Went to Magic Mountain and wow... just wow...

[Victoria]

It's been nearly two years since my first visit to the park. On that first trip, it seemed to be in fairly decent shape all things considered... only the crowd was pretty young overall and somewhat rowdy. Lots of people you wouldn't want to look at the wrong way. Anyway, the rides were good, and overall I had a good time.

But I went back yesterday for the second time and wow. What happened? I mean, yeah, last time I was there it wasn't the cleanest theme park around, but in just two years it seems to have really gone downhill. For one, the restrooms need to be bigger! This was the case two years ago and nothing has changed. Not even all of them have sit-down papers or even mirrors (which would probably get graffitied and broken). One restroom didn't even have paper towels. The lady cleaning the bathroom even told me there were none.

While the rides are plenty and very good, the theming of the queues and boarding areas has taken such a downturn. Simple upkeep does not seem to be a priority. Batman The Ride comes to mind. There were lightbulbs that were dead... others that had lots of dead bugs in them that could easily be cleaned out with a mere screwdriver, and yet others that had gum on them. Other rides' queues and boarding areas were so filthy. Paint chipping everywhere you look, rust on handrails and walls, gum all over the place. Stickers left by guests in various places. Does management not send people out with gumscrapers and Simple Green? Plus features of the various queues were not working... The Riddler's Revenge lighting wasn't on in the boarding area, for example. Batman The Ride's bat symbol wasn't lit. Fans that could have been running were not running. Fans that shouldn't have been running after dark were still running. Queue's after dark had unlit areas that were dangerously dark without any light. Elements that played roles in the experience of queues and boarding areas is a big thing that the park is neglecting. It seems once something that isn't really necessary to the operation of a ride breaks, they don't fix it.

Again, the rides themselves are great. I love coasters, and Terminator Salvation is a shining example of an attraction done right at Magic Mountain from start to finish. The queue could have used some more shading, but it did have some great parts to it. The television screens showing clips from other theme parks and music performances (along with commercials of course) is nice for passing the time. The ride itself is awesome. And again the crowd... well, quite a bit different from the typical Disneyland crowd.

I realize Magic Mountain is struggling right now when it probably shouldn't be. It's been there for years and should be turning a profit for the most part. But it seems that in order to counter its financial struggles, the park isn't bothering with general upkeep, nor is it bothering to fix broken elements in the attractions. Instead they're pushing the lockers they make you rent out if you have a loose article on you when you get close to getting on pretty much every ride. Not to mention, a lot of employees greatly exaggerated the wait times on several rides. Would the park be in better financial shape if they were doing a better job if their upkeep was better? Probably. Is it saving them money in the short term to just let things break and not go out of their way to repair chipped paint and remove rust? Likely. So in that regard I see why they're handling things the way they are. But I also know that such poor presentation is a way to make people not want to come back to the park. I know that I certainly don't need to go there for another two years mainly for those reasons (okay, it's also pretty out of the way). And as far as the crowd goes, it definitely doesn't make the park seem like a family friendly place. Tons of teenagers cursing out loud, line jumping, and being overall unpleasant. Magic Mountain needs to quit the cheap season passes and raise the prices so that the park becomes a more family-oriented establishment that makes the entire experience more pleasant for everyone. I know a few people personally that keep away from the park for that very reason.

Anyhow, I don't mean to rant about my disdain with some of the park's way of doing things, I'm just quite a bit peeved that Magic Mountain seems to be taking such a downturn. It's sad, really.

[PeoplemoverMatt]

Originally Posted by Victoria

While the rides are plenty and very good, the theming of the queues and boarding areas has taken such a downturn. Simple upkeep does not seem to be a priority. Batman The Ride comes to mind. There were lightbulbs that were dead... others that had lots of dead bugs in them that could easily be cleaned out with a mere screwdriver, and yet others that had gum on them. Other rides' queues and boarding areas were so filthy. Paint chipping everywhere you look, rust on handrails and walls, gum all over the place. Stickers left by guests in various places. Does management not send people out with gumscrapers and Simple Green? Plus features of the various queues were not working... The Riddler's Revenge lighting wasn't on in the boarding area, for example. Batman The Ride's bat symbol wasn't lit. Fans that could have been running were not running. Fans that shouldn't have been running after dark were still running. Queue's after dark had unlit areas that were dangerously dark without any light. Elements that played roles in the experience of queues and boarding areas is a big thing that the park is neglecting. It seems once something that isn't really necessary to the operation of a ride breaks, they don't fix it.

While these are problems, they are problems that existed two years ago as well, and go back longer than that. These are, unfortunately, some of the lingering effects of the absolutely horrible way Premier Parks ran SFMM while they owned it.

So why doesn't SFMM just fix these things? Well because the chain is under a mountain of debt, and it's a real big fight to incur any costs at all, no matter what they are. I can't go into too much detail about the back of the house financial discussions, but, I can assure you that the park knows about these problems and really does want to fix them.

Imagine if you owned a home, and your bathroom was seriously messed up by an unruly houseguest, or the people who you bought the house from left you a totally messed up bathroom for you to fix. How would you go about fixing it? You'd go shopping, write a bunch of checks, sign some contractors' paperwork, maybe even secure a loan of sorts, and fix it, right? But there are some problems. What if you weren't in control of your own money? What if your distant cousin, sunk in debt up to his eyeballs across the country, had to give you permission first before you could spend the money? You can imagine what might happen there.

Unfortunately SFMM brass doesn't always have the kind of financial control that it wished it had, and is limited to making improvements they know they need to make when & how they can. This is why the restrooms is this years-long odyssey. Fixing bathrooms alone sounds like too big a cost, but build a big new ride like Terminator and BAM! - the restrooms closest to it gets renovated. Why? Because spending money must be prioritized like that. The federal government isn't giving Six Flags a bailout, so they have to do what they have to do.

SFMM has made progress, has made many improvements, and now has shown multiple examples of how great they are building and designing their new shops, restaurants, and attractions. The headaches all come from how to fix the terrible and lingering mistakes of the past. That's a work in progress that's going to take a long while, but there is light at the end of that particular tunnel.

Hopefully you'll see more improvements next time.

[The Disneylander]

Yeah...I can tell you personally that the new SFMM management are great people who sincerely want to make their park better.

Unfortunately, they're pretty much in a bind right now...

[TacAlert]

Victoria'a post......YEAH. Somoeone finally gets it!!!!!!

The whole problem is the cleaning of the park. Recently they just went to 7 day a week operation for the summer. But come on, during the off season they can clean the stickers and gum and everything else. Heck, they should be able to do this during the day and after hours when the park is regularly open.

[Victoria]

Originally Posted by PeoplemoverMatt

While these are problems, they are problems that existed two years ago as well, and go back longer than that. These are, unfortunately, some of the lingering effects of the absolutely horrible way Premier Parks ran SFMM while they owned it.

So why doesn't SFMM just fix these things? Well because the chain is under a mountain of debt, and it's a real big fight to incur any costs at all, no matter what they are. I can't go into too much detail about the back of the house financial discussions, but, I can assure you that the park knows about these problems and really does want to fix them.

SFMM has made progress, has made many improvements, and now has shown multiple examples of how great they are building and designing their new shops, restaurants, and attractions. The headaches all come from how to fix the terrible and lingering mistakes of the past. That's a work in progress that's going to take a long while, but there is light at the end of that particular tunnel.

Hopefully you'll see more improvements next time.

If they are moving in a direction that rights all the wrongs of the past, then good for them. That's great to hear. I would look forward to the day when Magic Mountain is the place that I hear it once was.

Originally Posted by TacAlert

Victoria'a post......YEAH. Somoeone finally gets it!!!!!!

The whole problem is the cleaning of the park. Recently they just went to 7 day a week operation for the summer. But come on, during the off season they can clean the stickers and gum and everything else. Heck, they should be able to do this during the day and after hours when the park is regularly open.

That's the biggest gripe I have about the park. Okay, so they don't have the money to fix elements in the queues and boarding areas that no longer work. Fine... that's a bit understandable. But doing such a poor job keeping the cleanliness of the park up to acceptable standards? That is enexcusable. Things like bugs trapped in lightbulbs, unlit queues at night, gum stuck all over the place, and stickers stuck on walls should not be an issue. I get that the crowd that's the park's main draw might not be mature enough to help stop the problems, but Six Flags has no excuse for not even TRYING to improve these things.

A couple other things I forgot to mention...

I was a bit disappointed to see that the park is making money off of people paying to get people wet on the Log Jammer. After the ride ends, the logs proceed back to the loading/unloading area. On their way over there, people watching from afar can stick a quarter into a machine that activates water sprays that COMPLETELY SOAK the riders. Yeah, I know the ride warns you that you can get wet, but this is extremely unnecessary. Where is the family-friendliness in that?

The other thing... $15 for parking. That's more than Disneyland. And the tram service isn't even close to being as good or as effective.

[PirateChick]

Originally Posted by Victoria

I was a bit disappointed to see that the park is making money off of people paying to get people wet on the Log Jammer. After the ride ends, the logs proceed back to the loading/unloading area. On their way over there, people watching from afar can stick a quarter into a machine that activates water sprays that COMPLETELY SOAK the riders. Yeah, I know the ride warns you that you can get wet, but this is extremely unnecessary. Where is the family-friendliness in that?

If this is a problem for you I suggest not going to Sea World San Diego because they have the same thing on Journey to Atlantis and Shipwreck Rapids. It might not be fun if you are in the boat getting hit with the water but for the people doing it, I think they get a small thrill at other peoples misfortunes.

[JesterMn]

^I gotta agree that paid soak fountains on water rides are pretty common. Nothing out of the ordinary there.

I totally agree with PeopleMoverMatt... SFMM is doing their best to maintain the park with the limited funds they have. Just because you have an off season doesn't mean money appears out of nowhere to clean things. I went to the park recently, and yes, one bathroom in particular was in a bad state. (Although I think it's unreasonable to expect them to be reconstructed just to be larger, when they are lots of other things I'd fix first.) That said:

• Ninja got repainted
• The Sky Tower is open again, with a terrific museum on top
• All the X2 upgrades and improvement to line times (believe it or not, but the line does actually move faster than it did before)
• Terminator: Salvation opened, is fun, and has some great theming touches in the pre-show area
• The waterfall in the front of the park was brought back after being shut off for years
• A Johnny Rockets branch opened up, as well as Panda Express
• The Cyber Cafe, where you can surf the net for free! Even Disney doesn't offer that!
• Lots of charaters wander around
• The new FlashPass system

You get the idea. I'm sure there's other things I'm forgetting, but there are many signs of improvement. Is there still more to do? Of course. But steps are being taken in the right direction. Can we stop beating up the park completely?

[Victoria]

Originally Posted by JesterMn

^I gotta agree that paid soak fountains on water rides are pretty common. Nothing out of the ordinary there.

I totally agree with PeopleMoverMatt... SFMM is doing their best to maintain the park with the limited funds they have. Just because you have an off season doesn't mean money appears out of nowhere to clean things. I went to the park recently, and yes, one bathroom in particular was in a bad state. (Although I think it's unreasonable to expect them to be reconstructed just to be larger, when they are lots of other things I'd fix first.) That said:

• Ninja got repainted
• The Sky Tower is open again, with a terrific museum on top
• All the X2 upgrades and improvement to line times (believe it or not, but the line does actually move faster than it did before)
• Terminator: Salvation opened, is fun, and has some great theming touches in the pre-show area
• The waterfall in the front of the park was brought back after being shut off for years
• A Johnny Rockets branch opened up, as well as Panda Express
• The Cyber Cafe, where you can surf the net for free! Even Disney doesn't offer that!
• Lots of charaters wander around
• The new FlashPass system

You get the idea. I'm sure there's other things I'm forgetting, but there are many signs of improvement. Is there still more to do? Of course. But steps are being taken in the right direction. Can we stop beating up the park completely?

The new FlashPass system costs twice what it did two years ago.

I didn't see any characters wandering around other than at the front of the park when I arrived and Marvin the Martian nearby shortly thereafter.

Cyber Cafe? I suppose I'll take my laptop next time I make the hour and a half drive to Magic Mountain and take some time from waiting in the lines and enjoying the coasters to surf the net while in there. Sounds like a totally unnecessary addition in the grand scheme of problems the park seems to be having.

And as far as beating up on the park completely, I'll be very honest with you. I'd never once been into the Six Flags forum before this morning. I didn't read any of the other threads. I simply posted my own thoughts on the park after experiencing it for the first time in nearly two years. So if there's some beating up on the park going on in this forum other than the major shortcomings I outlined in this thread, then that's got to tell you something about the park.

[JesterMn]

I've got news for you... "flashpass" systems at any park other than Disney cost extra. So let's not cry too loud about that. If you don't want to use it, don't pay for it.

You saw two sets of characters early on. Uh, doesn't that count as two character sightings? It would be so easy for SF to not have them at all.

The Cyber Cafe is a place to relax, not a destination in itself. And it's actually come in handy for me... I visited SFMM on the day Universal Studios had it's big fire (which I actually live very close to), and I was able to check the progress of the fire from the park.

I get upset about people beating up SFMM here because Disney fanatics seem to expect unrealistic sights on any park that isn't Disney. Knott's gets beat up just as much, and it just brought back newly refurbished (and accurate) peek-ins! And very few people here give them any credit. As mentioned earlier, the current management has been so very vocal about trying their best to improve the park with a very limited budget.

How would you feel if you were showing of a new house you just bought and proudly fixed up, only to have every visitor say things like, "There's weeds in the front yard, the towels are wet in your bathroom, isn't this bedroom too small, why haven't you repainted the walls," etc.?

[Barbossa]

Originally Posted by Victoria

Simple upkeep does not seem to be a priority. Batman The Ride comes to mind. There were lightbulbs that were dead...

That's because someone interrupted Christian Bale, and then he went there to trash some lights.

[BlAcKoUt510]

Originally Posted by Barbossa

That's because someone interrupted Christian Bale, and then he went there to trash some lights.

. Hope he wont trash Terminators anytime soon.

Originally Posted by Victoria

Cyber Cafe? I suppose I'll take my laptop next time I make the hour and a half drive to Magic Mountain and take some time from waiting in the lines and enjoying the coasters to surf the net while in there. Sounds like a totally unnecessary addition in the grand scheme of problems the park seems to be having.

Six Flags is surely improving what been damaged in the years.
Of course with this quote your just speaking for yourself. Parents can hangout there while their kids go on rides. It would be more a waste of time to drive your kids and their friends to a park you already dont want to go to and then drive back home and even sometimes drive back to pick them up. You said you live an hour and a half away can you imagine three trips. Yikes!
A park full of thrills and teens like you said this place is definately an improvement for those looking to chill.

JesterMn was right those were big problems that they fixed. I saw lots of characters when i went we actually saw catwoman sneaking around in the dark shadows the popped out for pictures at people passing by it was awsome. The park started announcing these approvement just i think the most 3 years ago right after they decided not to sell it. I think we got alot of things in those 3 years and hopefully alot more coming.

BTW to your batman comment the batman lights havent working for years and 1 thing i hope they fix. Before the train left the station all the lights in the station the this cool little and quick light show then the trains took off. Havent seen that work for years.

[PeoplemoverMatt]

Originally Posted by Victoria

A couple other things I forgot to mention...

I was a bit disappointed to see that the park is making money off of people paying to get people wet on the Log Jammer. After the ride ends, the logs proceed back to the loading/unloading area. On their way over there, people watching from afar can stick a quarter into a machine that activates water sprays that COMPLETELY SOAK the riders. Yeah, I know the ride warns you that you can get wet, but this is extremely unnecessary. Where is the family-friendliness in that?

Well it's meant to be all in good fun. While there can be some social awkwardness involved in soaking perfect strangers, people get enjoyment at the misfortune of others, making water bombs quite popular. The machines also bring in a good amount of revenue for the park, and liven up an area that was completely dead & deteriorating everyday, much to the shegrin of park-goers.

Originally Posted by Victoria

The other thing... $15 for parking. That's more than Disneyland. And the tram service isn't even close to being as good or as effective.

It's $3 more than Disneyland while admission is $10 less. That's still a $7 net savings over Disneyland. As for the tram, have you ridden Disneyland's tram lately? I can walk to Downtown Disney in about the time it takes for a tram to make it there from the Mickey & Friends Structure now.

Originally Posted by Victoria

The new FlashPass system costs twice what it did two years ago.

And it's also a totally different system than it was two years ago. Two years ago people purchased paper tickets for $20-25 depending on the day, and if a party 4 bought 1 ticket strip, they could only use it on one ride. Today, the Q-Bot (Flash Pass) can be used on multiple rides during the day for $19/person plus rental fee. Flash Pass for 4 costs $91, which is a $9 savings over buying 4 ticket strips at $25 each. Therefore, after 4 rides, the new Flash Pass becomes cheaper for a group of four than the old tickets used to be.

Originally Posted by Victoria

Cyber Cafe? I suppose I'll take my laptop next time I make the hour and a half drive to Magic Mountain and take some time from waiting in the lines and enjoying the coasters to surf the net while in there. Sounds like a totally unnecessary addition in the grand scheme of problems the park seems to be having.

Actually, the park provides computers for you in the air-conditioned building. All you need to do is sit down and start surfing away. They'd also appreciate it if you sat & surfed while sipping a coffee, or enjoying a nice sandwich.

Originally Posted by JesterMn

I've got news for you... "flashpass" systems at any park other than Disney cost extra. So let's not cry too loud about that. If you don't want to use it, don't pay for it.

There's an important point. SFMM gives you the choice if you want to pay for the ride reservation system or not. Disneyland does not give you that choice. They include the FastPass system in your admission. While the perception may be that FP is free at Disney, the reality is that it is not. Everyone pays for it, but not everyone gets the same use out of it. At SFMM, only those who want to use it will pay for it. Thus, a much greater percentage of users will get full utility out of what they paid for.

Personally I don't like comparing Disneyland to SFMM directly because they are simply different brands. While SFMM is improving as best it can right now, it's a little comparing GM to Ferrari. GM's trying to improve, and might even use Ferrari as a mark to strive for because whether they make it or not, striving for the goal yields its own rewards. Regardless of that, it's not Ferrari right now today, and complaining about how GM is not Ferrari doesn't really do anyone any good at this point. I'd rather live & let live, and appreciate SFMM's improvements for what they are.

[TacAlert]

Originally Posted by JesterMn

I get upset about people beating up SFMM here because Disney fanatics seem to expect unrealistic sights on any park that isn't Disney.

This comes up many times in the SFMM threads, but was a Disney comparison ever mentioned in this one?

[TacAlert]

Originally Posted by PeoplemoverMatt

It's $3 more than Disneyland while admission is $10 less. That's still a $7 net savings over Disneyland. As for the tram, have you ridden Disneyland's tram lately? I can walk to Downtown Disney in about the time it takes for a tram to make it there from the Mickey & Friends Structure now.

You are so right. The tram takes forever now and it is so much quicker to just walk. It would be nice if they put in a moving sidewalk like at the airports.

[Victoria]

I personally haven't had any tram problems at Disneyland. Everytime I've gone it's typically no more than a five to eight minute wait to board a tram.

In any case, I'm not comparing Disneyland to Magic Mountain. It's apples and oranges. But I still believe that there is no excuse for the park to be as trashy as it is. What would it cost to have one of the employees manning the lockers to hand them some liquid cleaner and a gum scraper? They don't even need to hire more help. Just relocate some of their people to go make the place a little more presentable. Fixing queues and elements of loading areas is one thing. Cleaning up the easily fixable things is another. There's absolutely no excuse for the park to look as dirty as it does.