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  1. #46

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    Re: Disney Orders TWO new ships!

    Quote Originally Posted by Disneynut View Post
    M.

    I do know that with two aging ships, the goal has been to change the marketing message with the Magic and Wonder in future years to be more of an extension to WDW packages and start to cut out some of their stale itineraries. They will do more visits to Castaway Cay (such as double stops on the 2008 Wonder 4 night cruises) and make it more about an immersive Disney experience than a "cruise". Current talk is that they would keep Castaway Cay as an East Coast exclusive in order to lure people onto older ships.
    Now this is a real sad state of affairs. Those ships are by no means "aging" as they are less than 10 years old. Yet todays cruising public has been conditioned by the pissing match between Mickey Arison of Carnival and Richard Fain over at RCI that suddenly if your ship isn't less than three years old it's an "old" ship. Between that and the monsters RCI has been building.....bigger is not always better, and in fact, it's usually worse. Often times they are just packing in more pax with out the addition of any more public space, so the passenger space ration drops to a dismal value (such as with Princess' CROWN PRINCESS and CARIBBEAN PRINCESS), and service levels cannot be maintained on an ultra mega ship with hordes of people. The QM2 is the only giant ship I could ever stand to sail on, as it only holds 2,600 pax at 150,000 gross tons. It has the passenger space ratio of a much smaller ship and apparently never feels crowded.

  2. #47

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    Re: Disney Orders TWO new ships!

    One point: one of the new ships is DEFINITELY going to be based in LA ... again, people can question it all they want, but it is. And the ships are being built so they can fit thru the Canal.

    Another point: totally agree on the bigger isn't better deal. Took my first cruise on Explorer of the Seas (RCCL) which was the world's largest when built a few years ago. It was my worst cruise by far. It was like being on a floating mall/buffet/stadium with 4,000 plus of my least fave friends and their brats. It was not a good experience and can't compare to cruises I've had with Disney, Princess and NCL on much smaller ships.

    I wouldn't want Disney to ever go any larger than these two new ships.

  3. #48

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    Re: Disney Orders TWO new ships!

    i wont go on the huge mega ships. they have become nothing more than floating hotels. yes they have rock climbing walls, and ice rinks and such but they lose the feeling of being on a cruise. everyone is talking about hawaii and mexico and alaska but let me throw in another idea. Asia. one ship could sail throughout asian ports or even go to australia. Also remember that we amercans don't like to take trips of more than a week at a time, but europeans and south americans and asians tend to take longer vacations. Disney could market the line and product to a whole new group of families and still do very well.

  4. #49

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    Re: Disney Orders TWO new ships!

    The ships that RCI sails are nothing but giant floating amusement parks/shopping malls at sea. Rock Climbing walls, rollerblading paths, surfing, ice skating and in the center a giant shopping mall "The Royal Promendade"). I mean, who the hell wants to go to sea only to have a Johnny Rockets to dine at? (RCI thinks you do).

  5. #50

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    Re: Disney Orders TWO new ships!

    Mod note: can we finish with the "who knew what first" pissing match and get back on the topic of what is happening with the cruises please? Your cooperation in this matter is appreciated.

    Future "I told you so" posts will be moved to the litterbox, as the point has already been most resoundingly made.

  6. #51

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    Re: Disney Orders TWO new ships!

    i really hope one ship will stay in Europe for a Mediterranean Cruise during summer .
    HKDL : Done !!!

  7. #52

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    Re: Disney Orders TWO new ships!

    The Disney ships are going to be a right size. Not a monster, but not a sail boat. They will surely be impressive to look at. But I can't imagine how big some ships are going to get. Freedom is so massive, yet they have yet to unveil the even bigger Genesis species. Mind boggling.

  8. #53

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    Re: Disney Orders TWO new ships!

    I prefer the yacht approach that Windstar uses, myself. Sailing is more romantic and evocative. And, their smaller ships have several advantages over the floating hotels.

    http://www.windstarcruises.com/

  9. #54

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    Re: Disney Orders TWO new ships!

    Quote Originally Posted by DisneyMickey View Post
    The Disney ships are going to be a right size. Not a monster, but not a sail boat. They will surely be impressive to look at. But I can't imagine how big some ships are going to get. Freedom is so massive, yet they have yet to unveil the even bigger Genesis species. Mind boggling.
    IMO, there is no excuse for any ship to be over 100,000 GRT or more. I was even unhappy (as many ocean liner/ship enthusiasts were) when the QM2 was announced at 150,000 GRT. Although we love her, many of us still wish she were no more than about 80,000 GRT or thereabouts, and that is much larger than the original QUEEN MARY, QUEEN ELIZABETH, or NORMANDIE. QM2's saving grace from her size is her excellent passenger space ratio, and the fact that she continues to be a real ship, not some floating theme park/shopping mall on the seas, unlike what RCI builds.

  10. #55

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    Re: Disney Orders TWO new ships!

    Okay, you have had your "I told you so" moment? Congratulations to you on being right.

    I still believe it is an error on Disney's part as we have seen in the cruise industry so much overcapacity has led to many fire sales just to try and fill the ships. While intially these ships will do well as everybody will want to see the new ships, over time the prices will have to come down.

    As for making it through the Panama Canal, these must be long instead of wide ships. The two Grand Class Princess ships at only 109,000 gross tons cannot make it through and these two new ships are at 122,000. The expansion of the canal is not scheduled to be completed until 2015. As for the ship in Alaska, they will have some hurdles there with the government as current regulations will not allow a passenger ship of that tonnage to sail in Alaska waters, nor does Alaska have docking facilities for a passenger ship that large.

    But as we have seen, you have the inside scoop, so I will default to you and say great, I would love to see a new ship here and I hope the itineraries you mentioned are correct. It would make my job easier.

  11. #56

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    Re: Disney Orders TWO new ships!

    Quote Originally Posted by WDW1974 View Post
    Another point: totally agree on the bigger isn't better deal. Took my first cruise on Explorer of the Seas (RCCL) which was the world's largest when built a few years ago. It was my worst cruise by far. It was like being on a floating mall/buffet/stadium with 4,000 plus of my least fave friends and their brats. It was not a good experience and can't compare to cruises I've had with Disney, Princess and NCL on much smaller ships.

    I wouldn't want Disney to ever go any larger than these two new ships.
    Won't this be the same experience on the new Disney ships, but only smaller? These new ships are designed to carry 4000 passengers. With only 1250 staterooms, it will be quite a few triple, quad or more capacity. At 122,000 tons, that is going to make for some crowded areas.

  12. #57

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    Re: Disney Orders TWO new ships!

    Quote Originally Posted by WDW1974 View Post
    It was like being on a floating mall/buffet/stadium with 4,000 plus of my least fave friends and their brats.
    It is quite clear you don't like RCI. The problem I see how you were on the Explorer with 4000 when the Passenger Capacity is 3,114. Lets see Disney is building a smaller ship then the Explorer that will hold more people. I just don'd see how it all adds up. And the kids are just the same on RCI as they are on Disney.
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  13. #58

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    Re: Disney Orders TWO new ships!

    figure two to a cabin and you have 2500, figure 4 and you have 5000. i think the grand class princess ships hold around 2500. and the island and coral princess, those are the ones that did alaska when i was there, held about 1900 or so. i could be wrong about the number, it's been awhile since i was on either boat. and yes there is a tonage limit in alaska but that can be fixed by sending the magic or wonder to the west coast or bypassing glacier bay and college fiord. both those areas limit the size of boats allowed. as far as docking goes, they could always tender into ports.

  14. #59

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    Re: Disney Orders TWO new ships!

    Quote Originally Posted by tahoebob54 View Post
    It is quite clear you don't like RCI.
    I will go on record that I personally loate and despise Royal Caribbean Cruise Lines. RCI is the parent company who has an excellent product I have not tried but want to try, in Celebrity. I have a few quibbles with Celebrity in terms of some of the nomenclature they use, and I hate flags of convenience, but that's for debate between ship geeks.

  15. #60

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    Re: Disney Orders TWO new ships!

    I have been on the Freedom of the Seas and for a large ship and over 4000 passengers it did not feel crowded at all. For a family, this ship had every amenity you could want and enough to keep the adults happy. There are some RCI ships I do not recommend, especially the Monarch or Majesty. RCI is more competition for Carnival and if it was a choice between those two I would take RCI. Celebrity has some nice ships and great service. Princess is a nice choice for middle of the road cruise line. NCL can be hit or miss.

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