 7/3: The Party's Over

    How could they not be aware of the popularity? It's on their property.


  6. #36

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    Re: 7/3: The Party's Over

    I recall being at PI often during the day (usually on my way from Marketplace to West End) and found the whole stretch of shuttered facades and darkened signage a bit odd. I think the whole area would have been better suited to have been more out of the way. I suppose this was more the case before opening up the island as a thoroughfare.

    Still, I will greatly miss Comedy Warehouse and the Cast of fantastic comedians and pianists that entertained me time and again. I am sad to see it go and do hope to see more fun, improv performances put into the park along the lines of DUH (Dept. of Untapped Hilarity) at DCA.
    I worked at Walt Disney World as a member of the Disney College Program in Spring 2008 and Summer 2010. Now, I build software, design live events, and frequently make the short trek from Costa Mesa to Disneyland with my Annual Passport in hand.

  7. #37

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    Re: 7/3: The Party's Over

    Quote Originally Posted by swrdfghtr View Post
    I just got a call from WDW Guest Relations regarding a letter (unrelated to PI) I'd sent them a while back. Toward the end of the call, the cast member ran through some standard questions, including whether or not we plan to return to the resort (actually, they know we're DVC, so the question was more like "when"). I brought up PI's closure as a factor - we'd planned to go back in June next year, but are re-thinking that since a major part of that visit would have been PI-based, and that obviously is no longer an option. She said she was also disappointed by the closure.

    She also said that, just this morning, they were issued a memo regarding PI. She was kind enough to read it to me - it was intended to help inform guests (e.g., it wasn't an internal-only memo), and is clearly a reaction to all the buzz about Adventurer's Club.

    In short, it said that some of the new PI venues will be "immersive, character-based dining and nightlife" (with a note that "character" doesn't necessarily mean Mickey et al). The memo specifically answered two common questions: Will Adventurer's Club still be closing (yes)? Will the A.C. building be renovated (no - it will be demolished). The memo specific prohibits further comment or speculation by cast when conversing with guests, but it seems as if Disney's not unaware of the popularity of A.C. and Comedy Warehouse and has plans to bring something along those lines to the new PI.

    It doesn't mention if these will be Disney-owned venues, or some third-party effort - like a "murder mystery" dinner or some other thing. But, Disney certainly likes to hold things like this close to the vest - it's possible that this re-do of PI will bring something even more beloved. Certainly, more seems to be on the table than just pure shopping and dining.
    Sorry to hear you were just fed a bunch of corporate b.s. that is only meant to fend off loyal Adventurers Club members, of which there are likely a number who are DVC members as well. And of course she is sorry to hear that you are dissappointed, because they have to work with you through this obviously ignorant decision and the obvious smoke and mirrors that Disney management is doing now.

    And just to add, the way management is handling WDW is really a big concern for its long term future. Especially with Universal gearing up for Harry Potter, and WDW not even trying to keep up with the properties it already "manages".

  8. #38

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    Re: 7/3: The Party's Over

    I remember ever since I first read about the Adventurer's Club wanting to visit it. Now that it's gone, coupled with the continual cloning of attractions at Disney World and Disneyland and adding in the purported lowering of food quality resort-wide, I don't really see a whole lot of reason for me to go to WDW anytime soon. Sorry, Disney. That's some of my money you won't be getting. I said as much in a letter to Disney World the other night, which I still have not received even a form letter reply to.
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  9. #39

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    Re: 7/3: The Party's Over

    First, I want to say that usually I tend to ignore posts from newbies especially those novel-sized jobs like Walle posted above. But guess what? A newbie who has his facts straight and who has the history to back it up. Well done.

    I don't want to regurgitate what walle posted or what I've already posted on other threads regarding this closure.

    But it's telling that most of Kevin's column and most of the responses were about the Adventurer's Club ... just one small part of what used to be Pleasure Island.

    Unfortunately, for the better part of the past decade AC has been -- largely -- the only 'must do' club for WDW regulars. That's because the rest of PI had long since grown stale, many favorites from the past (from the Fireworks Factory to the Neon Armadillo to Jessica's to the jazz club to the special events) have been gone so long that many can't recall them any more than they can Swan Boats or Explorer Canoes at the MK, midnight closures at EPCOT or Sorcery in the Sky at the Studios.

    PI died in the late 1990s when management decided it didn't want to reinvest, update and keep the place relevant.

    So it died ... a long, slow, agonizing death. This is the end game.

    What's left is some fans of one club bemoaning its death. And I agree with Kevin -- I already posted the opinion a few days ago -- that AC had become more Rocky Horror Picture Show than anything else. I used to love it, but frankly found many of the regulars there to be obnoxious of the same ilk as those who get in the stretchroom of the Mansion and start playing ghost host.

    So now what do you have? Not much. Not much at all.

    I would disagree with Kevin or anyone who says PI and nightclubs were/are bad ideas businesses for Disney. They aren't. PI was built to take clubbing to a different level and it did so for the better part of a decade.

    But it got old fast and, unlike EPCOT, Disney's investment wasn't great enough that pouring money into it made more sense than finally killing it.

    I don't like what Disney did. But this decision was started when Bubba was still in the White House.

    Crying over it now is a wasted effort.

    PI ... RIP.

  10. #40

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    Re: 7/3: The Party's Over

    A lot of the posts make it sound that Disney pulling the plug on PI means the demise of nightlife in DTD. I just don't see it that way. It is just the demise of Disney owned and operated nightlife in DTD.

    Many pointed to Disney not refreshing the clubs and giving folks something new as a major factor in PI's declining popularity. If that is the case, then Disney's move to being a property landlord and not a club owner should be viewed as a good thing.

    It will now be up to private individuals and companies to come up with new and exciting venues that they feel will work with the local and visitor market. It will then be up to them to "keep it fresh" and if not, they will close and something else will take their place.

    For those of you that are upset about the AC, I am sure if you invented a similar concept, approached Disney and were willing to shell out the rent like every other DTD shop, club, or restaurant, Disney would be thrilled to have you. Then it will be up to you to turn a profit and keep the place packed.

    Last time I was at WDW I stayed in the hotel village and every night downed more than my fair share of pints at Raglan Road. Why? Because that is the venue that appealed to me and my friends and I was very happy to pay the prices, drink the ale, and enjoy the atmosphere.

    Really, that is all we're talking about here, letting private operators come in and open up the types of operations that they feel will appeal to their target demographic and then let the customer decide.

    Capitalism at it's best. I'm glad for the change. There re a number of venues I really like in DTD and am glad to spend my money there, unfortunately the ones on PI were not them.

  11. #41

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    Re: 7/3: The Party's Over

    The Adventurers Club and the Comedy Warehouse are chock full of some of the most talented and entertaining performers in all of Central Florida and some of their alumni have gone on to be successful in much larger cities, such as New York and Los Angeles. Both clubs have had strong followings for years and whereas the dance clubs might have only five patrons on a slow weeknight, the Warehouse and AdvClub still have dozens upon dozens. Multiply that tenfold on busy weekend nights.

    A dance club is a dance club but there is nothing in the world that's similar to the Comedy Warehouse or, even much moreso, the Adventurers Club and it would be a shame to see them disappear. A petition has been started to try to "save" the Adventurers Club from being closed and destroyed and, as of this writing, has received over 4,000 signatures since its inception on June 28th. We all realize it's probably a long shot but anything is worth trying. If you could please add your name to the list, it would be appreciated.

    http://www.petitiononline.com/wdwaclub

    Here are some email addresses for those of you who many feel compelled to write a complaint:

    Bob Iger, Vice President of Operations, Walt Disney World
    [email protected]

    Kevin Lansberry, Vice President of Operations Downtown Disney
    [email protected]

    Barry Carlson, GM of Operations
    [email protected]

    Patsy Pederson, GM Guest Show
    [email protected]

    Kris Piser, DTD Finance Manager
    [email protected]

    Eric Johnason, Downtown Disney Business Relations
    [email protected]

    Christina Simeonides, Guest Service Manager, Downtown Disney Business Relations
    [email protected]

    ==========

    Snail mail sometimes has a bigger impact than email, so for those who are interested:

    Mr. Robert Iger
    Chief Executive Officer
    The Walt Disney Company
    500 South Buena Vista Street
    Burbank, CA 91521-4873

    Walt Disney World Guest Communications
    PO Box 10040
    Lake Buena Vista, FL 32830-0040

    Mr. James A. Rasulo
    Chairman
    Walt Disney Parks & Resorts
    500 South Buena Vista Street
    Burbank, CA 91521-4873

    Meg Crofton
    President
    The Walt Disney World Resort
    PO Box 10040
    Lake Buena Vista, FL 32830

    Al Weiss
    President
    Worldwide Operations
    Walt Disney Parks and Resorts
    PO Box 10000
    Lake Buena Vista, FL 32830

    It looks like the die is already cast and the venues will be gone after Sept. 27th, but for the sake of the performers and for the sake of their past, present and future audiences, I'm keeping my fingers crossed. There's always hope.

  12. #42

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    Re: 7/3: The Party's Over

    While I get why they want to close the clubs, I don't get the comedy places.

    Some solutions I could see would be to swap where the West End and PI are, or add a new sort of PI (though, I still see their conflict with that solution).

    I think what would be better is to close the clubs (maybe leave one), but leave the two comedy places. Keep the Adventurers club as is with a nominal fee or something similar, and change the comedy club to a family-friendly improv show. Improv does not have to be adult to be funny, can can actually often be made better without the "adult" aspects, which often rely on shock value through swearing.

    These things are unique. The entire area will now be shopping and food. While I enjoy good food, I can only do one of these locations a night, and it is very costly. I don't really like shopping, so that doesn't really appeal to me much.

    As to the article, I can understand not liking the AC and feeling that it is alot of inside jokes...but one must remember that all of those people were first timers at some point. My first (and, as it would seem, my only) trip to the AC was amazing, from being molested by a french maid and forced to bow to a talking wall to the general atmosphere. It was a great time, and one of my favorite memories there.

  13. #43

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    Re: 7/3: The Party's Over

    While I acknowledge that this thread is specifically in response to the closure of Pleasure Island, as a European I want to re-iterate that the problem with Disney and nightlife is not limited to Walt Disney World.

    Some of us are fans of what went on at Pleasure Island and some are not, but I've yet to see many people stand up and claim that the nightlife offering at Walt Disney World is perfect. The truth is that, after dark, most of what Disney has to offer is pretty weak. What's more, now that the parks both in the US and in France are cutting down on those extended nighttime hours, the problem is exacerbated. The lack of decent nighttime options is even more apparent now than it was a few years ago.

    In many ways the closure of Pleasure Island could be a good thing. What's needed is a selection of entertainment options that can open during the day and remain open until 1am or so. But, crucially, these locations need either big-brand appeal (a la House of Blues) or they need a revitalised, contemporary take on the Disney touch. I'm not talking "hip and edgy" like California Adventure. I mean a choice of restaurants, bars, shops, even video arcades or bowling...all of which adults, teens and kids can enjoy together. Something to do late at night that isn't the hotel restaurant or pool.

    This same need exists in Paris just as it exists in Florida. As another poster has mentioned, the potential must exist for huge profits in night-time entertainment, provided the offering is sufficiently exciting. At the moment Pleasure Island in Florida and Disney Village in Paris are so dire that no adult, teen or child in their right mind would spend substantial amounts of money in there. It's up to Disney to shake things up, and I hope they will use this opportunity to attempt a change.

  14. #44

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    Re: 7/3: The Party's Over

    WDW1974 and Kevin are both right this is a long time coming.. the PI that originally opened and the PI that we've had for the last 5-10 years are night and day.

    Disney didn't help PI... the drinking/dining options in DTD helped canabalize PI's own market.

    I'm not sure why Disney didn't promote 'adult outtings' more at their resorts. Coordinated promotion and publications in the resorts/transportation/PI systems to promote couples, parents, and singles to 'get away' for the evening. Disney had the means and the captive audience, but did not promote it's unified army. Babysitting, transportation, and ticketing all together.. A perfect model to let adults who may not think they can get away.. actually get away.

    All this emphasis on locals I'm not really convinced of... locals know of the location, Disney should have been fighting harder to get those out of towners out. Everyone has to eat.. and many like to go have drinks with or after dinner. The potential customers are out there.. by the thousands... Disney just didn't grab the opportunity.

    Part of it was the lack of real unique attractions and rebirth. Virtually every club needs to reinvent itself or constantly be running promotions to keep things fresh and people coming back. What makes or breaks any club is the crowd. Disney didn't pull the crowd.. and then that's a self-feeding cycle that goes further and further downhill.

    We never had any interest in the last few years I've been there on travel on going into the clubs because they were just like any other club and the crowd wasn't there. The same thing can be said of Citywalk... when there is no crowd, there is no point in going.

    And as for Orlando... its still quite a ways off in a cab and you need 'intel' to know where to go when. Disney total flubbed it by missing this opportunity to make both those things a non-issue for its guests.

    There still needs to be adult entertainment and dining in the complex. I think part of PI's problem is it was a bit too big in its own right. If Disney were to look at traditional promo patterns used by bars/clubs... I bet they could pull focused crowds into venues and grow with the demand. The problem today is you are overbuilt, and not promoting to pull the crowds.

    Maybe due to a thought that you can't promote this type of entertainment in a 'family' place... but I think that's a fallacy. No you don't promote 9am bloody mary parties... but why not make the afternoon spiels on the buses/etc promote the evening's entertainment for after the parks, etc?
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  15. #45

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    Re: 7/3: The Party's Over

    Kevin, I don't think it's fair to use the death of Club Paris as an example of the decline of Church Street. Have you been there recently? They just reopened up the world famous country saloon. It's beautiful. Plus, Club Paris was shuttered because of problems with company spokeswoman Paris Hilton, not because of a lack of foot traffic. The nightclub reopened as Dolce Nightclub. It's doing VERY well. Couple that with the other clubs on church street (a ultra-chic lounge opened up last year, there's ever-crazy Mako's, and many others), well, Church Street is more of a force today than it has been in a while. It's much more populated by locals than tourists, but just because it's off the tourist radar screen doesn't mean it is a major nightlife contender.

    As far as how other things go, House of Blues still is a nightclub at night, so there will still be one offering after these changes (service industry Sunday nights over there are well known in the Orlando area).

    It's really disappointing that they are shuttering the clubs. Granted there are MUCH better attended clubs downtown Orlando (which might be able to absorb the early 20's disney resort guest looking for something to do on a weekend)- but I see Universal really winning on this one. Why? Because over the years, Disney has been concentrating on the tween demographic (see the evolution of Tomorrowland as proof). Disney is removing the magnet for several annual events: college spring break, New Year's Eve, and lets face it, any on site guest awake after midnight.

    Also, this is alarming given the trend Disney has recently been on with downplaying the local market (I don't understand it either- given gas prices!). Kissimmee/Celebration residents are losing the local bar/club scene while their populations are increasing. When you couple this with other things such as the elimination of the dining program, Disney's really counting on the tourist market--- and given the economy, one must question why. Church street is no longer a threat because it is catering to the LOCALS market, and this market appears to not be the segment Disney's going after.

    Also, the markup on alcohol is enormous. Surely Disney will still have Epcot, but they are REALLY going to see a decrease in revenue from the register at the new custom hat shop versus what it brought in when it was placed on the bottom of the (personal favorite) Mannie's dance club.

    I don't see this as an intelligent move long term. The only way this makes sense is if the new downtown disney on Western Way fills this gap with clubs/bars.

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