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  1. #1

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    Country Bear condition status

    Hey,

    If anyone has seen the Country Bears since they reopened from the Christmas changeover, could you tell me the condition of the show?
    A friend of mine has been telling me that the bears have had a few problems(Trixie's eyes being messed up so she's either cross-eyed or looking in two seperate directions, and Melvin making a lot of mechincal racket). I just want to see if any of these were cleared up during the changeover.

  2. #2

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    Re: Country Bear condition status

    I saw the show last week and thought it loooked a little 'off' to me ... the sound especially seemed very low and weak.

    But it doesn't surprise me because I doubt WDW has any folks who actually know how to care for and repair AAs anymore.

  3. #3

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    Re: Country Bear condition status

    That kinda sucks because I saw the regular show Halloween weekend and it was all fine for me.

  4. #4

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    Re: Country Bear condition status

    I heard they like "remastered" the sound ont he original show but I guess they haven't cleaned up the Christmas show... which I don't think I have ever seen.

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by WDW1974
    But it doesn't surprise me because I doubt WDW has any folks who actually know how to care for and repair AAs anymore.
    That isn't the case. The older AAs are almost impossible to fix. They just need to be updated to digital ones to help fix most of the problems.

    As for the show, I saw it last week for my first Christmas show and I did enjoy it. I will say some of the AAs did seem a shaky, but they usually are. I was sitting in the second row so and I can't tell you too much about Teddi.

  6. #6

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    Re: Country Bear condition status

    Quote Originally Posted by J.E.Smith
    (Trixie's eyes being messed up so she's either cross-eyed or looking in two seperate directions, and Melvin making a lot of mechincal racket). I just want to see if any of these were cleared up during the changeover.
    I noticed those two exact same problems when I saw it on October. I haven't seen it post-changeover however. WDW1974 says it was "a bit off," which I think is a good description for most of the AA shows on property.

    Just an interesting side note. Country Bears Xmas show was specifically designed to change-out in 36 hours (5 eight-hour shifts with some overlap), and as recently as 1993 they were still doing it in 36 hours. It was only closed for one operating day (the day before Thanksgiving). When I went through traditions (I am no longer a CM) this was used an an example of how Disney put the guest experience first--minimizing down-time.

    But this sudden consentrated workload for decorating and maintanence always leads to a lot of overtime. Sow now its down for like 4 or 5 opperating days to save money.

  7. #7

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    Re: Country Bear condition status

    Quote Originally Posted by BigPigletFan
    That isn't the case. The older AAs are almost impossible to fix. They just need to be updated to digital ones to help fix most of the problems.

    As for the show, I saw it last week for my first Christmas show and I did enjoy it. I will say some of the AAs did seem a shaky, but they usually are. I was sitting in the second row so and I can't tell you too much about Teddi.
    I know a lot of people that can fix AAs from the 1960s and 1970s, but most of them have lost their jobs in the past few years. Older AAs are almost impossible to fix if no one on staff knows how.

    If The Walt Disney Company were willing to spend the money to update all the older AAs, the point would be mute. Unfortunatly they have chosen to both lay-off older workers who can fix the figures, and not upgrade the older figures.

    The shaky AA is a phenom of the past 10 to 15 years. Yes, they usually are shaky now, but there was a time when their movements were so fluid, some guests thought they were real people (Lincoln and GMR Witch).

    Big Piglet Fan, I hope you do not take my comments personally. I know you are a new CM (as I once was), and I have a lot of respect for high-energy positive new CMs like yourself. The Walt Disney Co. needs people like you. But, the truth is that quality has slipped, and The Walt Disney Co. also needs people to speak out when it does (even if they don't like to hear it).
    Last edited by Pete; 11-20-2005 at 11:50 AM.

  8. #8

    • Jerm is Food...Not Friend
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    Re: Country Bear condition status

    BPF is one of the greatest CM's ever!!!!! I have seen her at work and she rocks.

    As far as how easy it is for people to fix these things......that means a lot coming from people who are talking about this on a fan board. I am a CM and yes things changes over the years but no matter what Disney is the best. While problems do happen with CM's and the company it is the love of the Disney name that makes it all magic!

    J
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    *END OF LINE*

  9. #9

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    Re: Country Bear condition status

    Quote Originally Posted by Pete
    I noticed those two exact same problems when I saw it on October. I haven't seen it post-changeover however. WDW1974 says it was "a bit off," which I think is a good description for most of the AA shows on property.
    YES! I knew I wasn't the only one.

    They used to appear so fluid, in some cases, lifelike. Now, most look like squeaky old robots that aren't in synch with their soundtrack and effects.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pete
    Just an interesting side note. Country Bears Xmas show was specifically designed to change-out in 36 hours (5 eight-hour shifts with some overlap), and as recently as 1993 they were still doing it in 36 hours. It was only closed for one operating day (the day before Thanksgiving). When I went through traditions (I am no longer a CM) this was used an an example of how Disney put the guest experience first--minimizing down-time.

    But this sudden consentrated workload for decorating and maintanence always leads to a lot of overtime. Sow now its down for like 4 or 5 opperating days to save money.
    Well, the guest only comes first if they are at City Hall and are loud and obnoxious and demanding a freebie for some perceived slight. Other than that, Disney pays lip service to guest service most of the time.

    As to your above comment about decorating, I think the same could be said about Christmas decorations in general. They used to do the entire MK in one evening, usually the night before Thanksgiving.

    Now, you can see decorations in some places (like the Epcot resorts) three weeks into next year.

    It's all bad show, but you think Al Weiss cares about that?

  10. #10

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    Re: Country Bear condition status

    Quote Originally Posted by Pete
    I know a lot of people that can fix AAs from the 1960s and 1970s, but most of them have lost their jobs in the past few years. Older AAs are almost impossible to fix if no one on staff knows how.

    If The Walt Disney Company were willing to spend the money to update all the older AAs, the point would be mute. Unfortunatly they have chosen to both lay-off older workers who can fix the figures, and not upgrade the older figures. ).
    Yes, but if you allow the AAs to fall into disrepair (see CoP) then you can rip the costly buggers out and replace 20-minute AA shows with 2-minute Pixar-based kiddie rides.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pete
    The shaky AA is a phenom of the past 10 to 15 years. Yes, they usually are shaky now, but there was a time when their movements were so fluid, some guests thought they were real people (Lincoln and GMR Witch).

    Big Piglet Fan, I hope you do not take my comments personally. I know you are a new CM (as I once was), and I have a lot of respect for high-energy positive new CMs like yourself. The Walt Disney Co. needs people like you. But, the truth is that quality has slipped, and The Walt Disney Co. also needs people to speak out when it does (even if they don't like to hear it).
    It's great to hear the perspective of a former CM, who KNOWS firsthand that WDW's quality isn't nearly what it once was.

    I, for one, hope you hang around here and post your throughts often.

  11. #11

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    Re: Country Bear condition status

    Quote Originally Posted by WDW1974
    Yes, but if you allow the AAs to fall into disrepair (see CoP) then you can rip the costly buggers out and replace 20-minute AA shows with 2-minute Pixar-based kiddie ride.
    A 2 minute kid ride that would get higher attendance, cost less in the long run, and want people to revisit that park for a new attraction. While I am not a fan of the old attractions making way for new stuff, just typing that makes no sense, you have to understand that people, in general, don't care about a 20 minute show. If you think about it most families no love for an attraction that has been around for some 40+ years because they could do 5 different things during that timespan.

    I hate to jump on to this old topic but if all Disney did was keep the old attractions around no one would go to the park. Walt himself pulled out things when something new and better came around. CBJ has been a main stay of WDW from day 1, it was one fo the top billed NEW attractions. CoP is not a opening day attraction and does not ALWAYS get the same crowd plus it is a prime location for a new larger attraction.

    Yes it would be nice to see the AA's back at top show! BUT Disney is a company just like all the rest they have to put the money where they can make money. While that sounds like it is so against everything Disney has stood for it is the truth. If you want to make sure that attractions don't leave, don't sit here and type about it and DON"T walk into City Hall and say how bad it is that you heard a rumor about it leaving (which is what SO MANY PEOPLE DO) go to that attraction and enjoy it. Then take your family and friends on it and have them do the same. Disney wont pull out an attraction that pulls in the numbers, why CoP has stuck around for the past few years, but they will pull out something when no one enjoys it.

    Off my soap box,
    J
    Kungaloosh!

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  12. #12

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    Re: Country Bear condition status

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerm
    A 2 minute kid ride that would get higher attendance, cost less in the long run, and want people to revisit that park for a new attraction. While I am not a fan of the old attractions making way for new stuff, just typing that makes no sense, you have to understand that people, in general, don't care about a 20 minute show. If you think about it most families no love for an attraction that has been around for some 40+ years because they could do 5 different things during that timespan.
    I guess that's why Disney now builds parks that are half-day ventures, right?

    That logic makes no sense to me. It's the 'if it's good enough for Six Flags' Paul Pressler crap. The one thing that always set Disney apart from the other guys were long, imersive shows and attractions. Pirates in Aneheim is at least 15 minutes long and it sure isn't tired or not getting numbers ... what about the American Adventure? That's 30 minutes of history ... maybe we can put in a rolley coaster thru a WalMart sweatshop factory in instead, it tells a lot about the USA today.

    No offense, but how do you know that people in general don't want 20-minute attractions? (and I'm not saying you're wrong at least for the current WDW clientele).

    And the reason CoP has been around since the '64 World's Fair was because Disney always tried to keep it relevant. The core point about family and progress certainly IS timeless. The attraction may not be popular now, but why is that?

    Could the fact Disney has wanted to rip it out since the late 90s have had something to do with it? CoP regulaly appears and disappears from park maps. It's nowhere to be seen on promotional materials, even the resort TV stations.

    The attractions hasn't seen any changes to it since the early 90s ... that was before the Internet, before kids had cell phones, before anything like an I-Pod existed ... do you think that maybe the show needs some serious updating to make it relevant to a new audience?

    They are doing to CoP what they do everytime they wish to remove an attraction. Make it so no one knows it exists or when it will open, leave it fall into disrepair, watch the numbers fall, than justify a decision that was made years before.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerm
    I hate to jump on to this old topic but if all Disney did was keep the old attractions around no one would go to the park. Walt himself pulled out things when something new and better came around. CBJ has been a main stay of WDW from day 1, it was one fo the top billed NEW attractions. CoP is not a opening day attraction and does not ALWAYS get the same crowd plus it is a prime location for a new larger attraction.
    I am not one of the people who don't believe in change. I am for the changes they are going to make to Pirates, for example. That isn't the point I am debating.

    And as to space, the MK has oodles of it available. They don't need to take CoP or anything else away to add something.

    They just took the abandoned site of a former E-Ticket and turned it into a McPoohPlayland, so I just don't see space as an issue.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jerm
    Yes it would be nice to see the AA's back at top show! BUT Disney is a company just like all the rest they have to put the money where they can make money. While that sounds like it is so against everything Disney has stood for it is the truth. If you want to make sure that attractions don't leave, don't sit here and type about it and DON"T walk into City Hall and say how bad it is that you heard a rumor about it leaving (which is what SO MANY PEOPLE DO) go to that attraction and enjoy it. Then take your family and friends on it and have them do the same. Disney wont pull out an attraction that pulls in the numbers, why CoP has stuck around for the past few years, but they will pull out something when no one enjoys it.

    Off my soap box,
    J
    And I know plenty about business and the entertainment business in particular. I also know my Disney stock, and I have a decent-sized investment, has been hovering around $25 for the past few years, after coming up from the mid-teens. I should point out that it was $43 5-6 years ago.

    And I don't walk into City Hall with complaints. That's just a total waste of time. I take the issues to the people. And I let the execs know, one way or another, that I am displeased with certain things that affect my satisfaction as a guest and dilute the Disney name.

    Oh, and FWIW, bitching in a forum like this does have an affect as well.
    Disney execs and PR folks, mainstream media and consultants all monitor forums like this.

    The Internet can be a very powerful tool in getting your voice heard.

  13. #13

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    Re: Country Bear condition status

    Quote Originally Posted by WDW1974
    I guess that's why Disney now builds parks that are half-day ventures, right?

    That logic makes no sense to me. It's the 'if it's good enough for Six Flags' Paul Pressler crap.
    Buzz Lightyear is crap?


    Quote Originally Posted by WDW1974
    No offense, but how do you know that people in general don't want 20-minute attractions? (and I'm not saying you're wrong at least for the current WDW clientele).
    If you look at attractions such as Tiki Room, CoP, American Adventure, Hall of Pres, or any of the circle vision shows in any US parks you will see that as far as attraction attendance goes those are some of the lower visited.

    Quote Originally Posted by WDW1974
    Could the fact Disney has wanted to rip it out since the late 90s have had something to do with it? CoP regulaly appears and disappears from park maps. It's nowhere to be seen on promotional materials, even the resort TV stations.

    The attractions hasn't seen any changes to it since the early 90s ... that was before the Internet, before kids had cell phones, before anything like an I-Pod existed ... do you think that maybe the show needs some serious updating to make it relevant to a new audience?
    While I would love to see it updated, will that really change much? What is one of the most internet hated attraction.....Tiki Room after the update. While that is not the best come back, I wonder how much the change in the 90's really did to the attractions attendance.

    Quote Originally Posted by WDW1974
    They are doing to CoP what they do everytime they wish to remove an attraction. Make it so no one knows it exists or when it will open, leave it fall into disrepair, watch the numbers fall, than justify a decision that was made years before.
    I would love to know what you base this off of. If 1974 was the year you were born, I have been around Disney parks just as long as you and I have never seen them do something like this? What attractions are you talking about?



    I am not one of the people who don't believe in change. I am for the changes they are going to make to Pirates, for example. That isn't the point I am debating.




    Quote Originally Posted by WDW1974
    Oh, and FWIW, bitching in a forum like this does have an affect as well.
    Disney execs and PR folks, mainstream media and consultants all monitor forums like this.

    The Internet can be a very powerful tool in getting your voice heard.
    As someone that has worked in 2 major theme parks, in more then just a line CM position, I can tell you that yes these boards are monitored at times. These boards are not something that are looked at more then the surrvey reports from the CM's in the park.


    I am not saying that every point that has been brought up are not a good point, but come on what would a child in the park rather do? CoP or Buzz? I love all the attractions but at the same time I also love ToT, Buzz, Rn'Rc, and some of the new classic attraction. Things have come and gone in the park over the years and while a lot of the past attractions are missed in 5 years those attractions are only missed by a few Disney geeks like us.

    J
    Kungaloosh!

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  14. #14

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    Re: Country Bear condition status

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerm
    Buzz Lightyear is crap?
    If you think the attraction replacing CoP will be anything like Buzz, you are mistaken.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerm
    If you look at attractions such as Tiki Room, CoP, American Adventure, Hall of Pres, or any of the circle vision shows in any US parks you will see that as far as attraction attendance goes those are some of the lower visited.
    True of the others but not the American Adventure. It's well attended and rates highly on the "intent to return" column of the surveys (I had access to them for many years). The American Adventure is also the best maintained AA show.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerm
    While I would love to see it updated, will that really change much? What is one of the most internet hated attraction.....Tiki Room after the update. While that is not the best come back, I wonder how much the change in the 90's really did to the attractions attendance.
    I can't imagine anyone suggesting that CoP be changed in the same manner as Tiki. The Tiki re-do changed the flavor of the show (just as Journey into YOUR Imagination did). This is never a good idea.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerm
    I am not saying that every point that has been brought up are not a good point, but come on what would a child in the park rather do? CoP or Buzz?
    Again, don't assume the new attraction is going to be like Buzz. Don't even assume a child will be able to ride. These are not safe assumptions.

  15. #15

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    Re: Country Bear condition status

    Quote Originally Posted by Pete
    Again, don't assume the new attraction is going to be like Buzz. Don't even assume a child will be able to ride. These are not safe assumptions.
    You are assuming that it will be another AE/M:S from the sounds of your reply, while I am not assuming that I have any clue what if anything will replace it you sound like you have been to WDI and have seen the plans and if you have next time you are in Glendale call me and we can go shopping at Mickeys of Glendale. I am going off the early statment that the 2minute pixar type ride would be the type of replacement.

    When it gets down to the brass tacks of things I don't want CoP gone I love it, it is a Disney Classic. But what I, a 31 year old male, or what we, a bunch of people that have nothing better to do then post on Disney boards, want is not and are not the main people in the park giving money to the mouse. The families that spend thousands upon thousands of dollars to make a vacation out to Fl or to Ca are who they are looking at. If you fall into that group then next time you go to the park ask your 7 year old daughter what she wants to do? Walt wanted a place where parent and child could play together...I would love it if my niece would run to CoP as the first attraciton when I take her to WDW but come on we all know that will not happen anytime soon.

    J
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