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  1. #16

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    Re: An old friend may be returning...

    The problem isn't simulating the look or design, but the kinetics. Classic-era toons (Freleng, Clampett, Avery, et al.) derive from a world that is purely graphical. Mo-cap derives from the purely physical. Toons live in graphical dimensions that vary according to the toon. Mo-cap lives in the Newtonian universe.

    Much can be achieved by mo-cap to simulate other physics. But bottom line, Daffy Duck is drawn, not moved. His movement is a result of drawing. Mo-cap movement results in drawing.

    It'll be interesting to see what Zemeckis does.
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  2. #17

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    Re: An old friend may be returning...

    ^Correct. Computers can and do assist to a great degree in today's cel animation, but mocap is not an appropriate technology to be used if one is trying to recreate the look and feel of 1930's-40's classic animation. The only way to get that is to hire great animators who can still draw. They are out there.
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  3. #18

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    Re: An old friend may be returning...

    I agree it needs to be properly drawn, not all computer rendered. The older Toons flat out wouldn't look right - in the current Disney Channel crop of kid's shows like Mickey Mouse Clubhouse, the Fab Five in CGI just look wrong. Mickey should NEVER be done 'on the cheap'.

    But give the great animators the newest electronic tools to make the drawing part easier. The computer can do all the complex calculations for the In-Betweening, to make sure the base character stays positioned and framed when the camera is moving around - place a maquette exactly where the character needs to be in each frame, then give the CGI folks the tools to adjust the 'squash and stretch' and 'bounce' in full-speed playback so the motions are smooth.

    Then the animator doesn't have to be following and compensating for all the motions frame by frame, and can concentrate on bringing their drawings to life.

    Look at all the 'helicopter shots' in the ballroom for 'Beauty and the Beast' et al, where the computer keeps the ballroom in perspective and draws the background frame by frame. The computer can pull that stuff off a lot easier and faster than Peter Ellenshaw (glass-painting backgrounds) ever dreamed of.

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  4. #19

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    Re: An old friend may be returning...

    ^ Not to nitpick, but breakdowns and inbetweens are definitely where you don't want computers involved. If you're doing classic toons you don't want computers touching the shapes or the timing during the animation process -- both are the essence of the animator's performance and the character's personality.

    Where technology can help is in giving the animator instant feedback as a scene is being built ("electronic drawing boards/instant sweatbox"), calculating pans, freeing layout from field guides, that sort of thing.
    "With the acquisition of Marvel and now of Lucasfilm,
    Disney may have finally found the grail. You don't need
    imagination or art. All you need is a brand."

    - Neil Gabler


  5. #20

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    Re: An old friend may be returning...

    ^Yes, but if the Animator himself has the power to adjust those CGI inbetween drawings to get the movement right first, he can make the 'instant sweatbox' rough footage and play it through to see how it matches up with the live-action part - before wasting a lot of time making full drawings that don't work and end up being tossed.

    The final maquette in the CGI would only be the 'Rough Sketch' with proper angles and perspective (and sightlines so they are looking eye to eye) that they draw the animation on top of. And would automatically handle the 'registration marks' so it all composites seamlessly.

    I'm betting that this is one of those things that each artist would have to approach slightly differently to match their individual style.

    Like driving - Some people can just get in the car and GO!, others need to look at the road map for 30 seconds, and yet others have to make a detailed set of directions before they leave. And there's nothing wrong with any of that.

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  6. #21

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    Re: An old friend may be returning...

    While that's cool, I'm a little let down...


    For a second I was hoping that this was official confirmation of HBG. =/ oops.
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  7. #22

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    Re: An old friend may be returning...

    Let me first say: I LOVE Roger Rabbit! It's one of my all time favorite films. My friend and I decided that we're going to start evaluating if people are worth knowing or not based on their thoughts on that movie.

    That aside... I'm terrified at the idea of a second movie. It was too good the first time, too innovative, too new... I just feel like it'll lose all that with a sequel
    Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see a new Roger film (hell even new Roger shorts) but I just have so much fear that they won't do it right!! I mean did you see Alvin & the Chipmunks or any of those other films that tried to do what Roger did. They pale in comparison!

    Everything in this article is really old news anyway. They say it's new Zemeckis info, but it's a lot of the same stuff that's been going around for years. There have been two prequels written and never put into production. I just can't get my hopes up too much
    [/off soap box]

    To relate this back to the Disneyland topic, I'd really love if it just translated into more rides or walk around characters or any of that (just general Roger representation really)!


  8. #23

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    Re: An old friend may be returning...

    Quote Originally Posted by Walt Jr. View Post
    While that's cool, I'm a little let down...


    For a second I was hoping that this was official confirmation of HBG. =/ oops.
    Yeah, my first thought was "Hat box ghost! WANT!" But this is pretty cool, too.


  9. #24

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    Re: An old friend may be returning...

    Quote Originally Posted by SaraNoH View Post
    I wonder if in today's day and age, Jessica Rabbit will be even sluttier than before?! Yeah, that thought kinda scares me. Otherwise, sounds like a great idea to me!!
    Actually she's likely to be less slutty, due to the fact that the MPAA has in fact become stricter and more conservative since then where that sort of thing is concerned. Just recently, I was reading a discussion going over all the things that Roger Rabbit (the movie) wouldn't get away with if it was made today (wish I could find that again).

  10. #25

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    Re: An old friend may be returning...

    Already have the Rabbit talk going on here: http://micechat.com/forums/movies/11...-zemeckis.html

  11. #26

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    Re: An old friend may be returning...

    rather than bringing da judge back from the dead, as bruce stated, why not invent a new villain? like his twin brother? that way christopher lloyd can reprise the role of the villain?

  12. #27

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    Re: An old friend may be returning...

    Quote Originally Posted by DrMemory View Post
    Actually she's likely to be less slutty, due to the fact that the MPAA has in fact become stricter and more conservative since then where that sort of thing is concerned. Just recently, I was reading a discussion going over all the things that Roger Rabbit (the movie) wouldn't get away with if it was made today (wish I could find that again).
    Really? Yeah, if you could find that article, that'd be great! I'd be interesting in seeing what it says.

  13. #28

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    Re: An old friend may be returning...

    All this talk of a sequel and yet no mention (on this thread) yet of the contractual difficulties between Disney, Amblin and Gary Wolf that still seem to simmer 20 years on.
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