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  1. #1171

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    Re: Mass Transit 2 the Disneyland Resort

    Quote Originally Posted by sediment View Post

    They might. The reason is that many studies of energy efficiency by mode often make questionable and — depending on the author’s point of view — self-serving assumptions.

    Which the author goes on to do over and over again. Not so smart.

  2. #1172

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    Re: Mass Transit 2 the Disneyland Resort

    You'll have to refute them one at a time.
    Oh, and point out his self-servingness.
    "Here You Leave the World of California Today and Enter the World of, um, er, California Today."

  3. #1173

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    Re: Mass Transit 2 the Disneyland Resort

    Quote Originally Posted by sediment View Post
    You'll have to refute them one at a time.
    Oh, and point out his self-servingness.
    The author goes back and forth, to make it a neutral article. They use errant information to make the pro and con points.

  4. #1174

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    Re: Mass Transit 2 the Disneyland Resort

    Looks like Measure J didn't get a 2/3 majority needed to pass.

  5. #1175

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  6. #1176

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    Re: Mass Transit 2 the Disneyland Resort

    And to get you to Anaheim:

    "It is the project of the century," said UC Berkeley civil engineering professor Bill Ibbs, who has worked on other high-speed rail systems around the world.

    The sheer scale and scope of the bullet train's push into Southern California, including traversing complex seismic hazards, would rival construction of the state's massive freeway system, water transport networks and its port complexes. It is likely to be viewed in future decades as an engineering marvel — or a costly folly. If nothing else, it is ambitious.


    The plan calls for bullet trains to shoot east from Bakersfield at 220 mph, climbing one of the steepest sustained high-speed rail inclines in the world. It would soar over canyons on viaducts as high as a 33-story skyscraper. The line would duck in and out of tunnels up to 500 feet below the rugged surface. It would cross more than half a dozen earthquake faults heading toward L.A.
    LA Times

  7. #1177

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    Re: Mass Transit 2 the Disneyland Resort

    That link doesn't work.

    Yes, it might take a century to build it.
    I'm predicting costly folly.
    "Here You Leave the World of California Today and Enter the World of, um, er, California Today."

  8. #1178

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    Re: Mass Transit 2 the Disneyland Resort

    Perhaps following the I-5 corridor would be more cost effective - but there are two reasons for following the CA-14 corridor, and including a stop in Palmdale:

    1. Politics: Mike Antonovich/Zev Yaraslavsky
    2. Connection to future Palmdale-Vegas HSR.

    ---------- Post added 11-14-2012 at 11:41 AM ----------

    Try this:
    SoCal Bullet Train Route: Skycraper-Tall Viaducts, 500-Foot Deep Tunnels, One of the Steepest Grades in the World - High-Speed Rail - Curbed LA

  9. #1179

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    Re: Mass Transit 2 the Disneyland Resort

    I never been a fan of mass transit. But the Freakonomics article does point out some of the areas where mass transit makes sense, i.e. where parking is a premium. The Anaheim resort area definitely fits the bill as an area where parking is at a premium.

    Though the stories I read talk about a trolley from the new transit center to the DLR. While a trolley is cute does it have the capacity to move enough people especially at peak times? A trolley would be overwhelmed at park opening/closing.

    Realistically if employees and guests are going to use regional mass transit to get to the Resort, they are going to need a high capacity mass transit system that connects the new Transit Center to the resort area (and stadia).

  10. #1180

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    Re: Mass Transit 2 the Disneyland Resort

    At full speed, however, a bullet train would need four to five miles to make an emergency stop on level ground, and longer going downhill. The probability of an earthquake occurring as a train is going over a fault is "very small," Gillam said. Some experts, however, say the probability is not inconsequential, considering high-speed trains are expected to be running as frequently as every five minutes in each direction.
    Te probability is not very small. Approximately every 2.5 minutes, a train will cross the fault. Large earthquakes last over a minute. So, if an earthquake occurs, there will certainly be trains nearby the fault and possibly nearing one.

    It's a risk everyone is going to have to take, especially at the current price tag.

    So, yeah, I-5 would be a lot more cost effective, but no one seems to care about the cost but me. If it's successful, then sure, make a spur line out to Palmdale as the first leg to Las Vegas.

    ---------- Post added 11-14-2012 at 03:04 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by PecosBill View Post
    Though the stories I read talk about a trolley from the new transit center to the DLR. While a trolley is cute does it have the capacity to move enough people especially at peak times? A trolley would be overwhelmed at park opening/closing.

    Realistically if employees and guests are going to use regional mass transit to get to the Resort, they are going to need a high capacity mass transit system that connects the new Transit Center to the resort area (and stadia).
    One trolley would not have the capacity. 20, or 50, might.
    "Here You Leave the World of California Today and Enter the World of, um, er, California Today."

  11. #1181

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    Re: Mass Transit 2 the Disneyland Resort

    Quote Originally Posted by PecosBill View Post
    Though the stories I read talk about a trolley from the new transit center to the DLR. While a trolley is cute does it have the capacity to move enough people especially at peak times? A trolley would be overwhelmed at park opening/closing.
    As planned a Street Car would come roughly every 3.5 minutes. The Street Cars are portrayed as having many cars and can aptly be called light rail as there is multiple cars per train. However they are running on the streets, so referred to as street cars. They may fit upwards of 300 or 300 passengers per train.

    The number of trains could and would be expected to increase if ridership demands it.

  12. #1182

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    Re: Mass Transit 2 the Disneyland Resort

    Would they be putting the rail down the middle of Katella? Seems only logical. there is a nice greenbelt there, but progress demands it.
    I'm sure there are plenty of people who go to the balls game would like the option of easy transportation to the Resort and back, either before the game or after. Yes, someone will lose parking money. Boo freaking hoo.
    "Here You Leave the World of California Today and Enter the World of, um, er, California Today."

  13. #1183

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    Re: Mass Transit 2 the Disneyland Resort

    It's reported the train will be in the right lanes. This makes a lot of sense compared to median trains since this train may unload a lot of people at its few stops rather than handfulls every blocks or two. Imagine when people are going to, the baseball stadium, the disney parks, and the convention center, versus office buildings.


    I see a side effect which will increase ridership. If this is built, and better rail is built to Anaheim, over by the ARTIC station is a great place for hotels. You can get to the hotel on a big train and use the little train to get to the parks and Convention Center.

    The Ayres Inn is nice to stay in but I don't think it would be as cheap, and probably have some neighbor hotels.

  14. #1184

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    Re: Mass Transit 2 the Disneyland Resort

    As someone who started this thread and its predecessor to generate enthusiasm and interest in connecting Anaheim to the rest of the country by rail, it's gratifying to not only see progress in this regard but also Micechatters getting "on board"!

    All of Disney's foreign parks have train stations near the front gates.

    Disneyland is a big "toy train track", as the author of PragmaticIdealist's article points out, there was never a greater train enthusiast than Walt. Can't help thinking he'd be proud.

    ---------- Post added 11-14-2012 at 07:02 PM ----------

    PS: For the Harbor Blvd portion of the track, I hope Disney offers part of the former parking lot tram driveway to the streetcar right of way.

  15. #1185

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    Re: Mass Transit 2 the Disneyland Resort

    Quote Originally Posted by CaliforniaAdventurer View Post

    PS: For the Harbor Blvd portion of the track, I hope Disney offers part of the former parking lot tram driveway to the streetcar right of way.
    I wonder about that too. Of course as noted in the original path maps there is no stop there. The Disney stop is on the edge of the Pumba lot. This might be an indicator that the Harbor entrance will be greatly modified and less of a drop off spot.

    The street cars will take away a small bit of demand from ART.

    Also wondering why the plan shows it going to Convention Way and not down it to the Convention Center Entrance. It may have to do with turning them around.

    ---------- Post added 11-14-2012 at 11:13 PM ----------

    What will the new Transportation Secretary think?

    Obama

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