D23 Loosing Its Luster?

[ALIASd]

Originally Posted by WDW1974

If I were a D23 member and couldn't get tix for an event, but saw folks from Miceage, Mouseplanet, Mousesteps, LaughingPlace, Jim Hill Media at these events, I'd be pitching a --it fit and making sure REAL MEDIA heard about it.

The REAL MEDIA would hardly twitch as the preferred media list is always the place to be. "Buying off" goodwill is standard practice, almost everywhere. Here's a recent example of how they do it in the bigs:

Pricey tropical junket seems to have paid off for 'Couples Retreat'

Pricey tropical junket seems to have paid off for 'Couples Retreat' | Company Town | Los Angeles Times

From a professional contesting standpoint a suggestion, D23 should limit the winning opportunity for arguably the most sought-after FREE events: the studio tours should be changed to once per member.

D23 Members may attend only one "D23 Day at The Walt Disney Studios and Archives" per calendar year. There are a limited number of tickets available.

[flynnibus]

if the main complaints are still about getting tickets to limited access things - everyone should push Disney to change ticket distribution. Make it a submit interest and lottery system instead of first come, first serve.

[sediment]

So, Disney paid for the banner adverts for the Expo, same amount as any other company would?
(If this is prying, then I withdraw the question.)

[flynnibus]

Originally Posted by sediment

So, Disney paid for the banner adverts for the Expo, same amount as any other company would?
(If this is prying, then I withdraw the question.)

the ads are by google.. so Disney would have 'bought' the ad space through the auction system.

[SnorkletsMom]

WDW1974, I totally agree with most of what you said, although I dislike your tone:

"That's much easier when you have bored lonely philandering housewives, soccer moms, geeks living in the folks' basement or the New Hampshire wilderness blogging about how magical your products are."

Condescending and rude. Whose attitude is showing there, yours or Disney's?

[WDW1974]

Originally Posted by BlueSkyDriveBy

I highly doubt you're wrong. The silence in this thread is deafening.

How much longer before the regular visitors of these fan sites and blogs realize that they're being duped? Would their attitude about their favorite Disney webmasters change if it was common knowledge that they had early access to these special events ticket sales before their readers?

How ironic that the D23 fans flock to the discussion boards to rightfully complain about being squeezed out of event tickets that were in painfully short supply before being released, all thanks to the very people who run the sites they're complaining on.


Pixie dust is indeed very powerful. The Pentagon will probably launch a study on how to weaponize the stuff.

Absolutely.

The thing is Disney is playing everyone, but some are getting more out of it.

Something else to ponder, the FLA events were scheduled over the same weekend as the NFFC's big holiday bash at WDW.

That wasn't a coincidence. The folks who run D23 were aware of the dates three months in advance and planned their event to go up against the NFFC's

And while some folks would certainly take an 'independent' event over a Disney-sanctioned one, let's be blunt ... they're few and far between. People want the official pixie dust that only Disney can give.

I have more to say, but this thread looks to be dying so I'll wrap it up with a few comments on some other issues.

I don't doubt Dusty's word about when this site was informed. I'm fairly certain this site is still way down on the list of ones it believes it can co-opt fully. Al Lutz has, to his credit, always said he'd never take anything from Disney. But regardless, someone(s) are going to have tickets to both the FLA and CA events. They will be there and they will take pics and blog about them.

As to real media and junkets, sure they're a fact of life. That's not the point here.Those whorefests (and I've been to some) don't involve the general public (except perhaps inconveniencing them by closing a park early).

I'll also say that there's no guarantee Disney will get positive publicity from the mainstream media, even if it wines and dines them. But the online folks?

These are people who don't generally get to mingle with 'famous people' or get wined and dined. Disney is guaranteed positive coverage from the fan sites and they deliver.

People expect to all have a fair chance at grabbing tix for these events ... and until I see an event take place at the parks where there's no one from any of the major and minor sites there, I'll maintain what I know to be true. Disney is making an effort to get these folks into the events AHEAD/IN PLACE of other D23 members. That's just not cool.

As to the last post questioning my statement, it may have been a bit harsh but largely that's what many of the online folks are. And leeching off of a Disney has given them a reason for living, and -- in some cases -- a very nice way to make a living. That, in and of itself, makes their 'coverage' often dubious at best.

[flynnibus]

when D23 puts on an event that people hate. Let us know... so far the problems have really been people can't get enough. And it's not because they are brainwashed either.

[WDW1974]

Originally Posted by flynnibus

when D23 puts on an event that people hate. Let us know... so far the problems have really been people can't get enough. And it's not because they are brainwashed either.

I have yet to comment on the quality of said events. I haven't been to any, but friends have and I take their word. And that word is almost universally positive.

So, that's not the issue here, unless someone else brought it up and I missed it.

The point is about Disney seeding the field with Internet sites, at the expense of other paying D23 members, so they can get free positive publicity.

[BlueSkyDriveBy]

Originally Posted by WDW1974

The point is about Disney seeding the field with Internet sites, at the expense of other paying D23 members, so they can get free positive publicity.

Bingo.

[flynnibus]

Originally Posted by WDW1974

The point is about Disney seeding the field with Internet sites, at the expense of other paying D23 members, so they can get free positive publicity.

A practice universally done in just about all forms of entertainment, education, sports, etc. To chastise D23 for allowing 'media' to have preferred access is just looking to pick a fight - not that D23 is being devious and underhanded.

The fan sites ARE the media for the target audience of D23.

Sounds like sour grapes to me.

[nbodyhome]

Originally Posted by Dustysage

I was personally VERY happy with the 3 Christmas events and have signed up for the Magic and Merriment event at WDW - which sold out almost immediately.

Dusty - I am glad you got into the Magic and Merriment event! That is one that I was totally unable to get into, I even spent $5.00 at Baltimore Airport for internet access to sign up for it (but was not quick enough).

Chuck - I enjoyed your article. The one thing about D23, it won't ever replace the community that sites such as Micechat offer (nor can it replace the NFFC).

[BlueSkyDriveBy]

Originally Posted by flynnibus

Sounds like sour grapes to me.

I don't think it's sour grapes at all. If Disney wants to seed the fan community with coverage of these events from the inside, fine. Let them offer a set number of tickets to their favorite fan sites, and possibly rotate the sites from one event to the next, just to keep things fair.

But to set a maximum for the number of attendees per event, which is almost always quite limited to begin with, and then skim off a significant number from the top for the webmasters, thereby reducing the remaining available tickets for the members, is a total scam. This type of action never builds good will with the fan base, and could potentially destroy it, should word ever get out amongst the members.

This is what Chuck claimed was happening, according to his inside source at D23. If it's true, then D23 should be ashamed of creating an artificial scarcity for access to these events, when it's so difficult to get the tickets in the first place.

[flynnibus]

Originally Posted by BlueSkyDriveBy

I don't think it's sour grapes at all. If Disney wants to seed the fan community with coverage of these events from the inside, fine. Let them offer a set number of tickets to their favorite fan sites, and possibly rotate the sites from one event to the next, just to keep things fair.

But to set a maximum for the number of attendees per event, which is almost always quite limited to begin with, and then skim off a significant number from the top for the webmasters, thereby reducing the remaining available tickets for the members, is a total scam. This type of action never builds good will with the fan base, and could potentially destroy it, should word ever get out amongst the members.

The glass is half full, or half empty. It makes no difference. If the place only can accommodate X people at a time, what difference does it make if you skim from one pool of tickets or setup two pools of tickets? The overall capacity is not changing.

Creating a separate set of tickets does not increase capacity.

[BlueSkyDriveBy]

Originally Posted by flynnibus

Creating a separate set of tickets does not increase capacity.

You're missing the point. Of course overall capacity for the event would remain the same, that's obvious. What would change, however, is how the tickets are distributed and how many the webmasters would receive.

Webmasters should be selected in advance and given the tickets to the event outright. They wouldn't be required to log in secretly a few minutes before the members, to get first pick of the goodies. That practice would stop.

Members and only members would have X number of tickets available to them from the start. The tickets would become available at 10 AM on a specific date for everyone other than the pre-selected webmasters, who've already been taken care of. And these advance tickets would not be distributed to the same sites over and over for every D23 event, but rotated amongst a pool of fan sites which D23 would utilize to help cover the events.

The problem stems from secretly allowing the webmasters to sign on a few minutes before the members, along with countless numbers of their friends, and cherry picking the tickets before members get their shot. The tickets being made available for the webmasters should be restricted in number, which does not seem to be the case at the present time, according to what Chuck was reporting in his article.

The tickets to these events are inherently limited, which is why D23 should hand out a small, specific amount of said tickets to a rotating list of webmasters separate from the online feeding frenzy of distribution to the members.

[flynnibus]

Originally Posted by BlueSkyDriveBy

You're missing the point. Of course overall capacity for the event would remain the same, that's obvious. What would change, however, is how the tickets are distributed and how many the webmasters would receive.

But lets get practical. The theory is Disney telling people to log in a few minutes early to get the tickets would not help these media people get tickets alone! Thousands of people are trying the exact same thing! People are hammering the site consistently up until the flood gates are opened.

The difference is Disney is pre-selecting people to allow them early access to the tickets. HOW they do it (via minutes early, or even if they MAILED them separately weeks before) really is irrelevant. The root complaint is by granting 'media' access, they are affecting fan's capacity.

HOW they do it is pretty much irrelevant - the end result is the same. So why moan about the method when it's the IMPACT that people are really concerned about.

Originally Posted by BlueSkyDriveBy

Webmasters should be selected in advance and given the tickets to the event outright. They wouldn't be required to log in secretly a few minutes before the members, to get first pick of the goodies. That practice would stop.

Members and only members would have X number of tickets available to them from the start

And such a model of creating two hard defined groups actually REDUCES capacity for fans/members. Because by slicing off a fixed portion ahead of time, you can overestimate how many you need. By having them both from the same pool, unused capacity automatically moves to the fans.

Originally Posted by BlueSkyDriveBy

The problem stems from secretly allowing the webmasters to sign on a few minutes before the members, along with countless numbers of their friends, and cherry picking the tickets before members get their shot. The tickets being made available for the webmasters should be restricted in number, which does not seem to be the case at the present time, according to what Chuck was reporting in his article.

And we have nothing from Chuck except speculation.

How exactly do you believe Disney is identifying 'countless numbers of their friends' as being blessed enough to get through the webpage while everyone else is doing the same exact thing? All they can do is pre-identify those people.. which is basically the same as selecting them prior to the ticket sales. So again, the METHOD is pretty much irrelevant.

Really, the method used for media distribution is really irrelevant to what people are concerned about the final impact. The complaint is about limited capacity, and the method used for members to get tickets as being inherently unpredictable and cumbersome.

Trying to use the media access as a scapegoat about why these problems are worse is pretty much useless. Organizations are ALWAYS going to give media access preference. It's just a reality. So media being there or not is pretty much useless to complain about. Focus on the real issues

- capacity
- distribution model to members

The second is easily done with software and requires moving away from a 'first come, first serve' model. A lottery system with a finite response window could easily level out ticket distribution and improve access to everyone and remove the hassle.

Simply have members 'sign up' for an event to show they want to attend. Disney has a phased lottery. At each stage, Disney picks from the pool of people who have 'signed up' but who have no received a ticket yet. After each round, there is a finite response time for winners to reply they 'accept' the ticket. Say 1 day or 2 days. After that, any remaining tickets are put through the same lottery system, and the process is repeated until all tickets are distributed. The same model could be used to redistribute tickets people back out on shortly before the event. A 'last chance' lottery.

The same selection model could be used to level out access to events. Lottery selection could be weighted by people's past failures. The more events you miss out on, the more heavily weighted you become in the lottery to win. If you back out of a ticket, or win, your weighting is reset or adjusted (depending on how you want to penalize winners).

All of this can be done without worrying about Media getting preferred access or not. That's really what this bitch is about and its pretty much an argument you'll never win with Disney, or any other company.