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  1. #61

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    Re: Inside Toy Story Midway Mania - Pictures

    Quote Originally Posted by EpcotServo View Post
    I told you guys the story connection to Pixar Place a few pages ago, nobody listened.


    It's very simple...

    Pixar is the home of all the Pixar Pals. (Again, think ToonTown/ Maroon studios)

    the toy's have set up the new Midway games while Andy's away.

    They invite us, and everyone at Pixar Studios to come become toys to play the games. (After all, what's a Midway without people?)

    We become toys, and have a great time.

    What's so hard to understand?



    Anyhoo, from one (Me) who has now been up and down and all around Pixar Place and Midway Mania, here's my review.
    Toon Town is not a movie studio -- it's the community where the Toons live. Pixar Studios is just that - a studio.

    I'm pretty sure Andy lived in his own house. I mean, it's been a while since I've watched Toy Story, but I'm pretty sure his bedroom wasn't in the Pixar Animation Studios headquarters and it wasn't dominated by oversized toys.

    The theming is a mess, and the backstory WDI created is laughable.

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  2. #62

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    Re: Inside Toy Story Midway Mania - Pictures

    Quote Originally Posted by lazyboy97O View Post
    So where exactly doe sit take you or is it merely a visual distraction that keeps the mind from noticing the otherwise bland buildings?
    Actually the Pixar buildings look great. I want the walls to be down so we can see all the detail at ground level. There is just a ncie feeling to the area and the buildings are all "cafe, camera shop, story". Maybe not be a new New Orleans Square but not bland at all. It give a great feel of a studio, studio = hollywood, Hollywood Studios needs more Hollywood. It got it.

  3. #63

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    Re: Inside Toy Story Midway Mania - Pictures

    Quote Originally Posted by tloolgb View Post
    Actually the Pixar buildings look great. I want the walls to be down so we can see all the detail at ground level. There is just a ncie feeling to the area and the buildings are all "cafe, camera shop, story". Maybe not be a new New Orleans Square but not bland at all. It give a great feel of a studio, studio = hollywood, Hollywood Studios needs more Hollywood. It got it.
    Therein lies the largest problem/complaint. A Hollywood (Pixar) studio=/=Andy's room, which for some inexplicable reason is in a studio warehouse. It'd be like (I know there's not space to do it) putting Indy into the Space Mountain building: a thematic mess. As others have pointed out, the giant toys on the outside are a HUGE disconnect for the ride. If there were no giant toys, it'd be easier to buy being shrunk down to a toy. Heck, there could be an area of the queue just for that (there might be....don't shoot me). But the big toys on the outside don't come across as markers for "Hey, this is a Toy Story building," but rather to aid in a sense of scale. I think when that mixes with whatever other Pixar attractions are in the area, there's going to be trouble. It'd be like having a land with Indy, BTMR, Pooh, and Astro Orbitors all in one. A midway doesn't really fit a studio. A bedroom doesn't really fit a studio. I almost want to give credit to WDI for coming up with a semi-plausible idea of how the ride makes sense outside of Paradise Pier, but in my opinion, they failed. That's not saying the ride isn't good or that the queue doesn't look good. It's all about theme and consistency.

    What I would have preferred, if they wanted to shoehorn the attraction in so much, is to spend a few million (or ten or however much) to make the ride appropriate for DHS. Instead of playing midway games, why can't the toys be making their own movie? You could have self-reflexive references (could be a bad idea) coming from everywhere, and it fits a lot better. Each game could be a different aspect of production...The potato-head animatronic could be the director. I would also have a part of the queue (and the exit) where it is CLEAR that you are in fact "shrinking." Heck, they could make it part of the ride with the set-up being going on a Pixar tour when one of the animators unveils his newest, crazy idea to take you into the world of Toy Story (perhaps getting digitized?) This would:
    1) Make it fit with DHS
    2) Provide a learning experience that fits with the park
    3) Still maintain a similar ride experience while providing an externally and internally consistent theme and even story because WDI is so dead set on everything having an actual story.

    As for that: Expedition Everest...no real story. Test Track...no real story Laugh Floor and Turtle Talk (from what I can tell)...no real story. Soarin'...no real, explicit story (more of an experience ;-)). Etc., etc., etc.

    As for DCA, although I hate to say this, the others that have been saying that you don't need to theme or story up a ride about playing midway games that is thematically placed on a pier. The toys are a questionable aspect, but it's like midway funhouses.

    Although an attraction that executes a well-themed queue is important, I'd personally rather have an attraction that fits where its located. Naturally, both would be optimal (Expedition Everest...cough cough), but I don't think a queue, no matter how well themed, can save an attraction that doesn't fit. Think back to my Indiana Jones in Tomorrowland example.

  4. #64

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    Re: Inside Toy Story Midway Mania - Pictures

    The first on-ride video of Toy Story mania is now on line on Alain's Disney and more blog !!

    No need to say that if you want to keep the surprise, don't watch it!

    http://disneyandmore.blogspot.com/20...-story_03.html

  5. #65

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    Re: Inside Toy Story Midway Mania - Pictures

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    Therein lies the largest problem/complaint. A Hollywood (Pixar) studio=/=Andy's room, which for some inexplicable reason is in a studio warehouse.
    What - do you require a big sign to accept any transition?

    Last I recall there was no big explanation written out, put up on big signs in the ride and spieled to guests how the waterfalls are intended to transition people away from NOS to a spanish town for POTC. I don't understand how we get from a water flume in IASW to some doll warehouse??? Or why is there a graveyard at night inside the HM during the day???

    Honestly I believe people just need to justify hatred towards things being done today. If it was done prior - they accept explanations as 'good' but any explanations today are wrong and bad.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    A midway doesn't really fit a studio. A bedroom doesn't really fit a studio.
    And studios themselves inherently have no identity - their whole job is to create magic and places that aren't really there. If we created a studio that was only to be what the studio itself was... we'd have a bunch of non-discript warehouses and nothing else. Their job is to create something that doesn't really exist - not be something themselves.

    Where is all the outcry when Disney made TV shows and shorts with his characters playing out real human roles around the Disney Studios.. as if they were real life actors. That doesn't make any sense either - what are characters that only exist in a make believe world where reality doesn't apply doing walking around in a real world setting?

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    I almost want to give credit to WDI for coming up with a semi-plausible idea of how the ride makes sense outside of Paradise Pier, but in my opinion, they failed
    The only thing different in this respect for DCA is the building exterior fits the boardwalk theme of the surrounding land. Just like the DHS's building fits the theme of it's land. The 'andy's room' doeesn't belong statement would apply uniformly to both.

    Disney's model of transfering you to an alternate place INSIDE a building is nothing new and certainly a common trait amoung many Disney attractions. Yet somehow in the age of the armchair imagineers and the internet - you can't have this anymore.

    There are no german castle's next to a London bedroom - I think Peter Pan is completely a mess!!!! This hypersensitive type of thinking is absurd and isn't applied uniformly by such critics. Its used to try to justify their predisposed hatred towards projects.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    Each game could be a different aspect of production...
    Because besides what many of the west coasters haters refuse to accept - the idea of the studios was to take you places you experienced in the movies (like Andy's room!) not just the backstage mechanics that make movies happen. The original MGM park covered both aspects of film... taking you into the make believe world/places that previously you only saw in movies as well as showing you the 'reality' side of movies which is what you saw outside the view of the camera and 'how they do that'.

    In a movie studio.. you step onto a set and if done well, within the view of the camera it should appear as if you are there. You don't fixate that outside it was sunny and in here its now night, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    As for that: Expedition Everest...no real story.
    It does.. tours and expidition up to the mountain and the risk of encountering a mysterious yeti.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    Test Track...no real story
    It does - you are being given a tour of a test facility and given the opportunity to experience the type of testing being done.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    Laugh Floor
    You are going to a comedy club.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    Turtle Talk (from what I can tell)...no real story.
    Turtle Talk is a meet and greet. It's even in the freaking title 'Turtle TALK with Crush'. The whole theory of the attraction is getting to meet and talk with Crush who's in a tank exposed to the room. There is no adventure you are going on.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    Soarin'...no real, explicit story (more of an experience ;-)). Etc., etc., etc.
    Soarin you are going on a flight over california.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    Although an attraction that executes a well-themed queue is important, I'd personally rather have an attraction that fits where its located. Naturally, both would be optimal (Expedition Everest...cough cough), but I don't think a queue, no matter how well themed, can save an attraction that doesn't fit. Think back to my Indiana Jones in Tomorrowland example.
    And so much is ignored if you look at Disneyland and what is 'accepted' because it was done by the old crew vs modern teams. So in the case of many DL attractions you have neither - fit NOR queue - yet people are accepting of it simply because 'its always been that way'. The exterior of the building does not always have to be a 1:1 match to the interior of the building. I don't recall how ATIS's exterior has anything to do with the attraction inside, just how it doesn't for Star Tours either.

    The ideas of transporting, disconnecting interior and exterior, and theme as more then just physical location are all concepts utilized by Disney since the beginning.
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  6. #66

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    Re: Inside Toy Story Midway Mania - Pictures

    Quick question: How do Pirates fit into Critter Country and FronterLand? It is like a bedroom in a movie studios.

    p.s.

    What up with Yellow Stone and the Dinosaurs in Tommorrowland? Get the point.
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  7. #67

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    Re: Inside Toy Story Midway Mania - Pictures

    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    What - do you require a big sign to accept any transition?

    Last I recall there was no big explanation written out, put up on big signs in the ride and spieled to guests how the waterfalls are intended to transition people away from NOS to a spanish town for POTC. I don't understand how we get from a water flume in IASW to some doll warehouse??? Or why is there a graveyard at night inside the HM during the day???

    Honestly I believe people just need to justify hatred towards things being done today. If it was done prior - they accept explanations as 'good' but any explanations today are wrong and bad.
    Poor examples here. Very poor. In PotC, you aren't just in the middle of piratey action all of a sudden. There is a VERY large transition because of the bayou scene at Disneyland. This does, in fact, serve as a sign. Small World you got me on. Haunted Mansion, on the other hand, sets up the nighttime aspect in the queue itself. After all, we don't know how long we're in the stretching room, regardless of what time it is. Like I said in the rest of my post, it's thematically confusing to have LARGE toys on the inside and outside of the building. If they weren't on the outside, I wouldn't be mentioning it. Also, the examples lack in terms of the whole transition argument because these queues don't call special attention to themselves in respect to how their buildings look. You go through HM's queue on the outside and GASP, you're actually in the HM. With TSMM, on the other hand, from the outside you have a large warehouse style building and then transition to Andy's room without an explanation as to why. According to the scale of the toys on the outside, that building is no bigger than a typical child's room.

    It's not that I'm not willing to accept today's interpretations or things like that. I'm not calling them bad or justifying my hatred toward anything. I just see the execution of the queue of the ride relative to its surroundings to be the thematic equivalent of having the Space Mountain building having the queue and ride for Indy.


    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    And studios themselves inherently have no identity - their whole job is to create magic and places that aren't really there. If we created a studio that was only to be what the studio itself was... we'd have a bunch of non-discript warehouses and nothing else. Their job is to create something that doesn't really exist - not be something themselves.
    This muddles the theme though. The story being pushed by Disney isn't "Hey, you're in a movie studio that's designed to make you feel like you're toy sized." I would buy THAT. But the story being pushed by Disney is that the guests actually are shrunk down to toy size to go under Andy's bed and play with this new midway playset. For example, on the park's description for the Honey, I Shrunk the Kids playground, they are explicitly calling it a movie set. Guests aren't EVER explicitly persuaded that they themselves have actually changed. It works because it's in the backlot section. Also, look no further than Muppets. The attraction takes place in a warehouse. What do you get when you go inside? GASP, a warehouse. Just like the exteriors of RnRC, ToT, and Sounds Dangerous (ick, I had to say it) mirror what the interiors are supposed to be, a lot of the studio attractions are very up front about the fact that it's not supposed to be real. Yes, on RnRC, I understand that you are on the "outside" in the inside of a building, but the interior itself lends to that fact. That's always been the justification for why the Ewok village and AT-AT aren't complete show pieces.

    Where is all the outcry when Disney made TV shows and shorts with his characters playing out real human roles around the Disney Studios.. as if they were real life actors. That doesn't make any sense either - what are characters that only exist in a make believe world where reality doesn't apply doing walking around in a real world setting?


    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    The only thing different in this respect for DCA is the building exterior fits the boardwalk theme of the surrounding land. Just like the DHS's building fits the theme of it's land. The 'andy's room' doeesn't belong statement would apply uniformly to both.
    I never said it didn't. I'm not a big fan of the Andy's Room thing for DCA's version, as I already said. There was absolutely NO reason to do that. DHS's version, if they had left it as a relatively non-descript warehouse without throwing in toys that confuse a sense of real scale, it would have been fine. Boring to look at? Yeah. Fitting with the studio theme? Definitely.

    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    Disney's model of transfering you to an alternate place INSIDE a building is nothing new and certainly a common trait amoung many Disney attractions. Yet somehow in the age of the armchair imagineers and the internet - you can't have this anymore.

    There are no german castle's next to a London bedroom - I think Peter Pan is completely a mess!!!! This hypersensitive type of thinking is absurd and isn't applied uniformly by such critics. Its used to try to justify their predisposed hatred towards projects.
    This isn't the same sort of thinking at all. Although the Alice in Wonderland part starts drifting away from it, all of the Fantasyland buildings in Disneyland and WDW match each other exterior wise. On top of that, the queues for these rides don't suggest any real pretense. The Peter Pan queue doesn't suggest that you're in a bedroom. That doesn't happen until the ride starts. The buildings themselves match each other. I know that a suspension of disbelief is required and that Disney has a long history with this dating back to Disneyland rides, but suspension of disbelief in Fantasyland compared to something that exterior wise represents a VERY realistic style is two different things. Take Indy for example. When you enter the "temple" you aren't suddenly in the warehouse from Raiders or anywhere other than inside the temple. Why? Because Adventureland leans toward a more realistic theme. The same thing can be said for Animal Kingdom and most of its lands. Heck, Dinosaur itself is a good example of a ride explicitly transporting the guests from the outside world to the world of the ride and back. A lot of really successful rides pull this off (ToT, RnRC to some extent, Philharmagic, Pirates (DL), HM, etc.).

    I'm not predisposed to hating TSMM. I would be the first to defend (and have been one to defend) the concept of the ride past the "story" they've tried to throw into it. I realize that everyone has their own opinion, but when posters jump on and start talking about how much better one queue is over another, I feel that I should represent my opinion the best I can, hence my long post. While DHS's queue better sets the "toy size, under Andy's bed" feeling that Disney wants to go with, it conflicts severely and unnecessarily with the exterior of the attraction. Frankly, I wish they didn't throw this same story mess onto the DCA counterpart because it didn't need it at all to make sense.


    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    Because besides what many of the west coasters haters refuse to accept - the idea of the studios was to take you places you experienced in the movies (like Andy's room!) not just the backstage mechanics that make movies happen. The original MGM park covered both aspects of film... taking you into the make believe world/places that previously you only saw in movies as well as showing you the 'reality' side of movies which is what you saw outside the view of the camera and 'how they do that'.

    In a movie studio.. you step onto a set and if done well, within the view of the camera it should appear as if you are there. You don't fixate that outside it was sunny and in here its now night, etc.
    My gripe with this is that this is not how the ride is being presented. That's seriously my only problem with it. If Disney would change their stance on how they are presenting and marketing the ride, I'd shut up. I'm not a hater from the West Coast. I'm a Disney fan from Oklahoma that has been to WDW a lot over the past 8 years. I've been to Disneyland a lot as well. They each have their appeal to me. My problem is that there is nothing in the description of the ride or the "playset under Andy's bed" story that suggests all we're doing is stepping onto a set. If there were, I wouldn't have a problem with it.


    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    It does.. tours and expidition up to the mountain and the risk of encountering a mysterious yeti. It does - you are being given a tour of a test facility and given the opportunity to experience the type of testing being done. You are going to a comedy club. Turtle Talk is a meet and greet. It's even in the freaking title 'Turtle TALK with Crush'. The whole theory of the attraction is getting to meet and talk with Crush who's in a tank exposed to the room. There is no adventure you are going on. Soarin you are going on a flight over california.
    I wouldn't really call any of these stories. These, to me, fit under experience type attractions, especially Soarin', EE, and Test Track. Sure, it's almost getting into the level of semantics, but there isn't really a set plotline in the sense of a beginning, middle, and end with characters, etc. The Imagineer quote that's been brought up handles this pretty well. As for Laugh Floor, it doesn't seem to have a story to it either because it lacks a narrative.


    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    And so much is ignored if you look at Disneyland and what is 'accepted' because it was done by the old crew vs modern teams. So in the case of many DL attractions you have neither - fit NOR queue - yet people are accepting of it simply because 'its always been that way'. The exterior of the building does not always have to be a 1:1 match to the interior of the building. I don't recall how ATIS's exterior has anything to do with the attraction inside, just how it doesn't for Star Tours either.

    The ideas of transporting, disconnecting interior and exterior, and theme as more then just physical location are all concepts utilized by Disney since the beginning.
    There's a large difference between futuristic surroundings housing futuristic locales and attractions and what appears to be a movie studio setting housing what is PRESENTED to be actually being in a child's bedroom at a toy's size.

  8. #68

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    Re: Inside Toy Story Midway Mania - Pictures

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    Therein lies the largest problem/complaint. A Hollywood (Pixar) studio=/=Andy's room, which for some inexplicable reason is in a studio warehouse. It'd be like (I know there's not space to do it) putting Indy into the Space Mountain building: a thematic mess. As others have pointed out, the giant toys on the outside are a HUGE disconnect for the ride. If there were no giant toys, it'd be easier to buy being shrunk down to a toy. Heck, there could be an area of the queue just for that (there might be....don't shoot me). But the big toys on the outside don't come across as markers for "Hey, this is a Toy Story building," but rather to aid in a sense of scale. I think when that mixes with whatever other Pixar attractions are in the area, there's going to be trouble. It'd be like having a land with Indy, BTMR, Pooh, and Astro Orbitors all in one. A midway doesn't really fit a studio. A bedroom doesn't really fit a studio. I almost want to give credit to WDI for coming up with a semi-plausible idea of how the ride makes sense outside of Paradise Pier, but in my opinion, they failed. That's not saying the ride isn't good or that the queue doesn't look good. It's all about theme and consistency.

    What I would have preferred, if they wanted to shoehorn the attraction in so much, is to spend a few million (or ten or however much) to make the ride appropriate for DHS. Instead of playing midway games, why can't the toys be making their own movie? You could have self-reflexive references (could be a bad idea) coming from everywhere, and it fits a lot better. Each game could be a different aspect of production...The potato-head animatronic could be the director. I would also have a part of the queue (and the exit) where it is CLEAR that you are in fact "shrinking." Heck, they could make it part of the ride with the set-up being going on a Pixar tour when one of the animators unveils his newest, crazy idea to take you into the world of Toy Story (perhaps getting digitized?) This would:
    1) Make it fit with DHS
    2) Provide a learning experience that fits with the park
    3) Still maintain a similar ride experience while providing an externally and internally consistent theme and even story because WDI is so dead set on everything having an actual story.

    As for that: Expedition Everest...no real story. Test Track...no real story Laugh Floor and Turtle Talk (from what I can tell)...no real story. Soarin'...no real, explicit story (more of an experience ;-)). Etc., etc., etc.

    As for DCA, although I hate to say this, the others that have been saying that you don't need to theme or story up a ride about playing midway games that is thematically placed on a pier. The toys are a questionable aspect, but it's like midway funhouses.

    Although an attraction that executes a well-themed queue is important, I'd personally rather have an attraction that fits where its located. Naturally, both would be optimal (Expedition Everest...cough cough), but I don't think a queue, no matter how well themed, can save an attraction that doesn't fit. Think back to my Indiana Jones in Tomorrowland example.


    Exactly right.

    And to Monkey Joe, Pirates isn't in Critter Country. And how it fits into Frontierland? Very badly.

    Grand Canyon and Primeval World are not really a part of Tomorrowland. You just happen to see these dioramas between Tomorrowland and Main Street Stations.


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  9. #69

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    Re: Inside Toy Story Midway Mania - Pictures

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    Therein lies the largest problem/complaint. A Hollywood (Pixar) studio=/=Andy's room, which for some inexplicable reason is in a studio warehouse. . As others have pointed out, the giant toys on the outside are a HUGE disconnect for the ride.
    Well chief you'll notice my defense was for the PIXAR buildings, and how they fit a Hollywood park. I mentioned nothing about the transition into the ride and or the giant toys on the outside.

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    Re: Inside Toy Story Midway Mania - Pictures

    Quote Originally Posted by tloolgb View Post
    Well chief you'll notice my defense was for the PIXAR buildings, and how they fit a Hollywood park. I mentioned nothing about the transition into the ride and or the giant toys on the outside.
    I wasn't specifically going after you. I concede that the warehouse building is a nice looking building in and of itself.

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    Re: Inside Toy Story Midway Mania - Pictures

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    Poor examples here. Very poor. In PotC, you aren't just in the middle of piratey action all of a sudden. There is a VERY large transition because of the bayou scene at Disneyland.
    The point was about the interior not matching the exterior... and these examples illustrate that need is not a requirement. Nor does the transition need to be pointed out to the guests. In the DHS version, you are getting this transition through immersion and removal from the exterior influences.. and through the queue you transition into the Toy Story world.. ending up in the familiar Andy's room. Where do you see that happening in DCA? I sure hope that exposed point we see in DCA is unload and not load... otherwise you lose that entire aspect.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    Haunted Mansion, on the other hand, sets up the nighttime aspect in the queue itself. After all, we don't know how long we're in the stretching room, regardless of what time it is.
    Again - the point is the guests are not explicitly told how all this is done.. its done subconsciously to the guests. People understand these older attractions it because its been explained and written about so extensively. Instead of just letting yourself go and letting the elements work on you - today people are being hypercritical looking for the gaps right from the start. Elements that work on you subtly never stick and are ineffective if you are sitting there on the defense trying to analyze everything. The armchair imagineers and al lutz-wannabes refuse to let themselves just experience an attraction for what it is. The put on their critic hats before they've even tried it and skew themselves from the start.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    Like I said in the rest of my post, it's thematically confusing to have LARGE toys on the inside and outside of the building. If they weren't on the outside, I wouldn't be mentioning it.
    I guess all the dark rides are all screwed up then huh? Hrmm.. why is Pooh so small in the attraction when he's 5ft tall outside in the meet and greet? Why are the people so small in a dark ride when they are so big on the outside? Why the white rabbit so big out here, and so small in there?

    The scale on the outside you can't escape - its already in play because of the parades, meet & greets, etc. I doubt the average guest will be confused by this at all - considering they help establish scale with the sets on the interior of the building.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    With TSMM, on the other hand, from the outside you have a large warehouse style building and then transition to Andy's room without an explanation as to why.
    Basing this on what? Most photos and videos posted so far don't show the outside to inside transition at all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    I just see the execution of the queue of the ride relative to its surroundings to be the thematic equivalent of having the Space Mountain building having the queue and ride for Indy.
    An analogy that really holds no validity - one that introduces so many more conflicts - and the only conflict you've infers that exists here is purely scale.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    This muddles the theme though. The story being pushed by Disney isn't "Hey, you're in a movie studio that's designed to make you feel like you're toy sized."
    They are pushing you ARE in a movie studio environment on the outside. Just as in NOS you are pushed that you are on a New Orleans street and once inside you are taken somewhere else. Where all the crying bloody murder about the VERY FIRST THING you see as you enter the POTC building? WHAT, we just walked in a doorway and there are boats passing by me??? And a pirate treasure chest on a jungle like beach? What the hell??? WHere's the transition there?

    These rules people are trying to apply as absolutes simply don't work that way.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    It works because it's in the backlot section. Also, look no further than Muppets. The attraction takes place in a warehouse. What do you get when you go inside? GASP, a warehouse.
    The building isn't a warehouse, nor is that what you are lead into initially. Its only the preshow that is in a prop warehouse. The story isn't in a warehouse either. Only the DCA clone puts it in a 'sound stage' building. The DHS version is built into the city scape.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    Yes, on RnRC, I understand that you are on the "outside" in the inside of a building, but the interior itself lends to that fact. That's always been the justification for why the Ewok village and AT-AT aren't complete show pieces.
    They are supposed to be a movie set. The very building you enter is marked as such. Its in part to show how the movie magic is done.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    DHS's version, if they had left it as a relatively non-descript warehouse without throwing in toys that confuse a sense of real scale, it would have been fine.
    I guess you should be throwing the theme police at all the parades and just about every other non-ride variation of the characters while we are at it. Tinkerbell?? Pixar Play Parade? Mickey walking around at 5ft.. instead of the 2ft or so he's originally portrayed as. Again - you can see these made up rules that the attraction is now 'breaking' simply don't apply how people are attempting to apply them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    Boring to look at? Yeah. Fitting with the studio theme? Definitely.
    I think the theme you see evolving in the Pixar Studios area from what they have done so far is almost like the characters are breaking out and overrunning the place... its like a breakout.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    This isn't the same sort of thinking at all. Although the Alice in Wonderland part starts drifting away from it, all of the Fantasyland buildings in Disneyland and WDW match each other exterior wise.
    And every one of those attractions takes place in different places and times.. so again here is the disconnect from interiors and exteriors being accepted in original attractions 'as is' - yet people come up with new rules for new attractions. On top of that, the locations totally conflict with the interiors.. totally lacking any transitions. Sound familiar?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    On top of that, the queues for these rides don't suggest any real pretense. The Peter Pan queue doesn't suggest that you're in a bedroom. That doesn't happen until the ride starts.
    And the very transition you scold the toy story attraction for missing and being in conflict happens here as well. You just said, I'm in the scenario of what the exterior is... and now BAM 5 seconds into the ride I'm supposed to be flying out the window of a london bedroom? There's major conflict there.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    I know that a suspension of disbelief is required and that Disney has a long history with this dating back to Disneyland rides, but suspension of disbelief in Fantasyland compared to something that exterior wise represents a VERY realistic style is two different things.
    The exteriors in FL are meant to be very realistic looking. The gap was even MORE significant in the original style which was all medival faire type styling. How does that apply to the attractions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    While DHS's queue better sets the "toy size, under Andy's bed" feeling that Disney wants to go with, it conflicts severely and unnecessarily with the exterior of the attraction.
    A 'rule' being made up that can be demostrated time and time again is not adhered to. Going all the way back to original attractions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    Frankly, I wish they didn't throw this same story mess onto the DCA counterpart because it didn't need it at all to make sense.
    Yeah... instead somehow we have aliens, space rangers, and other out of era stuff somehow in a victorian themed amusement area? Yeah - those blend perfectly together with no effort... The stereotypical midway prize are plushies... not articulated space men or Mr Potato Head toys.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    My problem is that there is nothing in the description of the ride or the "playset under Andy's bed" story that suggests all we're doing is stepping onto a set. If there were, I wouldn't have a problem with it.
    Again - look at ANY of the attractions. Which have stories written out for guests to read as they enter the attraction? You get staged and lead... you aren't given a plot or program to follow along with. You are taking exterior inputs and trying to apply them to the experience of the attraction without ever actually letting your mind be manipulated.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    I wouldn't really call any of these stories. These, to me, fit under experience type attractions, especially Soarin', EE, and Test Track. Sure, it's almost getting into the level of semantics, but there isn't really a set plotline in the sense of a beginning, middle, and end with characters, etc.
    They very much have stories including a story line, rising actions, climax, and falling actions. You aren't necessarily following a specific character because YOU are the character. The irony is again... the idea that you now propose that attractions must have some story with defined characters, and identifiable story progression... where some of the finest, most adored attractions in the Disney arsenal blantent deny such a 'rule' - see the Haunted Mansion, Jungle Cruise, Space Mountain, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    There's a large difference between futuristic surroundings housing futuristic locales and attractions and what appears to be a movie studio setting housing what is PRESENTED to be actually being in a child's bedroom at a toy's size.
    I fail to see how the star tours building is anything 'futuristic'. Or how about the Great Movie Ride where we enter a realistic movie theatre, progress through preshows which are explicitly a movie theatre, and then somehow we are all in all these disconnected places. It's because you are being sent INTO those movie environments... not that you really are in OZ, or a Jungle, or NYC street. You are being sent into the movie's realm.... it's what's happening here, we are being sent into the Toy Story setting. You aren't being explictly told you are leaving A and entering B... its a immersion. Very few of the Disney attractions explictly outline it for the guests how you are supposed to be moving from A to B... its infered and the guests are lead to let their conscious go there.

    Obviously a freedom many here will never let happen.
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  12. #72

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    Re: Inside Toy Story Midway Mania - Pictures

    very cool

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    Re: Inside Toy Story Midway Mania - Pictures

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    I wouldn't really call any of these stories. These, to me, fit under experience type attractions, especially Soarin', EE, and Test Track. Sure, it's almost getting into the level of semantics, but there isn't really a set plotline in the sense of a beginning, middle, and end with characters, etc. The Imagineer quote that's been brought up handles this pretty well. As for Laugh Floor, it doesn't seem to have a story to it either because it lacks a narrative.
    I should add that while every attraction should have a story - its not the guests that necessarily progress through that story.

    The difference is that of a backstory vs the guest progressing through that story. BTMRR has zero story the guest runs through themselves. There is no point when the train goes from controlled, normal mine train to runaway. Typhoon Lagoon has a backstory; you don't experience the hurricane as part of your visit.

    Attractions use the story to tie together the elements and help bring in what belongs or not - it doesn't have to be what the guests explicitly progress through. Many times what the guests go through is actually moving THROUGH that environment rather then being told the story outright. Space Mountain has a story to tie its elements together - not that the guests go through some story themselves except they are supposed to be on rocketships launching, going through space, and returning.
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    Re: Inside Toy Story Midway Mania - Pictures

    Quote Originally Posted by flynnibus View Post
    I should add that while every attraction should have a story - its not the guests that necessarily progress through that story.

    The difference is that of a backstory vs the guest progressing through that story. BTMRR has zero story the guest runs through themselves. There is no point when the train goes from controlled, normal mine train to runaway. Typhoon Lagoon has a backstory; you don't experience the hurricane as part of your visit.

    Attractions use the story to tie together the elements and help bring in what belongs or not - it doesn't have to be what the guests explicitly progress through. Many times what the guests go through is actually moving THROUGH that environment rather then being told the story outright. Space Mountain has a story to tie its elements together - not that the guests go through some story themselves except they are supposed to be on rocketships launching, going through space, and returning.
    I'm not claiming that rides HAVE to have stories. What I was suggesting was that DCA's version is getting, in my opinion, crippled because Disney is sticking to the "under Andy's bed" guns to try to give the ride some sort of story or make sense out of it. I'm saying that's completely unnecessary. A ride about midway games located on a pier doesn't need a story or immersion any more past that.

    I'm not proposing that rides shouldn't have clear stories or that they should. Disney has done both stories and "experiences" well. What I'm saying is that I'm not a big fan of trying to throw a story onto a ride when it can work as an experience ride. Other than some time things to make up and some changes to the queue, it would be like having Indiana Jones in the EE ride.

    EDIT: I'll get to the other stuff later.

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    Re: Inside Toy Story Midway Mania - Pictures

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    I'm not claiming that rides HAVE to have stories. What I was suggesting was that DCA's version is getting, in my opinion, crippled because Disney is sticking to the "under Andy's bed" guns to try to give the ride some sort of story or make sense out of it. I'm saying that's completely unnecessary. A ride about midway games located on a pier doesn't need a story or immersion any more past that.
    Sure it does - It needs rational behind it. It needs to make sense to naturally flow to th guests. The difference is whether this is implicitly spelled out to the guests or not. Your posts have been illustrating that if you don't see the story (tho I don't know how you didn't in TT unless you don't listen to any video or audio) it isn't there. That simply isn't the case.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twist_of_Fate View Post
    I'm not proposing that rides shouldn't have clear stories or that they should. Disney has done both stories and "experiences" well. What I'm saying is that I'm not a big fan of trying to throw a story onto a ride when it can work as an experience ride
    They all have stories - its part of the design process. There wouldn't be any cohesion in the ride itself without them. The key (and what people oft complain about) is the attraction's story does not connect with the land - hence the theme clashing. See Pirates and Tom Sawyer Island.

    Really the only ones that wouldn't have a story are the carnival rides. (like Dumbo, Carasoul, etc)

    In this day, there is so much information out there and so easily accessible people forget they used to goto DL without all this 'data' preceeding their visit. Now they are armed with all this information and instead of just riding an attraction and letting go, they are trying to compare and be critical of that data.
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