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  1. #46

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    Re: Disney Announces Avatarland to open in 2017

    Sleeping Beautyland sounds great actually.

  2. #47

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    Re: Disney Announces Avatarland to open in 2017

    A lot of people on these boards weren't happy about Cars Land when it was announced, same old story, Disney releases some things and then when the land actually comes to fruition, most people love it. I understand the constant comparisons to Universal in Orlando, but I've never heard anyone say they're just going to Florida from Universal... at least from the West Coast.
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  3. #48

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    Re: Disney Announces Avatarland to open in 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Wiggins View Post

    "Avatarland" is just another symptom of the chronic marketeering-think that dominates the management of Disney's domestic theme parks. All the hoopla that surrounds it won't be able to drown out the gurgling sound of Disney's once-famous reputation for innovation, originality and imagination circling the drain.
    Indeed. They're still kicking themselves over losing Harry Potter to Universal and they really think Avatar is gonna make up for that? Not even Belle's Village comes close to being a threat.
    Toonaspie: I have Asperger's. I like cartoons. Toonaspie!

  4. #49

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    Re: Disney Announces Avatarland to open in 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by StevenW View Post
    This is an argument that proves nothing. Its a strawman argument.
    Actually, it's the exact opposite of a strawman argument; I was specifically arguing with biggsworth who said "I am not sure if you have been to Carsland but it will last well beyond 5 years easy. There really isn't any doubting that."

    Quote Originally Posted by StevenW View Post
    There are plenty of lands that changed from its original purpose. Its a shame that they didn't finally fix Tomorrowland by doing away with the name. No one would go to Disneyland to see Tomorrowland since there is nothing there to see. Instead, there is Space Mountain and Star Tours. There is nothing inherently Tomorrow-ish about these attractions.
    Tomorrowland is not a single-property land ... and never has been.


    Quote Originally Posted by StevenW View Post
    We still have a Tom Sawyer Island. Who knows anything about Tom Sawyer these days?
    You just made my point. It's the most unvisited area of the park.

    Quote Originally Posted by StevenW View Post
    We still have a Hollywood Pictures Backlot at DCA. Who cares about the golden age of film? It is ridiculous that Disney still celebrates this ancient piece of history.
    Lots of people care about the golden age of film (and the modern age of film). However, that does not make DCA's Hollywood area a single-property land. It's not TwilightZoneland; for good reason.


  5. #50

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    Re: Disney Announces Avatarland to open in 2017

    The Davy Crocket and Sleeping beuty examples are perfect. The only reason Davy Crocket is least visited is it's location. Sleepy Beauty Castle is probably the most visited area in the park. It's all about execution. Carsland may be in the back of DCA but people will go there to enjoy it for years to come. It's land based off one franchise yes but it's executed almost perfectly. You have a C, D and E ticket attraction with shops and restaurants. All of which are brilliantly themed. Why would people lose interest in it? It's fun to just go and hang out in the land and watch the atmosphere. I expect a Carsland like delivery when it comes to Avatar. If they cheap out which NONE of us know then it will suck I agree. I am optimistic though I can't just poo poo on something for no reason.

    and for the record I think a Sleeping Beauty land would also stand the test of time and be awesome to walk through.

  6. #51

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    Re: Disney Announces Avatarland to open in 2017

    The argument about single property land or not is completely arbitrary. It is shown how completely subjective it is in popularity.

  7. #52

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    Re: Disney Announces Avatarland to open in 2017

    Single-Property or not.. In the end, if the land is well executed, well themed, and built with quality and heart.. It will be a success. Which is why I believe Carsland will be very popular for MANY MANY years.






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  8. #53

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    Re: Disney Announces Avatarland to open in 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by biggsworth View Post
    The Davy Crocket and Sleeping beuty examples are perfect. The only reason Davy Crocket is least visited is it's location. Sleepy Beauty Castle is probably the most visited area in the park. It's all about execution. Carsland may be in the back of DCA but people will go there to enjoy it for years to come. It's land based off one franchise yes but it's executed almost perfectly. You have a C, D and E ticket attraction with shops and restaurants. All of which are brilliantly themed. Why would people lose interest in it? It's fun to just go and hang out in the land and watch the atmosphere. I expect a Carsland like delivery when it comes to Avatar. If they cheap out which NONE of us know then it will suck I agree. I am optimistic though I can't just poo poo on something for no reason.

    and for the record I think a Sleeping Beauty land would also stand the test of time and be awesome to walk through.
    So, obviously, you'd advocate removing all the current Fantasyland attractions and replacing them with Sleeping Beauty attractions, right? That would be more of a draw and much more popular than current Fantasyland, right?


  9. #54

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    Re: Disney Announces Avatarland to open in 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by biggsworth View Post
    The Davy Crocket and Sleeping beuty examples are perfect. The only reason Davy Crocket is least visited is it's location. Sleepy Beauty Castle is probably the most visited area in the park. It's all about execution. Carsland may be in the back of DCA but people will go there to enjoy it for years to come. It's land based off one franchise yes but it's executed almost perfectly. You have a C, D and E ticket attraction with shops and restaurants. All of which are brilliantly themed. Why would people lose interest in it? It's fun to just go and hang out in the land and watch the atmosphere. I expect a Carsland like delivery when it comes to Avatar. If they cheap out which NONE of us know then it will suck I agree. I am optimistic though I can't just poo poo on something for no reason.

    and for the record I think a Sleeping Beauty land would also stand the test of time and be awesome to walk through.
    If it had been Davy Crockett Land there would have been no Tom Sawyer Island, probably no Mine Train Through Nature's Wonderland, or Golden Horseshoe review either. You would instead have the canoes, the keel boats, and probably something about the Alamo and a ride about the river pirates.

    Once the (bigger than Star Wars) Davy Crockett phenomenon had run its course, Davy Crockett land would have needed a fairly substantial retheme to turn it into something else. Sure, they could have left it the way it was and try to survive off the nostalgia but sooner or later it would become a museum piece for some bygone era. That is the best case scenario for Carsland, Avatarland, Star Wars Land, or any land based on a single film or film series.

    Disney didn't build Crockettland. They built Frontierland, and while it has had Crockett attractions in it, the broader theme means that once king of the wild frontier was no longer in fashion, the land at large could keep plugging along with little to no need to change a thing.
    It bothers me when people selectively edit quotes to support whatever point they are trying to prove.

  10. #55

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    Re: Disney Announces Avatarland to open in 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by SunsetLament View Post
    So, obviously, you'd advocate removing all the current Fantasyland attractions and replacing them with Sleeping Beauty attractions, right? That would be more of a draw and much more popular than current Fantasyland, right?
    It could have worked. Alice in Wonderland is a unique dark ride, there's also TeaCups. If the Canal Boats took you to oversized and miniature Alice Worlds, it could work. Possibilities for multiple attractions are endless.

    Sleeping Beauty has a dragon who's never appeared in an attraction. There's a scary forest, no? It's been a while since I watched it but I don't see why any classic Disney couldn't hold it's own as a standalone land.

  11. #56

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    Re: Disney Announces Avatarland to open in 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by SunsetLament View Post
    So, obviously, you'd advocate removing all the current Fantasyland attractions and replacing them with Sleeping Beauty attractions, right? That would be more of a draw and much more popular than current Fantasyland, right?
    If it's better than what's there now yes.

  12. #57

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    Re: Disney Announces Avatarland to open in 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by Disney Analyst View Post
    Single-Property or not.. In the end, if the land is well executed, well themed, and built with quality and heart.. It will be a success. Which is why I believe Carsland will be very popular for MANY MANY years.
    Heart is the key component. Cars is a heartfelt tribute to Route 66 and Lasseter was able to push that through into the land despite why it was chosen. Who at Disney has that same passion that can push through the reactionary, non-creative reasons for which Avatar was chosen and forced upon Disney's Animal Kingdom?

  13. #58

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    Re: Disney Announces Avatarland to open in 2017

    Will Lasseter not have creative sign off on the Avatar project? After Cameron signs off?

    Star Tours worked out fine between Lucas and Imagineering, two times.

  14. #59

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    Re: Disney Announces Avatarland to open in 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by CaliforniaAdventurer View Post
    It could have worked. Alice in Wonderland is a unique dark ride, there's also TeaCups. If the Canal Boats took you to oversized and miniature Alice Worlds, it could work. Possibilities for multiple attractions are endless.
    If today's Disney theme park executives had been running Disneyland in its early years, there would have been no Alice in Wonderland rides, much less an entire Alice land -- the film didn't do well at the box office. Instead, there likely would have been a CinderellaLand, pushing the hot brand from the Studio's hit film of that era, Cinderella -- complete with Cinderella Meets-and-Greets, Cinderella Dress-up Balls for little girls, and Cinderella merchandise in every store throughout the park.


    Quote Originally Posted by CaliforniaAdventurer View Post
    Will Lasseter not have creative sign off on the Avatar project? After Cameron signs off?

    Star Tours worked out fine between Lucas and Imagineering, two times.
    I think it's inconceivable that Cameron would have entered an Avatar licensing deal with any theme park company on the planet that wouldn't give him final sign-off.

    The relationship with Lucas in the mid-80's was a totally different beast: it involved the relationship that Jeffrey was nurturing between George and Disney, which had its roots when Jeffrey and Michael were at Paramount. Part of it, too, was the longtime love that George had for Disneyland, and the Walt-era philosophy of Imagineering that Tony Baxter brought to the project.


    Quote Originally Posted by lazyboy97O View Post
    Heart is the key component. Cars is a heartfelt tribute to Route 66 and Lasseter was able to push that through into the land despite why it was chosen.
    Exactly. And John had to leverage not only his position in the Company, but his authority as Cars creator, in battling Disney's beancounters to get what he wanted.


    Quote Originally Posted by lazyboy97O View Post
    Who at Disney has that same passion that can push through the reactionary, non-creative reasons for which Avatar was chosen and forced upon Disney's Animal Kingdom?
    No one. Certainly not the low-RISC quartet of Rasulo, Iger, Staggs and Crofton.
    Last edited by Mr Wiggins; 05-07-2013 at 10:49 PM.
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  15. #60

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    Re: Disney Announces Avatarland to open in 2017

    The bottom line is this: Avatard is a visually stunning, unimaginitive, crap movie with no memorable characters. When I saw it I couldn't get past how it followed Fern Gully almost exactly. But hey, it's Disney's park. They can do what they want with it.
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