Get rid of Standby altogether, for Fastpass Attractions

[Bug]

Originally Posted by Aaron Morrow

Does anyone else think this sounds somewhat familiar to the plans for the Jumbo-sized Dumbo?

(At least in terms of the “no physical line” concept; it sounds like Dumbo will be more of a deli-style “take a number and wait” conceit.)

i think they're aiming towards a more enjoyable interactive queue so you kind of forget you're in line. it's a bold move and i hope it works. i guess we'll have to wait and see.

[Barbaraann]

The Fastpass system at Disney World has been around for a very long time. I don't see it going away anytime soon. Sean's mom and I were shopping for pins on Main Street, and we ran across a Fastpass pin. I bought it for her. I also bought us both some really nice Toy Story Mania pins. We have this practice that when we experience a ride for the first time, then we purchase the pin. We both really enjoyed the Toy Story Mania ride.

So my Fastpass idea was mentioned in the Roundup today. That usually means that some new and different MiceChatters may now glance at this thread. Like they said, Take Your Shots. I can take it. I need to learn a few things.

[Thorpeedo]

Here goes my tuppence....please bear with me...apologies as I only skim read a lot of the debatye

Any ride has a fixed capacity in any given day. (Ok not an absolute fact, but basically true). It will also have a number of people on any given day that would like to ride it. (again not strictly true, people could change their plans and decide not to ride or decide they fancy another go. Assuming this evens out makes the point easier to explain). Assuming a ride with a capacity of 5000 rides per day, again for ease of explanation.(random numbers to illustrate the point)

If only 2000 people want to ride during the day, the ride capacity massively exceeds the number of people wanting to ride, like say carousel of progress, then you can almost turn up at any time and ride - no problem.

If the demand outstrips the capacity, you have 5,000 rides available in a day, and simply have to decide how to issue those 5,000 rides among the 7,000 guests that want to ride in whatever manner is most beneficial to the company.

In a standby only situation, If you assume that ticket no 1 is given to the first person in the queue, and they take ride number 1, the next ticket is given to whoever is at the front, and they then ride, at the end of the day you issue ticket 5000, and let them take ride 5000 and then close the ride. It self regulates as of the 7000 people, The 2000 disappointed people mostly pick themselves. They all could declare an interest at the start of the day and force the ride operator the difficult decision of picking out which 2000 of them to dissappoint. Because during the course of the day they each will decide for themselves that they do not want to queue up, decide not to ride and walk away, they have self regulated.
With fastpass, Disney are essentially handing out tickets for later rides, (because they want people to be spending instead of queuing). Say you got a fastpass and get ticket number 2500, this would be for ride number 2500, approximately half way through the day. When that time comes, if you're not there and ready to use your ticket, they simply give ticket 2501 to the person at the front of the standby queue, and then let them take ride no 2500, and so on until you turn up and ride, and get the numbers back in sync. This is why I can't see a change to people coming back late with fastpasses being accepted.
You always "effectively" know roughly how many rides are left because you know how close to closing time it is. The standby queue will then self regulate as a standby line does with people deciding to disappointed themselves, by deciding the ride isn't worth the wait.
The ride capacity does not change, it still takes x people per hour. All that changes is the experience of the wait. It is always first come first served, with fastpass however, you can come, go, and then be served. With Standby, you have to come, wait and then be served, which is seen by some as inherantly fairer than allowing people that actually came before you to wander off and then come back.

I had a recent experience with Everest where the wait time was long enbough to put me off, but i decided I did want to get a ticket and return later on. That still involved a 15 minute queue, but same night we were able to do 3 rides on the bounce.
Toy story, we only managed 1 ride, by getting there reasonably early, getting a fastpass and returning.
Kali river rapids, we got a fastpass, and returned last thing at night, the lines were non existant by that time, so we essentially got a fastpass, but chose not to use it, and allowed the standby queue to move quicker.

Where demand outstrips supply, the question is how do you fairly select who is allowed to ride and in when, such that work in the best interests of both guest and company?
The easy answer is make them wait in a line, first come first served.... I think they've got it about right with fastpass, aside from when people are forced to queue in a line that is longer than the advertised wait time, I think there are times when they could definately be a bit cleverer with the posted wait times, like breakdowns.

[Thorpeedo]

Originally Posted by Barbaraann

My idea allows you to get all your fastpasses at the beginning of your day. Let's say that there are 5 different rides and/or attractions at a park. With my plan, you could collect all of them at the beginning of the day. You then have the rest of the day to use those passes. The only restriction being that you arrive after the time stated on each of those five fastpasses.

The way the system is now, you might be able to get a fastpass for one attraction, and have a second before riding the first, but a third attraction isn't always possible, because by that time they are all gone.

I'd just like the opportunity to be able to ride all the popular rides during my day.

Ooohh no.... First come being the only ones to get served, get up early or lose out completely ??
At least by limiting the fastpasses held by an individual you are increasing the number of guests that are able to take advantage. Spreading the wealth. I think the system works as it is. As Bug says, they have ways of managing breakdowns.... I experienced a CM working RnR, through a breakdown only last fortnight, and it left me happy.

[Barbaraann]

My idea, came to me, after having a bad experience at the park. While I believe that it would have been the ideal solution, for me personally. It is obvious that it wouldn't work for the masses that have passed through the turnstiles at Disney World. Disney World, is a work in progress, and I hope that in the future less and less people have the same bad experience that I did.

[Kiba]

Originally Posted by Aaron Morrow

Does anyone else think this sounds somewhat familiar to the plans for the Jumbo-sized Dumbo?

(At least in terms of the “no physical line” concept; it sounds like Dumbo will be more of a deli-style “take a number and wait” conceit.)

It might be a next gen version of the queue areas in Indy and Everest- an immersive, pre-show experience updated with more options and no lines. It will be interesting to see it in action.

[Director_Guy]

Just bring back the ticket books, why not.

[joanna71985]

Originally Posted by aimster

Disney needs to get rid of FastPass altogether. Or charge for it and limit the number sold, like Universal.

I wouldn't mind if Disney got rid of FP for certain rides (as FP just makes the lines longer).

Originally Posted by Barbaraann

My day at DHS allowed me to do just about everything that I wanted to do. My basic complaint is, that when I got in the Toy Story Mania Line with my grandson, the wait time said 70 minutes. That time was inaccurate. Not by 5 minutes, but by 50. That is my beef. At that moment in time, I was willing to wait an hour for the ride, believing that my grandson would enjoy it. We actually had fun in the cue. Fun, up until the time that our 70 minutes had elapsed, and now we realized that we were only about 1/2 way through the cue. Now, I guess we could have gotten out of the line, at that point. I know that my grandson wished he had never gotten in the line at all.

Unfortunately that didn't have to do with just FP. Probably the FLIK cards hadn't caught up yet, so the time was off.

Originally Posted by TDLFAN

I'm sorry Barbaraann but I can't agree with your idea. Why not get rid of Fastpass so the regular lnes can move faster? And while you are at it.. terminate special benefits for people in wheelchairs as well, who abuse the line by bringing their 20 (able-body) family members to the front of the line as well without wait time.

With wheelchair parties, only 6 guests total are allowed to (or supposed to, anyway) go to the front. And that is definitely enforced at TSM.

Originally Posted by ti2gr

What they also need to start doing is enforcing the fastpass time frames. As it stands right now, as long as you return anytime after the start time on your fastpass they'll let you in. They should start enforcing it more meaning that when the pass says between 12:05 and 1:05, means as long as you arrive anytime between those times your let in. arrive after 1:05, sorry you blew it. arrive before 12:05, comeback after 12:05. right now, if you arrive after 12:05 they let you in, whether it's 7:45pm or 1:04

Unfortunately that is not always possible. Things do happen where it is impossible to get back on time for the FP.

Originally Posted by ti2gr

I agree totally, especially on the special benefits part. People in wheelchairs and their entourage should wait like everyone else. If you can't handle the line in a wheelchair like everyone else then don't get in line. Sorry if that sounds cruel, but if it were one or 2 people fine, but when there is an entourage of 20 people or so, then it's just abuse of the system.

Oh trust me, wheelchair parties do wait (sometimes a lot longer for certain rides). I know at TSM, it can take a lot longer to get on, if there are a lot of wheelchair parties waiting. And at the rides, only 6 people in total are supposed to go with the person in the wheelchair.

And I almost forgot something- if the person just has a chair (no GAC), at most rides the wheelchair can fit through the queue line (or most of the line, if there are stairs at some point).

[BC_DisneyGeek]

I can't imagine a Fastpass-only scenario would work.

There would inevitably have to be more people using Fastpass, making the Fastpass line longer than it is now. To mitigate that somewhat I think the return times would need to both be narrower, and heavily enforced.

It would probably be a logistical nightmare resulting in many unhappy guests.

Getting rid of Fastpass altogether is a better idea IMO, but I don't endorse that either.

[OneWorld]

Originally Posted by Bill

Your grandson is right! Fastpass needs to be removed. If you want your problemt to go away, then this needs to happen, but it is also highly unlikely: Then the prices to enter the parks need to be raised to a level where crowds are no longer a major problem. (Effectively limiting attendance each day... perhaps some days of the week or year could be more expensive than others)

Yea lets raise the single park pass to $100.00 for adults and $85.00 for children. Then raise park hoppers accordingly. Or maybe even double that. No, lets make the parks only for the top 1 percent.

What an idea this person has.

[OneWorld]

Originally Posted by sleepyjeff

There is a 3rd way.....or what I like to call the FIRST way.

The problem with no fastpass is that some people keep getting on the ride/attraction over and over again with the only cost to them a wait in a line.

With fp, you get to ride more quickly but only after a period of time has passed....during which you may crowd that attraction or some other attractions line. Net result.....long waits for all again.

With an only fp system you would still have the undue crowding of non-fp attractions not to mention the inability for anyone to ride a fp attraction more than once.....which will just encourage people to make those non-fp attractions even more crowded yet. The only way this could really work is if every single attraction had it.

But, there once was a time when lines had two checks against getting too long.

Check one was, of course, the wait itself. People would check out the wait time and determine for themselves if they thought it was worth the wait.....

Check two, and this is the more important one, was an actual monetary cost to getting in line....A - E tickets. If you have a ticket book with only 5 E-tickets inside you will have a good reason not to queue up for the same attraction over and over again and instead perhaps break up your E-ticket riding marathon with a visit to some of the less expensive attractions, or taking in a free show, or eating at a full service restaurant(instead of churros and turkey legs), etc.

Walt knew what he was doing.......the turkeys runnning the show now, not so much

Walt knew his stuff. I have one of the old ticket books from Disneyland. Also don't leave out how cheap the Florida residents get in. They can easily fill up Disneyworld on any given weekend. The better discounts should be given to the people from out of state that have to pay a lot more just to get there. Or at least charge the same price. Have everyone that travels from out of state quit going and see how well they do with just Florida residents going to their parks.

[Thorpeedo]

Originally Posted by OneWorld

Yea lets raise the single park pass to $100.00 for adults and $85.00 for children. Then raise park hoppers accordingly. Or maybe even double that. No, lets make the parks only for the top 1 percent.

What an idea this person has.

I presume you are being sarcastic....but not quite getting the point. Cost and demand are intertwined...it's how the world works. Bill has got exactly the appropriate concept, but unfortunately not an ideal one. On any given day capacity is a set number of people. If you limit that number to make sure queues are manageable inside the park, then you either need to reduce the demand or you will be shutting up shop regularly when it's full. This will obviously leave a whole boatfull of disappointed potential customers. If you do not want to do this, you can up the price so that not quite as many people want to come in, reduce demand, and try to strike the balance so you get close to full each day. The current offers are reflective of broad managment of the situation. There is a reduced demand because of the world economy. Disney are keeping the park numbers up, leading people to believe that they make the bulk of their money in food and merchandising. He says in his Indy shirt bought 2 weeks ago .

As I said in my long update earlier regarding queues, you are looking for the disappointed people to choose themselves, and therefore feel like they made a decision rather than your policies denied them access.