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  1. #46

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    Re: Holy cow, WDW's Magic Kingdom is Horrible! (Compared to Disneyland Park)

    Quote Originally Posted by WDW1974
    And broken stuff? Did you ride Mansion? How about Splash Mtn? Buzz Lightyear?
    I'm gonna back him up on this. As a 2-3 times per year visitor (and one who really looks for things to be out of place) the Magic Kingdom is very easy to get lost in and to forget about the peeling paint and such. But one also has to look at it this way. Things break...and you might just hit it wrong.
    Splash was not 100% for me in October...but it was in the summer. Star Tours was perfect when I rode it over the summer, all the queue's bots worked and they ran all the simulators...something I had never seen before. I've yet to see something on Buzz be broken...though yes the paint is pretty bad on the cars themselves.
    The one exception is the Haunted Mansion which really needs it's sound system replaced.
    So yes the park isn't perfect...but it is so far ahead of so many other parks sometimes you need not think and just enjoy.

    BTW Bill...
    and when you adjust that to California prices, it's a bargan.
    Last I looked California currency was still the dollar (you know being in America and all) and my east coast dollar didn't have a fluxuating exchange rate for the west coast dollar...so what does this mean?

  2. #47

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    Re: Holy cow, WDW's Magic Kingdom is Horrible! (Compared to Disneyland Park)

    Quote Originally Posted by tloolgb
    Last I looked California currency was still the dollar (you know being in America and all) and my east coast dollar didn't have a fluxuating exchange rate for the west coast dollar...so what does this mean?
    I think he meant that everything (in general) is more expensive in CA than in FL.
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  3. #48

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    Re: Holy cow, WDW's Magic Kingdom is Horrible! (Compared to Disneyland Park)

    Quote Originally Posted by MickeyMania
    Perhaps, but they're all slowly becoming the same thing. You'll see that if you Park Hopper that WDW ticket.

    DL has Star Tours, it's not that WDW doesn't, it's that it's in MGM instead of MK.
    DL has Indy. That's nice, and WDW put a different spin on it and put it in AK instead of the MK. IMO, that works out nicely since it leaves the visitor with two unique experiences to go enjoy.
    DL has Innoventions. MK doesn't, and should be thankful for that, but EPCOT does.
    DL has two boats going around the Rivers of America, WDW has one. It's still the same trip around the river either way, but DL counts it as two attractions just because they can. This is also the same reason why Casey Jr and Storybook Boats are two attractions even though they travel around the same thing.

    Basically, DL has tried to integrate stuff from greater WDW, as best as it can, within the theme of DL, with mixed results. DCA is so desperate for attendance that it's allowed a lot of things people would go to Orlando for to come to Cali, for instance:

    TOT suddently comes to CA from the Studios.
    Muppets 4D suddently comes to CA from the Studios.
    The Animation Building is essentially an import of the Animation feature at the Studios.
    "Honey, I Shrunk..." comes to DL from one of the WDW parks (I forget which.)
    Turtle Talk comes to CA from EPCOT.

    What do we give in exchange?

    EPCOT gets Soarin' from DCA.

    Basically, DL and DCA are loading up on WDW stuff that you guys have enjoyed for the past 17 years or so because we have the need and, suddently with the resort's expansion, we have the room. What will always keep the parks special are rides that are unique or special, whether designed that way or just happen to be that way because of circumstances.

    For instance:
    DL has Matterhorn, WDW now has Everest but they're very different.
    Due to eliminations, DL has Mr Toad and WDW doesn't, but WDW has Country Bears and DL doesn't.
    WDW doesn't have the Pinocchio dark ride but DL doesn't have Philharmagic, either.

    I do have to admit all these WDW imports makes the case to going to DL a lot stronger now, though. Previously, there was no comparison as to what I could do more at, but nowadays a lot of the stuff that made me wish I could travel to Orlando are now here in Xeroxed form.
    Yes, it's in different parks... that's why the MK is so watered down in WDW. It's not that they replaced Fantasmic! with another nighttime show at WDW's Magic Kingdom, there's just nothing there. Same with the Matterhorn, Storybook Land, Alice in Wonderland, etc.

    Yes, WDW may have almost everything Disneyland Park has, but it's spread out through four parks to have a minimal amount of attractions in each park and to get the most money per guest because of the need to park-hop to see multiple attractions that are all in the same park at Disneyland.

    If the Magic Kingdom in WDW had more replacements for the missing attractions (Including the ones found at other WDW parks) then I'd agree. But until you realize how saturated Disneyland Park is with attractions & things to do, you really can't say that Magic Kingdom in WDW is the same as Disneyland Park in DLR. The way I see it, the Magic Kingdom at WDW needs at least ten more original attractions (attractions not found in WDW) before you can start comparing it to Disneyland Park.

    The problem at WDW is that every park needs about ten more attractions, Animal Kingdom and the Disney-MGM Studios needing even more. And that costs so much money... but I'd say it's about time to start building out the wazoo at WDW's Parks. And DCA for that matter. And if anyone mentions that WDW needs another theme park, they need to be shot on site... well, or gently explained to that the current parks need to be filled with attractions before new parks should be added. The WDW parks get crowded easilly because there aren't enough attractions to handle it all. More attractions = WDW will be less crowded.

  4. #49

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    Re: Holy cow, WDW's Magic Kingdom is Horrible! (Compared to Disneyland Park)

    Quote Originally Posted by askmike1
    I think he meant that everything (in general) is more expensive in CA than in FL.
    Yeah, I guess I was just saying that Disneyland is pretty cheap for California Locals compared to WDW's prices. Though I was amazed at how much the Annual Passports went up in price at Disneyland Resort. Although the price is much higher, if that was what was needed to lower the crowds, I'm rather happy the prices went up.

  5. #50

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    Re: Holy cow, WDW's Magic Kingdom is Horrible! (Compared to Disneyland Park)

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill
    Hmmm...

    I think you're missing the point on why Disneyland Park is better than WDW's Magic Kingdom Park...

    I'm not just pointing out the painting and the chips in the sidewalks. I'm pointing out how much more Disneyland Park has to offer. It has about twice as many attractions as the Magic Kingdom Park in Walt Disney World. Twice as many. That's not a small number. And Disneyland Park's one day admission price is cheaper than that of Walt Disney Worlds... and when you adjust that to California prices, it's a bargan.
    I didn't miss that at all. All you have to do is compare attraction rosters and the MK pales in comparison to the original. Look at how much more realized Fantasyland is. Not only do you have Pinnochio and Alice dark rides, but superior effects in every other attraction. You have Casey Jr. and Storybook Land and a better version of Small World with the amazing facade. Compare New Orleans Square with Liberty Square. NOS still has so much charm from unique shops (minus the one they turned into a pin shack) to numerous dining options to live music. LS has the ruined Hall of Prez, LTT for dining (which has been characterized for dinner) and not much else. The unique shops that were there even a decade ago are now replaced by a huge Disney Christmas character shop. Some shops just sit with blackened windows. How about comparing a fully realized Toowtown at DK with the cheap, tacky, temporary land we have in Florida? Or a Rivers of America without canoes, Columbia etc ...

    The only land I find superior at WDW is Tomorrowland ... and that's by a smidge. And will change once the Finding Nemo Sub Voyage opens.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill
    Perhaps it stays down because Disneyland Park's admission price must be the same as DCA's price, and DCA can be done in only a few hours.
    Nah. It stays down because historically it always has been less to visit DL.
    The WDW MK has the highest one-day ticket price of the five world-wide and I'm pretty damn sure it would rank fourth on my list if I had visited all the others.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill
    Disneyland is amazing. The theming is better on most attractions, there's more to do, and even when it's insanely crowded, they are much better than crowd control at WDW's Magic Kingdom. Turning the hub into a traffic circle is genius. But then, Disneyland learned how to do crowd control ever since Fantasmic! appeared. They have it down to a science. At WDW... Well, it's a little harder to move around when it gets crowded, even with the larger paths. Superior versions of almost every attraction at WDW can be found at Disneyland Park. The shops have a tad more variety. And the seasonal overlays of attractions are just amazing. Disneyland has more magic.
    That last sentence sums up my feelings perfectly.

    Glad you had a great time, Bill.

  6. #51

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    Re: Holy cow, WDW's Magic Kingdom is Horrible! (Compared to Disneyland Park)

    Quote Originally Posted by MickeyMania
    Perhaps, but they're all slowly becoming the same thing. You'll see that if you Park Hopper that WDW ticket.

    DL has Star Tours, it's not that WDW doesn't, it's that it's in MGM instead of MK.
    DL has Indy. That's nice, and WDW put a different spin on it and put it in AK instead of the MK. IMO, that works out nicely since it leaves the visitor with two unique experiences to go enjoy.
    DL has Innoventions. MK doesn't, and should be thankful for that, but EPCOT does.
    DL has two boats going around the Rivers of America, WDW has one. It's still the same trip around the river either way, but DL counts it as two attractions just because they can. This is also the same reason why Casey Jr and Storybook Boats are two attractions even though they travel around the same thing.
    The park-hopping idea is why WDW can get away with lower quality across the board. You can't ever be disappointed in a WDW vacation, at least in my mind, if you base it on the whole rather than the parts.

    But what if you only had one day. And spent it at the MK ... or the Studios ... or Epcot? Then you'd start to realize that all those glossy ads and TV campaigns are focusing on attractions in four parks and many resorts. Not one. And that makes a world ... a World of difference.

    I can't imagine anyone spending just one day at the MK (and no where else at WDW) and thinking they were getting a better quality Disney product. Or, heck, two days with one at MK and one at Disney-MGM vs. one at DL and one at DCA ... I still think DL would come out on top.

    And as far as your examples, the attractions you mentioned weren't imported from WDW. It was the opposite. Star Tours opened at DL in 1987. Didn't hit the Studios until 1990. DL had Indy in 1995, while WDW had to wait until 1998 to get the inferior CTX/Dinosaur.

    Quote Originally Posted by MickeyMania
    Basically, DL has tried to integrate stuff from greater WDW, as best as it can, within the theme of DL, with mixed results. DCA is so desperate for attendance that it's allowed a lot of things people would go to Orlando for to come to Cali, for instance:

    TOT suddently comes to CA from the Studios.
    Muppets 4D suddently comes to CA from the Studios.
    The Animation Building is essentially an import of the Animation feature at the Studios.
    "Honey, I Shrunk..." comes to DL from one of the WDW parks (I forget which.)
    Turtle Talk comes to CA from EPCOT.
    Well, as I pointed out above, the cloning of attractions/ideas/ride systems goes both ways.

    Muppets and HiStA (which plays at Epcot), which are both tired, came to DL because they were incredibly cheap. You build a theater at one park, DL already had one, and you add the movie/effects. The more savvy SoCal visitors grew tired with these attractions very quickly. I've never seen either theater filled in the last 3-4 years.

    The Animation attraction is actually far superior at DCA. Once they closed Feature Animation Florida, they did a few stopgaps to make it seem like they still had an attraction. Now they have copied some of the DCA elements.


    Quote Originally Posted by MickeyMania
    What do we give in exchange?

    EPCOT gets Soarin' from DCA.

    Basically, DL and DCA are loading up on WDW stuff that you guys have enjoyed for the past 17 years or so because we have the need and, suddently with the resort's expansion, we have the room. What will always keep the parks special are rides that are unique or special, whether designed that way or just happen to be that way because of circumstances.

    For instance:
    DL has Matterhorn, WDW now has Everest but they're very different.
    Due to eliminations, DL has Mr Toad and WDW doesn't, but WDW has Country Bears and DL doesn't.
    WDW doesn't have the Pinocchio dark ride but DL doesn't have Philharmagic, either.

    I do have to admit all these WDW imports makes the case to going to DL a lot stronger now, though. Previously, there was no comparison as to what I could do more at, but nowadays a lot of the stuff that made me wish I could travel to Orlando are now here in Xeroxed form.
    That's understandable. What you get at WDW is the true resort experience with a myriad of resort, dining and recreational opportunities available that you'll never get in Anaheim. But as far as park attractions ... you have plenty of WDW at the DLR.

    Want DAK? Just go see It's Tough to be a Bug.

    How about the Studios? OK, you get ToT, Playhouse Disney, MuppetVision and a superior Animation attraction ... and a better coaster in Screamin. Not to mention the original (and better) Fantasmic.

    Epcot? OK ... not much here ... just Soarin and Innoventions.

    Frankly, from a park standpoint, WDW is worth a visit for a DL veteran only if that person is going to spend a lot of time at DAK, Epcot and the resorts.

    You certainly can't be wowed by Pirates in Orlando after riding the original ... or Peter Pan ... or Space Mountain ... or Small World ... or even Splash Mountain, which features way more AA's in Anaheim and logs that don't reek of sweat.

  7. #52

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    Re: Holy cow, WDW's Magic Kingdom is Horrible! (Compared to Disneyland Park)

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill
    Yeah, I guess I was just saying that Disneyland is pretty cheap for California Locals compared to WDW's prices. Though I was amazed at how much the Annual Passports went up in price at Disneyland Resort. Although the price is much higher, if that was what was needed to lower the crowds, I'm rather happy the prices went up.
    But it hasn't. The crowds are bigger than ever. All the AP increases have done is make more money for the Mouse.

    Although a few years ago you could buy a two-park DL PAP for $199 ... definitely underpriced. So I'm not sure you can say $349 now is overpriced.

  8. #53

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    Re: Holy cow, WDW's Magic Kingdom is Horrible! (Compared to Disneyland Park)

    But what if you only had one day. And spent it at the MK ... or the Studios ... or Epcot?
    If I could spend one day at any of those parks, I'd be a happy person. I would enjoy every second of it and come out with a smile on my face and a little extra magic in my heart.

    Then you'd start to realize that all those glossy ads and TV campaigns are focusing on attractions in four parks and many resorts.
    The only commercials that even mention non-MK attractions are the 2 HCOE commercials (the one with Walt & the Castle, and the one earlier this year with CGI Mickey) & the M:S commercial from a few years ago. All the other commercials feature some cute/magical family moment followed by the nightime view of Cinderella Castle. Dog Days commercial, Pluto commercial, Crazy Uncle Jim commercial, the commercial with the little girl trying to catch lightning bugs, etc. Those TV ads are focusing on the Magic Kingdom.

    Muppets and HiStA (which plays at Epcot), which are both tired
    Personally, I go see Muppets every year (at least 3 times per vacation) and it never gets old. I still laugh in the same spots & love it. Same with HISTA. I always find Dr. Nigel Channing very funny.

    The Animation attraction is actually far superior at DCA.
    Besides their names, the 2 animation attractions are virtually the same now.

    Want DAK? Just go see It's Tough to be a Bug.
    [sarcasm]Yeah, because that's the main part of AK.[/sarcasm] You can't sum up AK in ITtbaB.

    So I'm not sure you can say $349 now is overpriced.
    Let's see... I'd say that DL's Premium Annual Pass is equivilant to WDW's regular AP in what they offer (theme parks, no blackouts, etc). WDW's is $395 for adults and $336 for Children. DL's is $349 for adults and $349 for children. If you want to compare with WDW's premium (which is basically 4 theme parks, 2 water parks, 1 indoor themepark, Downtown Disney & 12 resorts), they are $515 & $438, which is only 1.5 times the adult DL ticket and 1.3 times the child DL ticket. So for me, I'd call them terribly overpriced.
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  9. #54

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    Re: Holy cow, WDW's Magic Kingdom is Horrible! (Compared to Disneyland Park)

    I still say that WDW totally needs Matt. After all, he'd have his second in command in charge and the days of General Paul Grevious and Asajj Harris are over. Peace and Justice must be restored to the Florida parks...
    And Magic Kingdom isn't that horrible. Sure we have a bunch of inferior stuff and Disneyland could pull off one of those Mortal Kombat finisher moves on us as a show of sheer awesometude(like the spinal cord ripping one), but we still have some magic within and the blessing of size. It just needs to be set free and nurtured just like what Ouimet-Wan Kenobi has done for Disneyland.
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  10. #55

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    Re: Holy cow, WDW's Magic Kingdom is Horrible! (Compared to Disneyland Park)

    Quote Originally Posted by askmike1
    Besides their names, the 2 animation attractions are virtually the same now.
    Look me in the eye and tell me that the Disney-MGM Studios Animation Building is anywhere near as impressive as the DCA one. You've got to be kidding me. You walk in the place and right away you realize how amazingly themed the DCA version is. Ours reminds me of a remake of a larger Monster Sound Show post show. In DCA, it reminds me of the old Image Works from Epcot. Even more themed than the old image works.

    Perhaps they both have the academy and the interactive screens, but in DCA it's much more well done.

    Then again, you're the one who mentioned that Dinosaur is comparable to the Indiana Jones Adventure. When's the last time you've been out to Disneyland? I've had the pleasure of going on both attractions in the same week. Unless you do them back to back like I've done, you don't realize how horrible Dinosaur is compared to Indy. It's amazing.

  11. #56

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    Re: Holy cow, WDW's Magic Kingdom is Horrible! (Compared to Disneyland Park)

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill
    Look me in the eye and tell me that the Disney-MGM Studios Animation Building is anywhere near as impressive as the DCA one.
    I meant the same in what they offer. I haven't been to DL, so I can't comment on the theming. However, I do think that the new DMGM version is much worse than the old version. I liked the tour better.

    Then again, you're the one who mentioned that Dinosaur is comparable to the Indiana Jones Adventure.
    I've never compared Dinosaur to Indiana Jones. I couldn't have because I've never been on IJ. These 2 rides are not comparable (because they are 2 completely different rides). What I might have said was that I like Dinosaur.


    Unless you do them back to back like I've done, you don't realize how horrible Dinosaur is compared to Indy.
    I don't care what ride I go on, I would never think Dinosaur is horrible. Why for? Dinosaur is Dinosaur. IJ is not Dinosaur. They are two different rides. I absolutely love Dinosaur. I love seeing new riders scared at all the dinosaurs. I love the animatronics. I love how real it all is. I love the corniness of "We're not gonna make it." So I don't care how great IJ is (maybe if I rode it, I wouldn't think it is great), I would never call Dinosaur horrible.

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    Re: Holy cow, WDW's Magic Kingdom is Horrible! (Compared to Disneyland Park)

    Sorry, but the Disneyland Resort here in California still has a lot of growing to do and hopefully Matt will be staying to guide it. Disney World has been growing for years with new hotels, theme parks, and recreational facilities. Disneyland Resort still has a long way to grow to its full potential as Disney World has in the past few years. There has been DCA, the Grand Californian, and Downtown Disney, but there is still a lot that could be done to help Disneyland grow. It's time for Walt Disney Worlders to watch Disneyland Resort expand with new and ambitious projects instead of Disneylanders watching Walt Disney World.

    And someone please tell me, are WDW theme parks in as bad shape as Disneyland was two years ago? Is that why everyone wants Matt?

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    Re: Holy cow, WDW's Magic Kingdom is Horrible! (Compared to Disneyland Park)

    Quote Originally Posted by DisneyMickey
    And someone please tell me, are WDW theme parks in as bad shape as Disneyland was two years ago? Is that why everyone wants Matt?
    Well, IMO, the parks are almost as in bad as shape as Disneyland was. Not quite there yet, but they're on a downward spiral, and if nothing is done, we will end up like Disneyland was, only on a much larger scale.

    And I agree, Disneyland Resort has a lot of growing up to do. Matt does need to stay in Disneyland for a bit longer until the projects get finished...

    Disneyland Park needs...
    -Sub Lagoon (Being done)
    -People Mover Track
    -Big Thunder Mountain Trail (And BBQ) Just something needs to go there
    -New attraction to replace Innoventions
    -New attraction to replace Honey, I Shrunk the Audience
    -Return of the Jolly Trolley
    -Return of themed merchandise to areas of the park
    -Mini Rehab of Winnie the Pooh to add something to that attraction
    -Pirates of the Caribbean Rehab
    -Rehab to certain dining options around the park.
    -Backstage additions & rehabs
    -Eventual Underground tunnel system... (maybe if the budget was higher)

    Disney's California Adventure Needs...

    -Incredibles Robo-Coaster Ride
    -Monster's Inc Ride
    -Replacement for Golden Dreams
    -Parade Storage Area
    -Indoor queue themed to a theatre at the Hyperion
    -More rides
    -Replacements for some Paradise Pier Rides
    -Nighttime show on lagoon
    -Eventual Underground tunnel system (Budget)

    Disneyland Hotel needs...
    -Continual Rehab of grounds
    -24 Hour Quick Service Food Location
    -Replacement for Fantasy Waters
    -Repair of waterfalls
    -Renaming of Marina Tower (There's no marina anymore lol)

    Downtown Disney Needs...
    -More development to replace the street that the Double Decker busses once traveled.

    Once that is said and done, Matt can start to relax for a bit.

    If there was a clone of Matt that was in Florida and knew as much about the parks as I do, then I wish Disney would find him (or her) and put em in the position to make changes that need to be made. Because as many changes that I've mentioned above that Disneyland Resort needs, Walt Disney World needs about four times as many.

  14. #59

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    Re: Holy cow, WDW's Magic Kingdom is Horrible! (Compared to Disneyland Park)

    Get ready, ladies and gents, this is a MEGAREPLY.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill
    Yes, WDW may have almost everything Disneyland Park has, but it's spread out through four parks to have a minimal amount of attractions in each park and to get the most money per guest because of the need to park-hop to see multiple attractions that are all in the same park at Disneyland.
    Actually, a lot of the stuff in Disneyland is imported from WDW. I think Splash Mountain was the last huge Disneyland-first WDW-later attraction, unless you want to count Fantasmic or the Indy ride system, although I still count Indy as an exclusive.

    I just listed a ton of stuff that DL owes to WDW and there's even more still going back in time, such as Space Mountain. Point being, aside from granting the place existence by being the original Park, DL hasn't done much for WDW since the Magic Kingdom xeroxed it's format. Just in the recent age west coast gave east coast Star Tours, Splash Mountain, and Soarin'.

    DL still has quite a few unique attractions that are not at WDW or were done poorly, in terms of sharing the love it's been mostly a one-way relationship, although some of that is because Disney corporate puts a priority on getting rides in WDW first so as to sell hotel rooms.

    But until you realize how saturated Disneyland Park is with attractions & things to do, you really can't say that Magic Kingdom in WDW is the same as Disneyland Park in DLR.
    It was easier to justify prior to DCA, I'll admit right now it's difficult but I finally decided to go WDW for a few reasons: I'd never done it, there's more room to walk around, the place doesn't fill up on APs and Fastpasses all over the park. That's the sad thing about having so many top-tier rides in a park like Disneyland. There's Fastpass everywhere and I've vented about how that contributes to people being in your way instead of being in line.

    [quote]
    Quote Originally Posted by WDW1974
    You have Casey Jr. and Storybook Land
    Whooo. You ride on these once, if you can fit, and then you probably don't again for a while. I place these rides (which are almost one ride due to how they circle the same piece of property) in the same category as the Matterhorn, which isn't that WDW couldn't have it, but that there's no point because the reason the ride is still there today has to do with Walt Disney's legacy.

    An imitation Storybookland, just like an imitation Matterhorn, has no purpose because their history can't be imitated.

    and a better version of Small World with the amazing facade.
    Personally, I'd be more concerned about the drastically shortened Pirates over the IASW facade. I've found over the years that the facade creeps me out, but that's just me personally.

    NOS still has so much charm from unique shops (minus the one they turned into a pin shack) to numerous dining options to live music. LS has the ruined Hall of Prez, LTT for dining (which has been characterized for dinner) and not much else.
    Looking at it on paper, I'd say the one thing NOS has over Liberty Square is the Blue Bayou. I've never seen the Hall of Prez, but it sounds like Lincoln with the concept expanded upon and further funded instead of just one speech by Abe. Quite nice IMO.

    How about comparing a fully realized Toowtown at DK with the cheap, tacky, temporary land we have in Florida?
    Fully realized? Chip n' Dale's treehouse has been useless for years now. It took ages for them to haul that closed-down ballpit away. Donald's Boat never did anything and now does even less. Gadget's Go-Coaster is a bunch of steel rails with minor theming and a tie-in to a character nobody remembers anymore, while at least Goofy's BarnStormer gives me some flashbacks to the old Goofy's Glider cartoon. ("Hiiiigh, hiiiiiigh, up in the sky!")

    The park-hopping idea is why WDW can get away with lower quality across the board. You can't ever be disappointed in a WDW vacation, at least in my mind, if you base it on the whole rather than the parts.
    We've known that WDW was going to have to rely on Park-Hopping since the 80s, when people poo-pooed the opening of EPCOT as too stuffy, too boring, too corporate, and too lacking in Mickey Mouse. It was obvious few people would be willing to spend their entire day there and not hit up the MK.

    Park-hopping doesn't bother me too much because it distributes people. I'd much rather people distribute themselves across four parks than cram into one space like they're doing at Disneyland this weekend. Obviously it costs a bit more in the end, and at certain times of the year the parks will become as crammed as DL is and then it's lose-lose for everyone, but it's just my two cents.

    And as far as your examples, the attractions you mentioned weren't imported from WDW. It was the opposite. Star Tours opened at DL in 1987. Didn't hit the Studios until 1990. DL had Indy in 1995, while WDW had to wait until 1998 to get the inferior CTX/Dinosaur.
    No, I wasn't addressing that point when I was talking about Star Tours and CTX. I was addressing your point about the MK having a low attractions count compared to Disneyland and saying that it's not that some of Disneyland's best attractions not going to Florida, it's that they're distributed amongst more parks.

    Muppets and HiStA (which plays at Epcot), which are both tired, came to DL because they were incredibly cheap. You build a theater at one park, DL already had one, and you add the movie/effects. The more savvy SoCal visitors grew tired with these attractions very quickly. I've never seen either theater filled in the last 3-4 years.
    I wouldn't say these people grew tired of the attractions quickly because they're more savvy, but because DL has shifted focus to attracting people who will come again and again and again throughout the year. Those of us who save for Disneyland and hold each trip there as some kind of special occasion with memories to last aren't quite operating in the same universe. I found Innoventions as boring as everybody else does, but I can go on a simulator once every 4 years and find it entertaining every time. If I went on it twice a month I'd get bored.

    It's more a failing of DL's leadership to crutch themselves on constant repeat visits of Los Angelenos IMO, but anyway. I've never seen Muppets despite it's age because I haven't been to WDW where it's lived most these years, and I still look forward to seeing it when I get there. I can understand how someone who goes to the park regularly would tire of it, but I don't understand why DL choose to breed spendthrift "regulars" instead of souveneir-happy tourists. Especially since you and I have both established that people are more forgiving on vacation than at "their" park.

    Want DAK? Just go see It's Tough to be a Bug.
    That's an underestimation, I think. DCA has the raft ride and the Bug movie, but there's no live animals to be found.

    Quote Originally Posted by DisneyMickey
    It's time for Walt Disney Worlders to watch Disneyland Resort expand with new and ambitious projects instead of Disneylanders watching Walt Disney World.
    Not enough room for that. Not only physical room in the parks, but hotel rooms to sell on a new attraction. New attractions at WDW keep those endless resorts filled.

    The great thing about DL is it (usually) gets the cream of the crop. This knowledge is usually lost under the DL AP-holding fandom's endless whining (and I'll admit to whining myself, although I'm not an AP) about how prices have gone up on this, Walt wouldn't have approved of that, and TDA should do a better job on the other thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill
    Well, IMO, the parks are almost as in bad as shape as Disneyland was. Not quite there yet, but they're on a downward spiral, and if nothing is done, we will end up like Disneyland was, only on a much larger scale.

    And I agree, Disneyland Resort has a lot of growing up to do. Matt does need to stay in Disneyland for a bit longer until the projects get finished...

    Disneyland Park needs...
    -Sub Lagoon (Being done)
    -People Mover Track
    -Big Thunder Mountain Trail (And BBQ) Just something needs to go there
    -New attraction to replace Innoventions
    -New attraction to replace Honey, I Shrunk the Audience
    -Return of the Jolly Trolley
    -Return of themed merchandise to areas of the park
    -Mini Rehab of Winnie the Pooh to add something to that attraction
    -Pirates of the Caribbean Rehab
    -Rehab to certain dining options around the park.
    -Backstage additions & rehabs
    -Eventual Underground tunnel system... (maybe if the budget was higher)
    You also forgot:
    - Something to go in the Motorboat Cruise location
    - Have they actually DONE anything with the old Festival Arena location yet?
    Last edited by MickeyMania; 12-18-2005 at 02:08 AM.

  15. #60

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    Re: Holy cow, WDW's Magic Kingdom is Horrible! (Compared to Disneyland Park)

    Wow, askmike1, you just can't ever be wrong, can you?

    Back to Al's article... I think you misread something. While Al was wrinkling his nose at the term "presenteeism" (which, by the way, Disney did NOT conjur up, though they use it in a different way; Google it and find out), and he was certainly making pointed comments at the Casting Center and the scramble to make due with the limited cast on hand... where was he slamming the program itself? If anything, his comments on the reasons people were being terminated back up the goals of presenteeism, even if it is coming at a bad time.

    And nowhere in that article (or any other) has he stated that the park reached capacity because of lack of staff! Not exactly sure where you dreamed that, but I'm sure you'll let us know in order to justify your statements.

    Since you know so much, I'm sure you've talked to castmember friends who, even though overworked, back up the goals of presenteeism and are happy to see the exodus of those who took advantage of the past system. They are smart enough to see the benefits this will ultimately bring and most just hope they can hold out long enough to enjoy it.

    Try a little tact and humility in your posts; "youth" can only be excused for so much.

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